Banners Broker HYIP ponzi scam

[littleroundman]

Finch, on his excellent site, has likened BB to a cult.

It's more than "like" a cult.

What makes a cult a cult is less about the people involved or the reason for the cults' existence and more about the techniques used to control "members"

How many of the following apply to Banners Broker and/or it's members ???

By Rick Ross, Expert Consultant and Intervention Specialist

Ten warning signs of a potentially unsafe group/leader.



Absolute authoritarianism without meaningful accountability.
No tolerance for questions or critical inquiry.
No meaningful financial disclosure regarding budget, expenses such as an independently audited financial statement.
Unreasonable fear about the outside world, such as impending catastrophe, evil conspiracies and persecutions.
There is no legitimate reason to leave, former followers are always wrong in leaving, negative or even evil.
Former members often relate the same stories of abuse and reflect a similar pattern of grievances.
There are records, books, news articles, or television programs that document the abuses of the group/leader.
Followers feel they can never be "good enough".
The group/leader is always right.
The group/leader is the exclusive means of knowing "truth" or receiving validation, no other process of discovery is really acceptable or credible.


Ten warning signs regarding people involved in/with a potentially unsafe group/leader.



Extreme obsessiveness regarding the group/leader resulting in the exclusion of almost every practical consideration.
Individual identity, the group, the leader and/or God as distinct and separate categories of existence become increasingly blurred. Instead, in the follower's mind these identities become substantially and increasingly fused--as that person's involvement with the group/leader continues and deepens.
Whenever the group/leader is criticized or questioned it is characterized as "persecution".
Uncharacteristically stilted and seemingly programmed conversation and mannerisms, cloning of the group/leader in personal behavior.
Dependency upon the group/leader for problem solving, solutions, and definitions without meaningful reflective thought. A seeming inability to think independently or analyze situations without group/leader involvement.
Hyperactivity centered on the group/leader agenda, which seems to supercede any personal goals or individual interests.
A dramatic loss of spontaneity and sense of humor.
Increasing isolation from family and old friends unless they demonstrate an interest in the group/leader.
Anything the group/leader does can be justified no matter how harsh or harmful.
Former followers are at best-considered negative or worse evil and under bad influences. They can not be trusted and personal contact is avoided.

[AshKen1]

@LRM

De-brief and de-progamming required then. Has anyone done this that you know of? Explains why people from other ponzi schemes still believing.

[Dreamstealer]

We can all make exaggerated statements that baffle the mind, please clarify what point you are making in simple terms so that we can all understand what you actually mean.
This was easy for me to understand bbd. Why not ask a neighbour to explain it, perhaps with nice pictures?

[BB Defender]

"Only shooting stars break the mould"

Had to nip over to wiki as I just knew they'd have a great definition for this

"Shooting star is a common name for the visible path of a meteoroid as it enters the atmosphere to become a meteor. As it enters the atmosphere the meteor burns up into flames."

Basically shooting star = crash and burn. Says it all doesn't it?

Finch is right, it is very cult like. I wonder if anyone out there does de-briefs for ex-members of ponzi schemes. Sounds like it's needed.


Finch says BB is a Cult so therefore it must be. That is now a fact! You people are behaving just like lemmings. at least analyse the situation before jumping into the ocean.

[BB Defender]

This was easy for me to understand bbd. Why not ask a neighbour to explain it, perhaps with nice pictures?

OK ds you undertstand it so you explain.

[BB Defender]

It's more than "like" a cult.

What makes a cult a cult is less about the people involved or the reason for the cults' existence and more about the techniques used to control "members"

How many of the following apply to Banners Broker and/or it's members ???

By Rick Ross, Expert Consultant and Intervention Specialist

Ten warning signs of a potentially unsafe group/leader.



Absolute authoritarianism without meaningful accountability.
No tolerance for questions or critical inquiry.
No meaningful financial disclosure regarding budget, expenses such as an independently audited financial statement.
Unreasonable fear about the outside world, such as impending catastrophe, evil conspiracies and persecutions.
There is no legitimate reason to leave, former followers are always wrong in leaving, negative or even evil.
Former members often relate the same stories of abuse and reflect a similar pattern of grievances.
There are records, books, news articles, or television programs that document the abuses of the group/leader.
Followers feel they can never be "good enough".
The group/leader is always right.
The group/leader is the exclusive means of knowing "truth" or receiving validation, no other process of discovery is really acceptable or credible.


Ten warning signs regarding people involved in/with a potentially unsafe group/leader.



Extreme obsessiveness regarding the group/leader resulting in the exclusion of almost every practical consideration.
Individual identity, the group, the leader and/or God as distinct and separate categories of existence become increasingly blurred. Instead, in the follower's mind these identities become substantially and increasingly fused--as that person's involvement with the group/leader continues and deepens.
Whenever the group/leader is criticized or questioned it is characterized as "persecution".
Uncharacteristically stilted and seemingly programmed conversation and mannerisms, cloning of the group/leader in personal behavior.
Dependency upon the group/leader for problem solving, solutions, and definitions without meaningful reflective thought. A seeming inability to think independently or analyze situations without group/leader involvement.
Hyperactivity centered on the group/leader agenda, which seems to supercede any personal goals or individual interests.
A dramatic loss of spontaneity and sense of humor.
Increasing isolation from family and old friends unless they demonstrate an interest in the group/leader.
Anything the group/leader does can be justified no matter how harsh or harmful.
Former followers are at best-considered negative or worse evil and under bad influences. They can not be trusted and personal contact is avoided.



well here we go. all the signs are there, Chris Smith is now the leader of a new age cult, I wonder whether he is really an alien inside his skin and is leading all the affiliates in an invasion against humanity. This site has become a farce now with totally clueless individuals just posting their weird dreams as fact. I'm signing out for good and wont be back to even read the response.

[Joe_Shmoe]

From a reply on Finches latest Blog.

JoJo says: December 21, 2012 at 9:33 pm (http://finchsells.com/2012/12/20/banners-broker-scam-update/comment-page-1/#comment-71933)
Just in case you’re wondering what kind of man Raj Dixit is: he was charged with 2 counts of assault 1 1/2 years ago for abusing his stepchildren and common-law spouse. He will use and abuse anyone to get what he wants. This is not his first ponzi scheme he has been doing this for 10years now.

And yet he seems such a nice guy, wanting to change peoples lives around the world. :RpS_rolleyes:

[Julie Diligent]

I wonder how long Paypal will be an option on Buzinga after they have been alerted to the link between the site and Banners Broker? Time starts... now!

They incriminate themselves:

You go to a site called TownBeats... decide to buy the headphones... get sent to a site called Buzinga... transact by PayPal with the untraceable "8136655 Canada Limited"... and then receive an email saying: "Thank you for registration at Buzinga's store!" from "mbarrett@bannersbroker.com".

Muppets!

[Theseus]

We can all make exaggerated statements that baffle the mind, please clarify what point you are making in simple terms so that we can all understand what you actually mean.


I thought I had put it in simple terms, but evidently not. Actually, I sat down to write the whole BB process out, but substituting a tangible item, such as your USB stick in place of panels, but you know what, the whole thing just seemed so preposterous when explained in such a way I decided against posting it.

Seems like it may well be worth me having another go :RpS_wink:


EDIT: I've tried, and no matter how I phrase it the whole thing just sounds so ridiculous no-ne would believe it.

[Brenda]

From a reply on Finches latest Blog.

JoJo says: December 21, 2012 at 9:33 pm (http://finchsells.com/2012/12/20/banners-broker-scam-update/comment-page-1/#comment-71933)
Just in case you’re wondering what kind of man Raj Dixit is: he was charged with 2 counts of assault 1 1/2 years ago for abusing his stepchildren and common-law spouse. He will use and abuse anyone to get what he wants. This is not his first ponzi scheme he has been doing this for 10years now.

And yet he seems such a nice guy, wanting to change peoples lives around the world. :RpS_rolleyes:

the relevant agency has been made aware :)

[Theseus]

Finch says BB is a Cult so therefore it must be. That is now a fact! You people are behaving just like lemmings. at least analyse the situation before jumping into the ocean.

Irony overload :RpS_lol:

[Joe_Shmoe]

well here we go. all the signs are there, Chris Smith is now the leader of a new age cult, I wonder whether he is really an alien inside his skin and is leading all the affiliates in an invasion against humanity. This site has become a farce now with totally clueless individuals just posting their weird dreams as fact. I'm signing out for good and wont be back to even read the response.

BBD Tell me more about this Chris smith please. Education, previous employment, previous business experience? Anything please.

[AshKen1]

Finch says BB is a Cult so therefore it must be. That is now a fact! You people are behaving just like lemmings. at least analyse the situation before jumping into the ocean.

Well you will, of course, be able to provide an argument and empirical evidence that the current affiliate membership of BB does not exhibit any signs of being in a cult. Please do as soon as you can - you've seen the list of what does indicate it. We await your comments and rebuttal of the claim.

You saying things loudly (and often) doesn't convince anyone.

[Whip]

And this

2384

Seems they'll be recycling that one a few more times.

[Whip]

BBD Tell me more about this Chris smith please. Education, previous employment, previous business experience? Anything please.



Is he really white or black..............

[Theseus]

Is he really white or black..............

That's the beauty of being fictitious, you can be anything you want.....

[Theseus]

Found this, from the Oct 29 Chris Smith webnair with a translation for the terminally stupid...


Rumours

BB is NOT being investigated – Raj would know as Chief Operating Officer.

Yeah, because the authorities always tip scammers off that they're just about to get shut down

BB International is based in the Isle of Man and is fully operational

Fully operational = we have paid someone there to act as a nominee director so that we can't be found

If you spend your time answering every single nonsense, nothing would get done. Please keep that in mind.

So rush out onto realscam.com and show your complete ignorance. Use the term BLIND NETWORK as often as possible

We will not respond to blogs or forums. We have better things to do with our time.

We're far too busy touring the world for $50 investors, anyway we have a "company" taking care of that, don't we?

Chris Closed;

Are we a complete company? No

We're only missing real headquarters, a product, a legitimate funding source and a bank account though

Are we rapidly growing experiencing growing pains? Absolutely. We are putting in place the solutions to help us grow and develop into the next phase. Exciting development and future ahead.

The next phase being the bit where we run away with your money

Thank you for your effort, dedication and sacrifices that you are all making. Together we will get there.

Well, I say "we", I really mean, me, Raj and my wife, Gloria, the only bit that applies to the rest of you is the bit about sacrifices, and by that we mean your money

[Poyol]

Seems I've missed a bit!
Well, we've given hundreds of reason; evidence; and facts as to why in our opinion Banners Broker is a Ponzi scheme.

The only things I see Banners Broker defenders writing are:

*Blah blah BLIND NETWORK
*Let grown ups lose their own money; that way they'll learn!
*You don't understand the business.

I'm quite tired of the whole charade. If you don't have an actual debate - why come and buzz at us? You're like annoying flies - and this is me swatting you.

[noname999]

@BBDefender: I just have a few simple questions:

When & where did Chris Smith go to college, what did he study & what qualification did he gain?

These are very simple questions, I would appreciate simple answers.

[Joe_Shmoe]

@BBDefender: I just have a few simple questions:

When & where did Chris Smith go to college, what did he study & what qualification did he gain?

These are very simple questions, I would appreciate simple answers.



It appears the Banners Broker Defenders & Drones cannot answer this.
Why do you think that might be?
(Rhetorical to everybody except Banners Broker Defenders & Drones)

[buckyuk]

There are just endless amounts of posts on here now that are absolutely spot on, it amazes me how anyone is still joining this program.

Just goes to show how many people pile money into something off the back of a recommendation of a friend or family member without doing any research.

[Whip]

Seems I've missed a bit!
Well, we've given hundreds of reason; evidence; and facts as to why in our opinion Banners Broker is a Ponzi scheme.

The only things I see Banners Broker defenders writing are:

*Blah blah BLIND NETWORK
*Let grown ups lose their own money; that way they'll learn!
*You don't understand the business.

I'm quite tired of the whole charade. If you don't have an actual debate - why come and buzz at us? You're like annoying flies - and this is me swatting you.

That's what hypocrite trolls do.

[JordanBright]

well, banners broker is coming to india in feb 2013.. BBtour (http://thebbtour.com/)
and I never knew that this guy was chris smith, I saw him a couple of times as but in other names but still from banners broker :S

http://thebbtour.com/images/img2.jpg


by the way, try to look at the demographic of the people that came ot the "bbtour" to ireland

http://thebbtour.com/images/img4.jpg

that's really sad to see that a lot of Elderly people are there, putting their money in this ****..

[Theseus]

well, banners broker is coming to india in feb 2013.. BBtour (http://thebbtour.com/)
and I never knew that this guy was chris smith, I saw him a couple of times as but in other names but still from banners broker :S

http://thebbtour.com/images/img2.jpg


by the way, try to look at the demographic of the people that came ot the "bbtour" to ireland

http://thebbtour.com/images/img4.jpg

that's really sad to see that a lot of Elderly people are there, putting their money in this ****..


What other names did you see?

[Beacon]

2) after I started reading and posting here I asked allied wallet to remove my credit card info from their site, after two weeks of ASKING again and again to remove the card info they just closed the account, it was ok until today I asked them to look in the account and they can still look in the info and stuff, what the hell? so my credit card is still there, what can I do?



Call you credit card company and request they refund all payments . You can get back any payments you made over the last 30days in most juristictions. Ask them to do that. Then ask them to change your credit card and cancel the number they have and issue you with a new one. You will have to resubscribe to any standing orders or other regular payments. Then the credit card company will turn their artillery on Banners Broker.

[JordanBright]

What other names did you see?

all the other people, the one that got fired and the raj one had this pic but now raj is a "new man"..

another thing, found this pic on the internet the other day - http://www.mark-stokes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/BB-blind-network-partner-si.jpg

did anyone try to ask any of those sites if banners broker is really a partner, (I'm 99% sure they are not but getting the no from the is much better then what I think because it will be 100% will show more of how banners broker is just writing stuff to make it look real..

[JordanBright]

Call you credit card company and request they refund all payments . You can get back any payments you made over the last 30days in most juristictions. Ask them to do that. Then ask them to change your credit card and cancel the number they have and issue you with a new one. You will have to resubscribe to any standing orders or other regular payments. Then the credit card company will turn their artillery on Banners Broker.

already passed the 30 day mark.. so can't do that, I will just cancel this card and ask for a new one, then they can't do anything with the number, it's just that I didn't think allied wallet is a scamming people like that.. still waiting for an answer from them for the question of why they gave my credit card info to banners broker without asking me before.

Another thing, from this blog - http://www.mark-stokes.com/category/banners-broker there was a post about the people that work in banners broker -

Chris Smith CEO
Rajit Dixit COO
Lorenzo Guarini-Cooperate Canada IC
David Hooker {Sensational speaker and very British} His role is International compliance and PR type ….43 years experience in the business
Grant D’eall- International Corporate Trainer.
Stephanie Schlacht Support Training manager.

do any of you have any info about all the people but chris and rajit? because I never heard of them before and maybe they are linked with some hyips and ponzis that came before banners.

[Beacon]

"Only shooting stars break the mould"


And re the "cultlike" suggestion
I doubt it is this sophisticated and whether the BB management have either the knowledge or exoperience but Neuro Linguistic Programming woudl use business terms "breaking the mould" is one and "shooting star" is one of four types of businesses (based on high/low growth and marker share ) in the growth share matrix - CompensationMaster - Article: Cash Cow, Shooting Star, Question Mark, or Dog? (http://compensationmaster.com/articles/cash-cow.html)

People with a passing knowledge of marketing would have those terms in the back of their minds.

[Beacon]

@LRM

De-brief and de-progamming required then. Has anyone done this that you know of? Explains why people from other ponzi schemes still believing.

It isnt only cultlike . It is also part of the "follower" culture . Here is a free book ( I kid you not) from "Dr Bob" which I found very informative.

I especially refer you to Chapter 4 but please before you read anything do the 22 question quiz on page 10-12 first.
It would be nice if you posted you score here as well.

[Beacon]

Finch says BB is a Cult so therefore it must be. That is now a fact! You people are behaving just like lemmings. at least analyse the situation before jumping into the ocean.

I have an open mind on it. Di you do the quiz on page 10-12? http://members.shaw.ca/jeanaltemeyer/drbob/TheAuthoritarians.pdf
Please reply with your answers and you can perform the analysis you requested.

[Whip]

already passed the 30 day mark.. so can't do that, I will just cancel this card and ask for a new one, then they can't do anything with the number, it's just that I didn't think allied wallet is a scamming people like that.. still waiting for an answer from them for the question of why they gave my credit card info to banners broker without asking me before.

Another thing, from this blog - Banners Broker | Mark Stokes (http://www.mark-stokes.com/category/banners-broker) there was a post about the people that work in banners broker -

Chris Smith CEO
Rajit Dixit COO
Lorenzo Guarini-Cooperate Canada IC
David Hooker {Sensational speaker and very British} His role is International compliance and PR type ….43 years experience in the business
Grant D’eall- International Corporate Trainer.
Stephanie Schlacht Support Training manager.

do any of you have any info about all the people but chris and rajit? because I never heard of them before and maybe they are linked with some hyips and ponzis that came before banners.

what does their TOS say? I wouldn't doubt a clause snuck in there about sharing info.

[Beacon]

Is he really white or black..............

LOL I just thought - How about "50 Shades of Grey"?

[Beacon]

already passed the 30 day mark.. so can't do that,

I disagree. And it might not just be assisting you. One can argue the money was not a legit transaction. If it was a legit business then you can't get it back yes. But you are telling the Credit Card company you were defrauded by an illegal scam. Not alone will they freeze your card but flag any payments to any allied sources or scams. Direct them to this thread and the addresses people and businesses in it. Point out if they are an ethically responsible company they should act on such information. It may take some time but at least you are on the list of creditors.

... it's just that I didn't think allied wallet is a scamming people like that.. still waiting for an answer from them for the question of why they gave my credit card info to banners broker without asking me before.
[/quote]
Are you sure allied wallet isnt also a scam? I dont know anything about them.
The credit card company and the regulator would be interested in their behaviour. You probably have a case against them as well to recover your damages.



Another thing, from this blogdo any of you have any info about all the people but chris and rajit? because I never heard of them before and maybe they are linked with some hyips and ponzis that came before banners.

yes I posted about one ther other day Banners Broker Brand Ambassador Lorenzo Guarini

There was a Lorenzo Guarini listed as an executive in Raj Dixit's housing scam.


and an excellent post by Ms Dilligent links his partner/wife with the scam.

http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index187.html#post37239

[Beacon]

all the other people, the one that got fired and the raj one had this pic but now raj is a "new man"..

another thing, found this pic on the internet the other day - http://www.mark-stokes.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/BB-blind-network-partner-si.jpg

did anyone try to ask any of those sites if banners broker is really a partner, (I'm 99% sure they are not but getting the no from the is much better then what I think because it will be 100% will show more of how banners broker is just writing stuff to make it look real..

Again other posters have listed a lot of the so called "partners" are hollywood sets - i.e. you go around the back and they are held together with noting of substance. They are lumped on single servers and put there to give the appearance of a site which has adds on it. the fake writers and inane content is repeated often. In short ther dont appear to be any partners. any associated companies are the same people. for example "Stellar Point" is actually the same company and not a company "contracted to do refunds" . The change of name doccuments have been posted here. Banners Broker canada doesn't actually exist anymore!

[JordanBright]

[QUOTE=Beacon;37467]
about the legit transaction, that will be a lie if I tell them that, I did do a transaction from my credit card to allied wallet, BUT I did not do a transaction to banners broker, only paid with what I loaded to my ewallet in alliedwallet.. so I can't lie about that.

what I'm going to do is talk about flagging payments to or from allied wallet sources.

about directing them to this thread, don't know about that..

I will wait to see if allied wallet will send an email until tomorrow and then we will see what I do..

it's kinda scary thinking that banners broker not only has and I.D picture and the I.D number of you they also got your credit card number and I'm sure the cvv is also in their hands.. with the I.D they can't do anything to me but with the credit info + the i.d.. that's a whole new story.

[JordanBright]

Again other posters have listed a lot of the so called "partners" are hollywood sets - i.e. you go around the back and they are held together with noting of substance. They are lumped on single servers and put there to give the appearance of a site which has adds on it. the fake writers and inane content is repeated often. In short ther dont appear to be any partners. any associated companies are the same people. for example "Stellar Point" is actually the same company and not a company "contracted to do refunds" . The change of name doccuments have been posted here. Banners Broker canada doesn't actually exist anymore!

what is "Stellar point" ?

[Whip]

what is "Stellar point" ?

On this board, it would be and excellent statement made.......out in the world, it is a new name of the banners broker scam.

[kiwi chick nz]

Stellar Point has been discussed frequently on this forum, it a scapegoat, opps I mean company owned by raj and gloria, I suggest you look back through this discussion
kiwi

[kiwi chick nz]

As i suspected all negative facebook posts have been deleted.......would like a bb defender to explain this ...

[Beacon]

what is "Stellar point" ?

Stellar point according to Banners Broker are the company they ciontracted to do refunds and who operate out of an office in Canada


BannersBroker (http://bannersbroker.com/main/refund_policy_int)



Banners Broker International has contracted with Stellar Point, Inc. to handle all refund and cancellation requests for the company. Therefore, all requests must be sent to the following address:

Stellar Point, Inc.
5 Carlow Court
Whitby, ON L1N 9T7


But in fact Banners Broker changed its name some months ago to Stellar Point


https://www.ic.gc.ca/app/scr/cc/CorporationsCanada/fdrlCrpDtls.html?corpId=7250037&V_TOKEN=1356112783432&crpNm=Stellar




Corporate Name History

2009-09-28 to 2012-02-22 7250037 CANADA INC.


2012-02-22 to 2012-07-30 Bannersbroker Limited


2012-07-30 to Present Stellar Point INC.


Not alone that but the arddress is occupied by another company for decades
Durham Energy Specialist Ltd. - Consulting Engineers (http://www.durhamenergy.com/) click on "contact us"

If anything they probably rented a small table space or even just a mailbox certainly not offices for 100 employees as they claim - without any pictures!

[JordanBright]

On this board, it would be and excellent statement made.......out in the world, it is a new name of the banners broker scam.


Stellar Point has been discussed frequently on this forum, it a scapegoat, opps I mean company owned by raj and gloria, I suggest you look back through this discussion
kiwi


Tisochritifaos Ltd
Cyprus/ Greece: The office will be closed from December 22- January 1

CM Consulting
France: The office will be closed from December 21- January 2

North Star Support
Iceland/Sweden The office will be closed from December 21 - January 1

Banners Broker India
India: Banners Broker India office will closed only on Christmas Day - December 25

Stellar Point Inc.
International The office will be closed from December 21 - January 2

Macoone Online Marketing
Ireland: The office will be closed from December 21 - 26, December 29 - January 2

Exclusivalcance Unipessoal Lda
Portugal: The office will be closed on December 24 - 25, December 31 and January 1

Imander Associates S.L.
Spain: The office will be closed from December 22 - January 6

so that's whats the company is called like.. apart from this section you can't find a place in banners broker where they talk about Stellar Point..

oh and by the way kiwi chick nz, just clicked on the facebook and saw my post there, lol. don't know if you NEED to ask me to put that there but next time please do, I don't want banners broker to know what is my banners account so they won't just close it and run with my I.D pic and credit card info..

[AshKen1]

[QUOTE=Beacon;37467]
about the legit transaction, that will be a lie if I tell them that, I did do a transaction from my credit card to allied wallet, BUT I did not do a transaction to banners broker, only paid with what I loaded to my ewallet in alliedwallet.. so I can't lie about that.

what I'm going to do is talk about flagging payments to or from allied wallet sources.

about directing them to this thread, don't know about that..

I will wait to see if allied wallet will send an email until tomorrow and then we will see what I do..

it's kinda scary thinking that banners broker not only has and I.D picture and the I.D number of you they also got your credit card number and I'm sure the cvv is also in their hands.. with the I.D they can't do anything to me but with the credit info + the i.d.. that's a whole new story.

Jordan if you are worried, get in contact with your bank before they close for Christmas (2 days in UK) so you can arrange a new card and alert them to the fact you think your card has been compromised. Usually, this means that any strange transactions will be blocked and they may well contact you to check out what is going on. They will also issue you with new card.

[EagleOne]

Jordan most credit card companies allow you 60 days to disupte a transaction now, not 30 as before. This changed about 4 years ago.

[Theseus]

already passed the 30 day mark.. so can't do that, I will just cancel this card and ask for a new one, then they can't do anything with the number, it's just that I didn't think allied wallet is a scamming people like that.. still waiting for an answer from them for the question of why they gave my credit card info to banners broker without asking me before.

Another thing, from this blog - Banners Broker | Mark Stokes (http://www.mark-stokes.com/category/banners-broker) there was a post about the people that work in banners broker -

Chris Smith CEO
Rajit Dixit COO
Lorenzo Guarini-Cooperate Canada IC
David Hooker {Sensational speaker and very British} His role is International compliance and PR type ….43 years experience in the business
Grant D’eall- International Corporate Trainer.
Stephanie Schlacht Support Training manager.

do any of you have any info about all the people but chris and rajit? because I never heard of them before and maybe they are linked with some hyips and ponzis that came before banners.

Lots of information on all of them, what do you want to know?


If it saves time, they're all scammers, and the involvement of any of them should raise a big red flag.....

[amathyst87]

Its not really a bad analogy amathyst, you can also witness an impression and be the source of an impression, just go to google and type in "dishwasher" or "kettle" or any other commodity, the first things you see on the results page are adverts from retailers of these commodities. By viewing these adverts you have provided google with an impression/s which they have sold in advance to those advertisers. Google have therefore supplied a service/good/impression to their customers and have a legitimate claim to be payed by the advertiser.

When bannersbroker say they drive traffic to your website it means they have the ability to buy traffic/impressions from the blind network (see link for definition Advertising network - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advertising_network)) and have your banner ad seen by that traffic visiting the blind network. If your ad is seen then there is a likely chance that your ad will be clicked on and people will visit your website.

Also you have overlooked the possibility that today's web technology means that your ad can be served on any one of many banners within an ad network. The ad can move about from site to site depending on the where traffic is available this is the job of the brokers that control the network.

Furthermore there is even newer web technology called RTB real time bidding that allows advertisers to bid for a specific impression at the time the impression is being served. I think google may have invented this, just google this up and it will open your eyes to how advanced the online advertising industry has become. Gone are the days of fixed banner ads on websites waiting for that websites organic traffic to come and see it, its now all about targeting the right ad to the right people, its so much more lucrative.

Christ, I don't even know where to start with this. I work for the online team of a marketing department for a market leading UK company. I deal with this stuff every single day and I can tell you in no uncertain terms what Banners Broker (and subsequently your fine self) is spouting is absolute waffle.

Oh dear is all I have to say.

[littleroundman]

Are you sure allied wallet isnt also a scam? I dont know anything about them.

Isn't that the whole point ????

Which Banners Broker member DOES know anything about them ???

For that matter, which Banners Broker member knows anything about ANY of the payment processors they have used ???

Think about it.

Not only have people sent off money to a company they have never heard of, run by people who may or may not exist, they've done it via payment processors they never knew existed, which are based in overseas jurisdictions and are also run by who knows who ??

How many of the Banners Broker members even knew "payment processors" existed prior to joining ??

AND, on top of that, they've also sent off their most vital pieces of identification to these unknown people, as well.

Is it any wonder law enforcement officials tear their hair out in frustration ???

I couldn't imagine a more perfect scenario for mass identity fraud, mass credit card fraud and mass bank account draining if I tried.

AND

what's worse, all of the potential victims did it willingly and eagerly.

[Joe_Shmoe]

Probably nothing will come of it but I have just sent YouTube some feedback suggesting they remove all the videos promoting Banners Broker on YouTube as they are promoting an international Ponzi Scheme. I have pointed them to here & Finches Blog.

It only takes a couple of mins using the YouTube feedback tool that also takes a screen shot.

The more the merrier. Send YouTube your feedback, as basically they are unwitting enablers.
2385

[Beacon]

Isn't that the whole point ????


I looked up allied Wallet .com

https://www.alliedwallet.com/the-sunday-telegraph-details-how-allied-wallet-helps-business-grow/

Funny how
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/search/?queryText=+december+17+Sunday+Allied+Wallet

Reveals Zero results?

Having worked both writing for and making PR to attract Press coverage:
The above Press Release
1. Has no name or contact address phone email
2. Is written in a very unorthodox style
The "about" link https://www.alliedwallet.com/about/ contains no information about allied Wallett - company number, Board members, contacts, offices.

The complaince link has no policies on it, no link to the Statutory requirements. In fact you do not even know what state it is in other than the Press release mentions LA!

and this
https://www.alliedwallet.com/the-guardian-recognizes-allied-wallet-as-face-of-payment-innovation/
Claiming to be a Press Release lol "has been commended by the British daily news provider, The Guardian, for their innovation and achievements in the digital payment industry."
Passive form of verb? In a press release. Long meandering intro? And then using the same style as the previous one a paragraph detailing the circulation figures of The Guardian. "Is this PR for Allied Wallet or The Guardian" I would ask the writer before I told them to edit it or get a new job.

,At least it mentions , Andy Khawaja and gives an author A.J. Almeda who at least has a linkedin page
A.J. Almeda | LinkedIn (http://www.linkedin.com/pub/a-j-almeda/39/58b/244)

Which lists the background of this Marketing Co Ordinator in a credit and finance company.....

California State University-Long Beach
Liberal Arts, English

Doesnt mention whether it was a degree. His last job was a Lab Technician. Mind you as CEO he does not mention that but instead says "marketing co - ordinator"

Doesnt Californian Law require some regulation of people running credit institutions?

The CEO
http://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=162315281&authType=name&authToken=2VYD&goback=%2Enpp_%2Fa*5j*5almeda%2F39%2F58b%2F244&trk=prof-sb-browse_map-name
Andy Khawaja - with a very fuzzy picture? says he founded Allied Wallet in 2002 but didnt seem to do anything. Admits the company only began tyo grow since 2005.
Funny how during all this growth it has no press coverage until December 2012?

No way should anyone give ANY personal information let alone credit card data to such a source!

The domain www.alliedwallet.com is hosted from IP address 67.138.106.228, having reverse-lookup 67.138.106.228 and inward-pointing nameservers . According to records, www.alliedwallet.com is the only domain hosted from this IP address. The server hosting www.alliedwallet.com is located in a data center in Riverton, UT, United States.

Their contact page gives a London address
1 Northumberland Avenue, Trafalgar Square. London, WC2N 5BW. United Kingdom
Where just anyone can rent an office:
Serviced offices London Trafalgar Square to Rent & Let - Regus UK (http://www.regus.co.uk/locations/office-space/london-trafalgar-square)
or even a post box?

and the IT support contact?
7525 E Camelback #208
Scottsdale AZ 85251

Ironically, The domain banners-broker-site.com is currently hosted on a server located in Scottsdale AZ, United States with the IP address 68.178.232.100.


Allied Wallet had an address ther in 2008
Isnt internet archiving wonderfull?
Prohibited Merchant list | Allied Wallet (http://web.archive.org/web/20100211144208/http://www.alliedwallet.com/prohibited-merchant-list.html)



Prohibited Sectors


Allied Wallet will not process for any of these products or services.

Animals

Alcohol

Body Parts

Child Pornography

Drugs

eWallets

Money Transfer Businesses

Online gaming or Gambling in the USA (USA Cards must be blocked 7995 MCC)

Pharmacy: Controlled Substances

Prostitution

Tobacco (when sent outside of your country and/or state)
Weapons


Whats that ? No "eWallets" ? or
Money Transfer Businesses ?

Better tell the BB associates about that.

[Hypanor]

I thought there was an interesting point to this Facebook post:

"Zurab Shonia Dear BB team, There is bug in program which maintains Personal Information in the back office.
In The Government Identification section of the Account General Information to me, country was changed (do not understandable how) from Georgia to South Ossetia and I cannot change it back to Georgia. I am trying to edit, choose from combo box “Georgia” then click save, but in the country box displayed “South Ossetia” again. South Ossetia is not country, it is part of Georgia separated and occupied by Russian Federation. The country code for South Ossetia and Abkhazia is same as for Georgia and for this reason instead of Georgia and Abkhazia BB data base always would be displayed South Ossetia. South Ossetia and Abkhazia are not recognized by United Nations and they are not listed in the country lists of Operation Systems (e.g. MS windows). Therefore neither South Ossetia nor Abkhazia would be listed in country combo box. Please remove these parts of Georgia from your database countries list and I think this will remove a bug from your program.
BTW today my panels start to working, were not update since 11th Dec.
Thank you. 2012-12-21

Why would South Ossetia be listed as a country? Russia is one of the few that recognises it as a separate state - The UN and majority of the world see it as a region of Georgia. Those not familiar with world events, might like to familiarise themselves with the century old conflict Georgian (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgian%E2%80%93Ossetian_conflict)

As the post above says, you will never find South Ossetia in any 'normal' country list when signing up for something. It would be like having 'New South Wales' or 'California' listed as a country. However looking at the list of countries in the BB account area, there are many hand-added locations tacked onto the end of the standard list.

2386

2387

[littleroundman]

I looked up allied Wallet .com

https://www.alliedwallet.com/the-sunday-telegraph-details-how-allied-wallet-helps-business-grow/

Funny how
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/search/?queryText=+december+17+Sunday+Allied+Wallet

Reveals Zero results?

Having worked both writing for and making PR to attract Press coverage:
The above Press Release
1. Has no name or contact address phone email
2. Is written in a very unorthodox style
The "about" link https://www.alliedwallet.com/about/ contains no information about allied Wallett - company number, Board members, contacts, offices.

The complaince link has no policies on it, no link to the Statutory requirements. In fact you do not even know what state it is in other than the Press release mentions LA!

and this
https://www.alliedwallet.com/the-guardian-recognizes-allied-wallet-as-face-of-payment-innovation/
Claiming to be a Press Release lol "has been commended by the British daily news provider, The Guardian, for their innovation and achievements in the digital payment industry."
Passive form of verb? In a press release. Long meandering intro? And then using the same style as the previous one a paragraph detailing the circulation figures of The Guardian. "Is this PR for Allied Wallet or The Guardian" I would ask the writer before I told them to edit it or get a new job.

,At least it mentions , Andy Khawaja and gives an author A.J. Almeda who at least has a linkedin page
A.J. Almeda | LinkedIn (http://www.linkedin.com/pub/a-j-almeda/39/58b/244)

Which lists the background of this Marketing Co Ordinator in a credit and finance company.....

California State University-Long Beach
Liberal Arts, English

Doesnt mention whether it was a degree. His last job was a Lab Technician. Mind you as CEO he does not mention that but instead says "marketing co - ordinator"

Doesnt Californian Law require some regulation of people running credit institutions?

The CEO
http://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=162315281&authType=name&authToken=2VYD&goback=%2Enpp_%2Fa*5j*5almeda%2F39%2F58b%2F244&trk=prof-sb-browse_map-name
Andy Khawaja - with a very fuzzy picture? says he founded Allied Wallet in 2002 but didnt seem to do anything. Admits the company only began tyo grow since 2005.
Funny how during all this growth it has no press coverage until December 2012?

No way should anyone give ANY personal information let alone credit card data to such a source!

The domain www.alliedwallet.com (http://www.alliedwallet.com) is hosted from IP address 67.138.106.228, having reverse-lookup 67.138.106.228 and inward-pointing nameservers . According to records, www.alliedwallet.com (http://www.alliedwallet.com) is the only domain hosted from this IP address. The server hosting www.alliedwallet.com (http://www.alliedwallet.com) is located in a data center in Riverton, UT, United States.

Their contact page gives a London address
1 Northumberland Avenue, Trafalgar Square. London, WC2N 5BW. United Kingdom
Where just anyone can rent an office:
Serviced offices London Trafalgar Square to Rent & Let - Regus UK (http://www.regus.co.uk/locations/office-space/london-trafalgar-square)
or even a post box?

and the IT support contact?
7525 E Camelback #208
Scottsdale AZ 85251

Ironically, The domain banners-broker-site.com is currently hosted on a server located in Scottsdale AZ, United States with the IP address 68.178.232.100.


Allied Wallet had an address ther in 2008
Isnt internet archiving wonderfull?
Prohibited Merchant list | Allied Wallet (http://web.archive.org/web/20100211144208/http://www.alliedwallet.com/prohibited-merchant-list.html)



Whats that ? No "eWallets" ? or
Money Transfer Businesses ?

Better tell the BB associates about that.

Don't you love the thought processes that go into trusting something you've never heard of before called "Allied Wallet" or something similar and sending off your hard earned to it or them ??

So, this guy named Tony Soprano opens up a payment processor called "Bada-Bing E Wallet"

He register it in Britain using a serviced office address, uses a Utah address in the U.S.A. and website servers in a different U.S. state.

He nominates a whole heap of known HYIP ponzi fraudsters as "office bearers" and opens for business while associating the payment processor with a HYIP ponzi fraud.

Maybe it's just me, but, I sure as h*** wouldn't be rushing to send Mr Soprano my hard earned, much less allowing he or his friends within a country mile of my identity documents and bank account or credit card details.

Substitute the name "Soprano" for "Smith" and bada-bing, bada-boom, the Allied Wallet story in a nutshell.

[JordanBright]

Jordan most credit card companies allow you 60 days to disupte a transaction now, not 30 as before. This changed about 4 years ago.

already passed the 60 day mark too.. but I will talk to them.

by the way guys, you didn't look up all the things about allied wallet, allied wallet was in the news - FBI — Payment Processors Agree to Forfeit More Than $13 Million in Funds Traced to Money Laundering and Online Gambling (http://www.fbi.gov/newyork/press-releases/2010/nyfo081710b.htm) :)

[Theseus]

2390


So, you buy a 15,000 sq ft building and after a few months of BB ownership you get....

Twice Ya Floorspace? :RpS_lol:

But hold on, Banners Broker bought 5 Carlow Court? Surely that's the home of Stellar Point?

2391

Why are BB the ones paying to buy and refurbish the premises of an (allegedly) independent company?

Source (http://www.workingbb.com/what-s-new/dublin-reflections/)

[Dreamstealer]

I thought I had put it in simple terms, but evidently not. Actually, I sat down to write the whole BB process out, but substituting a tangible item, such as your USB stick in place of panels, but you know what, the whole thing just seemed so preposterous when explained in such a way I decided against posting it.

Seems like it may well be worth me having another go :RpS_wink:


EDIT: I've tried, and no matter how I phrase it the whole thing just sounds so ridiculous no-ne would believe it.

Your first post was simple to understand. You couldn't have put it in any simpler terms. Anyone saying that they didn't understand it either didn't read it properly, is lying, or educationally challenged. I suspect I know which of the 3 I'm going with. Don't waste your time on him.

[Jerrygo]

well now. A ponzi scheme, run by a person with proven previous involvement in ponzi scams, (and some of the team of the previous ponzi) is being facilitated by a payment processor who has been fined 13million dollars for money laundering, and is on the FBI website.
A convenient marriage. I think the FBI might be interested in this collaboration. After all there are real and increasing fears about money laundering accross borders, terrorism, identity theft etc. This damn thing goes from bad to worse.

[Beacon]

Jordan most credit card companies allow you 60 days to disupte a transaction now, not 30 as before. This changed about 4 years ago.

Yes I accept that. But that is in relation to a "cooling off" period in case you changed your mind isnt it?
Obviously an illegal scam isnt offering something for your consideration where money changes hands. the "offer" is fake so you are entitled to your money back. all of it! And to the person who suggested he will stay in even though he knows it is a scam, I suggest he uses the same greed logic and gets first in the queue for damages because when people want their money back they may well come calling tio him and only when he says he already reported the scam and asked for people to be paid back will he be safe from paying damages himself. Otherwise he is knowingly participating in the scam and the legal authorities will begin with the likes of him befoe they get to fry the big fish.

[Theseus]

2393



Ian Driscoll

There's my friend Jeff, I met Jeff in December (2011) in Toronto, Canada, where I touched the building, met all the programming staff, met Chris Smith, the owner.... and we're like brothers, although Chris is from Jamaica originally

2392

Question: Jeff Who?

[Beacon]

2390


So, you buy a 15,000 sq ft building and after a few months of BB ownership you get....

Twice Ya Floorspace? :RpS_lol:

But hold on, Banners Broker bought 5 Carlow Court? Surely that's the home of Stellar Point?

2391

Why are BB the ones paying to buy and refurbish the premises of an (allegedly) independent company?

Source (http://www.workingbb.com/what-s-new/dublin-reflections/)

We know stellar Point are in fact just the same company with a new name.
But the building has been used by Durham Energy Specialist Ltd. - Consulting Engineers (http://www.durhamenergy.com/)
for decades and they havent left it!

Also I reckon about 150 foot (pushing it probably nearer 140) by 50 foot ( again pushing probably 40) by two floors
Thats about 150*50*2= 15,000 total per floor and that is pushing it . And not including toilets corridors etc.
So I assume they rented a mailbox there or a small office with a phone and table from Duram Energy.

Maybe someone should contact DE and tell them about this?

[Theseus]

We know stellar Point are in fact just the same company with a new name.
But the building has been used by Durham Energy Specialist Ltd. - Consulting Engineers (http://www.durhamenergy.com/)
for decades and they havent left it!

Also I reckon about 150 foot (pushing it probably nearer 140) by 50 foot ( again pushing probably 40) by two floors
Thats about 150*50*2= 15,000 total per floor and that is pushing it . And not including toilets corridors etc.
So I assume they rented a mailbox there or a small office with a phone and table from Duram Energy.

Maybe someone should contact DE and tell them about this?

Well, as of yet we don't know for certain that DES still occupy those premises, but if anyone feels like contacting them to find out then the man to ask is

Michael Dlugosz
President
905-424-1117
mike.durhamgroup@rogers.com

[Beacon]

Threads are now being blocked and deleted on Linkedin too.

[Jerrygo]

Threads are now being blocked and deleted on Linkedin too.

Damage limitation.

[Beacon]

I suggest people join as many Linkedin groups as ppossible and post the FBI link on allied Wallet and the company name change link from Canada as well as the link to the actual offices being occupied.

[Beacon]

Damage limitation.

Yes but the people doing it are then colluding with the scam and cant claim they didnt know about it. Willful ignorance is not the same as ignorance. They are been shown about it but their greed or fear of losing money is mitigating in the direction of ignoring the problem. That makes them liable for damages IMHO.

I think maybe all Linkedin BB group mods should be contacted and asked if they wish to ignore the evidence.
Some may be honest in their dealings. Any who delete legal company and law enforcement references are being dishonest and liable. It also opens up a "locus standi" in that people being discriminated against have standing to take a complaint. If you arent actually directly affected you have no standing to make any claim for damages or reparations.

[Theseus]

As we all know, from fairly early on BB claimed to pay out "$1 million a day" to it's affiliates, which is odd as I'm watching a video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNN_ZQ-ctVc) (warning: very poor sound) of Ian Driscoll from Oct 2012, where he states (11:40)


On the 2nd of January this year the company had roughly 20,000 affiliates and had paid out roughly $20 million

That's a fair bit away from $1 million a day (about $950,000 away, if you wish to be pedantic) and only equates to $1,000 each. He then goes on to say that 9 months later, with 160,000 affiliates they have now paid out "more than $200 million". Again, that's still nowhere near "$1 million a day" and considering that the likes of Driscoll himself will have been syphoning it out as quickly as possible it would suggest that many, many people haven't seen any real cash from this at all.

[AshKen1]

well now. A ponzi scheme, run by a person with proven previous involvement in ponzi scams, (and some of the team of the previous ponzi) is being facilitated by a payment processor who has been fined 13million dollars for money laundering, and is on the FBI website.
A convenient marriage. I think the FBI might be interested in this collaboration. After all there are real and increasing fears about money laundering accross borders, terrorism, identity theft etc. This damn thing goes from bad to worse.

Reminds me that Poyol contacted AW a while to inform them that BB was breaking AW's terms and conditions and was ignored. Makes you wonder why... not...

[AshKen1]

Yes but the people doing it are then colluding with the scam and cant claim they didnt know about it. Willful ignorance is not the same as ignorance. They are been shown about it but their greed or fear of losing money is mitigating in the direction of ignoring the problem. That makes them liable for damages IMHO.

I think maybe all Linkedin BB group mods should be contacted and asked if they wish to ignore the evidence.
Some may be honest in their dealings. Any who delete legal company and law enforcement references are being dishonest and liable. It also opens up a "locus standi" in that people being discriminated against have standing to take a complaint. If you arent actually directly affected you have no standing to make any claim for damages or reparations.


I am sure that BB would really welcome a judicial review in the UK at this moment in time. I'd say no more on the matter at the moment and just watch them panic..........


We know you're watching BB. This is the best place for your information isn't it. Probably better communication on here than there is in your "company".

:watching_you:

[Whip]

It isnt only cultlike . It is also part of the "follower" culture . Here is a free book ( I kid you not) from "Dr Bob" which I found very informative.

I especially refer you to Chapter 4 but please before you read anything do the 22 question quiz on page 10-12 first.
It would be nice if you posted you score here as well.

But then wouldn't we be following you? http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v649/Whip412/376a.gif

[Theseus]

Another Driscoll gem (21:21 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNN_ZQ-ctVc))....



Do you know how credible you've got to be to get Banners Broker alongside Mastercard? It doesn't just happen by accident, you've got to put a lot of money aside for clawbacks, fraud and all the rest of it. So you're going to leave here today and tell a mate about this tomorrow and they're going to say it's a ponzi scheme, it's a scam, you're going to lose your money. Well can I ask you a question, do you think your mate next door or at work knows more about business than Mastercard does?

No, but then this is what Mastercard said when I contacted them


MasterCard does not endorse Banners Broker

so whilst my mate next door might not know more about Banners Broker than Mastercard, we do....

[JordanBright]

Well, as of yet we don't know for certain that DES still occupy those premises, but if anyone feels like contacting them to find out then the man to ask is

Michael Dlugosz
President
905-424-1117
mike.durhamgroup@rogers.com

did anyone send an email to them? I'm going to send one right now.

can anyone point me to where they said what is their new office place so I can show them?

[noname999]

For all the BB shills and cheerleaders reading this thread...

I have asked you repeatedly for information on Chris Smith. You cannot provide it. So my question to you all is:

Why is there no information about this Chris Smith?

The answer is obvious. So the next time you want to lie about doing due diligence, don't bother. The very first thing you would do is check up on the owner of the company you are investing in.This is the simplest due diligence of all.

[Jerrygo]

After a couple of replies from mastercard with the usual "we do not endorse mastercard" last week i got an email from someone who seemed a bit more interested. He asked me what were the grounds for my statement that bb were bringing MC into disrepute. And what evidence that bb were still claiming to be endorsed by MC. In a lengthy reply I gave them the quote from the head of bb in Ireland, "Would you think MasterCard would leave us use their logo if we weren’t compliant" and the link for Examiner interview by McCarthy. With of course the sunday world crime reporters investigation revealing that it is a ponzi.
I think that when enough complaints are received by the likes of MC, then they start to sit up and notice.

[Jerrygo]

BannersBroker (http://bannersbroker.com/main/contactus)

@ Jordanbright The more people you write to. And the more things you check the better.


did anyone send an email to them? I'm going to send one right now.

can anyone point me to where they said what is their new office place so I can show them?

[Jerrygo]

When I was getting that link for Jordanbright, I thought i would look up the Cork office, I notice there is no mention of Kinvara house on there yet . Address is listed as: Regus, City Gate, Mahon,Cork, Ireland. When I did a look up on regis in mahon I came to this. Rent Virtual Offices in Cork City Gate - Regus Republic of Ireland (http://www.regus.ie/locations/virtual-office/cork-city-gate) !!! Is this the virtual office in which the 17 virtual workers are virtually working?

[Theseus]

Well, as of yet we don't know for certain that DES still occupy those premises, but if anyone feels like contacting them to find out then the man to ask is

Michael Dlugosz
President
905-424-1117
mike.durhamgroup@rogers.com

Actually this seems like more up to date contact info

Leanne Skribe
Title: President
Area of Responsibility: Research/Development/Engineering
Telephone: (905) 430-7151
Fax: (905) 430-7154
Email: info@durhamenergy.com

[Theseus]

When I was getting that link for Jordanbright, I thought i would look up the Cork office, I notice there is no mention of Kinvara house on there yet . Address is listed as: Regus, City Gate, Mahon,Cork, Ireland. When I did a look up on regis in mahon I came to this. Rent Virtual Offices in Cork City Gate - Regus Republic of Ireland (http://www.regus.ie/locations/virtual-office/cork-city-gate) !!! Is this the virtual office in which the 17 virtual workers are virtually working?

They've also listed it as "Macoone Online Marketing and then there's the matter of the VAT number that shows up as fake when you run it through the EC verifier...

[Jerrygo]

Every part of bb that you look into turns out to be smoke and mirrors. Prestigeous office in cork with 17 employees busy beavering away, turns out to be a 69euro postal dropbox. Fake vat numbers. And on it goes. What will be next? Chris smith is really Raj's twin brother?

[noname999]

When I was getting that link for Jordanbright, I thought i would look up the Cork office, I notice there is no mention of Kinvara house on there yet . Address is listed as: Regus, City Gate, Mahon,Cork, Ireland. When I did a look up on regis in mahon I came to this. Rent Virtual Offices in Cork City Gate - Regus Republic of Ireland (http://www.regus.ie/locations/virtual-office/cork-city-gate) !!! Is this the virtual office in which the 17 virtual workers are virtually working?

I have been to that place and talked to the receptionist. She confirmed that there are no offices of BB there...surprise! surprise!
(And that was at a time before they supposedly moved to Kinvara House)

I wonder how much Paul had to pay to rent an office in Kinvara House for an hour, so he could do the Sunday World interview...

[Beacon]

But then wouldn't we be following you? http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v649/Whip412/376a.gif

No you are free to post your score or not.
As i stated i would like if you do. Im not forcing or demanding you do.
Furthermore I want your opinion rather than telling you how to think or respond.
It isn't the same at all!

[okosh]

Threads are now being blocked and deleted on Linkedin too.

All part of the exit stratergy......

[JordanBright]

BannersBroker (http://bannersbroker.com/main/contactus)

@ Jordanbright The more people you write to. And the more things you check the better.

just sent an email, let's hope they see and answer emails on christmas


Actually this seems like more up to date contact info

Leanne Skribe
Title: President
Area of Responsibility: Research/Development/Engineering
Telephone: (905) 430-7151
Fax: (905) 430-7154
Email: info@durhamenergy.com

sent her and every other worker in the company the mail.


When I was getting that link for Jordanbright, I thought i would look up the Cork office, I notice there is no mention of Kinvara house on there yet . Address is listed as: Regus, City Gate, Mahon,Cork, Ireland. When I did a look up on regis in mahon I came to this. Rent Virtual Offices in Cork City Gate - Regus Republic of Ireland (http://www.regus.ie/locations/virtual-office/cork-city-gate) !!! Is this the virtual office in which the 17 virtual workers are virtually working?

can't find a way to contact them in email, can you find it?

[Beacon]

another person in denian or part of the scam.
Banners Broker Is Not A Scam, Find The Undeniable Evidence Here | (http://jensholvoet.com/banners-broker-is-not-a-scam-find-the-undeniable-evidence-here/?goback=%2Egmr_4403417%2Egde_4403417_member_197771 763%2Egmr_4403417%2Egde_4403417_member_196313833)

[dolan1]

Today first time post spent time arguing with friends about this today told them all the facts and figures got shouted and was shouted down then privately one of the friends told me he knew it was a ponzi and of the others really shouted me out cause we were all idiots and he was right cause we didn't know how it all worked. At least someone does!

[dolan1]

Soz not very clear try and make it a bit clearer. The person who was shouting was the leader if the group who got everyone else into the scheme but his friends r starting to realise what it really is. Thanks to poyal for good post.

[Whip]

No you are free to post your score or not.
As i stated i would like if you do. Im not forcing or demanding you do.
Furthermore I want your opinion rather than telling you how to think or respond.
It isn't the same at all!

It was only a joke.

[Whip]

another person in denian or part of the scam.
Banners Broker Is Not A Scam, Find The Undeniable Evidence Here | (http://jensholvoet.com/banners-broker-is-not-a-scam-find-the-undeniable-evidence-here/?goback=%2Egmr_4403417%2Egde_4403417_member_197771 763%2Egmr_4403417%2Egde_4403417_member_196313833)

Seems to be lacking 'undeniable evidence'. Shocking I say!

[StevenHoward]

Seems to be lacking 'undeniable evidence'. Shocking I say!

A quote directly from his page "I don’t really care if you join or not,".

So why go to the trouble of creating a web page all about BB?.

Why put a link on that page to your own BB signup link?.

Why on the sleep apnea page is the only advert one for Banners Broker?, why not one for Pepsi, Argos, Sainsburys, A packet of nuts, a newspaper, a mobile phone company........................................... you get the idea ?.


Could it be because there really is no "blind network", show me a few ads from high street names and I'll accept BB is a legitimate business and "invest" some more of my hard earned cash, oh heck, I can't invest.

Only that's a load of codswallop (see mods, I'm trying to keep this clean) , here's a definition from a dictionary of the word invest.

"To put (money) to use, by purchase or expenditure, in something offering potential profitable returns, as interest, income, or appreciation in value.".

See BB *****IS***** an investment, no matter how you look at it, this alone should start alarm bells ringing amongst the BB faithful.

[Joe_Shmoe]

Seems to be lacking 'undeniable evidence'. Shocking I say!

Jens Holvoet say "However, people are entitled to the truth, so I think it’s only fair to finally end the discussion forever."

There you go he has ended the discussion forever lets hear no more about it.

(or some might say he recycled the same old Banners Broker drivel)

[Theseus]

another person in denian or part of the scam.
Banners Broker Is Not A Scam, Find The Undeniable Evidence Here | (http://jensholvoet.com/banners-broker-is-not-a-scam-find-the-undeniable-evidence-here/?goback=%2Egmr_4403417%2Egde_4403417_member_197771 763%2Egmr_4403417%2Egde_4403417_member_196313833)

In the Comments section...

2394

Now, why would "negative people" calling it a scam "risk ruining it for everyone else"?

Surely if it's not a scam negative comments will have absolutely no effect on Banners Broker? Remember too, they have a "company" on the case taking action against those who criticise it on sites like realscam.com and finchsells.com.

Fortunately for us "negative people" the main modus operandi of that "company" appears to be the posting of barely literate threats on Facebook, although in the minds of the Banners Broker faithful that probably qualifies them as one of the "top ten law firms in the world"....

[StevenHoward]

This thread contains many pieces of information scattered throughout some 4,800+ posts.
Some pieces of info are pure conjecture, some are hard facts, some are just unproven accusations with no proof whatsover and some are just plain common sense observations.

I don't have the time and am a relative newcomer as well so please shoot me down in flames if you think I'm overstepping the mark.

But..... wouldn't it make a lot of sense to compile a small list of provable facts alongside the common sense observations (with links to relevant pages) and post that list once a day or once a page, this would make it much easier for any investigating officer to gather relevant up to date information quickly and easily (type into google "banners broker" and "ponzi", realscam and this thread comes close to the top) .

[Theseus]

This thread contains many pieces of information scattered throughout some 4,800+ posts.
Some pieces of info are pure conjecture, some are hard facts, some are just unproven accusations with no proof whatsover and some are just plain common sense observations.

I don't have the time and am a relative newcomer as well so please shoot me down in flames if you think I'm overstepping the mark.

But..... wouldn't it make a lot of sense to compile a small list of provable facts alongside the common sense observations (with links to relevant pages) and post that list once a day or once a page, this would make it much easier for any investigating officer to gather relevant up to date information quickly and easily (type into google "banners broker" and "ponzi", realscam and this thread comes close to the top) .


For quick reference most of the pertinent information can be found in the two finchsells.com threads, anyone intent on doing some deeper digging probably won't object to going through the thread as it stands, as what may seem trivial or unimportant to you or I may be just what a law officer needs to connect the dots...

[Joe_Shmoe]

This thread contains many pieces of information scattered throughout some 4,800+ posts.
Some pieces of info are pure conjecture, some are hard facts, some are just unproven accusations with no proof whatsover and some are just plain common sense observations.

I don't have the time and am a relative newcomer as well so please shoot me down in flames if you think I'm overstepping the mark.

But..... wouldn't it make a lot of sense to compile a small list of provable facts alongside the common sense observations (with links to relevant pages) and post that list once a day or once a page, this would make it much easier for any investigating officer to gather relevant up to date information quickly and easily (type into google "banners broker" and "ponzi", realscam and this thread comes close to the top) .

He might not have posted for a little while but Samual.r has this link in his signature

http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index52.html#post31224

[hendyphilhendy]

I think Jason (poyol) is compiling a website as an all in one resource.

[BB Defender]

Christ, I don't even know where to start with this. I work for the online team of a marketing department for a market leading UK company. I deal with this stuff every single day and I can tell you in no uncertain terms what Banners Broker (and subsequently your fine self) is spouting is absolute waffle.

Oh dear is all I have to say.


OK firstly I need to apologise, I said I wouldn't be back out of anger at being informed that I was now part of a cult with that poor fellow chris smith as its leader, and here I am again (I feel like an addict now). "Cap in hand" Please can I come back in?

Now that you have all responded with a big "YES", (I can hear this in my telepathic mind you see being an alien and all).

First things first so amathyst, I am talking waffle am I? because you know better as you work in the "online team of a marketing department for a market leading UK company", a little proof would be helpful so we can verify what you say about yourself, maybe your linked in url, or your CV. I mean after all I could reveal that I am Larry Page CEO of Google and just like I cant dispute your claim you couldn't dispute my claim.

Secondly to the wider audience of BB doubters and debunkers, in the day or so that I have been silent, I have created the following websites to prove that the blind networks, ad exchanges and brokers exist and that real time bidding is real. Please peruse at your own convenience and let me know if they look good enough to convince the thousands of people I intend to invite to become BB affiliates below me.
__________________________________________________ _________:RpS_flapper:
__________________________________________________ ________:RpS_flapper::RpS_flapper:
__________________________________________________ _______:RpS_flapper::RpS_flapper::RpS_flapper:
__________________________________________________ ______:RpS_flapper::RpS_flapper::RpS_flapper::RpS_ flapper:
quick tell the FBI i'm encouraging people to join a ponzi pyramid cult thats planning to take over the world.


Going “Blind” with Ad Networks | Cogblog (http://www.cogmap.com/blog/2011/10/04/going-blind-with-ad-networks/)

SpotXchange Video Advertising Marketplace (http://www.spotxchange.com/)

Banner Ad Traffic Exchange Program - 1800banners.com (http://www.1800banners.com/) ( particulary impressed with my ability to create those ads served counters) had them running into the hundreds of millions for this month already.

[Bonzer]

http://newgenerationonlineadvertising.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Banners-Broker-Ireland-Event-Debrief.pdf

The official "debrief" delivered to BB affilliates after Dublin.

This brainwash document attempts to explain negative publicity by casting it as "black propaganda"

[okosh]

But..... wouldn't it make a lot of sense to compile a small list of provable facts .

BannersBrokers is nothing more then an illegal hyip-ponzi online money game that has all but imploded....

There ya go Steve.....List complete....
Anything else I/we can do for you??

BTW...Your welcome!!

[Brenda]

OK firstly I need to apologise, I said I wouldn't be back out of anger at being informed that I was now part of a cult with that poor fellow chris smith as its leader, and here I am again (I feel like an addict now). "Cap in hand" Please can I come back in?

Now that you have all responded with a big "YES", (I can hear this in my telepathic mind you see being an alien and all).

First things first so amathyst, I am talking waffle am I, because you know better as you work in the "online team of a marketing department for a market leading UK company", a little proof would be helpful so we can verify what you say about yourself, maybe your linked in url, or your CV. I mean after all I could reveal that I am Larry Page CEO of Google and just like I cant dispute your claim you couldn't dispute my claim.

Secondly to the wider audience of BB doubters and debunkers, in the day or so that I have been silent, I have created the following websites to prove that the blind networks, ad exchanges and brokers exist and that real time bidding is real. Please peruse at your own convenience and let me know if they look good enough to convince the thousands of people I intend to invite to become BB affiliates below me. :RpS_flapper:
:RpS_flapper::RpS_flapper:
:RpS_flapper::RpS_flapper::RpS_flapper:
:RpS_flapper::RpS_flapper::RpS_flapper::RpS_flappe r:

Going “Blind” with Ad Networks | Cogblog (http://www.cogmap.com/blog/2011/10/04/going-blind-with-ad-networks/)

SpotXchange Video Advertising Marketplace (http://www.spotxchange.com/)

Banner Ad Traffic Exchange Program - 1800banners.com (http://www.1800banners.com/) ( particulary imopressed with my ability to create those ads served counters) had them running into the hundreds of millions for this month already.

BBDefender, perhaps you've missed it, but noname99 has repeatedly asked for a member of BB to oblige him/her and provide details of Chris Smith's CV or indeed anything business related or activity that could give those who are sceptical some comfort. Think it's a little unfair of you to ask a poster here to provide his/her credentials when you haven't respected another's prior request.

[BB Defender]

Hey could one of you really good dirt diggers find out if 1800banners.com is a real company, it's that it just seems so much like BB that it's got me worried about competition for new recruits to the BB cult.

[BB Defender]

BBDefender, perhaps you've missed it, but noname99 has repeatedly asked for a member of BB to oblige him/her and provide details of Chris Smith's CV or indeed anything business related or activity that could give those who are sceptical some comfort. Think it's a little unfair of you to ask a poster here to provide his/her credentials when you haven't respected another's prior request.

Hi Brenda,

Im sorry I am just defending BB I am not privy to Chris's CV or anything, It was just a rhetorical request to let amathyst know that his claims couldn't be verified and so there is no validity to his rude dismissal of my explanations just because he says he is so and so. I dont expect amathyst to supply the information, it really wouldn't be a wise thing to do on this forum.

[jensholvoet]

So why go to the trouble of creating a web page all about BB?.


They call it marketing. Try it some time instead of bashing people who are trying to change their lives in a positive way. The web page is a sales funnel. Yes, you make a lot more money if you help the company to grow, surprise surprise. I bet your boss also pays your more if you decide to work harder.



Why put a link on that page to your own BB signup link?.


They call it marketing. It's a way to drive traffic to my own sales funnel and get sign ups. Surprise again. I know that this may all sound very complicated to you, but it's how internet marketing and online advertising works. Why would I drive traffic to a site that doesn't drive traffic to my other sites? That would be completely ridiculous.



Why on the sleep apnea page is the only advert one for Banners Broker?, why not one for Pepsi, Argos, Sainsburys, A packet of nuts, a newspaper, a mobile phone company........................................... you get the idea ?.


There's 2 ad spots. Look and think before you write something. And when the advertising network, in this case Clicksor, is currently not using the ad space, BB is putting my personal blog in the ad spot. Yes, that's a feature that BB publishers can enable. (once again, because it can drive traffic to my blog then instead of just having an empty ad space)



Could it be because there really is no "blind network", show me a few ads from high street names and I'll accept BB is a legitimate business and "invest" some more of my hard earned cash, oh heck, I can't invest.


Yes, you better don't "invest". It's also better that you stop stalking about BB, because you clearly have no idea how online advertising works.

[BB Defender]

BannersBrokers is nothing more then an illegal hyip-ponzi online money game that has all but imploded....

There ya go Steve.....List complete....
Anything else I/we can do for you??

BTW...Your welcome!!

okosh,

you were so concise and correct, its amazing that you know so much, where did you get such wisdom from?

[ProfHenryHiggins]

They call it marketing. Try it some time instead of bashing people who are trying to change their lives in a positive way. The web page is a sales funnel. Yes, you make a lot more money if you help the company to grow, surprise surprise. I bet your boss also pays your more if you decide to work harder.


That's an unusual analogy, coming from someone who "doesn't believe in jobs," Jens.

[BB Defender]

Response to questions of BB affiliates demographic i.e. (over 50 not internet savvy and very gullible)

Yep they all look like they are over 50 and gullible as anything.

2396

Chris Smith Banners Broker | Dane Sampson (http://danesampson.com/tag/chris-smith-banners-broker/)

2397

2398

its so easy to build up a one sided story when you represent your point with as much bias as the rejects from the BB cult do.

p.s note that on dane's website he says . (BTW BB are now in the position to hire a legal team to handle blatant falsehoods out there in internet land. So badmouthed bloggers beware!)

maybe he knows who will be BBs legal representatives the curious ones could ask him.

by the way for those of you who are now convinced that BB is a real business opportunity dont register with dane he probably doesn't really know much, let me know and I'll refer you and train you in how best to make a profit with BB.

[Theseus]

There's 2 ad spots. Look and think before you write something. And when the advertising network, in this case Clicksor, is currently not using the ad space, BB is putting my personal blog in the ad spot.

That would 24/7 then, just like all the other banners on all the other poor-quality wordpress sites in the "Choice Network". Since you're here though, Jens perhaps you, as one of the top earners/advocates for BB, could clear up a few points for us "non-believers".

If you could provide just the answer these few, straightforward, questions then we'll all be happy.

1) Who is Chris Smith? What is his backstory? Where did he come from, where did he get his degree from?

2) Why does a "reputable" company, need to keep moving its headquarters from tax haven to tax haven? It stated, as I'm sure you're aware, in Belize, now it's on the Isle of Man and I believe plans are afoot to move it to Dubai next.

3) Why are you sure BB isn't a ponzi, when it has all the hallmarks of one and is run exclusively by a team made up of former ICF World Homes staff?

4) If BB is Chris Smith's business why is it Raj Dixit's name that is on all the legal documentation?

I'm sure you'll agree that these aren't difficult questions, just the sort that any investor, sorry "buyer" would ask before committing to an investment, (sorry again it's very hard to phrase this without using the "i" word) wouldn't you agree?

[okosh]

okosh,

you were so concise and correct, its amazing that you know so much, where did you get such wisdom from?

Years of experience dealing with scum just like you....

[baylee]

okosh,

you were so concise and correct, its amazing that you know so much, where did you get such wisdom from?

I will not pretend to answer for okosh, but for myself, how many times does one need to see the same thing over, and over, and over? Go to the scam folders from the different forums and read through them and see the same answers and same problems over and over.

[Theseus]

Response to questions of BB affiliates demographic i.e. (over 50 not internet savvy and gullible)

Yep they all look like they are over 50 and gullible as anything.


its so easy to build up a one sided story when you represent your point with as much bias as the rejects from the BB cult do.

You only have to watch the videos from Driscoll or Stokes or any multitude of others and they boast about targeting pensioners. Driscoll even crows about snaring a 78 year old and talking him into "investing". Let's be very clear here this isn't a business aimed at internet-savvy "marketers", it's designed to take advantage of those who have no understanding of the industry.

[Hypanor]

Just a reminder that Jens is purportedly one of the top earners, in fine company with Simon 'The Pointer' Stepsys. How many people will be looking for you when the Ponzi folds Jens?

2399

[BB Defender]

OK so this 1800banners.com cult has got me really worried now!

I found the following copycat business terminology and modus operandi on their website.


http://www.1800banners.com/faqs.php

"What is a free banner exchange?
A free banner exchange is a group of participating Web sites that display each others' ad banners in exchange for credits; the more impressions you display the more credits you receive. The credits are then converted into ad spaces for you to display your ad banner on participating Web sites. Participating in free banner exchange programs is a great way to drive traffic to your site, especially if you have compelling content and a creative ad banner."

damn their spouting on about impressions and driving traffic as well.

"What is the pay cycle/period?
When your account balance has reached more than $20, you can request a payout. All payments are processed at the 1st of each month."
aargh its the same $20.00 capping limit before you get payout.

Banner Ad Traffic Exchange Program - 1800banners.com (http://www.1800banners.com/index.php)
"Target by geo-location (Country,City,State & Areacodes), category, age group, ad position, preferred sites Maximize your ROI (Return on Investment) with advanced targeting features.

Target by Geo-Location, over 150 countries world wide.

Increase your CTR rate with advanced ad-position targeting, with ad position targeting you can have your ads display only in top level positions on websites."

oh no the games up they've got geo targetting and contextual targetting as well...

Banner Ad Traffic Exchange Program - 1800banners.com (http://www.1800banners.com/index.php)
"Earn From Referrals You can easily earn credits by referring other webmasters to use our service.

Earn 5% from your first level referrals, 3% from second level referrals and 2% from third level referrals.

Earn a total of 10% from your referrals!

Link and promotional media are provided in the members area."

Thats the final nail in the coffin for the BB cult these copycats have even got a rewarding referral programme.

Ummmm. is it time to change cult?

[Theseus]

Ummmm. is it time to change cult?

You're not a cult, close though.....

[BB Defender]

Years of experience dealing with scum just like you....

Hey okosh, sarcasm is not the same a outright abuse, you calling me scum is out of order you should note that your post has been reported, for its abusive nature.

[BB Defender]

I will not pretend to answer for okosh, but for myself, how many times does one need to see the same thing over, and over, and over? Go to the scam folders from the different forums and read through them and see the same answers and same problems over and over.

Well evidence is still required before making statements like this. The possibility still exists that BB is a legitimate business opportunity and that BB have a new business concept that people like okosh fear simply because it's different.

[BB Defender]

You only have to watch the videos from Driscoll or Stokes or any multitude of others and they boast about targeting pensioners. Driscoll even crows about snaring a 78 year old and talking him into "investing". Let's be very clear here this isn't a business aimed at internet-savvy "marketers", it's designed to take advantage of those who have no understanding of the industry.

really well how do you explain myself, clearly I'm no stranger to the internet and its money making potential, I will also reveal but will not substantiate that I am under 40 and have a degree in business and a masters degree in computing, so how did i get hoodwinked by the BB scam? or is it just that I have looked into this a lot deeper than the detractors and found a real business model that actually works. (dont ask me to prove my claims of what I have said about myself, I wont post anything more)

[Theseus]

really well how do you explain myself, clearly I'm no stranger to the internet and its money making potential, I will also reveal but will not substantiate that I am under 40 and have a degree in business and a masters degree in computing, so how did i get hoodwinked by the BB scam? or is it just that I have looked into this a lot deeper than the detractors and found a real business model that actually works. (dont ask me to prove my claims of what I have said about myself, I wont post anything more)


Okay, fair enough, could you then explain how "deep" you've looked, where you looked for your information and what you found?

[baylee]

(dont ask me to prove my claims of what I have said about myself, I wont post anything more)

What a crock of crapola!

[BB Defender]

You're not a cult, close though.....

Were you there in ireland theseus? did you witness the close to cult member behaviour from the affiliates?
do the people partying and having fun in the bb ireland gala event, look like mesmerised cult members?
If you answer yes to all questions then seek out an optician, if No to all questions then provide some reasoning other than the blogging of a BB reject.

[BB Defender]

Okay, fair enough, could you then explain how "deep" you've looked, where you looked for your information and what you found?

see my responses there are urls linked above. I didn't really spend a day building those websites, they were there already. I didn't build the wikipedia page it was there already

[BB Defender]

What a crock of crapola!

Yep it hurts when you know others know more than you!

[baylee]

Yep it hurts when you know others know more than you!


I understand and I also know what a Christmas turkey is and you fit that bill.

[Beacon]

another person in denian or part of the scam.
Banners Broker Is Not A Scam, Find The Undeniable Evidence Here | (http://jensholvoet.com/banners-broker-is-not-a-scam-find-the-undeniable-evidence-here/?goback=%2Egmr_4403417%2Egde_4403417_member_197771 763%2Egmr_4403417%2Egde_4403417_member_196313833)

find the FBI data on their e wallet suppliers here :
FBI — Payment Processors Agree to Forfeit More Than $13 Million in Funds Traced to Money Laundering and Online Gambling (http://www.fbi.gov/newyork/press-releases/2010/nyfo081710b.htm)

Find the Canadian name change data here:
https://www.ic.gc.ca/app/scr/cc/CorporationsCanada/fdrlCrpSrch.html?locale=en_CA
type in the company number 7250037

Durham regional police here:
https://www.ic.gc.ca/app/scr/cc/CorporationsCanada/fdrlCrpSrch.html?locale=en_CA
Canadian anti fraud here:
Canadian Anti-Fraud Centre (http://www.moneymakergroup.com/redirect.php?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.antifraudcentre-centreantifraude.ca%2Fenglish%2Fcommon_contactus.h tml)

Canadian ruling on Legal juristiction and action
Court Sends Warning to Fraudulent Marketers Targeting Foreign Residents - Competition Bureau (http://www.competitionbureau.gc.ca/eic/site/cb-bc.nsf/eng/02992.html)
s. 52(1) of the Competition Act, R.S.C. 1985, c. C-34
"No person shall, for the purpose of promoting, directly or indirectly, the supply or use of a product or for the purpose of promoting, directly or indirectly, any business interest, by any means whatever, knowingly or recklessly make a representation to the public that is false or misleading in a material respect."

I also note Mr Dixit seemed to be "flashing the cash" around in the video of the dublin Party. One wonders how much cash left canada?
This NEW TRIAL ORDERED - R. v. Sajid, appeal by the Crown from the acquittal; failing to report the exportation of currency; (http://bcjustice.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=8108:new-trial-ordered-r-v-sajid-appeal-by-the-crown-from-the-acquittal-failing-to-report-the-exportation-of-currency-&catid=385:criminal-08&Itemid=1648)

...failing to report the exportation of currency as required by s.12 (1) of the Proceeds of Crime (Money Laundering) and Terrorist Financing Act, S.C. 2000, c. 17, and thereby committing an offence pursuant to s. 74 of the Act.

may also apply. Note sections 32 and 33.

[Theseus]

see my responses there are urls linked above. I didn't really spend a day building those websites, they were there already. I didn't build the wikipedia page it was there already

So essentially your "deep" research involves some wordpress sites and a paragraph on Wikipedia? You realise you're making a complete tit of yourself, don't you?

[BB Defender]

Okay, fair enough, could you then explain how "deep" you've looked, where you looked for your information and what you found?

Hey theseus you seem like a sensible individual, do you think we should also start up a thread to investigate and debunk the 1800banners.com business, it seems only fair that both should be held up for scrutiny and ridicule as they are both competitors in the same scam?

[Hypanor]

Hey could one of you really good dirt diggers find out if 1800banners.com is a real company, it's that it just seems so much like BB that it's got me worried about competition for new recruits to the BB cult.

Its nothing like BB. You can tell because they provide things like advertising rates, Support that works over Christmas, meaningful statistics, they use Paypal, anti-cheating technology, provide easily available source code (you don't have to ring, email, ring, email, wait weeks on end), etc. I learned more about how they work in 5 minutes than I have about Banners Broker in 2 or 3 months.

Would I work with them? No - a quick search indicates issues with the payment side of things (some calling it a scam), the blog hasn't been updated since 2009, and when I log in it has a banner saying "Happy New Year 2009". Hmmm....

Oh and have a look at their rates for imressions - you get 100,000 impressions for $11.95. What does that cost with Banners Broker again? The BB rate is $25 / 25,000 so the equivalent would set you back $100 - nearly 10 times the price!!!

[BB Defender]

So essentially your "deep" research involves some wordpress sites and a paragraph on Wikipedia? You realise you're making a complete tit of yourself, don't you?

well if thats really you in the picture holding up the 100% Risk Free sign then I'm not the only one making a complete tit of myself, I seem to be in a perfectly suited environment of a whole bunch of complete Tits. This whole thread seems to attract the creme de la creme of complete tits, spouting garbage as fact!

[Beacon]

Jens Holvoet say "However, people are entitled to the truth, so I think it’s only fair to finally end the discussion forever."

There you go he has ended the discussion forever lets hear no more about it.

(or some might say he recycled the same old Banners Broker drivel)

I hardly think BB are so sophisticated as to refer to Propopsition 7

Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tractatus_Logico-Philosophicus)
"Whereof one cannot speak, thereof one must be silent."

[Whip]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v649/Whip412/girl_tantrum-1.gif

Go clean the sand out of your vagina please.
Still waiting for you to answer actual questions and not the typical scammer deflect with some other irrelevant bullshit.

[Beacon]

It was only a joke.
Sorry...
Irony dectector not working....
Normal service now restored
Sadly for almost all of the BB associates it isn't.

[BB Defender]

p.s theseus if you really want the lowdown on my research your gonna have to get referred into the BB cult and then I will tell you why it is a real business, not just so you can make false claims and dig here and dig there and rebuff the research with whimsical statements.

[Whip]

What a crock of crapola!

2 crocks of crap really but he has lied before.

[BB Defender]

Its nothing like BB. You can tell because they provide things like advertising rates, Support that works over Christmas, meaningful statistics, they use Paypal, anti-cheating technology, provide easily available source code (you don't have to ring, email, ring, email, wait weeks on end), etc. I learned more about how they work in 5 minutes than I have about Banners Broker in 2 or 3 months.

Would I work with them? No - a quick search indicates issues with the payment side of things (some calling it a scam), the blog hasn't been updated since 2009, and when I log in it has a banner saying "Happy New Year 2009". Hmmm....

Oh and have a look at their rates for imressions - you get 100,000 impressions for $11.95. What does that cost with Banners Broker again? The BB rate is $25 / 25,000 so the equivalent would set you back $100 - nearly 10 times the price!!!


well those rates are probably applicable to 2009, as their website seems to be frozen in time, that counters still working though.

[Theseus]

well if thats really you in the picture holding up the 100% Risk Free sign then I'm not the only one making a complete tit of myself, I seem to be in a perfectly suited environment of a whole bunch of complete Tits. This whole thread seems to attract the creme de la creme of complete tits, spouting garbage as fact!

So are you saying that really was the total of your deep research?

[BB Defender]

Go clean the sand out of your vagina please.
Still waiting for you to answer actual questions and not the typical scammer deflect with some other irrelevant bullshit.

hey whip, why don't you clean the blood from your rear ventrical, someone seems to have shoved the whip in instead of whipping you with it.

[BB Defender]

2 crocks of crap really but he has lied before.

Yeh your right I did lie before I said I was never gonna come back, and I did, I seem to be addicted to this thread just like the rest of you. you cant blame a thtead junkie for their weaknesses.

[Whip]

hey whip, why don't you clean the blood from your rear ventrical, someone seems to have shoved the whip in instead of whipping you with it.

You need to come up with something original. Gerbils jokes are so 1995

[Theseus]

p.s theseus if you really want the lowdown on my research your gonna have to get referred into the BB cult and then I will tell you why it is a real business, not just so you can make false claims and dig here and dig there and rebuff the research with whimsical statements.

Why would I need to get referred into BB before you would back up your claims? Surely it's in both your and BB's interest to simply explain what you've discovered that makes you so certain it's all kosher?

Otherwise it really does sound like a cult.

[Beacon]

First things first so amathyst, I am talking waffle am I? because you know better as you work in the "online team of a marketing department for a market leading UK company", a little proof would be helpful so we can verify what you say about yourself, maybe your linked in url, or your CV. I mean after all I could reveal that I am Larry Page CEO of Google and just like I cant dispute your claim you couldn't dispute my claim.


Well let us not rely on "argument from authority" . Look it up under "logical fallacy" I have been on national level boards and have several qualifications but I dont use that to make my case. I use FACTS and evidence.
So the qualifications or background of amathyst is not required.
however another fallacy is evident that of "burden of proof" and "proving a negative"
Amytheist isnt claiming anything about BB being able to make huge profits. Nor is he claiming his personal qualifications prove it is.
It is impossible for him to prove the negative but the point is that is not wher the burden lies . the burden lies on the claimant i.e. if you claim to be able to make millions you have to supply the proof. Proving you cant make millions isn not required.
It isnt for anyone else to prove a negative claim about BB.
It is for BB to prove their claims with evidence.
One of their claims is a track record in business.
In spite of the fact that this isnt even sufficient proof of the BB system wotking no evidence has been supplied for these claims of experience.
Ametheyst Showing his experience or not wont change that fact.

[Beacon]

Well evidence is still required before making statements like this. The possibility still exists that BB is a legitimate business opportunity and that BB have a new business concept that people like okosh fear simply because it's different.

And as I stated the burden of proof is on the clqaimant BB to prove their case.
For example by showing who owns BB. company returns? Offices? Background of the management?
None of thiis has been forthcoming.

[BB Defender]

So are you saying that really was the total of your deep research?

wow so many tits to respond to don't know where to begin. but just so we are clear what I have posted is just what I have found on the internet now, my deep research was conducted some time back into all BB matters including the scandalous actions of some members of its leadership, its business model, the product, the actual profitability, the rules used by BB to keep affiliates profits down, the legitimacy of referral/affiliate marketing. My initial research indicated that what bannersbroker and some of its affiliates were spouting wasn't 100% correct there were inconsistencies with what was being shown as the business model and the outward profitability of the business this was all five months ago, I then kept digging and researching the online advertising industry and determined the reality of what bannersbroker were doing five months back, In ireland for the first time BB admitted to what their real business model was and that matched my actual results. The business model that they are using is the same as I have stated in my very first post.

[Hypanor]

I'm referred in, in fact I think I have signed up 9 or 10 times - can I have 'The Truth' now please BBD?
I'd like to know, because not one of the referrers I (silently) used have bothered to contact me or tell me anything. I'm assuming Banners Broker can provide an upline with contact details of those who have signed up under them? You know, so you know BB aren't ripping you off (actually they are, but you know what I mean)?

Which of my affiliate links would you like, I have several to choose from. Are they counted as part of the 250,000 brethren?

[Beacon]

Hi Brenda,

Im sorry I am just defending BB I am not privy to Chris's CV or anything, It was just a rhetorical request to let amathyst know that his claims couldn't be verified and so there is no validity to his rude dismissal of my explanations just because he says he is so and so. I dont expect amathyst to supply the information, it really wouldn't be a wise thing to do on this forum.

I suggest you look up affirming a consequent when you are preusing "logical fallacy"

Hint:
P: All communists have beards
Q: BB Defender has a beard

Therefore can we conclude BB defender is a communist?

Similarly whether or not Amathyst supplies any personal information about himself has no bearing whatsoever on claims made on the experience and working history of Chris Smith.

At best were amathyst to supply verification of experience in senior marketing it would confirm his claim about himself.
But even if he supplied such details he would not be able to prove anything based on the fallacy of "argument from authority"

tyhe point about chris smith isnt that proving his background would make his claims toru. Chris Smith should he produce his credentials would similarly be arguing from authority. The point is if Chris Smith utterly fails to produce background evidence he is most probably lying about his background and cant be trusted in any business. Amythest isnt asking anyone to buy into any business so it isnt required he support any claims about himself. But at least amythesyt supplies source material and verifiable references to back up his argument and not fast talk and opinion.

[Theseus]

wow so many tits to respond to don't know where to begin. but just so we are clear what I have posted is just what I have found on the internet now, my deep research was conducted some time back into all BB matters including the scandalous actions of some members of its leadership, its business model, the product, the actual profitability, the rules used by BB to keep affiliates profits down, the legitimacy of referral/affiliate marketing. My initial research indicated that what bannersbroker and some of its affiliates were spouting wasn't 100% correct there were inconsistencies with what was being shown as the business model and the outward profitability of the business this was all five months ago, I then kept digging and researching the online advertising industry and determined the reality of what bannersbroker were doing five months back, In ireland for the first time BB admitted to what their real business model was and that matched my actual results. The business model that they are using is the same as I have stated in my very first post.

The 7.8 Trillion $$ Advertising Industri Wants to Double Ur Money and Advertising! - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1e5KGw87QI)

There's the original business model, subsequent changes have always invariably been in response to posts on the likes of realscam that have pointed out the obvious flaws.

[BB Defender]

Well let us not rely on "argument from authority" . Look it up under "logical fallacy" I have been on national level boards and have several qualifications but I dont use that to make my case. I use FACTS and evidence.
So the qualifications or background of amathyst is not required.
however another fallacy is evident that of "burden of proof" and "proving a negative"
Amytheist isnt claiming anything about BB being able to make huge profits. Nor is he claiming his personal qualifications prove it is.
It is impossible for him to prove the negative but the point is that is not wher the burden lies . the burden lies on the claimant i.e. if you claim to be able to make millions you have to supply the proof. Proving you cant make millions isn not required.
It isnt for anyone else to prove a negative claim about BB.
It is for BB to prove their claims with evidence.
One of their claims is a track record in business.
In spite of the fact that this isnt even sufficient proof of the BB system wotking no evidence has been supplied for these claims of experience.
Ametheyst Showing his experience or not wont change that fact.

Have you ever tried getting any business to tell you how they make their money, does google tell everyone hey we are making money using such and such technology, did coca cola ever reveal their special ingredient. I don't know where you practice your legal and logical specialism but here in blighty, you are innocent till proven guilty. There is no necessity for anyone or any organisation to prove it is not a criminal enterprise, if the people believe it is a criminal enterprise let them quickly alert the authorities to this so that the authorities can investigate the business thoroughly, according to the posts 250000+ peoples wealth is at risk why don't you all alert the authorities if you feel so strongly that you have a case against BB. Do you seriously think that people like whip, poyol, hendyphilhendy and other rejects have not already done so?

[Beacon]

You only have to watch the videos from Driscoll or Stokes or any multitude of others and they boast about targeting pensioners. Driscoll even crows about snaring a 78 year old and talking him into "investing". Let's be very clear here this isn't a business aimed at internet-savvy "marketers", it's designed to take advantage of those who have no understanding of the industry.

Misleading Representations and Deceptive Marketing Practices: Choice of Criminal or Civil Track under the Competition Act - Competition Bureau (http://www.competitionbureau.gc.ca/eic/site/cb-bc.nsf/eng/01223.html)
Part VII.1 - Deceptive Marketing Practices

3. The seriousness of the alleged offence will include a consideration of:
(b) whether the deceptive practices targeted or took unfair advantage of vulnerable groups (e.g., children and seniors);

Ok guys here is your shovel start digging.

[BB Defender]

The 7.8 Trillion $$ Advertising Industri Wants to Double Ur Money and Advertising! - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1e5KGw87QI)

There's the original business model, subsequent changes have always invariably been in response to posts on the likes of realscam that have pointed out the obvious flaws.

As I said theseus, my initial research showed that BB and its promoting affiliates were not telling the truth about the business model applied by BB,

BB would possibly have done this because they wanted to protect their business model from copycats,

the BB affiliates because they were ignorant of the truth as BB had provided them with a facade of what they were actually doing.

[Beacon]

Well evidence is still required before making statements like this. The possibility still exists that BB is a legitimate business opportunity and that BB have a new business concept that people like okosh fear simply because it's different.

The possibility also exists that unicorns and fire breathing dragons are in my garage. the thing is though it doesnt really matter until I claim that they are there and start charginfg peopole on the promise that those people will see them. You dont seem to be getting the point about burden of evidence. It is for the claimant to prove the claim.

[BB Defender]

Misleading Representations and Deceptive Marketing Practices: Choice of Criminal or Civil Track under the Competition Act - Competition Bureau (http://www.competitionbureau.gc.ca/eic/site/cb-bc.nsf/eng/01223.html)
Part VII.1 - Deceptive Marketing Practices

3. The seriousness of the alleged offence will include a consideration of:
(b) whether the deceptive practices targeted or took unfair advantage of vulnerable groups (e.g., children and seniors);

Ok guys here is your shovel start digging.

Quick call the cops! BB is deceptively taking unfair advantage of the vulnerable young and old people.

thats a long sentence in jail for the management team, better get my money out now! :scared_1:

[Beacon]

OK so this 1800banners.com cult has got me really worried now!



Whataboutery!

That fact that someone else may claim pixies in their garage has no bearing on you r claim about unicorns in your garage.
And please dont come back with "well they claim unicorns too" .
And we already know about Dixit and the ICF World Homes.

[BB Defender]

The possibility also exists that unicorns and fire breathing dragons are in my garage. the thing is though it doesnt really matter until I claim that they are there and start charginfg peopole on the promise that those people will see them. You dont seem to be getting the point about burden of evidence. It is for the claimant to prove the claim.

Let justice be done! call the cops in to arrest the BB management team and force the truth out of them as they clearly wont say it from behind their protective BB office walls.

[Theseus]

Have you ever tried getting any business to tell you how they make their money, does google tell everyone hey we are making money using such and such technology

Yes, they publish audited accounts and annual reports which go into detail of how they earn their money. By contrast BB seem to rely entirely on Youtube and Facebook posts by well-known scammers to keep their investors (whooops, there I go again) informed. It is also possible to look up the backstory of Google's founders and indeed to visit their headquarters. Neither of which can be said to be true of Banners Broker.

[Beacon]

really well how do you explain myself, clearly I'm no stranger to the internet and its money making potential, I will also reveal but will not substantiate that I am under 40 and have a degree in business and a masters degree in computing, so how did i get hoodwinked by the BB scam? or is it just that I have looked into this a lot deeper than the detractors and found a real business model that actually works. (dont ask me to prove my claims of what I have said about myself, I wont post anything more)

I believe you educational claims for what it is worth.
I think you might look up Aum Shinrikyo
Aum Shinrikyo - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aum_Shinrikyo)

This is partly why i cautioned about "Argument from Authority"
It attracted such a considerable number of young graduates from Japan's elite universities that it was dubbed a "religion for the elite".
In fact they were capable of manufacturing Sarin nerve gas.
Being clever or educated is not an indication of being reasonable or kind to others.

[Beacon]

wow so many tits to respond to don't know where to begin. but just so we are clear what I have posted is just what I have found on the internet now, my deep research was conducted some time back into all BB matters including the scandalous actions of some members of its leadership, its business model, the product, the actual profitability, the rules used by BB to keep affiliates profits down, the legitimacy of referral/affiliate marketing. My initial research indicated that what bannersbroker and some of its affiliates were spouting wasn't 100% correct there were inconsistencies with what was being shown as the business model and the outward profitability of the business this was all five months ago, I then kept digging and researching the online advertising industry and determined the reality of what bannersbroker were doing five months back, In ireland for the first time BB admitted to what their real business model was and that matched my actual results. The business model that they are using is the same as I have stated in my very first post.

So you admit that BB had occult knowledge they hide from people?
Knowkledge which you now have?
So what is to stop you setting up a similar business in competition?

Furthermore wher is ther ANY evidence of your "initial research" or subsequent "digging and researching "?

[Theseus]

BB would possibly have done this because they wanted to protect their business model from copycats,




So this legitimate advertising broker, fearful of "copycats" launched its business as a "straightline cycler doubler" that (rather than offering any product) promised to "take $20 and DOUBLE it MULTIPLE TIMES TO $10,000" to throw others off the scent?

Come to think of it, you might be onto something there. I'm pretty sure when Google was launched initially it was a drive-thru carwash....

[Beacon]

Have you ever tried getting any business to tell you how they make their money,

Yes and I have succeeded in finding out. In fact management theory and training are full of such things.



does google tell everyone hey we are making money using such and such technology,


Yes they do.


did coca cola ever reveal their special ingredient.


Yes it originally was coca - yuou know the drug from which cocaine is made? their current ingredients are a trade secret. But we arent asking BB to reveal any trade secrets. We are asking like Coca cola
-where therir offices are
- what is the background of their staff
-wher are their annual company returns
- how much tax did they pay?

All this is freely available for Google and Coca Cola and indeed it is required by law.
so where is it for BB - which does not exist since it was changed to Stellar Point.


I don't know where you practice your legal and logical specialism but here in blighty, you are innocent till proven guilty.


Actually no! the UK is a common law juristiction. In CRIMINAL law innocence is assumed. You might well be guilty but it is assumed you arent. The BURDEN OF PROOF ( remember that phrase) is on the prosecution to prove guilt in a CRIMINAL case.

But in a civil case it is based on "balance of evidence" not "assumption of innocence"
Company Law and Contract Law is civil law.

In a sence BB is on trial here. The prosecution produced ample evidence about the background of Dixit and the failure to satisfy statutory regulatory conditions. what defence have you prodeced? what actual evidence? Piss and winf like the barber's cat.



There is no necessity for anyone or any organisation to prove it is not a criminal enterprise,



True and there is not necessity for terrorists to prove they are not terrorists either.
Or for the Nazis to prove they were not out to get people.
And if we all sit around and do nothing while others suffer eventually they come for you.


if the people believe it is a criminal enterprise let them quickly alert the authorities to this so that the authorities can investigate the business thoroughly,


what people do is their own business



according to the posts 250000+ peoples wealth is at risk why don't you all alert the authorities if you feel so strongly that you have a case against BB. Do you seriously think that people like whip, poyol, hendyphilhendy and other rejects have not already done so?

Again what I do or do not do elsewhere is nothing to do with the issue of you coming here to support claims about BB being a legit business.
and can you lay of the ad hominem? When you are losing an argument do you always resort to attacking the other person instead?

[Theseus]

I knew BBDefender reminded me of someone....

BBC Panorama: "Scientology and Me" - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HGM8DSnYh0)

:loser:

[Beacon]

Let justice be done! call the cops in to arrest the BB management team and force the truth out of them as they clearly wont say it from behind their protective BB office walls.

Yes but that may well take time and will be done by the relevant authorities. It isnt for us to take enforcement into our own hands. The issue here is you supporting your claims about BB being a legit business. If your reply to "where is your evidence" is "so sue me" then you are not really supporting anything you claim. Effectively you are admitting your claims of "extensive research" are empty claims.

[Whip]

So this legitimate advertising broker, fearful of "copycats" launched its business as a "straightline cycler doubler" that (rather than offering any product) promised to "take $20 and DOUBLE it MULTIPLE TIMES TO $10,000" to throw others off the scent?

Come to think of it, you might be onto something there. I'm pretty sure when Google was launched initially it was a drive-thru carwash....
Damn that's funny. These scammers really got nothing. lol

[jensholvoet]

That's an unusual analogy, coming from someone who "doesn't believe in jobs," Jens.

Grow up man. If you knew me, you would know why I "don't believe in jobs". I came here to answer those silly questions and that's it. I'm not going to reply to childish comments.

The sad reality is that all home based business opportunity haters always come and troll around on forums just to prove how wrong it is for people to be active in the industry.

You can try to prove that BB is a scam for many years to come. It won't affect the company anyway. Funny how some people are putting so much energy and time in ridiculous claims that don't make sense at all.

[ProfHenryHiggins]

Grow up man. If you knew me, you would know why I "don't believe in jobs". I came here to answer those silly questions and that's it. I'm not going to reply to childish comments.

The sad reality is that all home based business opportunity haters always come and troll around on forums just to prove how wrong it is for people to be active in the industry.

You can try to prove that BB is a scam for many years to come. It won't affect the company anyway. Funny how some people are putting so much energy and time in ridiculous claims that don't make sense at all.


You're blowing up in my face like a toddler with a tantrum, when I've barely spoken in this thread (or even this subject).

Try aiming your terrible twos at someone who has posted frequently about BB, Jens, and behave more like a businessman.

[littleroundman]

Did you know the average lifetime of a fruit fly is around 30 days, depending on climatic conditions.

During that 30 days, a fruit fly will hatch, mature, infect, reproduce and die.

I think perhaps we should reclassify Banners Broker HYIP ponzi shills as "advanced fruitflies"

Their lifecycle is definitely nearing the end.

[okosh]

Hey okosh, sarcasm is not the same a outright abuse, you calling me scum is out of order you should note that your post has been reported, for its abusive nature.

You ran to tell your mommy??....Should I go stand in the naughty corner now??......

[littleroundman]

so how did i get hoodwinked by the BB scam?

I don't know.

Perhaps you'd better ask the victims of previous frauds exactly how is was done.

Come to think of it, I think there's probably a whole pile of Madoff Securities victims who would have considered themselves a great deal smarter than events subsequently proved them to be.

IOW, your "how is it possible for someone as smart as me to be hoodwinked" may well work on rank amateurs, but it certainly won't work here.

[okosh]

Well evidence is still required before making statements like this. The possibility still exists that BB is a legitimate business opportunity and that BB have a new business concept that people like okosh fear simply because it's different.

LOL...Are you really that stupid??....Or did the nurse drop you on your head at birth??.....
Is there also the possibility that a fat man in a red suit will really come down my chimney??....

There is no "business concept" here....There is just a ponzi scheme that is all but over.....

Each and every ponzi scheme that comes along claiming to have a new "business concept" also comes complete with it's shills....
But bannersbrokers stuck out when they chose BB Defender as he is not even a good shill.....He's just an idiot with the same old BS we heard many times b4....

[littleroundman]

if the people believe it is a criminal enterprise let them quickly alert the authorities to this so that the authorities can investigate the business thoroughly, according to the posts 250000+ peoples wealth is at risk why don't you all alert the authorities if you feel so strongly that you have a case against BB. Do you seriously think that people like whip, poyol, hendyphilhendy and other rejects have not already done so?

From first recorded complaint against Andy Bowdoin and AdSurf Daily to civil action induced shutdown, took 18+ months.

Bowdoins' criminal prosecution took longer again.

Unlike Banners Broker, AdSurf Daily was based and hosted in mainland U.S.A.

Similarly, the Zeek Rewards U.S. based HYIP ponzi scam took approximately the same time for the civil action to be launched.

Banners Broker, on the other hand, purports to be Canadian based.

On top of the fact Canadian prosecutors are notoriously slow to act with regard to online fraud, cross border prosecution in such matters is highly unlikely, Banners Broker being a relatively small fraud in the 2012 scheme of things.

While your "let them go ahead and tell the authorities" taunt may carry some weight with your fellow HYIP ponzi players, it bears not the slightest relevance to the question of whether or not Banners Broker is a fraud.

Anyone who uses the fact a HYIP ponzi fraud has not "yet" been prosecuted as some sign of legitimacy is in for a very rude awakening as to how things work in the real world.

[littleroundman]

And as I stated the burden of proof is on the clqaimant BB to prove their case.
For example by showing who owns BB. company returns? Offices? Background of the management?
None of thiis has been forthcoming.

More than that, Banners Broker is the one accepting money for it's services.

By doing so, both it and it's "members" moved THEMSELVES into a completely different category.

There is no "burden of proof" on forums, blogs or members of the public.

THEY didn't take money.

In fact, many forums, blogs and members of the public are deliberately attempting to goad Banners Broker or it's sycophants to follow through with their empty threats of "legal action"

Why ???

Simple - they know there is no Banners Broker "legal department" and the chances of Banners Broker or any of its' founders or management willingly getting within a country mile of a court are non existent.

All we have to do is show a little bit of patience and Banners Broker will collapse based solely on mathematical reality.

Nobody here has set out to "save the world" and nobody stands to make or lose a cent from Banners Broker.

If ONE person can be influenced to avoid becoming a Banners Broker victim, our job is done.

[StevenHoward]

For quick reference most of the pertinent information can be found in the two finchsells.com threads, anyone intent on doing some deeper digging probably won't object to going through the thread as it stands, as what may seem trivial or unimportant to you or I may be just what a law officer needs to connect the dots...



You're correct of course, but what about someone thinking of signing up with BB?, they're almost certainly not going to read everything and some of the posts just seem like word slinging with no proof.

If you'd like to reply with the two "finchsells" links, I'll put them into my signature and refer to them from time to time.

[AshKen1]

Today first time post spent time arguing with friends about this today told them all the facts and figures got shouted and was shouted down then privately one of the friends told me he knew it was a ponzi and of the others really shouted me out cause we were all idiots and he was right cause we didn't know how it all worked. At least someone does!

Welcome to realscam dolan.

:RpS_smile:

[AshKen1]

well if thats really you in the picture holding up the 100% Risk Free sign then I'm not the only one making a complete tit of myself, I seem to be in a perfectly suited environment of a whole bunch of complete Tits. This whole thread seems to attract the creme de la creme of complete tits, spouting garbage as fact!

Yes that's Theseus! Great man he is too!!

[Poyol]

You're correct of course, but what about someone thinking of signing up with BB?, they're almost certainly not going to read everything and some of the posts just seem like word slinging with no proof.

If you'd like to reply with the two "finchsells" links, I'll put them into my signature and refer to them from time to time.

Banners Broker Scam – Don’t Let It Affect You « Finch Sells (http://finchsells.com/2012/10/21/banners-broker-scam-dont-let-it-affect-you/)
Banners Broker Scam Update « Finch Sells (http://finchsells.com/2012/12/20/banners-broker-scam-update/)

And my own (not in the slightest complete)
Jason Clark Investigates (http://www.jasonclarkinvestigates.com)

[AshKen1]

I hardly think BB are so sophisticated as to refer to Propopsition 7

Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tractatus_Logico-Philosophicus)
"Whereof one cannot speak, thereof one must be silent."

Awesome stuff!! Wittgenstein? Wow.... just wow.....

Not sure I'd be mentioning BB in the same breath....

[littleroundman]

You're correct of course, but what about someone thinking of signing up with BB?, they're almost certainly not going to read everything and some of the posts just seem like word slinging with no proof.

If you'd like to reply with the two "finchsells" links, I'll put them into my signature and refer to them from time to time.

Hiya Steven, and a belated welcome to REALSCAM.com (www.realscam.com)

You have pointed out one of the realities of 'net based HYIP ponzi fraud.

There IS no "proof"

It would be a pretty poor excuse for a fraud if there WAS "proof" readily available enough to satisfy the targets of said HYIP ponzi fraud.

Similarly "logic" and 'reality" play very little part in the equation when what appears to be easy money is at stake.

One of the realities of 'net based fraud is that fraudsters don't want "logical thinkers" neither do they want those with more than a passing interest in law and legalities.

ANYONE who believes for a minute the promised returns offered by HYIP ponzi frauds is at all possible has, in a sense, pre qualified themselves as a target/victim.

So called "Nigerian scammers" have the "self pre selection" process down to a fine art.

Anybody who even entertains the thought there really could be an multi million dollar inheritance awaiting them and responds to the fraudsters emails is like manna from Heaven to the fraudster.

It works perfectly when "normal" or "logical" or "sensible" people simply laugh and delete his or her emails.

It saves the fraudster time and effort separating the wheat from the chaff i.e. qualifying possible victims for the next phase of the scam.

So it is with the majority of HYIP ponzi victims.

They obviously "believe" in what's being offered, as improbable as it may seem to others.

After that, it's merely a matter of the fraudster filling in any holes in his/her story with as many lies, forgeries and deliberate deflections as he/she is inclined to pursue.

Think about it, ANYONE who believes a 1% or 2% per DAY ROI is possible is highly unlikely to know a great deal about company registrations, securities regulations or the advertising industry, and even less about fraud and fraudsters.

[AshKen1]

Have you ever tried getting any business to tell you how they make their money, does google tell everyone hey we are making money using such and such technology, did coca cola ever reveal their special ingredient. I don't know where you practice your legal and logical specialism but here in blighty, you are innocent till proven guilty. There is no necessity for anyone or any organisation to prove it is not a criminal enterprise, if the people believe it is a criminal enterprise let them quickly alert the authorities to this so that the authorities can investigate the business thoroughly, according to the posts 250000+ peoples wealth is at risk why don't you all alert the authorities if you feel so strongly that you have a case against BB. Do you seriously think that people like whip, poyol, hendyphilhendy and other rejects have not already done so?

Here you go mate, here's the dragon scroll..... has the secret to what you seek

[Hypanor]

You're correct of course, but what about someone thinking of signing up with BB?, they're almost certainly not going to read everything and some of the posts just seem like word slinging with no proof.

If you'd like to reply with the two "finchsells" links, I'll put them into my signature and refer to them from time to time.

Steven, this facebook page has most of the links that are relevant - Banners Broker Ponzi Scam | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/pages/Banners-Broker-Ponzi-Scam/398614356881465?fref=ts)

I still don't know who the page admin is as I don't get any replies to my messages, but he seems to be open to input - I messaged him/her with the Corporations Canada document and it appeared a day or so later. So if anyone thinks there should be something included there, message him (or me if your not on Facebook and I will pass it on).

[StevenHoward]

really well how do you explain myself, clearly I'm no stranger to the internet and its money making potential, I will also reveal but will not substantiate that I am under 40 and have a degree in business and a masters degree in computing, so how did i get hoodwinked by the BB scam? or is it just that I have looked into this a lot deeper than the detractors and found a real business model that actually works. (dont ask me to prove my claims of what I have said about myself, I wont post anything more)

Hi BBdefender.

Unlike a lot of people on this forum, PLUS unlike the vast majority of BBmembers I've an open mind, I'm not totally convinced one way or another, however after a lot of research I now think that BB ***IS*** a ponzi.

Note I said **THINK**. It ticks all the boxes of being a Ponzi, but as things stand there is still no absolute proof one way or another.

Banner Broker can kill this thread dead and vastly increase their number of affiliates IF they can prove where the adverts are displayed, not everyone, maybe a hundred out of the hundreds of thousands they claim to be publishing from genuine well known companies.

Who is this mysterious "Broker" in the blind network that places the ads for BB ?.

There will be no requirement for expensive lawyers to tackle the growing number of BB critics if the requested information above is supplied.

In the meantime, what else are intelligent people expected to think ?

[Poyol]

Hi BBdefender.

Unlike a lot of people on this forum, PLUS unlike the vast majority of BBmembers I've an open mind, I'm not totally convinced one way or another, however after a lot of research I now think that BB ***IS*** a ponzi.

Note I said **THINK**. It ticks all the boxes of being a Ponzi, but as things stand there is still no absolute proof one way or another.

Banner Broker can kill this thread dead and vastly increase their number of affiliates IF they can prove where the adverts are displayed, not everyone, maybe a hundred out of the hundreds of thousands they claim to be publishing from genuine well known companies.

Who is this mysterious "Broker" in the blind network that places the ads for BB ?.

There will be no requirement for expensive lawyers to tackle the growing number of BB critics if the requested information above is supplied.

In the meantime, what else are intelligent people expected to think ?


I had an open mind - I was a very low level affiliate.
But upon hundreds of hours of research I'm 99.999'% certain that it's a Ponzi scheme.

Jason

[StevenHoward]

Steven, this facebook page has most of the links that are relevant - Banners Broker Ponzi Scam | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/pages/Banners-Broker-Ponzi-Scam/398614356881465?fref=ts)

I still don't know who the page admin is as I don't get any replies to my messages, but he seems to be open to input - I messaged him/her with the Corporations Canada document and it appeared a day or so later. So if anyone thinks there should be something included there, message him (or me if your not on Facebook and I will pass it on).

Thanks for that, found this on the FB page which more or less is what I was wanting to post in the first place.

Here is 10 facts you can share with your friends. Get the message out there, Banners Broker is a scam!

Fact 1: Nobody can find the ads. Other than a few token (quite silly) ads run by them directly, there is no "footprint" of BB advertising on the internet.

Fact 2: The BB program was announced in 2010 as a "Straightline Doubler Cycler", and was exclusively announced on HYIP/MLM websites. If you don't know what "doubler cycler" means, research it.

Fact 3: The guys who started BB or who are now the leaders of it have zero credentials or history in the advertising business. They do, however, have a long history in MLM / Pyramid schemes.

Fact 4: BB refuses to work with you as a publisher, if you contact them with an offer to put traffic out on a well-positioned, high-traffic website. Several high profile people have tried this and were not able to even talk to anyone.

Fact 5: BB refuses to work with you as an advertiser, if you contact them with an offer to buy a large block of advertising. Again, several people have tried this and BB is completely unequipped to handle the request.

Fact 6: There is no organic traffic. BB offers the "choice network" to members, with no disclaimer whatsoever about it being in "test mode". However, when pressed on the complete lack of utility or credibility regarding this network, people quickly say "it is in test mode". This is not disclosed to any members via the dashboard, back office or on the BB website, anywhere.

Fact 7: No businessmen (or women) in a free market economy would "discover" a business model as elegant as BB claims to be -- and turn it over to anyone willing to sign up for a free membership. There are (supposedly) millions of dollars in cash flow at play here, with margins that would make the executives at Google salivate - yet the patrons who started BB decided to give it all away to the rest of us.

Fact 8: BB claims to be in business with Clicksor, yet Clicksor has nowhere near the capacity to even begin to touch the advertising flow-through that BB claims to be driving. You can call Clicksor yourself and confirm this.

Fact 9: BB is not known to any of the outside advertising reporting agencies who spend 24 hours a day tracking and reporting on the online advertising business. You can call ComScore yourself and confirm this.

Fact 10: The leaders of BB never attend, present a topic at or even have a presence (like a simple information booth) at any of the big advertising conferences. This is beyond unusual for a "breakthrough" business such as BB.

[StevenHoward]

I had an open mind - I was a very low level affiliate.
But upon hundreds of hours of research I'm 99.999'% certain that it's a Ponzi scheme.

Jason

I'm STILL a very low level affiliate, an affiliate who expects to lose his investment.

What I'm more concerned about is the people who have "invested" thousands of dollars, I know of two people (one in UK, one in Spain) who have put in over ten grand in the last six months AND still keep "reinvesting" despite having the apparent opportunity to withdraw some.

Neither of these people are stupid.......... it just baffles me that they are part of "the blind network", whoops sorry I mean Banners Broker believers.

[Poyol]

I'm STILL a very low level affiliate, an affiliate who expects to lose his investment.

What I'm more concerned about is the people who have "invested" thousands of dollars, I know of two people (one in UK, one in Spain) who have put in over ten grand in the last six months AND still keep "reinvesting" despite having the apparent opportunity to withdraw some.

Neither of these people are stupid.......... it just baffles me that they are part of "the blind network", whoops sorry I mean Banners Broker believers.

You can be blinded by greed even if you're the most intelligent person known to man.
And with the added blind network - I'd call it being double-blind.

J

[AshKen1]

I'm STILL a very low level affiliate, an affiliate who expects to lose his investment.

What I'm more concerned about is the people who have "invested" thousands of dollars, I know of two people (one in UK, one in Spain) who have put in over ten grand in the last six months AND still keep "reinvesting" despite having the apparent opportunity to withdraw some.

Neither of these people are stupid.......... it just baffles me that they are part of "the blind network", whoops sorry I mean Banners Broker believers.

I too have a mate who has invested at least £5000 (not dollars, pounds) in the belief that it will meet his pension needs. Doesn't matter what I say or show to him, he has been pulled in hook, line and sinker. Having known him for over 30 years I am angry with those who have fooled him. There are those whose circumstances are mainly greed I agree: in his case it's because his pension pot has been eroded. Others have been pulled in because they really need the money and are willing to believe anything that will make them money.

I am so sorry for those who are in need, because BB isn't the answer. So they paid everyone? Great ploy - so more money will be invested.... for a little bit longer BB will survive...

[Lil Ol' Radical Me]

For those who are "smart", "professionally qualified", "have experience in making money online" or for any other reasons, and doubt what critics of Banners Broker say about it, I think I have the answer.

You have been duped. And, as LRM and others have pointed out, It has happened to wiser folks than you. Go ask any other Maddoff victims (who included professional fund managers)

However, unliked the Maddoff victims, you have been able to avoid the situation as the information you needed has always been available on the internet, free gratis and for nothing.


Here is 10 facts you can share with your friends. Get the message out there, Banners Broker is a scam!

Fact 1: Nobody can find the ads. Other than a few token (quite silly) ads run by them directly, there is no "footprint" of BB advertising on the internet.

Fact 2: The BB program was announced in 2010 as a "Straightline Doubler Cycler", and was exclusively announced on HYIP/MLM websites. If you don't know what "doubler cycler" means, research it.

Fact 3: The guys who started BB or who are now the leaders of it have zero credentials or history in the advertising business. They do, however, have a long history in MLM / Pyramid schemes.

Fact 4: BB refuses to work with you as a publisher, if you contact them with an offer to put traffic out on a well-positioned, high-traffic website. Several high profile people have tried this and were not able to even talk to anyone.

Fact 5: BB refuses to work with you as an advertiser, if you contact them with an offer to buy a large block of advertising. Again, several people have tried this and BB is completely unequipped to handle the request.

Fact 6: There is no organic traffic. BB offers the "choice network" to members, with no disclaimer whatsoever about it being in "test mode". However, when pressed on the complete lack of utility or credibility regarding this network, people quickly say "it is in test mode". This is not disclosed to any members via the dashboard, back office or on the BB website, anywhere.

Fact 7: No businessmen (or women) in a free market economy would "discover" a business model as elegant as BB claims to be -- and turn it over to anyone willing to sign up for a free membership. There are (supposedly) millions of dollars in cash flow at play here, with margins that would make the executives at Google salivate - yet the patrons who started BB decided to give it all away to the rest of us.

Fact 8: BB claims to be in business with Clicksor, yet Clicksor has nowhere near the capacity to even begin to touch the advertising flow-through that BB claims to be driving. You can call Clicksor yourself and confirm this.

Fact 9: BB is not known to any of the outside advertising reporting agencies who spend 24 hours a day tracking and reporting on the online advertising business. You can call ComScore yourself and confirm this.

Fact 10: The leaders of BB never attend, present a topic at or even have a presence (like a simple information booth) at any of the big advertising conferences. This is beyond unusual for a "breakthrough" business such as BB.

(thanks to Steven Howard for pointing out the obvious)

You have been duped BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T DO YOUR HOMEWORK, you didnt check the facts, you didnt ask any or the right questions or even try to find out how a real advertising business works.

(and instead of Banners Broker you can substitute any HYIP which has claimed to be an advertising company - AdSurfDaily, 12DailyPro, any cycler, etc etc etc )

[Lil Ol' Radical Me]

The above comment was for BB shills, not to the people they have lied to, although they too need to be sent to this thread or at least directed to Steven's 10 Facts List before they waste any more of their money.

[littleroundman]

You have been duped BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T DO YOUR HOMEWORK,

In fact, many of them were duped BEFORE they even began to do their homework.

Many of the victims really do believe what they are doing IS "due diligence"

They fell victim to a "scam before the main scam"

The HYIP ponzi "industry" (if you can call it an "industry") have been working hard behind the scenes for many years promoting their version of "due diligence"

You don't have to look any further than the fact "Chris Smith said" is taken as being true by so many of the Banners Broker members.

"Chris Smith said that Banners Broker is a legally registered business" really does pass as "due diligence" for those people whose only experiences of "business" and "the law" come complete with advert breaks.

Throw in a "certificate of incorporation" and their "due diligence" is done and dusted.

[Lil Ol' Radical Me]

I fully agree with you, but the comments I made apply to anyone who is now shilling for BB or any other scam or defending it.

The only way for them to defend their program is to go back and do their Due Diligence all over again from scratch. Steven's List may well be a helpful tool for them to use.

What you are bringing to our attention are the tactics used by the HYIP/ponzi/online fraud industry, to dissuade people from doing their due diligence. And those tactics are certainly sophisticated, unscrupulous and effective. Brainwashing is not unknown This is on of the reasons why forums like Real Scam and all other places that try to educate the public are so necessary. As the internet has become part of our daily lives, criminals have moved there as it is a fast and initially anonymous way to defraud people who are still very naive about how the internet can be abused to part them from their hard earned money.

However, in the case of the advertising scam schemes, the list that Steven has produced is one that can be easily applied because it is full of COMMON SENSE and that should trump persuasion on the basis of FACT - that together with the MATH.

For those in serious denial - well that is another story

[Theseus]

BEWARE !!!

The end is nigh:

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc153/thelittleroundman/banners.jpg

I wonder why the "reputable and professional law firm in Ireland" that Dixit says they have on retainer hasn't taken The SW, Irish Examiner, Joe Duffy etc,etc to task?

Oh, right, it's because, just like the banners, they don't exist...

[noname999]

To jen and BBdef...and any other BB fan, why won't you answer my very simple questions?

[Poyol]

Thank you to everyone who has helped investigate Banners Broker.

Thank you to the defenders for giving us food for thought; and even laughter at times.

If in the new year you don't stoop to the levels of ad hominem when debating and iterating your points we'll get along slightly better. We'll be able to have a civilised debate. Now, I may be asking for too much - but 'tis the season of goodwill to all men. I'm not religious - but the morals are right.

I won't be here over the Christmas period - I'll be too busy with my family. However, if anyone does wish to contact me you may contact me at either: jason-clark@outlook.com or may contact me by phone.

I will provide a phone number to those who PM me upon reading this.

Thank you and have a very Merry Christmas!

Jason

[amathyst87]

Thank you to everyone who has helped investigate Banners Broker.

Thank you to the defenders for giving us food for thought; and even laughter at times.

If in the new year you don't stoop to the levels of ad hominem when debating and iterating your points we'll get along slightly better. We'll be able to have a civilised debate. Now, I may be asking for too much - but 'tis the season of goodwill to all men. I'm not religious - but the morals are right.

I won't be here over the Christmas period - I'll be too busy with my family. However, if anyone does wish to contact me you may contact me at either: jason-clark@outlook.com or may contact me by phone.

I will provide a phone number to those who PM me upon reading this.

Thank you and have a very Merry Christmas!

Jason

Have a good 'un

[AshKen1]

Thank you to everyone who has helped investigate Banners Broker.

..... Thank you and have a very Merry Christmas!

Jason

And a happy and peaceful Christmas to you and everyone else on here.

:)

[Soapboxmom]

05-18-2006, 08:11 AM





Soapboxmom (http://www.scam.com/member.php?u=13897) http://www.scam.com/images/statusicon/user_offline.gif
Banned



Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Mars
Posts: 1,926
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Re: Prosperity Automated System-- Anyone have any experience?
The not so good Dr. Lieven says:

Quote:


Out of the current 3,256 PAS MEMBERS, only 713 are
qualified, and that includes the recent "electronic flips
of qualification". Many of those, however, have NOT made
a profit sale yet. And many of those who have made one,
have still not achieved a BREAK EVEN on their investment,
or even covered their initial investment in marketing.

So, almost 4/5 of the membership is still in need of basic
Qualification, and thus is still a long way from profit. That
is over 2,500 members who need a Qualifying Sale and 2
profit Sales, just to get to a whee bit of profit.

That is over 7,500 Sales that are needed,
just to feed that bare Break Even necessity.




Only 22% have qualified. Of the 2500 who haven't qualifeid they need 7500 sales to get just past the break even point. That 7500 needs 22,500 recruits to break even. That 22,500 recruits needs 67,500. That 65,700 needs 202,500. They need 607,500 who need 1,822,500 who need 5,467,500 who need 16,402,500..................

That completely amoral scammer just described your pyramid scheme. He admitted that it is a losing proposition for thousands and will only get worse. The minute recruiting slows down we have 80% or so of the recruits losing tremendous amounts of money. So, let's be honest. What kind of folks get involved in a scam like this at all. If you are lucky enough to make money you are in a tiny minority and you must by design take cash from many folks who are destined to lose big. This is just the kind of venture to get lots of complaints and attention from the authorities.

He admitted the guarantee seems to have disappeared. They couldn't possibly honor it. Is that any surprise? Now you have heard about the phony bologna websites and paid infomercials as no legitimate news source, university or business expert is going to promote a blatant scheme like this! Hang on to your wallets and run fast folks!

http://www.hyipdiscussion.com/advert...s-feature.html (http://www.hyipdiscussion.com/advertisements/21917-urgentupdate-pulse-america-tv-series-feature.html)

That is a hilarious thread on the new paid infomercial PAS is doing. They try to make it seem that the Discovery Channel and CNN Headline News are airing some educational programming/"Pulse on America" that includes a segment on this egregious scam! PAS suggests that they won some kind of contest to be chosen for this "Models of Excellence series" This is unbelievable how these scammers will lie to lure in warm bodies.


Soapboxmom




The not so good doctor sure gets around. Amazingly he can do math. He has been involved in all sorts of sleazy deals. The SEC swooped in and shut down Prosperity Automated Systems much to our delight. Perhaps, BB will be next on the law enforcement radar here!

[Mundorf]

In fact, many of them were duped BEFORE they even began to do their homework.

Many of the victims really do believe what they are doing IS "due diligence"

They fell victim to a "scam before the main scam"




The HYIP ponzi "industry" (if you can call it an "industry") have been working hard behind the scenes for many years promoting their version of "due diligence"

You don't have to look any further than the fact "Chris Smith said" is taken as being true by so many of the Banners Broker members.

"Chris Smith said that Banners Broker is a legally registered business" really does pass as "due diligence" for those people whose only experiences of "business" and "the law" come complete with advert breaks.

Throw in a "certificate of incorporation" and their "due diligence" is done and dusted.

Very true.But when you have to do with humans,all kind of everything is possible.One of my friend from a social network site invested few hundred $ in BB obscure adventure.I asked him did he really know where is he throwing his money?I got answer -Yes I know it's scam and ponzi but,I will just try my luck with hope that I will profit before it goes belly up. - the world is not white and black.There are people who deal with evil by knowing they could get burned and burn others.I bet that large mayority BB members know they are a part of ponzi and scam company - they just do not care so far their greed has hope.This are people with greedy character so does not metter if they are aware or not where they invest money - greed as supreme priority

[Mundorf]

[TABLE="class: tborder, width: 100%, align: center"]
[TR]

The not so good doctor sure gets around. Amazingly he can do math. He has been involved in all sorts of sleazy deals. The SEC swooped in and shut down Prosperity Automated Systems much to our delight. Perhaps, BB will be next on the law enforcement radar here!

Oh yes...this is my wish 2 for the coming year...said that - May the Holiday season bring lots of Happiness and Success
to you and your loved ones.

[Whip]

You're blowing up in my face like a toddler with a tantrum, when I've barely spoken in this thread (or even this subject).

Try aiming your terrible twos at someone who has posted frequently about BB, Jens, and behave more like a businessman.

I would guess you have outed him in a cash gifting thread perhaps under another alias.

[StevenHoward]

Oh yes...this is my wish 2 for the coming year...said that - May the Holiday season bring lots of Happiness and Success
to you and your loved ones.


Actually, I know a way of guaranteeing you success in the new year, you see there's this fantastic new online opportunity called BannersBroker, you shell out a few dollars, wait a few weeks, double your money, then put all that back in and earn some more.


Here's a link to my signup page ......... BannersBroker (http://www.bannersbroker.com/imustbeanidiot/) :peace:

PS :- Just hover over the link, don't click on it, having said that there just might be an affiliate with that name.

Merry Xmas everyone.

[iainsherriff]

Hi everyone.

Just popped in to wish you all a very mery xma and a happy new year.

I hope we all get what we want in 2013 :RpS_thumbsup:


.........not quite sure how that will work tho :RpS_laugh:

[noname999]

To jen and BBdef...and any other BB fan, why won't you answer my very simple questions?

The silence is deafening...

[Beacon]

The sad reality is that all home based business opportunity haters always come and troll around on forums just to prove how wrong it is for people to be active in the industry.

Please look up "sweeping generalisation" under "logical fallacy"
I have run a business from home and that doesnt stop me being critical of scam home business.
In fact "work from home" schemes are in the top five of scams.


You can try to prove that BB is a scam for many years to come. It won't affect the company anyway. Funny how some people are putting so much energy and time in ridiculous claims that don't make sense at all.

Funny how people are putting their money ionto something that wouont be paying them in a few months time.
Actually not funny at all but rather sad and scary.
We dont have to prove any scam. If it is it will collapse. The point is BB makes claims it cant support which for any NORMAL business would be easy to support. e.g. annual returns, offices, employees, company registration details, background of executives etc. Scant evidence offered and what is offered is a farce when you look into it. the name has been changed ( Canada) and the company has moved from one tax haven to another( Isle of Mann; Belize) the office doesnt exist or isnt a banners broker office but one paid for by an associate. etc. all that is considered very dodgy in business It makes huge alarm bells ring. You know more about a guy that comes up to you in the street and says "here is a picture of me with the Pope can you trust me with you r life savings and I will double them?"

[Beacon]

You ran to tell your mommy??....Should I go stand in the naughty corner now??......
Please Okosh lay of the ad hominem and deal with the subject of the thread. Can you do that please? Likewise BBDefender. Leave off the personal attacks and deal with the issues guys.

[Beacon]

Banners Broker Scam – Don’t Let It Affect You « Finch Sells (http://finchsells.com/2012/10/21/banners-broker-scam-dont-let-it-affect-you/)
Banners Broker Scam Update « Finch Sells (http://finchsells.com/2012/12/20/banners-broker-scam-update/)

And my own (not in the slightest complete)
Jason Clark Investigates (http://www.jasonclarkinvestigates.com)

I happen to agree with stephen Howard. Can a mod sticky the references list on the thread page top ot in the forum list top?

[iainsherriff]

2402


" Hey Bannersbroker, I have a complaint. The presents your Affiliates but are way too BIG to fit down chimneys"


:RpS_wink:

[noname999]

@Iain: Can you answer my questions?

[Joe_Shmoe]

Ian, BBD, anybody please answer if you can.

When & where did Chris Smith go to college, what did he study & what qualification did he gain?

His previous employment? His previous business experience?

Surely during the huge amount of due diligence you all did with regards to Banners Broker before you sunk your money in, somebody somewhere must have some info on him?

[EagleOne]

To jen and BBdef...and any other BB fan, why won't you answer my very simple questions?

They can't.

[StevenHoward]

Fact 11: (This should probably be higher up the list). The are NO, repeat NO, banner adverts on Banner Brokers website, not one !!!!!.

[Theseus]

2402


" Hey Bannersbroker, I have a complaint. The presents your Affiliates but are way too

BIG to fit down chimneys"


:RpS_wink:

Looks like Santa is taking a huge dump down your affiliates' chimney, Ian....

A bit like what Raj Dixit is planning to do :RpS_lol:

[BB Defender]

I'm referred in, in fact I think I have signed up 9 or 10 times - can I have 'The Truth' now please BBD?
I'd like to know, because not one of the referrers I (silently) used have bothered to contact me or tell me anything. I'm assuming Banners Broker can provide an upline with contact details of those who have signed up under them? You know, so you know BB aren't ripping you off (actually they are, but you know what I mean)?

Which of my affiliate links would you like, I have several to choose from. Are they counted as part of the 250,000 brethren?



Have you really committed yourself brother cult member by putting money into any of your registered accounts? anyone even the detractors can show interest and not commit by just registering.

[BB Defender]

I suggest you look up affirming a consequent when you are preusing "logical fallacy"

Hint:
P: All communists have beards
Q: BB Defender has a beard

Therefore can we conclude BB defender is a communist?

Similarly whether or not Amathyst supplies any personal information about himself has no bearing whatsoever on claims made on the experience and working history of Chris Smith.

At best were amathyst to supply verification of experience in senior marketing it would confirm his claim about himself.
But even if he supplied such details he would not be able to prove anything based on the fallacy of "argument from authority"

tyhe point about chris smith isnt that proving his background would make his claims toru. Chris Smith should he produce his credentials would similarly be arguing from authority. The point is if Chris Smith utterly fails to produce background evidence he is most probably lying about his background and cant be trusted in any business. Amythest isnt asking anyone to buy into any business so it isnt required he support any claims about himself. But at least amythesyt supplies source material and verifiable references to back up his argument and not fast talk and opinion.


Hey Beacon, you are clearly a master of logical deduction and whatever else you specialise in, but you are also very clearly ignorant about real world business practices.

[BB Defender]

So this legitimate advertising broker, fearful of "copycats" launched its business as a "straightline cycler doubler" that (rather than offering any product) promised to "take $20 and DOUBLE it MULTIPLE TIMES TO $10,000" to throw others off the scent?

Come to think of it, you might be onto something there. I'm pretty sure when Google was launched initially it was a drive-thru carwash....

No actually google launched itself to a very small group of research students as a way to collectively share the research they had undertaken. Ummm sounds a bit different to the multi billion marketing machine it is today.

[BB Defender]

Yes and I have succeeded in finding out. In fact management theory and training are full of such things.



Yes they do.


Yes it originally was coca - yuou know the drug from which cocaine is made? their current ingredients are a trade secret. But we arent asking BB to reveal any trade secrets. We are asking like Coca cola
-where therir offices are
- what is the background of their staff
-wher are their annual company returns
- how much tax did they pay?

All this is freely available for Google and Coca Cola and indeed it is required by law.
so where is it for BB - which does not exist since it was changed to Stellar Point.


Actually no! the UK is a common law juristiction. In CRIMINAL law innocence is assumed. You might well be guilty but it is assumed you arent. The BURDEN OF PROOF ( remember that phrase) is on the prosecution to prove guilt in a CRIMINAL case.

But in a civil case it is based on "balance of evidence" not "assumption of innocence"
Company Law and Contract Law is civil law.

In a sence BB is on trial here. The prosecution produced ample evidence about the background of Dixit and the failure to satisfy statutory regulatory conditions. what defence have you prodeced? what actual evidence? Piss and winf like the barber's cat.



True and there is not necessity for terrorists to prove they are not terrorists either.
Or for the Nazis to prove they were not out to get people.
And if we all sit around and do nothing while others suffer eventually they come for you.


what people do is their own business



Again what I do or do not do elsewhere is nothing to do with the issue of you coming here to support claims about BB being a legit business.
and can you lay of the ad hominem? When you are losing an argument do you always resort to attacking the other person instead?


If it is a legal requirement that for BB to continue with its business it needed to declare all you say it needs to declare then logically thinking it would no longer be trading as the authorities would have shut it down? Private limited companies need only submit their company reports and accounts to the companies house or equivalent in Canada, if you want to find out its current turnover just use the Canadian equivalent of the compass guide. Regardless of what you say about private actions of individuals still it stands to reason that with so many people complaining about BB here on this thread since 10-21-2011, 12:01 PM some of you would have alerted the authorities and they would have taken some action. near the start there are statements such as

"Roll up, roll up,

Place your bets, Ladies and Gentlemen.

How many weeks left in this one ???" --- littleroundman (administrator)

hey littleroundman what went wrong why is BB still around?, your predictions seem as faulty as your subsequent intel on BB.

[BB Defender]

Did you know the average lifetime of a fruit fly is around 30 days, depending on climatic conditions.

During that 30 days, a fruit fly will hatch, mature, infect, reproduce and die.

I think perhaps we should reclassify Banners Broker HYIP ponzi shills as "advanced fruitflies"

Their lifecycle is definitely nearing the end.

as near as your initial prediction dated 06-21-2012, 04:18 AM

quoting "The end is nigh:"

that would mean I still have some time to make money on BB going by materialisation of your past prophecies.

[BB Defender]

I don't know.

Perhaps you'd better ask the victims of previous frauds exactly how is was done.

Come to think of it, I think there's probably a whole pile of Madoff Securities victims who would have considered themselves a great deal smarter than events subsequently proved them to be.

IOW, your "how is it possible for someone as smart as me to be hoodwinked" may well work on rank amateurs, but it certainly won't work here.



so in that sense nobody should ever start a business where there is any risk? We should all just sit on these threads expressing our negative opinions of the different business opportunities because its we cant get our head around the business concept. Or is it just spite at not being able to take part that makes us sit here?

[Joe_Shmoe]

so in that sense nobody should ever start a business where there is any risk? We should all just sit on these threads expressing our negative opinions of the different business opportunities because its we cant get our head around the business concept. Or is it just spite at not being able to take part that makes us sit here?

Can you supply the information we have asked for regarding Chris Smith if you have it?

Or are you for some reason avoiding the issue?

[BB Defender]

Hi BBdefender.

Unlike a lot of people on this forum, PLUS unlike the vast majority of BBmembers I've an open mind, I'm not totally convinced one way or another, however after a lot of research I now think that BB ***IS*** a ponzi.

Note I said **THINK**. It ticks all the boxes of being a Ponzi, but as things stand there is still no absolute proof one way or another.

Banner Broker can kill this thread dead and vastly increase their number of affiliates IF they can prove where the adverts are displayed, not everyone, maybe a hundred out of the hundreds of thousands they claim to be publishing from genuine well known companies.

Who is this mysterious "Broker" in the blind network that places the ads for BB ?.

There will be no requirement for expensive lawyers to tackle the growing number of BB critics if the requested information above is supplied.

In the meantime, what else are intelligent people expected to think ?


Steven, when I was investigating the inconsistencies with BB I thought it seemed like a pyramid scheme not a ponzi scheme though as there are subtle differences between the two, it seemed more consistent with the pyramid structure than Joseph Ponzi's approach to fraudulent business opportunities. However that being said both are illegal and fraudulent. However there were also aspects of this business that didn't sit in with your typical pyramid scheme, I cant speak for BB v1 as I had no interaction with it, but certainly in BB v2 it seemed there were things that didn't add up to pyramid scheme behavior.

1) The rules of working with the BB panels and traffic dictate that profitability is not as great as expected, check my earlier posts you will see factual info on what the return on investment actually is. If anyone can claim otherwise based on BB v2 then let them speak.

2) Typically the management of a pyramid scheme rarely choose to live overtly and go around promoting their product worldwide, The management team are known, they appear in public and I can tell you now that during Feb 2013 (8,9,10) they will be in the ICT Sonar hotel, in Kolkata, India. They don't seem to be running scared or in fear of being caught.

3) The business they have engaged in the buying and selling of impressions is not really that difficult to understand and once you know what to look for you can find the evidence of a real industry and the lucrative nature of the online advertising industry.

4) The compliance rules have meant that a lot of greedy and misbehaving affiliates such as DR lievan van neste have been kicked out of BB, some of them are here on this thread trying to take revenge by debunking BB with lies. Why would a fraudulent business enterprise do this? Why kick some others out for being greedy and exhibiting corrupt behaviour when they themselves are the source a great misconduct and scam?

5) Pyramid schemes rarely last very long, they collapse when the money from new recruits does not pay for the recruiters profits. The amount of new money going into BB is not huge the organisation must be undertaking some profit making activity in order to be able to continue paying out the profits to the affiliates, there simply is not enough fresh money coming in to cover that cost.

6) For any affiliate to make any serious money on a Pyramid schemes that individual has to recruit new affiliates, with BB this is not so you can make money without recruiting new people, it may be slower and a little less profitable never the less it still is profitable if an individual chooses not to refer anyone.

7) Finally if BB is a pyramid scheme why would they still be around? they have already enough cash to running through the business to run and hide with tens of millions in their pockets, but they haven't rather they are constantly trying to make changes and improvements to their business model and structure so that they can continue running the business, this is more consistent with normal business practices than pyramid schemes. Sure maybe they are doing it out of greed to get a bigger payout but no one is that stupid after seeing zeek fall they would continue with their fraudulent business till the investigators come, they didn't seem nervous or scared in Ireland, in fact they have expanded into new offices so what gives?

Anyway the other questions you raised are answered below.

You really need to understand the concept of a blind network, the reality is that BB cannot provide you the location of the ads never mind that BB doesn't have this information the publishers/websites which are used wouldn't allow it as this would be like shooting themselves in the foot. Publishers are undertaking direct selling of their ad inventory at price (A) when they offer remnant ad inventory on the blind network due to market forces it is sold at a lower price say price (B), if the publishers allowed themselves to be named then this would negatively affect the direct selling of their ad inventory.

I am also curious to know which of the brokers they use maybe its a question I will pose on the Kolkata leg of the BB world tour, they don't have anything to lose now as they already have real competitors who have started operating with the same business model and I don't mean the 1800banners.com which I mentioned in my earlier posts. All that was just to wind up the pathological pessimists sitting on this thread.

[Joe_Shmoe]

BBDefender

You seem to be an expert in all things Banners Broker.

Can you supply the information we have asked for regarding Chris Smith if you have it?

We know nothing about this guy who runs a multi-million dollar worldwide advertising company.

[BB Defender]

Can you supply the information we have asked for regarding Chris Smith if you have it?

Or are you for some reason avoiding the issue?

Read my earlier post to Brenda, I don't have access to this information. I have never said that I do!

I am simply defending a business opportunity with the limited knowledge that I have gained over the last 6 months. The fact that I can refute or request evidence for the false claims that some of you guys are making is evidence that the one sided vitriol being spouted on this thread is really just nonsense, feelings, dreams, hypothetical's all being spouted as facts. I believe BB to be a genuine online business opportunity and I wish to defend it till I have been provided with irrefutable evidence that it is not.

When that evidence has been provided then I will change my name to BB Attacker and attack BB with all my might.

[Joe_Shmoe]

Read my earlier post to Brenda, I don't have access to this information. I have never said that I do!

That's the point Chris Smith he runs a worldwide advertising company we & you know ZIP about him. Why is this?

This guy just popped up out of nowhere apparently.

[BB Defender]

BBDefender

You seem to be an expert in all things Banners Broker.

Can you supply the information we have asked for regarding Chris Smith if you have it?

We know nothing about this guy who runs a multi-million dollar worldwide advertising company.



All I know about Chris Smith is that he is really a black afro carribean man, he seems somewhat overweight, doesn't dance too well and is not a very good public speaker. but that doesn't make him a criminal, that doesn't make him the leader of a cult, that doesn't make him the mastermind behind an evil pyramid scam that is planning to rob millions of people of their hard earned cash.

He just seemed to be soft spoken ordinary person who had a really good business concept and managed to get it to work.

[littleroundman]

Oh dear,

and I had such high hopes for BB Defender, too.

Now he's had to resort to the HYIP ponzi pimps' last fallback defenses: "flood the thread" and "Is it a ponzi or is it a pyramid"

Ponzi -pyramid ?? pyramid - ponzi ???

Who the h*** cares ???

Certainly not prosecutors.

Securities violations / wire fraud / fraud / money laundering / conspiracy

THAT'S what we're talking about here.

Just ask Andy Bowdoin or Paul Burks.

[Joe_Shmoe]

All I know about Chris Smith is that he is really a black afro carribean man, he seems somewhat overweight, doesn't dance too well and is not a very good public speaker.

So on that basis (knowing literately nothing about his business acumen, history, qualifications etc, etc, etc,) you would consider him a good investment?


A guy who popped up out of nowhere no back story or history?


Raj Dixit has a history if you care to look it up.

[noname999]

@BBdefender: What due diligence did you do before putting money into BB?

[littleroundman]

@BBdefender: What due diligence did you do before putting money into BB?

He asked himself "is it paying" ??

[Lil Ol' Radical Me]

If it is a legal requirement that for BB to continue with its business it needed to declare all you say it needs to declare then logically thinking it would no longer be trading as the authorities would have shut it down? Private limited companies need only submit their company reports and accounts to the companies house or equivalent in Canada, if you want to find out its current turnover just use the Canadian equivalent of the compass guide. Regardless of what you say about private actions of individuals still it stands to reason that with so many people complaining about BB here on this thread since 10-21-2011, 12:01 PM some of you would have alerted the authorities and they would have taken some action. near the start there are statements such as

"Roll up, roll up,

Place your bets, Ladies and Gentlemen.

How many weeks left in this one ???" --- littleroundman (administrator)

hey littleroundman what went wrong why is BB still around?, your predictions seem as faulty as your subsequent intel on BB.

How do you know they haven't and they aren't?

[Mundorf]

So on that basis (knowing literately nothing about his business acumen, history, qualifications etc, etc, etc,) you would consider him a good investment?


A guy who popped up out of nowhere no back story or history?


Raj Dixit has a history if you care to look it up.


Probably Smith will start to have back story once BB goes belly up as junior ponzi collector

[BB Defender]

Oh dear,

and I had such high hopes for BB Defender, too.

Now he's had to resort to the HYIP ponzi pimps' last fallback defenses: "flood the thread" and "Is it a ponzi or is it a pyramid"

Ponzi -pyramid ?? pyramid - ponzi ???

Who the h*** cares ???

Certainly not prosecutors.

Securities violations / wire fraud / fraud / money laundering / conspiracy

THAT'S what we're talking about here.

Just ask Andy Bowdoin or Paul Burks.

Well its important to know which crime you are theoretically taking part in and profiting from.

[littleroundman]

How do you know they haven't and they aren't?

It's not hard to tell who has experience in these matters and who has gained their experience from watching TV and movies.

It doesn't matter how many times we remind people, in the real world, HYIP ponzi investigations take a minimum of 12 months and, more usually around 18 months, there's always a HYIP ponzi pimp who trots out the "if it were a ponzi, why haven't the authorities acted" defense.

[Mundorf]

He asked himself "is it paying" ??

And then he found that Smith is soft spoken ordinary person and answer was " it must be paying"

[BB Defender]

So on that basis (knowing literately nothing about his business acumen, history, qualifications etc, etc, etc,) you would consider him a good investment?


A guy who popped up out of nowhere no back story or history?


Raj Dixit has a history if you care to look it up.


I didn't invest money in Chris Smith, I started up a business whether it sinks or swims is up to me BB is just a mediator that allows me to interact with a much bigger market place.

I know about raj dixit and his homes scandal. It was a big bother to me when I first found out, but I got over it, he made his mistakes, he payed his dues and maybe he has learnt his lesson that crime doesn't pay and so on this occasion is not committing a crime.

[Joe_Shmoe]

Probably Smith will start to have back story once BB goes belly up as junior ponzi collector

He will simply disappear into the ether from whence he came, but considerably wealthier.

[noname999]

@BBdefender: What due diligence did you do before putting money into BB?

@BBdef: I think you may have missed my question.

[BB Defender]

@BBdefender: What due diligence did you do before putting money into BB?

I did a little research, trusted the person referring me and took a risk based on my own reasoning. I don't think I would have done anymore before starting up any other business, it wasn't a huge monetary risk.

The proper research came sometime after I had put money in when I found out about raj and his criminal activity. That was the ditch or continue moment, but by researching and understanding the business I came to the conclusion that there is a genuine business model in BB. I came to this website and read the evidence piled up against BB here, and on other scam buster sites, but nothing here convinced me for certain that BB was a pyramid scheme. It cast shadows over some aspects for sure but every business is a risk. There are no 100% risk free business in this world. However when I pieced together the real business that BB undertake and it was confirmed from the horses mouth in Ireland, no doubts remained whatsoever.

Now I'm here debunking the debunker's as it annoys me that so many people sit on this thread talking nonsense and telling lies to try to scare affiliates and convince people that BB is a scam.

[noname999]

I did a little research.

What research?

[noname999]

There are no 100% risk free business in this world.

According BB members this is not true. In fact they say 'its impossible to not make money'.

So are you telling the truth or are they?

[noname999]

it was confirmed from the horses mouth in Ireland



Are you referring to Paul McCarthy?

[okosh]

Hi BBdefender.

Unlike a lot of people on this forum, PLUS unlike the vast majority of BBmembers I've an open mind, I'm not totally convinced one way or another, however after a lot of research I now think that BB ***IS*** a ponzi.

Note I said **THINK**. It ticks all the boxes of being a Ponzi, but as things stand there is still no absolute proof one way or another.

Banner Broker can kill this thread dead and vastly increase their number of affiliates IF they can prove where the adverts are displayed, not everyone, maybe a hundred out of the hundreds of thousands they claim to be publishing from genuine well known companies.

Who is this mysterious "Broker" in the blind network that places the ads for BB ?.

There will be no requirement for expensive lawyers to tackle the growing number of BB critics if the requested information above is supplied.


In the meantime, what else are intelligent people expected to think ?

Yet it ticks none of the boxes for being real, doing as it claims and for not being a ponzi.....So what is there to think????.....

Maybe looking at this from the other side may help you to see that there is no way that BB is real which means it must be a ponzi....

In other words....See what evidence you can find to show proof that it is real.....

Keep in mind that any twit can register a name in just about any country in many cases online....
Any twit can set up a business address for a hyip without ever being there....Virtual offices are a dime a dozen....Short term real rentals of a property are just as easy....
Any twit can set up a facebook page.....
Any twit can find a few shills....

Bottom line is that so far I am yet to see any proof at all that BB is real.....No proof that BB is anything but a ponzi scheme....

Way back as far as 2006 with ponzi schemes like 12dp, pips, asd, v-lane, CEP, zeek and a host of others the shills always demand that it is us who must show proof that their pet program is a ponzi.....
Not once will they ever step up and show proof that it is not a ponzi.....Why won't they ever stand up and show proof that the program really does what they claim??....

At the end of the day the proof that BB is a ponzi will come.....Only problem is that it will come much too late for those who were scammed.....By then the "BB defenders" will be long gone....Moved on to the next new scam with a new name to post under....

[BB Defender]

And then he found that Smith is soft spoken ordinary person and answer was " it must be paying"

hey gandalf, is that longbottom leaf any good?

[noname999]

Now I'm here debunking the debunker's as it annoys me that so many people sit on this thread talking nonsense and telling lies to try to scare affiliates and convince people that BB is a scam.

I can't speak for everyone but I try not to talk nonsense and I don't tell lies. I ask simple questions, questions that have never got a proper answer.

[okosh]

I didn't invest money in Chris Smith, I started up a business whether it sinks or swims is up to me BB is just a mediator that allows me to interact with a much bigger market place.


Are you serious??.....
If you honestly believe that then you either a newbie without a clue or a complete fool.....
Either way you in for a huge shock....

[littleroundman]

Now I'm here debunking the debunker's as it annoys me that so many people sit on this thread talking nonsense and telling lies to try to scare affiliates and convince people that BB is a scam.

REALLY ????

You're psychic now ???

How do you know posters are "trying to scare affiliates" ???

How do you know we aren't simply following the REALSCAM.com (www.realscam.com) stated aim of allowing people to decide for themselves ??

http://www.realscam.com/images/misc/realscam-logo1.gif

HYIP ponzis stand and fall on their own merits.

A relatively small forum such as this can have no impact on the mathematical reality of HYIP ponzis and how they work.

No one here stands to lose of gain a cent from Banners Broker.

None of us are paid and there's no advertisers to keep happy.

YOU, on the other hand.............................................. ...............................

[littleroundman]

Are you serious??.....
If you honestly believe that then you either a newbie without a clue or a complete fool.....


You left out the third and most important option:

"or a HYIP ponzi shill"

[noname999]

No one here stands to lose of gain a cent from Banners Broker.

None of us are paid and there's no advertisers to keep happy.
.

These are a very important points that are probably not stressed enough.

[littleroundman]

These are a very important points that are probably not stressed enough.

We'd better be careful here, or we'll be flooded with Banners Broker pimps spouting their "dreamstealers" and "haterz" nonsense.

[okosh]

You left out the third and most important option:

"or a HYIP ponzi shill"

I thank you for pointing this outas I did forget to add the 3rd option....

But IMHO BB defender is in fact a newbie and has no idea what he got himself into.....I just hope he didn't mortgage the farm or max out the credit cards and drop the lot in BB....

[BB Defender]

Yet it ticks none of the boxes for being real, doing as it claims and for not being a ponzi.....So what is there to think????.....

Maybe looking at this from the other side may help you to see that there is no way that BB is real which means it must be a ponzi....

In other words....See what evidence you can find to show proof that it is real.....

Keep in mind that any twit can register a name in just about any country in many cases online....
Any twit can set up a business address for a hyip without ever being there....Virtual offices are a dime a dozen....Short term real rentals of a property are just as easy....
Any twit can set up a facebook page.....
Any twit can find a few shills....

Bottom line is that so far I am yet to see any proof at all that BB is real.....No proof that BB is anything but a ponzi scheme....

Way back as far as 2006 with ponzi schemes like 12dp, pips, asd, v-lane, CEP, zeek and a host of others the shills always demand that it is us who must show proof that their pet program is a ponzi.....
Not once will they ever step up and show proof that it is not a ponzi.....Why won't they ever stand up and show proof that the program really does what they claim??....

At the end of the day the proof that BB is a ponzi will come.....Only problem is that it will come much too late for those who were scammed.....By then the "BB defenders" will be long gone....Moved on to the next new scam with a new name to post under....


well you can register your name in any country but you need to prove you are who you are with government ID and address id before being able to pull money out, so if you cant do that then don't put money in.

BB International use offices in Canada, they share the office with Stellar Point which is the new name for BB Canada, 5 Carlow Court, Whitby, ON L1N 9T7 , some idiots looked at it on google maps saw the old sign from when it was owned by energy services back in August 2012 even then any idiot should have noticed its vacant look, they immediately assumed that it was a lie and BB didn't own the offices. BB have not denied that Stellar Point is the maanged services company that looks after BB operations in canada.
BannersBroker (http://bannersbroker.com/main/welcome_canada)

Yes any twit could set up a facebook page even the president of America is capable of setting up a facebook page, so what?

Yes any organisation can find a few shills but finding 250000 is a different matter, why aren't these shills all deaparting from their being really dissapointed at BB.

Bottom line is you havent bothered to look hard enough, you haven't attended a conference, you haven't visited the canadian offices or the reseller offices any where else so yes you can say all that you say but its just your feelings. Why dont you visit offices above and see if BB do actually use it.

[noname999]

you haven't visited the canadian offices or the reseller offices any where else so yes you can say all that you say but its just your feelings. Why dont you visit offices above and see if BB do actually use it.

I did in Ireland. The office didn't exist.

[noname999]

even then any idiot should have noticed its vacant look,



Similar to the vacant look of Kinvara House?

[BB Defender]

We'd better be careful here, or we'll be flooded with Banners Broker pimps spouting their "dreamstealers" and "haterz" nonsense.

Damn my real goal of diverting and flooding this thread with positive posts about BB has been discovered.

[BB Defender]

Similar to the vacant look of Kinvara House?

The point being that the picture was taken before BB moved into it.

[BB Defender]

I did in Ireland. The office didn't exist.

Cant speak for Ireland they were a odd bunch of people.

[noname999]

The point being that the picture was taken before BB moved into it.

I got your point. It just wasn't a very good one. I'm still waiting to hear what research you did...

[BB Defender]

REALLY ????

You're psychic now ???

How do you know posters are "trying to scare affiliates" ???

How do you know we aren't simply following the REALSCAM.com (www.realscam.com) stated aim of allowing people to decide for themselves ??

http://www.realscam.com/images/misc/realscam-logo1.gif

HYIP ponzis stand and fall on their own merits.

A relatively small forum such as this can have no impact on the mathematical reality of HYIP ponzis and how they work.

No one here stands to lose of gain a cent from Banners Broker.

None of us are paid and there's no advertisers to keep happy.

YOU, on the other hand.............................................. ...............................


As I said speak the truth with evidence and I will be happy to listen, but nonsense just annoys me.

but participants spouting lies and conjecture as true facts is not enabling people to make a decision for themselves.

oh and you are correct your presence here does not have much of an effect other than worrying poor affiliates like Brenda (assuming she is an affiliate), and that annoys me as well.

so I'm just responding to the nonsense but you will notice where people care to be civil I reciprocate in a likewise manner.

I'm not paid to be here posting about BB either!......I just do it because it gives readers an alternative viewpoint.

[noname999]

Cant speak for Ireland they were a odd bunch of people.

What do you mean by that?

[baylee]

I know about raj dixit and his homes scandal. It was a big bother to me when I first found out, but I got over it, he made his mistakes, he payed his dues and maybe he has learnt his lesson that crime doesn't pay and so on this occasion is not committing a crime.


LOL, I am still cleaning my computer screen! As always the crapola still runs downhill.

[okosh]

I can't speak for everyone but I try not to talk nonsense and I don't tell lies. I ask simple questions, questions that have never got a proper answer.

That's because they can't give you what doesn't exist.....

Back in the good old days it used to be simple.....Admin decides to open a program....He gets a website made....Then he starts thread at MMG or TG where he says, "here is my new hyip, lets play"......And the players play......

These days players don't want that.....They seen the SEC and other members of the American alphabet police step in with 12dp and others so now they want the hyip to resemble a real investment or business.....

It's kinda like how a magic act has evolved.....Back in the good old days to pull a rabbit out of a hat would gets bums on seats.....Today the people want David Copperfield and they want to see an elephant vanish.....
It's still a basic magic trick but for the elephant to vanish they use smoke and mirrors.....

Programs like BB are much the same.....It's still just a hyip.....Just with a whole lot of smoke and mirrors.....None of it is real just like the elephant doesn't really vanish....

[Mundorf]

At the end of the day the proof that BB is a ponzi will come.....Only problem is that it will come much too late for those who were scammed.....By then the "BB defenders" will be long gone....Moved on to the next new scam with a new name to post under....

....and you know what?..he knows it...he knows it very well..he only wants and demands (and defend) to take as much money from suckers as he can and then one day to post under WHOKNOWSWHATdefender the same parade in hope to support few more coins from fools and spoons - that's all what is here about