Thread: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

Originally Posted by janzmr

@Eagleone - What I really don't understand is WHY YOU feel you can be God, Judge and Jury over the 'scam' Programs. I think that with as may of these as there have been exposed for what they really are - and yet people continue to join them - that is THEIR Choice. I'm sure they are all big boys & girls and realize the risks involved. What upsets me about what you do (and have done) is that YOU are causing these people to lose whatever monies they put into these programs - even IF they are scams, there is the possibility that some (or more), may have been able to 'ride' a bit longer, and may have possibly been able to recoup some of their monies before it all finally crashed.
I really don't understand WHERE YOU fit in all of this!?!?!

janzmr: Welcome to RS. Please forgive me but where did I say I was God, judge, and jury over scam programs?

And no many do not know what they are joining is a Ponzi. While it is true that the promoters, shills and players do, the newbies don't. And the admin, promoters, shills and players all lie to the newbies making them think it is a real investment program.

If you think these are just innocent money games and no-one gets hurt, you have your head buried in the sand. Trillions of dollars is being stolen worldwide in these innocent money games. People are losing their homes, cars, and their life savings to these innocent money games. People are getting divorced, people do commit suicide from losing their life savings, families are broken up, familites and friends are estranged because of these innocent money games.

I do not tell people what to do with their money. I do warn people they are joining a Ponzi or they are in a Ponzi. What they do with that information is up to them. But they know what it is they are getting themselves into before they join.

When the Ponzi admins start putting the following in BOLD red letters: "THIS IS A PONZI. THERE IS NO TRADING OR INVESTING OF ANY KIND. YOU ARE BETTING YOU CAN GET YOUR MONEY FROM OTHERS JOINING AFTER YOU BEFORE I RUN WITH THE MONEY. PLAY AT YOUR OWN RISK." , and the promoters, shills and players say it on the Ponzi forums, then I will stop warning people about these Ponzi's. But we both know that will never happen.

People running these Ponzi's are breaking the law. Anyone who participates in these Ponzi's are breaking the law. I will continue to help law enforcement in any way we can to put these criminals away. I also hope that law enforcement starts putting the major pimps away too in the near future. For if they did, these programs would be far and few between.

As explained by littleroundman, you have the right to say what you say, and I will defend your right to do so. But likewise I have the right to say what I say, and I back mine up with action and facts, not just words.

Originally Posted by perthlady

Ride a bit longer and recoup their monies from WHOM? The new people getting sucked in! The longer it goes on, the more people at the bottom that lose out. It is not right to gain money via deception - this is not simply a game of chance played by those in the know, or there would be no need of the fake back story. These schemes prey on the vulnerable, using "charity" and religion, it's sick. I am sure there are many people grateful to the Ron Eagles of this world for helping them avoid losing their hard earned money and having it possibly used for money laundering and/or financing terrorism.

perthlady: Welcome to RS, and thanks for your wise insight into what these Ponzi's are all about. I look forward to your continued contributions to this thread and others here.

as explained by littleroundman, you have the right to say what you say, and i will defend your right to do so. But likewise i have the right to say what i say, and i back mine up with action and facts, not just words.

applaud.gif

bravo!!

Originally Posted by janzmr

@Eagleone - What I really don't understand is WHY YOU feel you can be God, Judge and Jury over the 'scam' Programs. I think that with as may of these as there have been exposed for what they really are - and yet people continue to join them - that is THEIR Choice. I'm sure they are all big boys & girls and realize the risks involved. What upsets me about what you do (and have done) is that YOU are causing these people to lose whatever monies they put into these programs - even IF they are scams, there is the possibility that some (or more), may have been able to 'ride' a bit longer, and may have possibly been able to recoup some of their monies before it all finally crashed.
I really don't understand WHERE YOU fit in all of this!?!?!

Chill. They have the same rights to free speech as you do. They are in disadvantage on public forums as is 'cuz all they can offer are opinions vis-a-vis real transaction IDs for payments.

Tick tock, tick tock goes the HYIP ponzi clock

How utterly predictable.

First comes news of the cease and desist order

Then comes the flood of "I got paid" posts on the usual suspect HYIP ponzi forums.

Then the truth slowly starts to trickle out.

Originally Posted by janzmr

@Eagleone - What I really don't understand is WHY YOU feel you can be God, Judge and Jury over the 'scam' Programs. I think that with as may of these as there have been exposed for what they really are - and yet people continue to join them - that is THEIR Choice. I'm sure they are all big boys & girls and realize the risks involved. What upsets me about what you do (and have done) is that YOU are causing these people to lose whatever monies they put into these programs - even IF they are scams, there is the possibility that some (or more), may have been able to 'ride' a bit longer, and may have possibly been able to recoup some of their monies before it all finally crashed.
I really don't understand WHERE YOU fit in all of this!?!?!

First of all you are wrong in your assumption that all people go into these schemes knowingly and willingly. The victims /newbies go in believing it is a legal and sustainable scheme because they have been lied to and by some very professional liars.

Secondly, It is not the forums like this that cause people to lose their money. The money games ALWAYS end up with most people losing their money, it is just a question of when and how.

- If the program implodes because there is no new members money to pay the old members, then the new members lose (the old members, including the inner core of promoters will have made their money back several times by then and moved on to the next "greatest thing"

- If the owner runs with the money, then the new members lose (the old members having profited as above)

- If the program is closed down by the authorities. Sometimes this is done while there is still some money to be confiscated and enough is recovered to repay the victims their lost investments - and there is always the possibility of more being recuperated through claw backs. In ASD it was 100% but in others it has been less, and sometimes there is no money to confiscate - just, as said above, a few fast cars to sell. In Zeek, there is not enough money to make the victims whole, but claw backs are in process which will increase the pot to distribute to victims. In the past in other closed down programs people have received cents on the dollar But for the last in, this is the best scenario.

It is not yet known which will be the scenario for the end of Profitable Sunrise, but, without betting the farm on it, I would guess the first or second at Easter.

Originally Posted by Janz

I'm sure they are all big boys & girls and realize the risks involved.

Can I take the opportunity to call "bulls**t" on your assumption ??

Originally Posted by janzmr

... YOU are causing these people to lose whatever monies they put into these programs - even IF they are scams, there is the possibility that some (or more), may have been able to 'ride' a bit longer, and may have possibly been able to recoup some of their monies before it all finally crashed.
I really don't understand WHERE YOU fit in all of this!?!?!

It is called stealing, if you participate in a scam knowingly, it means you financed it to continue it's operation plus if you profited on it, you stole some victim's money.

Originally Posted by janzmr

I'm sure they are all big boys & girls and realize the risks involved.

I would say as a practical matter you do not have a lot of life experience, like having your parents exploited because they started to decline mentally. As people age some become less and less able to make sound decisions, couple this with having what is called a "life savings" it is recipe for disaster. So your $.72 cent interest payments that you proudly tweet about likely came from someone's mother or grandmother who is now bankrupt thanks to (Fill in the blank business opportunity). They were told it was real, and they believed. They same way they will believe they need a new roof, have won the lottery, have a new friend in Nigeria, have a relative in trouble who needs a wire of some cash, have a new "best friend", and on and on.

As a second matter, Roman and others have nothing to worry about if he is in fact making loans as he claims. All the blogging, naysayers, haters, and dreamstealers in the world won't change the fact that people need money to fund their deals, and clearly Roman is the man (or woman) with the money. The only way I see that any of this presents a problem for any of these folks is if their only concern is to recruit new suckers.

Following your logic, we should take down all the stop signs cause people who drive are all big boys and girls who realize the risks in driving.

Originally Posted by janzmr

@Eagleone - What I really don't understand is WHY YOU feel you can be God, Judge and Jury over the 'scam' Programs. I think that with as may of these as there have been exposed for what they really are - and yet people continue to join them - that is THEIR Choice. I'm sure they are all big boys & girls and realize the risks involved. What upsets me about what you do (and have done) is that YOU are causing these people to lose whatever monies they put into these programs - even IF they are scams, there is the possibility that some (or more), may have been able to 'ride' a bit longer, and may have possibly been able to recoup some of their monies before it all finally crashed.
I really don't understand WHERE YOU fit in all of this!?!?!

And when they see it is a scam can decide not to join. So to quote yourself: What I really don't understand is WHY YOU feel you can be God, Judge and Jury over the 'scam' Programs. in this case in reference to people warning other people about getting ripped off. You got in too late. No one's fault but your own. As you said....it was your choice.

Hmm, guess Yippee is going to keep the thread closed for at least 24 hours at MMG. Someone must have really ticked her off to keep it closed this long. Usually the closure is for about 12 hours if my memory serves me correctly.

I am waiting to see just how long Nanci Jo Frazer stays on vacation. Kind of tells you how much she cares about her over 20,000 members she got into this Pozni doesn't it being MIA at this point in time. What has been fun to watch is her team trying to sanitize all of her videos and text on her websites, and then from all in her group who used her videos on their sites and posts on YouTube of her videos. I see that John Shepcoff finally took the rest of his PS videos down. This has got be hurting recruiting big-time for all those using YouTube videos to recruit.

One thing for sure, when you can't recruit to keep enough new people joining so they can pay the early ones in, the Ponzi is going to go down. Now the only question is how long before Roman pulls the plug? He can't comply with the NC Cease & Desist Order to provide proof he is legal, so he has to be gone before that due date. So will it be the end of this week or the week of the 18th, or will he try to stretch it to the week of the 25th? There is no way he will be operating after the 27th of March, D-Day for the NC demand, and of course his big payment on April Fool's day.

It's a good thing they got rules on MMG. Here one off-topic post feeds everyone, including the admins.

Originally Posted by Finix

It's a good thing they got rules on MMG. Here one off-topic post feeds everyone, including the admins.

Well Now isn't this speacial...

http://www.wealthcreationsnetwork.co...ProSunCall.mp4

Is this Nanci?

Donate

Yep, a businessman doesn't come close to a member of the clergy when it comes to fleecing the flock. But that's nothing new, folks.

She is a real person. With money. Her downline can sue her ass and FU ministries (what a name!) when PS goes down.

Originally Posted by littleroundman

Tick tock, tick tock goes the HYIP ponzi clock

How utterly predictable.

First comes news of the cease and desist order

Then comes the flood of "I got paid" posts on the usual suspect HYIP ponzi forums.

Then the truth slowly starts to trickle out.

People's accounts have been getting 'blocked' long before the cease and desist order. I even quoted a post from an MMG member a few pages back when it started happening.

You don't get a response from Roman unless he thinks you are going to thrust thousands of dollars of your savings into the scam.

Originally Posted by Finix

Is this Nanci?

Donate

Yep, a businessman doesn't come close to a member of the clergy when it comes to fleecing the flock. But that's nothing new, folks.

Nanci Jo Frazier is going to fall off of roof of the palace that she built for herself if she is really a thief, just be patient. Nobody is smart enough to outwit ancient wisdom,especially when they defraud in the name of God.

Originally Posted by Fendaril

Nanci Jo Frazier is going to fall off of roof of the palace that she built for herself if she is really a thief, just be patient. Nobody is smart enough to outwit ancient wisdom,especially when they defraud in the name of God.

Are you for real? Preachers are master emotional manipulators, there are no better in the world. She is going to paint Roman as the devil, play the victim and the same people she fleeced in the name of God are going to feel bad for her and donate more money.

Originally Posted by fishbay

Well Now isn't this speacial...

http://www.wealthcreationsnetwork.co...ProSunCall.mp4

One of my favorite lines, and there are many, from this audio clip was that by Roman not accepting money after 2/28 for the long haul program proved PS was not a Ponzi. How? Because Ponzi's need new money to keep going. He kept to his word he would not accept new money after 2/28 for the long haul and he did.

OK, let's follow that logic. If that is true, then he doesn't need anyone new joining and investing in his other programs either. I don't see him announcing he will no longer take investments for any of his other programs. Talk about being delusional.

One of the longest smoke and mirrors spiel I have heard in a long time that took so much time to say nothing.

I also love how now you are not investing but "loaning" money to Roman. Hmm, only took them 15 months to come to that conclusion. Maybe some of these geniuses should read the Howey Test from the Supreme Court to see how "loaning" is "investing." Oops!

What is scary is that Ralph Yerkes, a claimed Wall Street Financier, was on this tape telling everyone PS is a real and legitimate company and not a Ponzi. I would hate to be one of his clients with this kind of due diligence. What is truly scary is they believe this malarkey.

Originally Posted by ribshaw

I would say as a practical matter you do not have a lot of life experience, like having your parents exploited because they started to decline mentally. As people age some become less and less able to make sound decisions, couple this with having what is called a "life savings" it is recipe for disaster. So your $.72 cent interest payments that you proudly tweet about likely came from someone's mother or grandmother who is now bankrupt thanks to (Fill in the blank business opportunity). They were told it was real, and they believed. They same way they will believe they need a new roof, have won the lottery, have a new friend in Nigeria, have a relative in trouble who needs a wire of some cash, have a new "best friend", and on and on.

As a second matter, Roman and others have nothing to worry about if he is in fact making loans as he claims. All the blogging, naysayers, haters, and dreamstealers in the world won't change the fact that people need money to fund their deals, and clearly Roman is the man (or woman) with the money. The only way I see that any of this presents a problem for any of these folks is if their only concern is to recruit new suckers.

Following your logic, we should take down all the stop signs cause people who drive are all big boys and girls who realize the risks in driving.

Excellent post! It is sad to consider the real damage done to real people who are scammed by these serial criminals and cons.

If Roman Novak is actually making loans with the money he is taking in, then I am the real Easter Bunny!

Notice that not one of the "leaders" of PS have ever said " I (or my Certified Accountant) looked at Inter Reef's Audited Financial Statements, registrations and his qualifications and he proved to me that he really is in the loan business."
Of course Roman never posted any financial due diligence. It seems no one could be bothered to ask. Unbelievable.
There is no real CV for Roman that anyone could research and verify.
Did NJF, a registered non-profit corporation not retain a lawyer before leading the flock into this? No evidence of that.

No, Roman just sets out to raise $1.5 billion and make all of the believers rich with insane compounding interest rates.
Laws? Regulations? Due Diligence? Credentials? US Banks? I must be crazy to even ask.
But..but....it's NOT A PONZI.

Just wire your hard earned money to The Czech Republic, Russia or Cypress and everything will be OK. Trust Roman.

Trust NJF and all of the rest of the uncredentialed clowns that promote these schemes. Lord have Mercy!

Assuming that PS goes down in flames in the next 30-60 days...people should understand:

The promoters that make themselves and Roman rich can be held accoutable in civil and criminal courts.
Promoting any illegal behavior for profit. Call it what you want but it is actionable. These people are directly responsible for the losses of others.

I say throw the book at them all. I don't have "standing" as I did not invest in this BS deal or I would fiile the actions myself. Maybe EageOne has an idea to share.

C'mon Roman and his henchmen! Bring it on, baby. You bring your "best defense" and I will pay for the ride in the cop car!

It's time for people to start naming names of the cons who make garbage like PS go. Call out the losers and go after them.

Roman's Easter Gift to so many tens of thousands will be a ROTTEN EGG and the only LONG HAUL I hope for is his LONG STINT IN FEDERAL PRISON.

There! I have exercised my Freedom of Speech.

Bidding for the complete set of Nanci Joe Frazer videos and slideshows will begin when she is back from "vacation."
This is a collectors item sure to be voted into the Ponzi Hall of Shame.
Do you think she will autograph them?
Will they compound in value every day?

Proceeds from this auction of scammer's memorobilia will go to Eagle Research Associates.

Wall Street? Is there a Wall Street in Eaqle, Idaho? That's where the only "Ralph Yerkes" I see in the financial industry is, and he looks to be real estate and insurance, not stocks and bonds.

Of course, there could be other Ralph Yerkes' who aren't coming up on an initial check.

Originally Posted by Merchant of Truth

Excellent post! It is sad to consider the real damage done to real people who are scammed by these serial criminals and cons.

If Roman Novak is actually making loans with the money he is taking in, then I am the real Easter Bunny!

Notice that not one of the "leaders" of PS have ever said " I (or my Certified Accountant) looked at Inter Reef's Audited Financial Statements, registrations and his qualifications and he proved to me that he really is in the loan business."
Of course Roman never posted any financial due diligence. It seems no one could be bothered to ask. Unbelievable.
There is no real CV for Roman that anyone could research and verify.
Did NJF, a registered non-profit corporation not retain a lawyer before leading the flock into this? No evidence of that.

No, Roman just sets out to raise $1.5 billion and make all of the believers rich with insane compounding interest rates.
Laws? Regulations? Due Diligence? Credentials? US Banks? I must be crazy to even ask.
But..but....it's NOT A PONZI.

Just wire your hard earned money to The Czech Republic, Russia or Cypress and everything will be OK. Trust Roman.

Trust NJF and all of the rest of the uncredentialed clowns that promote these schemes. Lord have Mercy!

Assuming that PS goes down in flames in the next 30-60 days...people should understand:

The promoters that make themselves and Roman rich can be held accoutable in civil and criminal courts.
Promoting any illegal behavior for profit. Call it what you want but it is actionable. These people are directly responsible for the losses of others.

I say throw the book at them all. I don't have "standing" as I did not invest in this BS deal or I would fiile the actions myself. Maybe EageOne has an idea to share.

C'mon Roman and his henchmen! Bring it on, baby. You bring your "best defense" and I will pay for the ride in the cop car!

It's time for people to start naming names of the cons who make garbage like PS go. Call out the losers and go after them.

Roman's Easter Gift to so many tens of thousands will be a ROTTEN EGG and the only LONG HAUL I hope for is his LONG STINT IN FEDERAL PRISON.

There! I have exercised my Freedom of Speech.

Bidding for the complete set of Nanci Joe Frazer videos and slideshows will begin when she is back from "vacation."
This is a collectors item sure to be voted into the Ponzi Hall of Shame.
Do you think she will autograph them?
Will they compound in value every day?

Proceeds from this auction of scammer's memorobilia will go to Eagle Research Associates.

That is why it is a secret group that is 'invitation only', you scammed yourself basically.

Originally Posted by Fendaril

That is why it is a secret group that is 'invitation only', you scammed yourself basically.

Those are the real scammers, not players. Players just ride the damn things for a few wins and adrenaline rush.

3 big picture truths

1)Anyone legit in Romans position would inundated Eagle-Lyndell with lawsuits. If you cant face discovery process, you let Eagle go.

2)Anyone capable of this kind of legal return would be sitting in London, NY, Tokyo, etc managing billions.

3)Admin goes on and on about Christ Child, etc=NEVER in the history on income opps//hyip has the religious type been legit.

If he was a true man of god & this $ was going to make real changes in developing nations........Roman is furious w/Eagle and whats in these forums=injunctions, press releases, etc are the answer.
The NC cease and desist? Roman is on offensive vs false charges today if legit........Instead Roman puts out 1 line facebook sentence, his henchwoman is on vacation?

fishbay, thank you for posting that webinar. When I listened to it I had a flashback to Troy Dooly reporting on Zeek Rewards. Specifically when the North Carolina State Employee Credit Union referred to Zeek as a fraudulent company on 8/2/2012 via e-mail. Of course that story was shot down by Troy - Breaking Zeek Rewards News: Rex Venture Group COO Responds To NCSECU | MLM Help Desk. He actually thought Zeek would sue the NCSECU and win a court case. Then there was the North Carolina Department of Justice publicly issuing a Civil Investigative Demand (CID) on Zeek on 8/7/2012. Again no worries and actually Troy said he knew was probably happen. He thought the CID would put to rest the false claims that Zeek was a ponzi - The Facts of NC AG Investigation & Zeek Rewards Recording | MLM Help Desk. Well ten days later Zeek was shut down by the SEC. I can assure you that the temporary cease and desist order is the tip of the iceberg. Profitable Sunrise will be shut down very soon. All of the false propaganda will be to no avail just like it was not with Zeek Rewards. Time is ticking and the firework show is about to begin.