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Thread: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

  1. #876
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Quote Originally Posted by Scamtracker-Jaap View Post
    Until now 2 shops have been hooked, but FK is very secretive about it. And these shops are owned by FK agents themselves. FK is very quiet about it all and the lack of success stories is telling.
    This is another one of those "most bothersome" themes the emerge repeatedly with Flexkom . If the true goal was to drive sales for business and build a massive network of stores and users there would be NO secrecy. If one were to ask their neighbors about Groupon most would have heard of it, and maybe tried it. Ask the same question of a business owner and you would get the same, and possibly a response of "they want me to discount too much" or "it does not drive the right sort of customers".

    Unless your neighbors are "internet marketers" or "scam busters" Flexkom I am betting will deliver a blank stare. Four years into a model that needs buzz to work, or no buzz to continue recruiting suckers.



    Quote Originally Posted by Scamtracker-Jaap View Post
    Is it the lure of the American Dream?
    There are four staples that sell year after year. Love Stories, Self Help, Weight Loss, and Get Rich Quick.

    The girlfriend brought home cake from work, and some strawberries from the grocery. I wanted to hear nothing of the berries, but could not wait to get that cake in my belly. Get Rich Quick is a similar easy sell, just like telling folks like me they can eat whatever they want and still lose weight. Promise a room full of people an untapped method or market to make money, and then give them access to easy credit. Rinse and repeat as they say.

    When you compare that to the reality for 99% of us of working extra hours, slowly and sensibly investing our money, doing without many things we want but don't need. Well that is downright depressing, $2000 you say and I can have it all now..

    Take My Money.jpg
    "It's virtually impossible to violate rules ... but it's impossible for a violation to go undetected, certainly not for a considerable period of time." Bernie Madoff
    https://www.facebook.com/pages/Scam-...98399986981403

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  3. #877
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Quote Originally Posted by Scamtracker-Jaap View Post
    These serial pyramid scheme promotors, like Russell Longcore for example, do you think they get paid for spreading false information?
    Abso-bloody-lutely they get paid.

    They get paid by being given "early positions"

    They get paid by being given free and / or minimum cost positions IOW, they spend little or no money of their own.

    They get paid by being given warning of an impending collapse.

    They get paid by having a blind eye turned to any "extra curricular" activities such as member to member transactions and /or breaking any rules members are required to follow i.e are allowed to have multiple positions

    They get paid (a higher rate) for anyone who signs up using their referral links

    They get paid (a higher rate) for bringing any "downline" they may have

    They get paid for lying, cheating, misleading, exaggerating, misdirecting and keeping quiet about anything which could adversely affect the fraud and fraudsters.
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

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  5. #878
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Just read this article.

    FlexKom [Michael Scheibe] Refutes Allegations by Brian McGinty - 6 January 2014

    The most interesting thing about it is that the dispute, the allegations, the refutations, the whole upset and argument are all on the subject of recruiting, er, team-building and the "pre-launch" phase. Only when you get right to the bottom of the article do you find any mention of customers at all.

    And this is that specific mention:
    FlexKom has hundreds of thousands of satisfied customers and affiliated retailers. In Great Britain, we have partners who now generate a five-digit monthly income.
    Of course, as long as you have 2 (or any plural) of partners in the UK on 10,000 per month or more, then that 2nd part can technically be true. (Ian Driscoll + one other?)

    The 1st part is not location-specific, so as long as you have 100,001 or more customers and retailers globally then the 1st part can be true. I wonder what the split is?
    2 customers and 99,999 retailers? (Surely we can find one of them.)
    2 retailers (needle in a haystack) and 99,999 customers (are they active, do they still have the app installed, or the card in their wallet?)

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  7. #879
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    I guess my "meth dealers" are fighting over territory rights and whose drug gives a better high.

    Or is it scammy scammers calling other scams a scam?

    Brian McGinty of, Banners Broker Ponzi scheme, Empower Network, Beepxtra, and Karatbars thoughts on Flexkom:

    http://www.pureleverage.com/premiert...avoid-in-2014/
    "TOP TEN TO AVOID"

    "1. Flexkom – I bought a “franchise Licence” from Flexkom in November 2012 as did tens of thousands of others across Europe and The World. They have invented a history of their business in Turkey which never existed. They do endless recruiting meetings where they ask people to part with thousands for something they never deliver. By the time people find out everything they say is lies they move on to another country.

    They have taken millions from people across the globe and delivered nothing. Just do some Google searches on this one and you will soon work it out. Latest I heard they are trying to open in America. The SEC in the USA and The Daily Mirror UK are currently investigating them.

    Easily the most sophisticated scam I have seen in eighteen years. Ten out of ten for wool pulling… They caught me out and many more experienced people with me. Never too old to learn!

    So much negativity online that duplication is near impossible!"

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  9. #880
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Quote Originally Posted by Char View Post
    Or is it scammy scammers calling other scams a scam?

    Brian McGinty of, Banners Broker Ponzi scheme, Empower Network, Beepxtra, and Karatbars thoughts on Flexkom:

    Top 10 Online Businesses To Avoid In 2014 | Online Company Review - Working From Home 2014
    "TOP TEN TO AVOID"
    His original review of Flexkom is still to be found in the Google Cache and on some other blogs reporting about Flexkom.

    FLEXKOM REVIEW – IS FLEXKOM A SCAM OR A REAL BUSINESS
    1

    Flexkom Scam – Or Is Flexkom a Genuine Business?

    12 Month “Insider” Review

    Before I begin it is important to note that Flexkom is just one of many businesses I have tested and reviewed in the past few years.

    I have tested/am testing Pure Leverage, Chartfords, Adclickxpress, IBO Toolbox, Empower Network, Adhitprofits, Rippln, Karatbars, Beepxtra and Myfunlife among others.

    **All of which are fine by the way if you are in them…

    .

    If this Flexkom review sounds in any way personal/negative it is only because Flexkom have tried to bully me and silence me with threats and legal action and that was a very bad idea on their part.
    I do not respond well to threats from anyone.
    .
    .
    I also don’t mind so much if people are spending $20 per month and something doesn’t work. Not all online businesses are successful.. same as offline.
    .
    The problem with Flexkom is we are talking big sums of money here which could ruin lives and relationships.
    .
    .
    .If this review saves one families rent/mortgage it will be worth it.
    .
    .
    .Flexkom International – Flexkom Scam? – My Flexkom Review

    I joined a business called Flexkom one year ago, 12th November 2012, and have been reviewing it ever since.

    I thought it was going to be a quick review as we were told in November the UK and the other seven European countries would be fully live by March 2013.

    Flexkom said Franchisees would be making money in the UK in a couple of months….

    This is now my 12 Month Flexkom Review

    It cost me 990 to buy a Franchise Licence on 12th November 2012. I would normally never join a business that costs more than 200 as a rule but a close friend recommended them to me and what he told me sounded like a great concept.

    My money was transferred to a HSBC bank account in The UK. (A personal account). *Should have been my first red flag even then!

    .

    *Everything I write is is fact and from someone who has been IN the business for twelve months. This is not guesswork or my opinion… Just facts..

    .

    I personally stopped recommending Flexkom back in May but have now decided to write this review as to do so before would have jeopardised my ability to review the company properly.

    This is a screenshot of my Flexkom back office…

    flexkom scam

    Updated 6th November screenshot. Registered people. (Not paid!) I’ll explain later….

    flexkom scam
    My team of 1690+ and Sales Manager Qualification.

    .

    Flexkom Product

    .

    Flexkom aim – Flexkom say they want to help the high street by installing terminals in shops across The World. These terminals will allow retailers to make money from their customers while they shop elsewhere.

    .

    They ask “Franchisees” to pay $2000+ to buy a licence. If the franchisee builds a team of 12 they can become a Regional Co-ordinator and get their own area.

    .

    Fantastic idea and fantastic vision. (Which is why I joined)

    .

    The reality however….

    .

    Flexkom promised a 5000 bonus for team building and a company car if targets were hit by January. I reached these targets yet no car or money came forward.

    They promised that Europe would be open… there was to be a large event in Paris in October…Never happened…..

    .

    They asked for 500 registrations in Ireland.. which was reached… They moved it to 1000…..?

    I had registered a team of 1700 people worldwide but thankfully only a handful of these people parted with any money. (Seven in total from the UK)

    Why did so few pay in my team?

    I didn’t mind losing the 990 to see inside the business but many people wanted to see contracts before they parted with any money. (Fair enough).

    T’s & C’s, bank guarantees, working contracts etc..

    .

    Most of my team was in Ireland and the entire Irish team refused to pay without a contract. 1200+

    Since the people who registered in Ireland asked for contracts in June the country has been completely ignored! The Ireland Country Manager even offered to get the paperwork done by a solicitor in Ireland.

    Over 1200 people registered in Ireland for months, retailers ready and waiting…. yet they refuse to open the country…. Why??… Because the Irish asked for contracts??

    Two countries that did not ask for contracts, Trinidad & Tobago and Kenya have been allowed to open since and Flexkom are taking money from these countries.

    Why open Trinidad and Kenya when you have over 1000 people in Ireland, a country Manager and contracts ready to sign?

    Once this happened the Ireland team realised things were not right so have completely pulled out. There is no Flexkom Ireland now.

    Flexkom is however taking money from people in The UK, Switzerland, France, Germany, Holland, Belgium and Macedonia.

    Having left Turkey and Europe in a mess Flexkom USA is opening in December?

    .

    Someone explain why the entire Flexkom Management are pushing to open Flexkom USA at The Mandaley Beach in Las Vegas on 7th December when there are thousands of people in Europe screaming for Flexkom to open there?

    FLEXKOM – The FACTS

    Can I say Flexkom is a scam 100% for definite… No

    Can I say that the internet is full of scam reports about Flexkom… YES

    These are four of the main ones….

    Is FlexKom a Scam? Lazy Man and Money

    Ripoff Report | FlexKom Complaint Review Nationwide: 1096436

    https://www.facebook.com/pages/Flexk...53709781338460

    FlexKom - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Can I say I can’t find one happy CONTACTABLE Flexkom shop owner anywhere in Europe? YES (And i’ve even been to Turkey in the summer too!)

    Can I say that all The Obtainer Magazine reports are independent? … NO

    Can I say Flexkom have taken millions of pounds from people across the world and delivered nothing worthwhile yet… YES

    Can I say they offer no support, the Flexkom management is a mess, they don’t answers phonecalls or emails, they don’t pay bonuses… Definitely YES

    Can I say any leader who has looked at this business has run a mile?… YES

    Can I say they are now asking existing Franchisees for even more money to become VIP’s in The UK??…. YES (I didn’t do this obviously)

    Can I report that they are now asking Regional Co-ordinators in The UK to pay for their own terminals and retailers for cards….. YES

    Do Flexkom think that their Franchisees are a 24/7 ATM they can draw money from??

    What could they possibly need more money for?

    Pictures can say a thousand words….

    Asker Sakinmaz

    This was probably the most in depth and detailed review I have ever done on any business and it has been an awful experience.

    I WAS very keen on this business at the beginning and was excited by the product.

    You do give people the benefit of the doubt once or maybe twice but the lies, smoke and mirrors that come from Flexkom are at a level I have never seen before.

    Meeting Flexkom in person

    I flew to the UK and have met Asker Sakinmaz, (CEO) Michael Scheibe (CMO), Cengiz Ehliz (Owner) and Peter Grunweld (CTO) in person.

    I was also shocked to find out that the CMO Michael Scheibe is actually a “Franchise owner!” I cannot say for definite about the others..

    They come across as arrogant and impossible people to deal with. For some reason Peter and Cengiz decide to use translators on stage in The UK when they can speak perfect English? (I always found that odd!)

    .

    Dir-Flexkom-France

    These people bully and bulldoze their way through people and meetings and I have seen many false tears and acting on stage.

    .

    Watch out for Askers story about his childhood.. Touching the first time but when you see it told in the same way with the same tears three times it really loses its effect! More alarm bells…

    .

    There is a story about The Kings Clothes I think applies to Flexkom!

    SCAM ALERT

    FLEXKOM REVIEW – MY ADVICE

    I could go down the road of slagging off the company completely and there are many things I have uncovered that I will not publish on my blog.

    A few simple searches and you will find them yourself anyway.

    I won’t do that because it is a complete waste of time and energy. I didn’t even want to write this blog post but if it saves one person their money I am happy I wrote it.

    The Flexkom concept is fantastic, the idea was brilliant… the people running the company could not run a raffle.

    .

    nothing

    .

    All I advise you do is to type “Flexkom scam” into Google, Facebook etc and do your own research.

    And ask for a contract before you hand over any money.

    .

    My personal opinion is that… At very best….. Flexkom is a terribly run company where some people with no money are using the money coming in to fund progress.

    .

    .

    At worst it is a money making scam where people are lining their own pockets with no intention of ever making it work.

    .

    Time will tell and I cannot decide which one it is.

    .

    Note to Flexkom: No amount of email threats will stop me from telling the truth as I find it. You stole money from myself and my friends and have wasted a year of my life.

    Please feel free to send as many threatening emails as you wish and please try and sue me. There isn’t a court on the planet you will win anything in based soley on the way you have trampled through UK consumer law.

    I review online businesses and yours is just one. It just happens to be the worst one i have seen in eighteen years.

    Rant Over Sealed.

    If you have any further questions about Flexkom or any other business I have reviewed please get in touch.

    Sorry to my usual readers…. That I have nothing positive to say about Flexkom but I have never reviewed a company with so many issues or problems in eighteen years.

    Email: support@onlinecompanyreview.com

    .

    Skype: onlinecompanyreview TEL – 0044 7511650427

    .

    Update 6th November – Had a letting from Flexkom yesterday telling me to take down this blog post! Maybe everyone should send them one asking for their money back??

    Update 22nd November: Flexkom Launching USA on 7th December? Launching what? Is Flexkom USA the next cash cow… Nothing left in Europe?
    Tens of thousands of people across Europe have paid thousands of Euros and received nothing including myself. …. Be warned!
    I have emailed Asker- CEO, Cenghiz -President, Micheal -CMO, Peter – CTO for my money back but to no avail.
    They continue to ignore my emails… funny that!
    Update 3rd December – Flexkom have now sent me two threatening emails saying that I am backmailing them! lol…
    All I want is a refund of my money…. This is the reply I sent them today…
    “As you have chosen to ignore my request for my refund I am starting on my list today and will be informing each authority on this list below.

    This is not blackmail, this is a very open and public request for my money back. I am completely within my rights to ask for a refund for a product I have not received.

    Sale Of Goods Act 1979 Sale of Goods Act 1979

    I am also within my rights to warn the general public about giving Flexkom any money.

    I am fortunate that I have contacts in over one hundred countries and can do this quite quickly.
    UK Police/Action fraud Action Fraud | Report fraud and internet crime

    Office Of Fair Trading UK Contact us - The Office of Fair Trading

    Watchdog UK https://ssl.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006mg74/contact
    FBI Fraud USA FBI — Common Fraud Schemes

    SEC USA https://tts.sec.gov/oiea/Complaint.html
    Mandalay Hotel USA Mandalay Bay Beach - Best Pools in Las Vegas

    Hardly blackmail. I simply want them to pay my money or I will inform the relevant authorities.

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  11. #881
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Well at least we have someone admitting the only "business" is that of recruiting aka "my team".

    Apparently this guy, McGinty, is cheesed because he didn't get his 5000 pounds in recruitment bonus. I'm not sure he'd be such an advocate for his team/victims if that weren't the case. I mean look at that other "businesses" he thinks are "fine". Seems to me he thinks a scam is okay if you only lose 20 a month. I wonder how he explained banners broker to his "team". I guess the ones you are promoting now are just "less bad" than Flexkom.

    Also, if you saw a red flag when you initially deposited your money, why continue? Did you have hopes of that bonus? Did you disclose that bonus to the people you signed up under you?

    Being so experienced like you claim, did you research the founders? Did you not have concerns they ran a similar scam previously and robbed people of their money?

    McGinty also says he won't positively call this a scam and that he thinks this is a "fantastic idea and vision". Of course, he's promoting beepxtra, another scam with the same concept.

    Thank you Brian McGinty for showing the world what downlines of team leaders ought to know. That is, it is never about the product and all about recruiting - Which I believe is illegal.

    So how does it feel to be scammed yourself? Obviously not too good or you wouldn't have taken to the net to expose Flexkom - And that is something people do everyday here at realscam along with your other so called opportunities.

    I reiterate, ANYONE WHO THINKS THEY WILL MAKE MONEY ON CASH BACK APPS IS NOT THE BRIGHTEST CRAYON IN THE BOX. If you happen to make any money, it will be from your friends and family losing theirs...NICE!

    What a racket!!!
    Last edited by Char; 04-01-2014 at 03:59 PM.

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  13. #882
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Most MLMs are scams. Most are also based on Amway, because the 1979 FTC court decision resulted in Amway being allowed to continue to do "business." If you want to compare any MLM to the granddaddy scam, read my blog (click on my name to visit the home page) and compare how the MLM of interest compares to Amway's operation.

  14. #883
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    No, most MLM's are not scams. They are an illegal pyramid schemes or Ponzi's. A scam is a program that promises payments on a future event happening which never happens.
    EagleOne
    Founder/President Eagle Research Associates
    https://eagleresearchassociates.org
    Author: "Robbing You With A Keyboard Instead Of A Gun - Cyber Crime How They Do It" available in soft cover and eBook at Amazon.com
    Lifetime Member of the National Association of Distinguished Professionals

  15. #884
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    You are correct, the more specific term that applies to virtually all MLMs is they are illegal pyramid schemes, and many of those are RICO frauds, owing to the tool scams they operate. I was answering the question in the context of the question, and I consider Ponzi schemes, illegal pyramids, and RICO fraud as subsets of the more generalized term, scam. Now that we have those definitions clarified, what are we going to DO about it?

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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    [QUOTE=Textex;69004]You are correct, the more specific term that applies to virtually all MLMs is they are illegal pyramid schemes, and many of those are RICO frauds, owing to the tool scams they operate. I was answering the question in the context of the question, and I consider Ponzi schemes, illegal pyramids, and RICO fraud as subsets of the more generalized term, scam. Now that we have those definitions clarified, what are we going to DO about it?[/QUOTE]

    How about we create a list of the Flexkom USA Promoters and when appropriate, make the viewers of this site aware of their past business affiliations and in some cases, prison sentences. Members of this board have tried to educate the Flexkom Promoters about legal issues of the Flexkom model and marketing practices.

    We pointed out obvious issues with their "pay to play" marketing plan. We showed their APP and POS system has never been proven and why it will probably NEVER work in the mainstream.

    They left this board with their tales tucked between their legs, and for good reason. They cannot defend the Flexkom method of doing business.

    It is time the members of this board step up our efforts to educate the general public on the potential RISKS (in my opinion) associated with being part of this company.

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  18. #886
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    I think that's a great start. I suggest we also find ways to get the word out beyond this site.

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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Brian McGinty of, Banners Broker Ponzi scheme, Empower Network, Beepxtra, isn't going to to let his experience with FlexKom stop him pimping Pyramid schemes

    Screen Shot 2014-04-02 at 19.25.30.jpg


    Karatbars Live Webinar Presentations

    If Simon Stepsys or Mark Ghobril are involved it's 100% a SCAM!

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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe_Shmoe View Post
    Brian McGinty of, Banners Broker Ponzi scheme, Empower Network, Beepxtra, isn't going to to let his experience with FlexKom stop him pimping Pyramid schemes

    Screen Shot 2014-04-02 at 19.25.30.jpg


    Karatbars Live Webinar Presentations
    I think they did not get a memo that Quebec, Canada declared Karatbars illegal investment scheme.
    Warning - Karatbars investment program

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  23. #889
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    for the future, if someone wants to find the pimp:


    Domain Name: KARATBARSPRESENTATION.COM
    Registrar: GoDaddy.com, LLC

    Registrant Name: Brian McGinty
    Registrant Organization:
    Registrant Street: apt 777 Vale Do Lobo
    Registrant City: Almancil
    Registrant State/Province: Loule
    Registrant Postal Code: 8135 034
    Registrant Country: Portugal
    Registrant Phone: +351.918188396
    Registrant Phone Ext:
    Registrant Fax:
    Registrant Fax Ext:
    Registrant Email: admin@algarveauctions.com

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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Maybe we are wrong by pointing at inactivity of law enforcements...

    Online scams explosion of the last 10 years might greatly contribute to some global changes of laws...
    No nice Cease and Desist letters, no polite letters to appear at court but busting the doors open and putting a machine gun into the scammers mouth while handcuffing , is what awaits them in future if things will continue to go the way they are.

    Scams contribute themselves greatly to their own demise.

    While all perpetrators (money movers, hosting companies, service providers) , even some respected names, will do nothing to stop servicing an obvious scam and never getting punished for that, scams will only grow under current polite legal treatment of these scams.


    Spreading the awareness is most important while law cannot catch up...

    Nigerian letter scams almost stopped working not because some scammers were busted but because most people know what it is when they see it in their mailbox.
    Last edited by NikSam; 04-03-2014 at 04:32 AM.

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  26. #891
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Quote Originally Posted by NikSam View Post

    Spreading the awareness is most important while law cannot catch up...

    Nigerian letter scams almost stopped working not because some scammers were busted but because most people know what it is when they see it in their mailbox.
    Wholeheartedly agree that education and awareness are the best offense and defense. Even if a scammer is brought to justice, there no scammer pension plan that can be garnished to get the money back. For victims the money most likely will be lost forever. Its one thing to screw up and go broke at 20 or 30, but a good number of these victims are on the other side of 60 or 70 and have almost no chance to make it back.

    Any dent that has been made is certainly by the people who have taken time to educate and warn others. How much that is I don't really know as billions seem to flow right to the pockets of scammers. Even here, how many people show up and argue with what can almost be considered a script why something is the real deal?
    "It's virtually impossible to violate rules ... but it's impossible for a violation to go undetected, certainly not for a considerable period of time." Bernie Madoff
    https://www.facebook.com/pages/Scam-...98399986981403

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  28. #892
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Quote Originally Posted by NikSam View Post

    While all perpetrators (money movers, hosting companies, service providers) , even some respected names, will do nothing to stop servicing an obvious scam and never getting punished for that, scams will only grow under current polite legal treatment of these scams.


    Spreading the awareness is most important while law cannot catch up...

    Nigerian letter scams almost stopped working not because some scammers were busted but because most people know what it is when they see it in their mailbox.
    Exactly. That's why I personally lean toward focusing on individuals and their previous acts.

    I've stated before that I believe scammers want discussion on their product, good and even bad, because it appears to legitimize the product by creating debate. I realize some discussion is necessary to debunk it, but that should not be the focus.

    I look at it like buying a stereo from a guy wearing an orange jumpsuit with numbers on the back. We COULD discuss the quality of the alleged stereo in the sealed box, OR look at the guy who is trying to sell it.

    Everyone can make a mistake ONCE, after that, they know MLM is not a money maker in the traditional sense of selling product. They then become a scammer or at best a liar.

    Its the MLM "system" that can't work, ETHICALLY THAT IS, and not all the different products.....PERIOD. Again, Please read Pink Truth

    Back to Flexkom. I've posted numerous "who is" posts about repeat offenders. These people need to be outed. It is NOT an accolade to be a "successful network marketer". Why don't people get that?

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  30. #893
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Quote Originally Posted by Char View Post
    Exactly. That's why I personally lean toward focusing on individuals and their previous acts.
    ...
    I look at it like buying a stereo from a guy wearing an orange jumpsuit with numbers on the back. We COULD discuss the quality of the alleged stereo in the sealed box, OR look at the guy who is trying to sell it.
    It's very difficult to judge personal qualities based on reports on the internet, or even from traditional media.
    There are such things as smear campaigns. There's such a thing as "crowd opinion" or "mob-style" justice.

    Even factual data about criminal convictions or court findings are only clues, not 100% certainties.

    Quote Originally Posted by Char View Post
    Its the MLM "system" that can't work ...
    Now this is more like it - where I think the education should be.

    When a friend explained the concept of FlexKom to me, before he had even mentioned the word "FlexKom", before I had even looked anything up on the net, or had emailed EBCON or phoned Germany regarding that other "authentication", before any of that, all I had going through my head was "stay away".

    The education has to do with basic economics. Economics so basic they should teach it in primary school.
    For any business or economic activity to be a success, it MUST produce, create or supply something that somebody genuinely NEEDS or WANTS, that wasn't there before. If it cannot do that, then it will fail, and anything else on top is just fluff, smoke, mirrors, PR, advertising, sales pitch, etc
    So to evaluate any given business you have to ask 2 questions:
    1) What is produced, created or supplied?
    2) Who wants or needs it?

    If you can't answer these questions without getting complicated, then stay away.
    If it's not obvious who benefits and who pays, and why, then stay away.
    If to answer these questions you need "enough people on board", then stay away.
    If any part of the "wants or needs" appears to be circular - meaning "you want it because others will want it", then stay away.
    If any part of the transaction involves a "false currency" - such as FlexMoney, or an eWallet, then stay away.
    If any part involves some kind of lock-in or long subscription which it's not easy to get out of, then stay away.
    If any part of it seems to involve some kind of arbitrary delay - such as waiting for something to "mature" or "it has to be ready before phase 2 starts", then stay away.
    If the company or group you're giving money to are ephemeral in any way at all, such as multiple companies with similar names when you look in Companies House [in the UK] (you do look at Companies House, don't you?), such as correspondence going to a PO Box, such as being unable to visit the actual offices of the people involved, then stay away.

    If it involves something dazzling you with new technology, then find an old technology analogy to compare it with, and see if that is understandable. New technology isn't some kind of magical wealth machine. Basic economics has been with us since the stone age.

    With FlexKom I couldn't get past question 1).
    It splits into 2 further questions:
    1a) WHAT is produced, created or supplied?
    1b) HOW is it produced, created or supplied?

    The "what" for FlexKom (assuming nothing but their own sales pitch for now) is:
    They produce price discounts & cashback for consumers, and advertising channels & cashback for retailers.
    Hmm, advertising is a valid business, so that part is believable, and might even work (like a "Yellow Pages" phone app?)

    But creating discounts & cashbacks? Why wouldn't a shop do this by themselves anyway? It's easy for a shop to discount a price, and they don't need someone else to do it for them. Sure sometimes a discount is offered when a retailer puts an advert somewhere, but that's his choice, and there's certainly no lock-in or subscription.

    So now we're curious. Why would this discount thing be there? That's a negative to the retailers, surely?
    Well, comes the answer, that's how you attract the customers to the app. "Everyone likes cashback!"
    So now we know that the system doesn't have a customer base already - it's like advertising in a magazine that has zero circulation. You wouldn't do it.
    So (to continue the analogy) we boost the circulation by offering cashback to anyone who has the magazine through their door, and then circulation will be way up there!

    Now we can understand the bare economics of it. Instead of a punter buying a magazine that he wants which also supports its business model through advertising revenue (for example, I Love Railways Weekly)
    We have a magazine which pays the end consumer to have it, and also which apparently pays retailers for promoting the magazine.

    And where will all these payments eventually come from? Where will all this money come from? What kind of magazine pays people to read it?
    Just think of your local town rag. In my town the circulation might be 30,000. If you paid everyone a penny each, that's a 300 expense.

    The apparent answer is: "the cashback money comes from all the economic activity which our product inspires".
    Ignoring arguments about how much economic activity cashbacks actually do inspire, I still feel hollow about this question, what does FlexKom actually add? What value have they actually injected into the system?
    Ignore the apps. Ignore the POS terminals. They're just fancy mechanisms for doing things that can already be done: forwarding an advert, and recording a sale + discount.

    What do they add that wasn't there before? What do they add that a consumer or retailer needs?
    If it has genuine value, FlexKom should expect to get paid, and consumer and/or retailer would be willing to, because it has value.

    But somehow:
    - FlexKom still take their cut
    - the consumer gets his cashback
    - the retailer gets his cashback

    Where is all this money coming from?
    Someone has to pay?!
    Who is going to pay?

    It comes from the consumer spending money with the retailer. But that's economic activity that is already happening, and all it does is squeeze the retailer's margins.
    FlexKom didn't create that. They claim they did. Or they claim it will when it all "takes off".

    As I've said before in this thread, any 3rd party involved in an economic transaction is either a leach, or a value injector.

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  32. #894
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    @stewart

    I think how to "spot" a scam and how to "prove" a scam do indeed have different criteria. Since proving one in court is such a lengthy process, and that's if it gets there, I think spotting one will save me my money and hopefully others.

    The first thing I look at is "who" then "what". It's interesting because the two always compliment each other. I just see it as a short cut because some of these scam products are very cleverly disguised like Flexkom. They take a while to understand completely, then by that time, it's too late. All by design of course.

    Identifying serial scammers has given me a 100% success rate in picking scams. Lol, that's not saying much because it's really easy after you know what to look for. Also, I've never come across an MLM that works in the way it's presented. Yes I think ALL MLMs are scams because of this fact. I use "scam" as an umbrella term because there are different kinds - Discussed a few posts back.

    I'd also add that even when there is a product that someone needs like soap from Amway, that theory about identifying a need for a product etc. might be unreliable. In a normal business, yes, but not in the recruiting pyramid scheme mlm business. Here again we go back to the system - A system that can't work.

    Here's a very good read for people considering MLM What's Wrong With Multi-Level Marketing?

    Stewart, I'm mostly agreeing with what you posted but just explaining my approach:)

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  34. #895
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Quote Originally Posted by Char View Post
    ... I think ALL MLMs are scams because of this fact. I use "scam" as an umbrella term because there are different kinds - Discussed a few posts back.
    ... Here again we go back to the system - A system that can't work.
    For me there's always been one other reason to stay clear of any kind of MLM. I've not much discussed it here or elsewhere because it's an opinion type thing, rather than a factual argument. It's a question of taste.

    I've always thought of MLM's that on a personal level, they would lose you your real friends, whilst making you fake friends out of others.

    In other words, it would go like this:
    You get into an MLM which sells widgets. You start talking to all your friends about widgets. Prior to that you were friends for whatever reason. Maybe you both like motorbikes. Maybe you were in the war together. Maybe you got the same taste in music. Maybe you like to talk politics.
    But now you're talking to them about widgets. They may tolerate this for a little while. They may express some opinion or other, or stay quiet. But eventually, if you don't STFU they're won't be calling you to the next barbecue.
    Meanwhile, you accumulate a lot of "friends" who do get interested in these widgets, when you sales-pitch them.

    For me, friends are the people you call when you marriage hits a rough patch, or when your son gets into drugs at school, or when you get hit by an uninsured driver, or you need to organise some all-day childcare with someone you trust, etc.
    And you're there for the reverse flow to them when they need something.

    Why would you pollute that for sake of widgets?
    And if there's even a 0.1% chance of a scam, I couldn't take the risk - I wouldn't sleep thinking that I might have scammed through ignorance someone who had been a friend.

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  36. #896
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    Quote Originally Posted by ribshaw View Post
    Wholeheartedly agree that education and awareness are the best offense and defense. Even if a scammer is brought to justice, there no scammer pension plan that can be garnished to get the money back. For victims the money most likely will be lost forever. Its one thing to screw up and go broke at 20 or 30, but a good number of these victims are on the other side of 60 or 70 and have almost no chance to make it back.

    Any dent that has been made is certainly by the people who have taken time to educate and warn others. How much that is I don't really know as billions seem to flow right to the pockets of scammers. Even here, how many people show up and argue with what can almost be considered a script why something is the real deal?
    While education helps, these scams are often very sophisticated, and most people will still get scammed. Therefore law enforcement needs to go after them HARD, in order to make them think twice about starting a new one.

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  38. #897
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    "How about we create a list of the Flexkom USA Promoters and when appropriate, make the viewers of this site aware of their past business affiliations and in some cases, prison sentences?"

    I think that is a great idea. On it should figure for certain Russell Longcore and Micah Theard. Any other candidates? Were these two involved in any earlier MLM schemes/scams? They pretend not to be, and only to show that they were would considerably weaken their position.

  39. #898
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??



    Micah Theards'
    micah.theard Flexkom page on Facebook



    Russell D Longcores' russell.longcore page on Facebook
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  40. #899
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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??

    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

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    re: FlexKom aka Flexcom aka Weeconomy - legitimate MLM or scam ??



    higher conversion rate


    HomeBasedMogul3 videos
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    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

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