Thread: Banners Broker HYIP ponzi scam

Originally Posted by EagleOne

Welcome to RS and glad you finally joined us. I look forward to more of your insight from someone that is in BB. Also enjoyed your posts at MMG and a voice of reason.

Why thank you! I appreciate your posts as well. Most of us here do have the common goal of getting to the bottom of BB before too many are hurt in the process.

Mark

Originally Posted by hendyphilhendy

Welcome Mark. Glad to see you here.

Thank you, Phil. This is a great group!

Mark

Originally Posted by marsh56

Thank you, Phil. This is a great group!

Mark

There you go then Mark, this group is great. We are nice and polite to represenatives of BB whenever we can be. There are moments when we do get a bit sarcastic (with some posters and each other) so bear with us when that happens ;)

Any help you can give in terms of information or leads gratefully received. If you don't feel you want to post publically, you will have seen who are the most prolific posters on here, simply drop them a Private Message. Yell if you want help on that as well. Obviously, someone has probably told you all this, so if I'm duplicating effort I apologise.

The same courtesy will be extended to everyone else who comes on here.

Have a good day

I've been busy trying to track down "Chris Smith" and have had some interesting developments.


What I need now is to follow a couple of leads, for this I need photographs of Chris Smith, preferably decent quality one's taken at one of the meetings.

I'd rather not say any more right now, but either attach photos to this thread, or PM me and I'll send you an email address.

If you can do this, thanks.

Originally Posted by RobinHoodlumTJ

At what point do we give up on Terry? As far as i can see hes provided nothing useful for us, but plenty of confidence to any brainwashed believer who wishes to erase their slight shadow of doubt. Those who are involved want easy money. You can be damn sure theyre simply looking at it from the surface. The anti-bb'ers are a bunch of idiotic posters, and terry's posting long elaborate inteligent sounding posts that (say nothing, but sure as hell seem to) say alot. Seems like the anti-bb'ers are just giving him airtime he no longer deserves.

Think about it. BB lives because as long as one doesnt scratch the surface, it looks and feels official. From that perspective, who looks more official? Anti-bb'ers or terry? Doesnt matter what the content is, just how the content looks.

Am i missing something? I hope a plan has formulated in the background through PM's because i dont seem to get it...

was kinda thinking the same about playing into his hands. It will need to be a general consensus thing though. I tell him I'm not clued up on these things and how these businesses operate and he writes back to tell me I'm not clued up on these things, still avoiding my question. sheesh!

While I was researching the Silverline-Smith connection, I also checked out the historical domain records for silverlineclub.com. Here are details from the first three cached records:

Domain: silverlineclub.com
Registrar: GODADDY.COM, INC.
Server: whois.godaddy.com
Created: 2007-09-13
Updated: 2007-10-22
Expires: 2008-09-13

Cache Date: 2008-01-14
Registrant:
Christopher Smith csmith5000@rogers.com
110 Cumberland Street
Suite 201
Toronto, Ontario M5R3V5
Canada

Cache Date: 2008-02-20
Registrant:
George Smith domainservice80@gmail.com
777 N. Rainbow Blvd.
Suite 250
Las Vegas, Nevada 89107
United States

Cache Date: 2008-06-12
Registrant:
Silverline Club domainservice80@gmail.com
777 N. Rainbow Blvd.
Suite 250
Las Vegas, Nevada 89107
United States

Chris Smith... to George Smith... to Silverline Club? Anyway, the key question is: what is the Silverline Club and who owns it? Let's go clickabout and see; first stop, YouTube...

The Silverline Club Challenge - YouTube

Well, well, well... a 2 x 3 CYCLER. And look whose channel it's on: "kuldipmillionaire". Couldn't be Kul(dip) Josun's by any chance, could it? Yep, sure is...

Kul Josun's Profile on Swom.com - Swom.com

"After searching months of research on all other plans that eventually will fail, i [sic] and my team came up with the answer. After putting the team together we launched Silverlineclub"

I had to smile at Kul's comment about all other plans eventually failing. Wonder if he's a millionaire, yet.

Second stop, Daily Motion...

*** SILVERLINE CLUB CHALLENGE ~ WHY WORK WITH US? *** - Video Dailymotion

(Heck, is that Troy Dooly doing the voiceover?)

Would Chris Smith have been a key member in "my team", as Kul put it, above? Being the domain name owner... of both silverlineclub.com and silverlineclub.biz... he would have to be on a list of suspects, wouldn't he?

Well folks, here's the clincher...

Money Aiddy-Blogger: Story

"After speaking with the programmer responsible for developing the Silverline Club itself, Chris Smith, a joint venture was created between Bruce and Chris to put Goldwell's training up as an independent web site called Goldwell iBox."

Next stop on our clickabout, the Silverline Club website. But unfortunately there isn't one, so lets pay our very helpful friends over at Wayback Machine a visit. They really have done us proud:

Internet Archive Wayback Machine

Plenty of archives to investigate, there. I've only visited one or two but so far seen no sign of the owners doing the decent thing and identifying themselves. Mind you, if Smith were to have been moonlighting while employed by DonRiver Inc., you wouldn't expect him to show his face, would you?

Originally Posted by AshKen1

There you go then Mark, this group is great. We are nice and polite to represenatives of BB whenever we can be. There are moments when we do get a bit sarcastic (with some posters and each other) so bear with us when that happens ;)

Any help you can give in terms of information or leads gratefully received. If you don't feel you want to post publically, you will have seen who are the most prolific posters on here, simply drop them a Private Message. Yell if you want help on that as well. Obviously, someone has probably told you all this, so if I'm duplicating effort I apologise.

The same courtesy will be extended to everyone else who comes on here.

Have a good day

Certainly if I have anything of value, I will post it here one way or another. Honestly I do not currently have the time nor the technical ability to do some of the in-depth research I see here!

One comment I can make on Stern's "explanation" of how BB apparently works is that it is a bunch of hooey in my opinion. The details actually sound like an interesting business model on paper but I do not see how it can work in a practical manner.

If it WERE true, it at least begs the question of why payouts are seldom, if ever, made on time. Stern makes it sound like BB should be awash in cash flow. If so, then why the delays?

As a member it is clear to me that their site is severely lacking, tech support is horrible and affiliate support is even worse! Giving BB the benefit of EVERY doubt, they are at best a poorly run wannabe Google competitor (laughable).

At worst--and notice the irony--BB is a VERY WELL RUN Ponzi. Funny how that works.

By the way, today is supposed to be the latest big pay day. And the clock is ticking.

Mark

Originally Posted by StevenHoward

I've been busy trying to track down "Chris Smith" and have had some interesting developments.


What I need now is to follow a couple of leads, for this I need photographs of Chris Smith, preferably decent quality one's taken at one of the meetings.

I'd rather not say any more right now, but either attach photos to this thread, or PM me and I'll send you an email address.

If you can do this, thanks.

Any use?

321365_435748583165262_110074099_n.jpg

559951_4609800815331_1760510930_n.jpg

Originally Posted by StevenHoward

I've been busy trying to track down "Chris Smith" and have had some interesting developments.


What I need now is to follow a couple of leads, for this I need photographs of Chris Smith, preferably decent quality one's taken at one of the meetings.

I'd rather not say any more right now, but either attach photos to this thread, or PM me and I'll send you an email address.

If you can do this, thanks.

Talk about suspense!

I assume the photos of chris smith found on google using the terms "chris smith bannersbroker" arent usable? If so, whats wrong with em and what do you need? Im happy to give a scan if i know what im looking for.

Welcome to RealScam, Mark.

Originally Posted by RobinHoodlumTJ

At what point do we give up on Terry?

The instant he refused to discuss, even in broad strokes, how BB generates >$132M in profit yearly is when I wrote him off. The guy is a MLM jewelry salesman who met David Hooker through Global Wealth Trade, what more do you need to know about him?

Funny though that the few posts he made did more to convince me that BB is a ponzi than anything else I've read from the BB leadership. The disclosure that the two ad network brokers they work with are Clicksor and OpenX is so incriminating I'm surprised you guys didn't pick up on it. Phil Hendy got it and was heading down that path.

OpenX just barely squeeked out a profit in 2011. I said "profit". They had been running in the red most of the year that year. In 2012 they said they were on a run-rate of $100M in revenue, with no disclosure as to profit but given the industry they will likely book around $10M to $20M of profit.

OpenX Announces First Full Quarter of Profitability | OpenX

Clicksor is a subsidiary of Yesup, and is an order of magnitude smaller than OpenX.

So there you have it. The two brokers they finally admit to working with between them *might* be generating to the tune of $20M of gross profit between them. Yet somehow they allowed their partner, Banners Broker, to walk away with more than $132M of yearly profit -- using their own advertising networks. What an embarrassment it must be to the CEOs of these companies; no wonder why there is absolutely no mention of Banners Broker on either of their websites or in any of their press releases. If their respective investors (like Samsung, for example) ever found out about this, they would be furious.

I know Terry will read this, and I know he can't get this math to work without contradicting at least one of the lies either he or BB themselves has made.

Originally Posted by RobinHoodlumTJ

Talk about suspense!

I assume the photos of chris smith found on google using the terms "chris smith bannersbroker" arent usable? If so, whats wrong with em and what do you need? Im happy to give a scan if i know what im looking for.

A scan? Eh, are you still using film?

Originally Posted by RobinHoodlumTJ

Talk about suspense!

I assume the photos of chris smith found on google using the terms "chris smith bannersbroker" arent usable? If so, whats wrong with em and what do you need? Im happy to give a scan if i know what im looking for.

Just a lead I had and shared with a few of the investigative types.

Originally Posted by RobinHoodlumTJ

Talk about suspense!

I assume the photos of chris smith found on google using the terms "chris smith bannersbroker" arent usable? If so, whats wrong with em and what do you need? Im happy to give a scan if i know what im looking for.

They're really low quality and there appears to be TWO different Chris Smiths (three if you count the white guy).

I've compared a few photos but could really do with some more, even if they're of low quality, also looking at the guys around him, if you were in his prescence any photos of his colleagues, table etc would be great.

Originally Posted by Brenda

was kinda thinking the same about playing into his hands. It will need to be a general consensus thing though. I tell him I'm not clued up on these things and how these businesses operate and he writes back to tell me I'm not clued up on these things, still avoiding my question. sheesh!

I've avoided reading the other Q & A thread until now. Have just lost the will to live as TDS doesn't answer any questions and then gets all uppity when challenged about the information he does give.

Makes me wonder a) why BB/BBI/Stellar Point or whatever they are called are employing him and b) as someone stated over on Finch what attracted him to work for them and c) will BB/BBI/Stellar Point give him a decent reference when it all ends. TDS claims to be a PR person: frankly, I wouldn't employ him on his performance here to date.

PR nightmare IMO!

-del this post need to check again something-

Originally Posted by Theseus

A scan? Eh, are you still using film?

Lol! Ahh the good ole days. Might have been more work but definitely felt more real!

And no! I meant give the net a scan. Scan with my eyes!

Just to be clear. I do not have access to any other photos than on the web. I never made Who i am clear but noone ever asked (or welcomed me! Hah!) i found out about BB after my future father in law invested money and generously invested some of my fiances money for her! Im not directly involved. Im just a guy who likes the little guys to win- hence the name.

Althought i dont endorse robbing or hoodlums ;)

But ill look around.

One thing i noticed about chris smith (the black on)- hes got a cornered ear at the top (sorta elvish - no offense chris- just trying to be clear)

Originally Posted by samuel.r

The instant he refused to discuss, even in broad strokes, how BB generates >$132M in profit yearly is when I wrote him off. The guy is a MLM jewelry salesman who met David Hooker through Global Wealth Trade, what more do you need to know about him?

Funny though that the few posts he made did more to convince me that BB is a ponzi than anything else I've read from the BB leadership. The disclosure that the two ad network brokers they work with are Clicksor and OpenX is so incriminating I'm surprised you guys didn't pick up on it. Phil Hendy got it and was heading down that path.

OpenX just barely squeeked out a profit in 2011. I said "profit". They had been running in the red most of the year that year. In 2012 they said they were on a run-rate of $100M in revenue, with no disclosure as to profit but given the industry they will likely book around $10M to $20M of profit.

OpenX Announces First Full Quarter of Profitability | OpenX

Clicksor is a subsidiary of Yesup, and is an order of magnitude smaller than OpenX.

So there you have it. The two brokers they finally admit to working with between them *might* be generating to the tune of $20M of gross profit between them. Yet somehow they allowed their partner, Banners Broker, to walk away with more than $132M of yearly profit -- using their own advertising networks. What an embarrassment it must be to the CEOs of these companies; no wonder why there is absolutely no mention of Banners Broker on either of their websites or in any of their press releases. If their respective investors (like Samsung, for example) ever found out about this, they would be furious.

I know Terry will read this, and I know he can't get this math to work without contradicting at least one of the lies either he or BB themselves has made.

Hi Samuel, you make a really good point. That's why I've just PM'd Noname as follows:

Hi Noname, here's my question for Terry. Any chance you could let me know whether you'll ask the question? Thanks in anticipation!

Hi Terry

At the last count, Banners Broker claimed to have 265,000 affiliates. Your website BannersBroker states that each affiliate earns an average of $567.57 per year (see foot of page). Your company must therefore generate $150,406,000 p.a. just to pay affiliates. On top of that you have operating expenses, plus a profit to generate for the company.

Is there any way in which you can prove a profit of well over $150 million per year?

(thanks and acknowledgments to samuel.r for the basis of this question)

Originally Posted by RobinHoodlumTJ

Just to be clear. I do not have access to any other photos than on the web. I never made Who i am clear but noone ever asked (or welcomed me! Hah!) i found out about BB after my future father in law invested money and generously invested some of my fiances money for her! Im not directly involved. Im just a guy who likes the little guys to win- hence the name.

Althought i dont endorse robbing or hoodlums ;)

But ill look around.

One thing i noticed about chris smith (the black on)- hes got a cornered ear at the top (sorta elvish - no offense chris- just trying to be clear)

Thanks for the help Mr Hood, can you simply post any of the images you come up with.

Experience has taught me that different people get slightly different results when searching the net, who knows what you might turn up.

Even if you think everyone else would have seen it, you just never know !!.

Originally Posted by Poyol

Just a lead I had and shared with a few of the investigative types.

Not sure what ya mean?

Btw- did i give ya a dead-end with those links or? I can check them out when i get home unless you think theres nothing there?

Originally Posted by RobinHoodlumTJ

Talk about suspense!

I assume the photos of chris smith found on google using the terms "chris smith bannersbroker" arent usable? If so, whats wrong with em and what do you need? Im happy to give a scan if i know what im looking for.

Anything, no matter how unlikely it may seem.

I'm not just sticking to google either, anything, no matter how ridiculous sounding it may be, could be worth a shot, we only need to get lucky once.

Please bear in mind though, ponzi's by their very nature lie about everything, Chris Smith possibly doesn't even exist.

Originally Posted by Julie Diligent

While I was researching the Silverline-Smith connection, I also checked out the historical domain records for silverlineclub.com. Here are details from the first three cached records:

Domain: silverlineclub.com
Registrar: GODADDY.COM, INC.
Server: whois.godaddy.com
Created: 2007-09-13
Updated: 2007-10-22
Expires: 2008-09-13

Cache Date: 2008-01-14
Registrant:
Christopher Smith csmith5000@rogers.com
110 Cumberland Street
Suite 201
Toronto, Ontario M5R3V5
Canada

Cache Date: 2008-02-20
Registrant:
George Smith domainservice80@gmail.com
777 N. Rainbow Blvd.
Suite 250
Las Vegas, Nevada 89107
United States

Cache Date: 2008-06-12
Registrant:
Silverline Club domainservice80@gmail.com
777 N. Rainbow Blvd.
Suite 250
Las Vegas, Nevada 89107
United States

Chris Smith... to George Smith... to Silverline Club? Anyway, the key question is: what is the Silverline Club and who owns it? Let's go clickabout and see; first stop, YouTube...

The Silverline Club Challenge - YouTube

Well, well, well... a 2 x 3 CYCLER. And look whose channel it's on: "kuldipmillionaire". Couldn't be Kul(dip) Josun's by any chance, could it? Yep, sure is...

Kul Josun's Profile on Swom.com - Swom.com

"After searching months of research on all other plans that eventually will fail, i [sic] and my team came up with the answer. After putting the team together we launched Silverlineclub"

I had to smile at Kul's comment about all other plans eventually failing. Wonder if he's a millionaire, yet.

Second stop, Daily Motion...

*** SILVERLINE CLUB CHALLENGE ~ WHY WORK WITH US? *** - Video Dailymotion

(Heck, is that Troy Dooly doing the voiceover?)

Would Chris Smith have been a key member in "my team", as Kul put it, above? Being the domain name owner... of both silverlineclub.com and silverlineclub.biz... he would have to be on a list of suspects, wouldn't he?

Well folks, here's the clincher...

Money Aiddy-Blogger: Story

"After speaking with the programmer responsible for developing the Silverline Club itself, Chris Smith, a joint venture was created between Bruce and Chris to put Goldwell's training up as an independent web site called Goldwell iBox."

Next stop on our clickabout, the Silverline Club website. But unfortunately there isn't one, so lets pay our very helpful friends over at Wayback Machine a visit. They really have done us proud:

Internet Archive Wayback Machine

Plenty of archives to investigate, there. I've only visited one or two but so far seen no sign of the owners doing the decent thing and identifying themselves. Mind you, if Smith were to have been moonlighting while employed by DonRiver Inc., you wouldn't expect him to show his face, would you?

Great piece of research on Chris (and/or? George) Smith there Julie...the plot thickens!

Originally Posted by Theseus

Any use?

321365_435748583165262_110074099_n.jpg

559951_4609800815331_1760510930_n.jpg

Yes thanks, good starting point.

I'm not convinced that these are the same person, the skin tone looks different but that's the flash from the camera I think (look at his hands, they're much darker), I'm more interested in his ears to start with.

Then look at his nose, the top one looks short, the bottom looks hawkish.

Originally Posted by Beethoven

Great piece of research on Chris (and/or? George) Smith there Julie...the plot thickens!

I second that, she's doing a wonderful job.