Banners Broker HYIP ponzi scam

[HARRISON]

Some news about Ian Driscolls latest venture...

TARA TALKS: Readers Stories - AL (http://taratalkstoday.blogspot.co.uk/p/readers-story-mr.html)

[Joe_Shmoe]

Some news about Ian Driscolls latest venture...

TARA TALKS: Readers Stories - AL (http://taratalkstoday.blogspot.co.uk/p/readers-story-mr.html)


Here is Mr Ian Driscoll now scamming in Trinidad & Tobago.

He he "Advertising's a very difficult beast" :RpS_lol:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NyxaBZP5XQ

[Poyol]

Yawn. I've just spoken to Stepsys' half nephew. I asked if they were related, he said "Yeah, keep away from him, he's bad news." ... I asked him to come over here and have a chat.

Jason

[HARRISON]

Here is Mr Ian Driscoll now scamming in Trinidad & Tobago.

He he "Advertising's a very difficult beast" :RpS_lol:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NyxaBZP5XQ

His like Arthur Daleys evil twin...:loser:

[Della Cate]

Some news about Ian Driscolls latest venture...

TARA TALKS: Readers Stories - AL (http://taratalkstoday.blogspot.co.uk/p/readers-story-mr.html)

Yes, according to our old pal, Mark Stokes, Mr Driscoll is the Uk National Sales Director for Flexcom.

5456

Stokes himself seems to have dropped BB like the proverbial hot potato and is pimping away at Flexcom.

Flexkom launches Phase II in the UK | Mark Stokes (http://www.mark-stokes.com/flexkom-launches-phase-ii-in-the-uk/)

Tell me, do these people EVER do what I'd call a "proper" job? They seem to jump from one venture to another. It's depressing to see various names crop up throughout BB, and now again elsewhere, and all of them what I'd term dodgy deals!

[Dreamstealer]

His like Arthur Daleys evil twin...:loser:

Not Arthur Daley. BB is more like Del Boy- No income tax, no VAT, No money back , no guarantees.

[HARRISON]

Oh to have friends in high places...

Senator Lisa Shoman on Belize Budget 2013 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-aplOJ-YA0)



TARA TALKS: BREAKING NEWS (http://taratalkstoday.blogspot.co.uk/p/breaking-news.html)

[Arthur Foxache]

Not Arthur Daley. BB is more like Del Boy- No income tax, no VAT, No money back , no guarantees.
Yes but you are leaving out the Major "No" as in 'No Product' .. and on a lighter note there is a person called "Will work for food" on MMG who still believes that V3 will solve all the problems, you could not make him up.. right back to eagerly awaiting this afternoons webovlies, ...

[littleroundman]

The funniest thing is watching the few remaining "true believers" still discussing strategies and solutions, just as if it is a real business they are discussing and not just a smoke and mirrors HYIP ponzi fraud.

[Newto]

Here we go: (get the puke bags ready)


BB Friday Q&A Webinar 8/9/13

We have a strong team working behind the scenes.

Payouts are going out according to the schedule, with people who haven't been paid first and then in date order.

We are working on Version 3 and things are going well with that.

Q&A

Martin Wilde: I work the business from my heart. I can't work any business unless I have complete belief. I have been with BB for 22 months. I've been a big supporter, and that's because when I first saw BB I did my due diligence and quickly got a strong feeling that it was good. My background was in advertising, so I had some insight into buying online traffic. Alot of the people have never gotten their heads around it. When any company grows as fast as BB did, there will be challenges. Fast growth is difficult to handle. There are issues with the company at the moment. I am only still here supporting Chris, because I know that if this company was looking for a way to run away, that would have happened a long time ago. I have spent time with Chris and I believe in his character and in his vision. He's done something that not many people do. He took an idea and ran with it and made a company that has paid out over $18 Million over time. The company has made mistakes and the affiliate have made mistakes. We have to pull together and work as a team if we want to get to this. I'm not privy to all the information but I know some of the things that are coming. I'm here until the fat lady sings, and Chris has promised me that she won't be singing. With all the new changes, remember, you don't need to rely on traffic packs to build your business. If you speak to new people about BB, as long as you tell them everything honestly. I didnt' know 2 years ago if BB would still be here today, so there always is a risk, but there is less risk now than when I joined. This company has proved itself, because BB is still here. There is alot of work happening behind the scenes that wouldn't be happening if Chris didn't believe in the future of BB. BB has done alot for me and my family. I want to do my part. I have reversed my withdrawals and begun using the new lower withdrawal system. It's our responsibility to get through this. There are always challenges, but this is what busienss is all about. It doesn't always go perfectly. If BB can get things back to normal, then everyone here on this call will be in a great place.

Chris:
Thank you very much. I appreciate Martin's passion. I'm glad to have him on the team.

Questions:

What are some of the items or things that you need to do to help BB? Promote and generate your own traffic through your social networks, emailing etcetera. We're going to be giving you some marketing tips for using social networks. Surveys is one of the things. Watching videos, etc. (please watch the replay to get all of this word for word) Driving traffic, watching videos, surveys, etc.

Duncan Woods:
I'd just like to say I've been in BB for 2 years. I was the most sceptical person. I've been scammed and everything else. When I started BB I can honestly say, it is the best business I have ever done. BB has changed more lives than any other business. I came out to Canada to meet Chris. I came away with 100% belief that Chris can turn this company around. I can't wait for Version 3.

Chris: Thank you for your support and for being with us.

Paul McCarthy: My history with BB goes back to 2011. My background is in mechanics. I tried many other businesses which didn't last more than 3-6 months. I started BB and just watched. I got 10 people from Ireland and we believed in everything we saw. I traveled to Canada to meet Chris in Nov. 2011. I finally met Chris in person. The bloggers are always negative. People come to me and ask is the company going to last next month or next year. I tell them, if Chris was goign to go, he would have gone in March when all the problems started happening. I believe Chris is goign to turn this around. Its frustrating, it's tough. When everything was fantastic, we were here. So when things go wrong, we should also be here. We have the responsibility to our teams. If the leader leaves, the team is left alone. We are going thru tough times, but hang in there. It's going to take some time. But we will then experience the same growth we did in the first 3 years.

Chris:

There are more leaders who have helped BB build the company to where it is. We can overcome these challenges and get to the next phase.

I wanted this call to be different. Please listen to the recording and share it with others. I've tried to give you updates on payouts and Version 3. Alot of things are happening in the background. We are cooking. We are working hard. Keep the feedback coming. I do read this. I am not doing this alone. it is with you and with your feedback. To see what changes need to be made. I don't want to make changes that are intolerable. I want the affiliates happy and to stay with us as we move forward.

(NOTE: please watch the replay, as this is just brief notes, not all that was said by Chris or others)

Have a great weekend. Take Care.

(end of webinar)
(summary notes prepared by Linda Lane, and not official transcripts)

[baylee]

The funniest thing is watching the few remaining "true believers" still discussing strategies and solutions, just as if it is a real business they are discussing and not just a smoke and mirrors HYIP ponzi fraud.

If the True Believers ever admit it to themselves then they will then have to admit they helped to scam/steal money from family, friends, and neighbors not to mention friendships that will be lost. That would have to be a bitter pill to swallow for a True Believer.

[Ken Roklin]

Here we go: (get the puke bags ready)


BB Friday Q&A Webinar 8/9/13

We have a strong team working behind the scenes.

Payouts are going out according to the schedule, with people who haven't been paid first and then in date order.

We are working on Version 3 and things are going well with that.


I wanted this call to be different. Please listen to the recording and share it with others. I've tried to give you updates on payouts and Version 3. Alot of things are happening in the background. We are cooking. We are working hard. Keep the feedback coming. I do read this. I am not doing this alone. it is with you and with your feedback. To see what changes need to be made. I don't want to make changes that are intolerable. I want the affiliates happy and to stay with us as we move forward.

(summary notes prepared by Linda Lane, and not official transcripts)

Who is we? The staff at headquarters in Belize? A couple of people working in his condo in Toronto? There is no BB registered company in Canada so where is the staff working out of? Stellar has no more staff dedicated to BB. So who and where is the "we" that is working so hard?

[Mundorf]

"But we will then experience the same growth we did in the first 3 years"....the only thing Chris wants affiliates and others to experience is to leave and forget BB...funny isn't it but that's the only way how to end the scam without drawing attention so that Chris can walk away as a Lord while members should fall in deep sleep and lose any interest to move around BB ...it started as fraud,lived as fraud and now even the death is fraud par excellence

[Gregg]

if this company was looking for a way to run away, that would have happened a long time ago.

Well, perhaps, although letting thousands of affiliates know your real names kind of makes that a bit more complicated.

[Martin88]

Q&A webinar?

One question and three glowing testimonials is pushing that description to the maximum.

The irony of this:


Promote and generate your own traffic through your social networks, emailing etcetera. We're going to be giving you some marketing tips for using social networks. Surveys is one of the things. Watching videos, etc. (please watch the replay to get all of this word for word) Driving traffic, watching videos, surveys, etc.

...is that BB is now leveraging its affiliates to make money through actual second-tier affiliate marketing. Shock horror.

Anybody who has engaged in this kind of affiliate marketing will know exactly where it ranks: Right at the bottom of the pile.

They are squeaking every last cent out of their database. It's shameless to the point where all I can do is shake my head.

On one hand, I wish people would pull their heads out of their asses.

On the other hand, I work in advertising. My job would be a lot harder if these people plugged their brains in.

[Della Cate]

Re Friday's webinar my reaction is this; YUK!

And then there were three.

Martin Wild: "I work the business from my heart".
Duncan Wood: "It is the best business I have ever done"
Paul Mc Carthy:"I believe Chris is going to turn this around"

Really, gentlemen? Really, really, really?

Where's the other players now, like Stepsys, Stokes, Lamb, Sharon James (?), Waterfield, "Little Jamie", etc who used to be so loud and stout in defence of BB. All gone, blown away like leaves on the wind, off to other schemes and ventures one must assume.

And that webinar told you absolutely nothing. To (mis)quote Shakespeare, and with apologies to the bard for making just one change to Macbeth's words below:-

To-morrow, and to-morrow, and to-morrow,
Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
To the last syllable of recorded time;
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
The way to dusty death. Out, out, brief candle!
BB's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
And then is heard no more. It is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.

[Jerrygo]

Oh to have friends in high places...

Senator Lisa Shoman on Belize Budget 2013 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-aplOJ-YA0)



TARA TALKS: BREAKING NEWS (http://taratalkstoday.blogspot.co.uk/p/breaking-news.html)

Lisa Shoman has a very good reputation regarding civil rights etc. Quite a surprising choice for BB. Possibly she didn't know the nature of the business she was being asked to represent.
The contact details given out by SP seem to be as useful as BB's own support system. She is not answering phone calls or emails.
On her FB page (https://www.facebook.com/LisaMShoman)she posts almost daily, but the couple of questions posted there about Bb remain unanswered. And she hasn't deleted the comments.
Perhaps she has decided to do a bit of research on BB before answering.

[Julie Diligent]

Meanwhile, over at Finchy's place, Harrison (Tara) posted this a few days ago:


harrison says:
August 4, 2013 at 12:41 am
I have some news about Chris Smith to share…make up your own mind if you think it has any truth to it. But I believe its true….
http://taratalkstoday.blogspot.co.uk/p/breaking-news.html (http://taratalkstoday.blogspot.co.uk/p/breaking-news.html)


As you can see, she posted evidence suggesting that Chris Smith was on the Board of Governors of Ryerson University. Only, a commenter then linked to a page of Ryerson Alumni showing that the Chris Smith in question was not in fact our favourite roly-poly Ponzi principal.

But Harrison's post spurred me to finish a write-up I was doing a while ago of my research into Smith's identity and background... what might appear on his CV were he to release it (and tell the truth, of course). The document would indeed have to include a post at Ryerson, but not a... er... BoG seat.

I abandoned the write-up because it was turning into War and Peace and by then it was clear SS Banners Broker was holed below the waterline and not long for the deep... so I thought why waste my time.

Anyway, 3 months on, the empty vessel is still chugging along, intent on squeezing every last cent it can from the Suckersphere before it sinks, for what could be several months more. So here it all is: one more torpedo of truth.

Best grab yourself a bucket of popcorn and supersize Coke, though; this is my longest (and very last) excursion down into the Banners Broker rabbit hole. Or should that be snake-pit?

It was this post of Sam's that set me off sharpening my trusty dot-connecting pencil once more:


Back on page 200 and something, I believe Julie found that Chris Smith was an employee of DonRiver at one point in time. This morning, I was trying to enhance my career so I (of course) went right to stteps.com. Interesting, I found this page: Stteps - Technology, Trends, Teamwork (http://stteps.com/nextmeeting.php) Note near the bottom "Presented by Stellarpoint and Donriver". So not only did Chris work there but it looks like DonRiver is partnered now with Stellarpoint at least on part of the scam activities. I did indeed make the original DonRiver Inc. connection Sam mentioned (noobs: backstory is here (http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index271.html#post41846)). On his LinkedIn profile, which I turned up last January, Smith claimed to have attended 'Ryerson University from 1990 to 2002' and be a 'Project Manager at DonRiver Inc. from March 2007 to Present'. He clearly hadn't updated it in a while.

But since my post he's doctored his LinkedIn profile (http://www.linkedin.com/pub/christopher-smith/4/376/8b6), removing the Ryerson reference completely and having us believe he's now a 'Project Manager at Chris Smith Inc.' There's no such entity in the Canada Federal Corporations registry, of course, and nothing else Googles up.

Disappeared down the memory hole now, too, is the Stteps website itself, as you will have discovered had you clicked on the link in Sam's post, above.

So here's a good question: If DonRiver is in bed with Banners Broker in this Ponzi fraud, is Stteps making it a threesome?

I pose the question because when I did my drilling into Banners Broker's Choice Network a while back, it struck me as very odd that the Stteps site, whilst in the network, was very obviously not of the network. Meaning it looks and functions like a real, purposeful, third-party site, in stark contrast to the laughable faux sites created by Smith and the DYZ Media mob, holed up in his condo in downtown Toronto (noobs: backstory here (http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index79.html#post33201), here (http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index141.html#post35537), and here (http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index283.html#post42337)).

Or rather condos, plural. It's since emerged he's taken a suite of them: Nos. 1901, 1902, 1905, and 1906.

Next stop, that scambuster's best friend: Wayback Machine. Where would we be without that goldmine of serial online scammers' incriminating footprints, eh? I checked out the very first incarnation of the Stteps website, from the February 2004 archive, and... paydirt! The outfit behind Stteps is evidently...


NetView Consultants Inc. aka NetView Solutions
60 Bristol Road East,
Suite 117Mississauga [20m west of Toronto]
ON, L5R1Y1
Canada


...and the individuals behind Stteps, who all conveniently posted their profiles, are...



Mike Millar - co-founder

Brent Ho-Young - 'technology consultant'







...and drum-roll, please, for this profile, reproduced in full...


http://web.archive.org/web/20040217233742im_/http://www.playline.ca/stteps/images/netview_solutions_logo_blu_small.gif (http://web.archive.org/web/20040217233742/http://www.netviewsolutions.ca/)

Christopher G Smith
chris@stteps.com (chris@stteps.com)
chris@netviewsolutions.ca (chris@netviewsolutions.ca)

"Christopher G Smith is a co-founder of STTEPS. Chris has been in the IT industry for 11 years starting with several positions with Ryerson University including Senior Network Administrator for the Continuing Education Corporate Division. After Ryerson, Chris went on to become a Pre-Sales Systems Engineer with a Value Added Reseller. Currently, Chris is a Technology Manager with Netview Solutions, an IT consulting services company helping companies develop and deploy the right choice in IT strategies to meet business goals.

Chris holds a Bachelor of Commerce from Ryerson University majoring in Information Technology with a minor in Communications, and is certified with Microsoft (MCSE+I v4.0, MCSE v2K, MCT), Cisco (CCNA, CCNP, CCAI), Novell (CNA), and CompTIA (A+, Network+, CTT+)

Chris enjoys downtown living and is (recently) happily married."


Unfortunately, Smith's picture is missing, but I think we can safely assume he's the dumpy Diddler-in-Chief of whom we speak ill. Here's that 2004 archived Stteps.com site (http://web.archive.org/web/20031225012757/http://www.stteps.com/) (click 'Profiles').

(While you're there at Wayback, you might want to check out the archived recently disabled Stteps.com site (http://web.archive.org/web/20130309001159/http://stteps.com/nextmeeting.php) with the 'Presented by Stellarpoint and Donriver' line that gives probable cause to suspect that DonRiver is involved in the Dikshit-Smith fuckery.)

If you surf the original site, you'll deduce that Stteps... which stands for Solid Technology Talks Enhancing interPersonal Skills... no, seriously... was launched around November 2001 and looks like it was abandoned by late 2004. (Pity there was no gallery of pics from their social events.)

You might also notice that the cached URL www.playline.ca/stteps/ (http://www.playline.ca/stteps/) gives away that the site was hosted at that time on the domain playline.ca. Both Netview and Playline domains were first registered between 2000 and 2003; let's see how they check out at DomainTools' oldest cached records from 2008 (unfortunately with address details made private):


Domain: playline.ca
Cache Date: 2008-12-23
Approval date: 2000/12/01
Registrant: Playline Consulting
Administrative contact: Christopher Smith
Postal address: Namespro.ca Private WHOIS


Here's the current, but looking unfinished and abandoned, Playline site: http://www.playline.ca (http://www.playline.ca/)


Domain: netviewsolutions.ca



Cache Date: 2008-04-18
Date-Approved: 2003/03/07
Organization: Playline Consulting
Admin-Name: Christopher Smith
Admin-Postal: Namespro.ca Private WHOIS




The Netview site exists no more, but here it is on Wayback Machine:




http://web.archive.org/web/20051211064138/http://www.netviewsolutions.ca/netview/home.htm (http://web.archive.org/web/20051211064138/http://www.netviewsolutions.ca/netview/home.htm)


There's no record in the Canada Federal Corporations database of NetView Solutions Inc., incidentally.

All this suggests that Smith, whilst working as 'Senior Network Administrator' at Ryerson, in 2000 set up Playline Consulting on the side. You know where I'm going back to with my special pencil next, don't you? That's right; here's the first playline.ca site archived at Wayback Machine, from August 2002:


http://web.archive.org/web/20020808003309/http://www.playline.ca/ (http://web.archive.org/web/20020808003309/http://www.playline.ca/)


I knew you'd be impressed by the sophistication of the home page. But a click away is this page:


http://web.archive.org/web/20021013124846/http://www.playline.ca/humber.htm (http://web.archive.org/web/20021013124846/http://www.playline.ca/humber.htm)


...which suggests that Smith taught IT courses at a Toronto polytechnic: Humber College Institute of Technology and Advanced Learning.

Corroborating that discovery is this site:


http://www.ratemyprofessors.com/ShowRatings.jsp?tid=45120 (http://www.ratemyprofessors.com/ShowRatings.jsp?tid=45120)


Now then, let me see what dots I can connect while I'm down this corner of the rabbit hole...

As search terms, the ubiquitous 'Christopher Smith' or 'Chris Smith' are a pain in the Googlies, returning pages of investigative dead-ends. But we can now nail that middle initial 'G' of his.

When I was digging into Silverline Club (noobs: backstory (http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index274.html#post41964)), the now defunct pyramid scheme he developed with Kul Josun, the sacked Banners Broker VP of Sales and alleged multimillion-dollar embezzler of BB affiliates' funds, I came across these details in historical domain name records for silverlineclub-dot-com:


Cache Date: 2008-01-14
Registrant: Christopher Smith csmith5000@rogers.com
110 Cumberland Street
Suite 201 [maildrop]
Toronto, Ontario M5R3V5

Cache Date: 2008-02-20
Registrant: George Smith domainservice80@gmail.com
777 N. Rainbow Blvd.
Suite 250 [maildrop]
Las Vegas, Nevada 89107


So Christopher GEORGE Smith it is. Well, well; how topical. Chris Smith: the future king of Ponziland?

So let's see what '"Christopher George Smith" Toronto' Googles up...

Yellow Pages yields these two results:


Christopher G Smith of 250 Jarvis St, Toronto ON M5B 2L2 (https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?client=firefox-a&q=250+Jarvis+St+Toronto+ON+M5B+2L2&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x89d4cb4a1ba7ecad:0xa746be90ab56d5cb,250+Ja rvis+St,+Toronto,+ON+M5A+3T4,+Canada&gl=uk&ei=gCVYUbbNLcmd0QWVlYGYCg&ved=0CDIQ8gEwAA)

C G Smith of 15 Maitland Pl, Toronto ON M4Y 2X3 (https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?client=firefox-a&q=15+Maitland+Pl+Toronto+ON+M4Y+2X3&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x89d4cb4db570b3d1:0xe0edac173013aa8e,15+Mai tland+Pl,+Toronto,+ON+M4Y+2X3,+Canada&gl=uk&ei=Xi1YUaaQB-eY1AXBo4C4Bw&ved=0CDIQ8gEwAA)


Significantly, both are condos in downtown Toronto. He likes collecting those, doesn't he? Maybe these two are in his fraud-funded property portfolio, too.

Meanwhile, the website TrainMark.com, a 'marketplace for the IT training industry' yields this nugget; it logs a Christopher G Smith as an instructor on a number of IT courses:





http://www.trainmark.com/instructors.asp?member=enc43659 (http://www.trainmark.com/instructors.asp?member=enc43659)


As you can see, the courses listed do cross reference with the IT qualifications Smith claimed to have whilst at NetView.

It remains an open question, then: Did Smith, over the span of 12 years stated on his original Linkedin profile (1990-2002), genuinely gain a B.Comm (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bachelor_of_Commerce) at Ryerson and stay on there as an employee? Or did he simply gain that clutch of IT certifications elsewhere... become an employee in Ryerson's IT department... and reasoned that, with his having worked there, he could bluff the Ryerson degree qualification?

Or did he never graduate from, nor work for, Ryerson, but simply teach IT courses at Humber College? After all, we have no evidence at all to corroborate his claim of an association with Ryerson, either as student or employee. I couldn't turn anything up elsewhere; I guess we would need access to the alumni database to verify the claim.

At least what's been uncovered so far does lend some support to the BB-drones' claim that he's an 'IT and maths genius'. Whilst I can buy 'IT expert', if not 'IT genius', I cannot buy the 'maths genius' bit. I mean, he has trouble working a simple spreadsheet. But maybe 'IT and Maths genius' is just a baseless conflation that was buzzing around the BB-hive... d'ya think?

Right. Back to those Stellar Point, Stteps, and DonRiver dots...

Piecing together the strands of evidence from the Stteps websites, Mike Millar's Linkedin profile (http://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=45903&authType=NAME_SEARCH&authToken=U50h&locale=en_US&srchid=2b1abb31-5976-45fd-aaea-f31af4175613-0&srchindex=1&srchtotal=7&goback=.fps_PBCK_*1_Mike_Millar_*1_*1_*1_*1_*2_*1_ Y_*1_*1_*1_false_1_R_*1_*51_*1_*51_true_*1_ca%3A48 76_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2 _*2_*2_*2&pvs=ps&trk=pp_profile_name_link), Brent Ho-Young's Linkedin profile (http://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=26354122&authType=NAME_SEARCH&authToken=gqef&locale=en_US&srchid=84f0dd63-6134-45fd-9c83-379191878701-0&srchindex=1&srchtotal=3&goback=.fps_PBCK_*1_Brent_Ho*5Young_*1_*1_*1_*1_*2 _*1_Y_*1_*1_*1_false_1_R_*1_*51_*1_*51_true_*2_*2_ *2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2_*2 _*2_*2&pvs=ps&trk=pp_profile_name_link), and the DonRiver executive team page (http://www.donriver.com/executive-team), and other evidence already unearthed, here's my best guess (with a dash of mischievous speculation) about who's done what, and when:


2000/1/2 - Whilst in the employ of Ryerson University, Smith teaches evening classes at Humber College and sets himself up the sideline Playline Consulting.

2002 - Smith leaves Ryerson and joins Ottowa-based JDSU Inc. (http://www.jdsu.com/en-us/Pages/Home.aspx) as a Pre-Sales Systems Engineer, where he meets Millar, who is also a JDSU Pre-Sales Systems Engineer.

2002/3 - The duo found NetView Consultants Inc./NetView Solutions on the side. They hatch Stteps as an in-house project and somehow rope in Ho-Young, who's working as an Accenture management consultant (but he's probably just moonlighting at NetView; Accenture consultants' day-rate would've been eye-watering.)

2006 - A breakawayteam of consultants from Accenture, including Ho-Young, set up DonRiver Inc.

2007 - NetView Consultants is acquired by Netwave Communications Inc. Millar joins them, whilst Smith joins Ho-Young at DonRiver as a Project Manager.

2007/8 - Smith moonlights as the IT guy and web wonk on Kul Josun's Silverline Club pyramid scheme, which he [Kul] hatched following his exit from the shut-down ICF Worldwide scam.

(Could this be the point where Smiffy succumbs to temptation and goes to 'the dark side'?)

2010 - Smith comes up with the idea of Banners Broker... teams up with Dikshit and Josun... who peddle it to the Ponzisphere as "The world's first straight line cycler-doubler".

2011/12 - Smith sets up DYZ Media under the Stellar Point identity to contrive the Choice Network websites, one of which, he decided, should be a resuscitated and re-designed Stteps.com site. Perhaps he thought the IT group recruitment meetings it promoted had genuine potential... if only as a means to recruit more unwitting operatives to the Banners Broker/Stellar Point sting... which it fulfilled with a campaign last November.


Which brings us full circle, back to the question of the Stteps-DonRiver-BB/SP connection...

What exactly is, and has been, the extent of Brent Ho-Young's involvement, if any, in Banners Broker and Stellar Point? He's appears to be a guy with a lot of reputation to lose. Is he fully cognizant of the multimillion-dollar Ponzi fraud with which DonRiver is on record as having an association?

Right, I'll leave you all with that question... put my special pencil away in the pencil box... and wait for the next online scam that engages my inner gumshoe. Shouldn't have too long to wait; do these looting leopards ever change their spots?

[Jerrygo]

Impressive example of a professional at work. Thanks Julie.

[Jerrygo]

I think there will be other dodgy connections turned up in time. Vector card services springs to mind, started up around the same time. BB was its only customer.
Its CEO went on the world tour with BB, even after the dump. Did Chris and Raj have a finger in that pie also?
And the moment Mastercard ditched BB, Vector dropped off the face of the earth on alexa rankings. 5501

[Ken Roklin]

I think there will be other dodgy connections turned up in time. Vector card services springs to mind, started up around the same time. BB was its only customer.
Its CEO went on the world tour with BB, even after the dump. Did Chris and Raj have a finger in that pie also?
And the moment Mastercard ditched BB, Vector dropped off the face of the earth on alexa rankings. 5501

Would anyone be surprised to find the new payment processor is just another new one set up by Vector? That is why it is taking a long time as if you go with an established one it shouldn't take months.

[Newto]

Would anyone be surprised to find the new payment processor is just another new one set up by Vector? That is why it is taking a long time as if you go with an established one it shouldn't take months.

I just don't get it why they still go through the trouble of "contracting" a new payment processor and creating version 3. Don't they know that they are dead?

[littleroundman]

I just don't get it why they still go through the trouble of "contracting" a new payment processor and creating version 3. Don't they know that they are dead?

Simple.

It costs them nothing to do and every cent they take in is pure profit.

It doesn't take long to rake in an extra few hundred thousand dollars.

Think about it, 2 guys sitting in their bedroom with a shared laptop could be doing this and no one would be the wiser.

[Jerrygo]

Willwork4food has posted on mmg, "There are rumors that the OSC has concluded their investigation and only gave suggestions"
I would not be surprised if that did turn out to be the case. The OSC has a terrible reputation, even among many Canadians.
i think they chose their 2 countries of operation well.
Even a senator in the national assembly of Belize Lisa Shoman turns out to be BB's lawyer.

[HARRISON]

This is the Chris Smith from Ryerson University...a picture I eventually dug up myself. The 'anonymous' link I was given didn't work...
5504

[Della Cate]

Well, well. Mr Dixit is now on Twitter

https://twitter.com/RajivDixit_SP

And here is a sample of some of his uplifting thoughts:-

5510

[Jerrygo]

Lol a bunch of self serving cliches. None of which he practices. What a hypocrite.

[Joe_Shmoe]

Lee Oakley (One of Mark Stokes' pals) now living in the good ol' US of A as he often likes to point out had better be careful.


HYIP Pitchpeople Beware: Legisi HYIP Pitchman Gagnon got 5 years FEDERAL PRISON SENTENCE (http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07/hyip-pitchpeople-beware-legisi-hyip.html)


Full Statement Of SEC On Criminal Conviction, Restitution Order And Civil Liability Of ‘Serial’ HYIP Ponzi Pitchman Matthew J. Gagnon (http://www.patrickpretty.com/2013/07/12/full-statement-of-sec-on-criminal-conviction-restitution-order-and-civil-liability-of-serial-hyip-ponzi-pitchman-matthew-j-gagnon/)

[Joe_Shmoe]

Well, well. Mr Dixit is now on Twitter

https://twitter.com/RajivDixit_SP

And here is a sample of some of his uplifting thoughts:-

5510

Ha Ha
The Definition Of Insanity Is Doing The Same Thing Over And Over Again Expecting Different Results!

The Definition Of Insanity Is Doing The Same Thing Over And Over Again Expecting Different Results! The Definition Of Insanity Is Doing The Same Thing Over And Over Again Expecting Different Results!
How ironic is that?


5515

Ha ha ! The Definition Of Insanity Is Doing The Same Thing Over And Over Again Expecting Different Results!

[AshKen1]

Ha Ha
The Definition Of Insanity Is Doing The Same Thing Over And Over Again Expecting Different Results!

The Definition Of Insanity Is Doing The Same Thing Over And Over Again Expecting Different Results! The Definition Of Insanity Is Doing The Same Thing Over And Over Again Expecting Different Results!
How ironic is that?


5515

Ha ha ! The Definition Of Insanity Is Doing The Same Thing Over And Over Again Expecting Different Results!







And one of his many followers (47 is many honest) is..... @stellarpoint

Don't see any of his fellow SP executives following him though.

[Jerrygo]

Lee Oakley (One of Mark Stokes' pals) now living in the good ol' US of A as he often likes to point out had better be careful.


HYIP Pitchpeople Beware: Legisi HYIP Pitchman Gagnon got 5 years FEDERAL PRISON SENTENCE (http://amlmskeptic.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07/hyip-pitchpeople-beware-legisi-hyip.html)


Full Statement Of SEC On Criminal Conviction, Restitution Order And Civil Liability Of ‘Serial’ HYIP Ponzi Pitchman Matthew J. Gagnon (http://www.patrickpretty.com/2013/07/12/full-statement-of-sec-on-criminal-conviction-restitution-order-and-civil-liability-of-serial-hyip-ponzi-pitchman-matthew-j-gagnon/)

I am sure that if SP had been based in USA they would have been closed long ago, and the principles locked up. BB has not been a small quiet scam working under the radar.
Any of us communicating with Canadian authorities know the frustration of being refered from dept a to dept b, then dept c, who refer us back to dept a again.
A huge campaign putting out evidence against the scammers resulted in opening the eyes of MC, eventbright,openx, Clicksor, who all dumped them.
But only after 2 years, Canada starts an OSC light touch investigation, which few people have any faith in. Well lets see what happens there.
BB have shown the way for other scammers. First move to Canada! then break your scam into 2 different arms. Move the named scam offshore to Belize or Cayman.
(You just need a shell company and maildrop).
Set up your second company under a different name in Canada. And describe it as just a support company. (Even though it does every single part of the scam from there)
Send all your ill gotten gains to Belize. Job done. you have at least 2 or 3 years to salt away your millions.

the Canadian authorities could learn a lesson from their cousins accross the border.

[Ken Roklin]

I am sure that if SP had been based in USA they would have been closed long ago, and the principles locked up. BB has not been a small quiet scam working under the radar.
Any of us communicating with Canadian authorities know the frustration of being refered from dept a to dept b, then dept c, who refer us back to dept a again.
A huge campaign putting out evidence against the scammers resulted in opening the eyes of MC, eventbright,openx, Clicksor, who all dumped them.
But only after 2 years, Canada starts an OSC light touch investigation, which few people have any faith in. Well lets see what happens there.
BB have shown the way for other scammers. First move to Canada! then break your scam into 2 different arms. Move the named scam offshore to Belize or Cayman.
(You just need a shell company and maildrop).
Set up your second company under a different name in Canada. And describe it as just a support company. (Even though it does every single part of the scam from there)
Send all your ill gotten gains to Belize. Job done. you have at least 2 or 3 years to salt away your millions.

the Canadian authorities could learn a lesson from their cousins accross the border.

Well let's see. It is great to see the US prosecute the Ponzi scammers as should every country. But, it took the "cousins" 5 years after the collapse of Legisis to prosecute him. If Canada were to follow their cousins, Canada has more than 5 years to go before sentencing anybody at SP. Also, since the USA is keen on going after the promoters (not owners) of Ponzis such as SP, which BBI promoters in the USA are the authorities investigating? In fact, what authorities in countries other than Canada and India are investigating the promoters? I am certainly not defending SP as they are/were promoting BB just like Driscoll is/was in the UK or all the Independent Contractors in all the countries BB has agreements with or the top affiliates in every country. Who is investigating them? Are US authorities investigating the top BB affiliates/promoters in the US?

[Mundorf]

Honesty doesn't always pay but dishonesty always costs - it's easy to speak about costs when costs are covered by BB affiliates.If dishonesty is rewarded,it's with honesty that is something wrong,isn't it Mr.Dixit

[Jerrygo]

Ken we are all defensive about our countries. Its understandable. When someone describes my country of being irresponsible, and letting bankers beggar the country, my hackles rise. But its true.
Citizens of other countries will not like being told their countries are war mongers, or have a bad human rights record, or whatever.
When I came researching BB a year ago I was puzzled to see seasoned scam busters complaining about Canadas lack of actions on scams.
My view of Canada is of a civilised law abiding democracy, a safe and easy going society. So I did a little research on the claims of lack of action on scams.
sadly it is true, even Canadian citizens, and the media there describe Canada as being slow to act, and soft on white collar crime.

The Globe and Mail "Want to be a corporate criminal? Move to Canada"
"I've turned over files to the RCMP and nothing happens," laments Al Rosen, the forensic accountant. "We just don't have people who are trained in what to look for. We have bad securities acts. We have bad sentencing guidelines. We've had some bad court decisions. We're 80 years behind the U.S. If you're a crook, this is the best place to be."

Yorkton this week "Another blow for RCMP white collar crime effort"
“Canada is 20 times safer to carry out corporate criminal activity than the United States,” said Martin Chambers, a former Vancouver lawyer who was disbarred and convicted of fraud.
"It’s a huge problem in Canada. A PriceWaterhouse-Coopers study reported 56 per cent of Canadian corporations had been victims of serious fraud at an average loss of $2 million. And individual investors have been bilked out of countless millions by ponzi schemes , phony investment opportunities and stock manipulation."
"In 2003, the RCMP decided to get tough on white-collar crime with the inception of their Integrated Market Enforcement Teams (IMET). It is not working. In nine years, they have only managed 11 convictions."

Financial post " OSC has dismal record"

The Star Why the OSC rarely gets its man.
“The whole system is not set up to protect investors,” says Kivenko, a former aerospace executive who wants to see major securities reforms. “If you did a cost-benefit economic model, Canada would be the place to go for white-collar crime. Your chance of detection is small and the consequences for getting caught are not high.”

The PricewaterhouseCoopers 2009 Global Economic Crime Survey puts Canada 4th. for white collar crime. After Russia South africa and Kenya.

"Canada is a fraudster’s haven. The problem is the whole system is broken from start to finish,” said the Toronto-based former RCMP officer, who is also a certified general accountant.

“Investigation is mired down in process. It’s practically paralyzing the system,” he explained. “If a case makes it to court, it can take years and years to make it through. Then sentences are often light and perpetrators are eligible for parole early.”

Major changes are needed to protect Canadians – businesses and individuals alike – and to alter the perception of this country on the world stage, Hannaford said. “Internationally Canada is seen as soft on crime,” he noted. “A lot of (frauds) have operated out of Canada.”

The Economist. "OUTSIDERS tend to think of Canada as a wholesome, boy-scoutish kind of place. Many Canadians have the same view. Yet their country is as shockingly slow as many in Latin America when it comes to dealing with allegations of corruption and white-collar crime"
"Canadian sloth in these matters is shown up by American zeal. Conrad Black was jailed for fraud south of the border but was never charged in his native Canada, although some of the press baron's offences were committed there"


International Monetary Fund, after an evaluation of Canada's regulatory system, found that both the provincial regulatory system and criminal enforcement were particularly weak (Langton, 2008). The IMF has called for improvements in both areas, specifically by adoption of a single regulator, and co-ordination between criminal and securities law enforcement (Langton, 2008).

"The United States has significantly outdistanced Canada in its regulation of white-collar crime with more than one thousand-two-hundred such convictions compared to Canada's three in the same period, and its more efficient laws with regard to witness testimony, evidence, and sentencing"

Ken I could fill 10 pages for you with refs and links. "Canadas own citizens believe it to be a haven for scammers"
So sadly it appears the veteran scambusters were correct.

[Ken Roklin]

Ken we are all defensive about our countries. Its understandable. When someone describes my country of being irresponsible, and letting bankers beggar the country, my hackles rise. But its true.
Citizens of other countries will not like being told their countries are war mongers, or have a bad human rights record, or whatever.
When I came researching BB a year ago I was puzzled to see seasoned scam busters complaining about Canadas lack of actions on scams.
My view of Canada is of a civilised law abiding democracy, a safe and easy going society. So I did a little research on the claims of lack of action on scams.
sadly it is true, even Canadian citizens, and the media there describe Canada as being slow to act, and soft on white collar crime.

The Globe and Mail "Want to be a corporate criminal? Move to Canada"
"I've turned over files to the RCMP and nothing happens," laments Al Rosen, the forensic accountant. "We just don't have people who are trained in what to look for. We have bad securities acts. We have bad sentencing guidelines. We've had some bad court decisions. We're 80 years behind the U.S. If you're a crook, this is the best place to be."

Yorkton this week "Another blow for RCMP white collar crime effort"
“Canada is 20 times safer to carry out corporate criminal activity than the United States,” said Martin Chambers, a former Vancouver lawyer who was disbarred and convicted of fraud.
"It’s a huge problem in Canada. A PriceWaterhouse-Coopers study reported 56 per cent of Canadian corporations had been victims of serious fraud at an average loss of $2 million. And individual investors have been bilked out of countless millions by ponzi schemes , phony investment opportunities and stock manipulation."
"In 2003, the RCMP decided to get tough on white-collar crime with the inception of their Integrated Market Enforcement Teams (IMET). It is not working. In nine years, they have only managed 11 convictions."

Financial post " OSC has dismal record"

The Star Why the OSC rarely gets its man.
“The whole system is not set up to protect investors,” says Kivenko, a former aerospace executive who wants to see major securities reforms. “If you did a cost-benefit economic model, Canada would be the place to go for white-collar crime. Your chance of detection is small and the consequences for getting caught are not high.”

The PricewaterhouseCoopers 2009 Global Economic Crime Survey puts Canada 4th. for white collar crime. After Russia South africa and Kenya.

"Canada is a fraudster’s haven. The problem is the whole system is broken from start to finish,” said the Toronto-based former RCMP officer, who is also a certified general accountant.

“Investigation is mired down in process. It’s practically paralyzing the system,” he explained. “If a case makes it to court, it can take years and years to make it through. Then sentences are often light and perpetrators are eligible for parole early.”

Major changes are needed to protect Canadians – businesses and individuals alike – and to alter the perception of this country on the world stage, Hannaford said. “Internationally Canada is seen as soft on crime,” he noted. “A lot of (frauds) have operated out of Canada.”

The Economist. "OUTSIDERS tend to think of Canada as a wholesome, boy-scoutish kind of place. Many Canadians have the same view. Yet their country is as shockingly slow as many in Latin America when it comes to dealing with allegations of corruption and white-collar crime"
"Canadian sloth in these matters is shown up by American zeal. Conrad Black was jailed for fraud south of the border but was never charged in his native Canada, although some of the press baron's offences were committed there"


International Monetary Fund, after an evaluation of Canada's regulatory system, found that both the provincial regulatory system and criminal enforcement were particularly weak (Langton, 2008). The IMF has called for improvements in both areas, specifically by adoption of a single regulator, and co-ordination between criminal and securities law enforcement (Langton, 2008).

"The United States has significantly outdistanced Canada in its regulation of white-collar crime with more than one thousand-two-hundred such convictions compared to Canada's three in the same period, and its more efficient laws with regard to witness testimony, evidence, and sentencing"

Ken I could fill 10 pages for you with refs and links. "Canadas own citizens believe it to be a haven for scammers"
So sadly it appears the veteran scambusters were correct.

If I wanted to take the time I could also fill 10 pages of refs and links showing that there is more white collar crime in the USA than in Canada (proportionally). In the latest roundup of Ponzis of people charged (Business Solutions & Software for Legal, Education and Government | LexisNexis (http://www.lexisnexis.com)) there were 2 in Canada vs. 36 in the USA. You mention that US had "one thousand-two-hundred such convictions" vs. Canada's 3 in the same period. Perhaps that is because there are a 1000 more such Ponzis starting up in the US than in Canada. In the US Ponzis are starting up on a daily basis whereas in Canada there are very few so when one does start it gets more publicity.

According to International Monetary Fund, "It is puzzling that authorities have problems dealing with pyramid and Ponzi schemes, and that they occur continually. Moreover, as recently demonstrated with what appears to be a multibillion dollar Ponzi operating on Wall Street in the United States, it is a myth to believe that Ponzis, pyramids, and other fraudulent schemes are limited to unsophisticated victims or are most prevalent in shallow financial systems. Indeed, based on numbers alone, the United States has probably experienced more Ponzi and pyramid schemes than anywhere."

As per a comment from an FBI agent "Florida is considered a haven for white-collar crime in the United States. Historically, the Florida criminal justice system has considered white-collar crimes to be less important than property crime or crimes against persons. There is no central source for collecting data or intelligence on white-collar crimes in Florida."

As for being tough on white-collar crime:
Re: White Collar Punishment:
The Association of Certified Fraud Examiners 2004 Report asserts organizations lose approx. $660 billion to white collar abuses and crimes every year. Even though FBI statistics show a drop in violent crime, white-collar crime have reached an all-time high and show few sign s of lessening anytime soon. According to the US Sentencing Commission, the average prison sentence length (not served) for white-collar crime was between 19.0 and 20.8 months."

If Canada is the place for white-collar crime why do most start up and run in the USA, i.e. Madoff, Enron, WorldCom, etc. etc. ? The USA prosecutes them bu only after years and years of operating and amassing fortunes in the billions. If the US is so far ahead in prosecuting these criminals why does it take them years to shut them down, many only get charged after the scheme collapsed?

It is obvious with the daily Ponzi start-ups in the US, operators still feel safer there than in Canada.
Yes we have Stellar Point but you have equivalent BB contractors/affiliates in the US and nobody is investigating them. Raj's previous company was shut down within 2 years of starting the operation because it was registered in Canada. US waits 2 years after the collapse before it takes any action.

Canada may not have a federal securities regulator but the SEC has a lot of issues. They have cost companies billions of dollars by allowing naked shorting - allowing brokers to sell non-existant shares. It took years of complaining from companies before they decided it was illegal.
I am not saying Canadian authorities couldn't use improvement in areas such as punishing white-collar crime but they certainly don't appear to be any worse than the US.

[Jerrygo]

Ken. I have no interest in having a protracted argument with you. Waste of time. I have seen your other posts. I know your view of SP/BB.
You have your views that Canada is more successful against white collar crime than is US.
I have the opposite view, based on advice from those more experienced than me, and from my own research, and experience dealing with Canadian authorities.
You have your view that SP's crime is only equivalent to BB contractors/affiliates.
I believe that SP is a prime mover in the BB ponzi. An initiator of, and a beneficiary of a criminal conspiracy.
We are both entitled to our views.
I stand by my belief that if SP was based in US, and if the campaign and info against it was directed to US authorities, there would have been action before now.
And that the action would be more severe than what we can expect from OSC.
You believe opposite.
Now Ken we have both expressed our views.
Leave it at that.

[Ken Roklin]

Ken. I have no interest in having a protracted argument with you. Waste of time. I have seen your other posts. I know your view of SP/BB.
You have your views that Canada is more successful against white collar crime than is US.
I have the opposite view, based on advice from those more experienced than me, and from my own research, and experience dealing with Canadian authorities.
You have your view that SP's crime is only equivalent to BB contractors/affiliates.
I believe that SP is a prime mover in the BB ponzi. An initiator of, and a beneficiary of a criminal conspiracy.
We are both entitled to our views.
I stand by my belief that if SP was based in US, and if the campaign and info against it was directed to US authorities, there would have been action before now.
And that the action would be more severe than what we can expect from OSC.
You believe opposite.
Now Ken we have both expressed our views.
Leave it at that.

No sense in keeping up this debate, however, don't put words in my mouth either. I did not say Canada is more successful against white collar crime than the US. Also, according to US law, Ponzi affiliates promoting a Ponzi are as guilty as the owners of the program.
Enough said.

[HARRISON]

I have had an email from one of Jo Spencers colleagues who has told me that she is still recruiting and has signed up half her office! And wow betide anybody who disagrees with her. Must make work such a pleasant place to be.
What was that saying about 'don't s**t in your backyard?
5519

[EagleOne]

Her's an analysis of what happened at the big show in Niagra. I must warn you that for all the "exciting" news that was announced by Chris, the person doing this video could put you to sleep. Now what was truly interesting and funny was how they drew for the Mercedes. If you want to skip all the BS, jump over to the 16:23 mark to hear how it was done. Absolutely GOLD: Zippyshare.com - Update for Team BB Tour 2.mp4 (http://www46.zippyshare.com/v/24493854/file.html) "WARNING!" Do not be drinking anything while waching this video, or you will ruin a good keyboard and monitor.

[Jerrygo]

Lol Chris and his excell spreadsheet again. He made no mistakes in it this time though. BB millionaire recruiter got the merc.
What would have been surprising though, is if some poor Joe Soap passive player had won it.

[path2prosperity]

I believe there's a solicitor's letter from Canada at my old address that I've got to go and collect on Saturday.

Any advice if it is what I believe it is?

*Worried*

Yes Jason.

You could use it to light a cigarette!

I replied to one threat by thanking the solicitor for his letter and told him that I could not find my lighter so it came in handy to light my cig when I turned on the kitchen hotplate. I can not remember whose lawyer it was who sent it but I think it was probably the one who wrote on behalf of "Terry The Banker" or "Terry The Something Else."

I sent a copy of BoggyBoy's solicitor's letter to SBM, Lynne, Patrick, okosh and a few others and we had the best laugh for a very long time. The solicitor dropped BoggyBoy the women's dirty knicker seller like a hot cake and they did not issue any libel writs.

[HARRISON]

Oh dear, Jo SPENCER doesn't think much of my little tweet enquiring about her finances from the ponzi BB...she sent me this:
5527

[Jerrygo]

Oh dear, Jo SPENCER doesn't think much of my little tweet enquiring about her finances from the ponzi BB...she sent me this:
5527

They dont like akward questions Harrison. Very little for us to do now, apart from baiting BB pushers and SP apologists.
Its a bit of fun though when you get a reaction. Shows you have touched a nerve.

[Ken Roklin]

Yes Jason.

You could use it to light a cigarette!

I replied to one threat by thanking the solicitor for his letter and told him that I could not find my lighter so it came in handy to light my cig when I turned on the kitchen hotplate. I can not remember whose lawyer it was who sent it but I think it was probably the one who wrote on behalf of "Terry The Banker" or "Terry The Something Else."

I sent a copy of BoggyBoy's solicitor's letter to SBM, Lynne, Patrick, okosh and a few others and we had the best laugh for a very long time. The solicitor dropped BoggyBoy the women's dirty knicker seller like a hot cake and they did not issue any libel writs.

I like the cigar thing, I'm always running out of butane. On the other hand, since it was sent to an old address why bother picking it up. Let them return it to the sender, unless you want some entertainment.

[HARRISON]

Rajit is certainly getting around isn't he...

Stellarpoint Inc. CEO Rajiv Dixit - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLqhkfEngPg#at=84)

[Ken Roklin]

Rajit is certainly getting around isn't he...

Stellarpoint Inc. CEO Rajiv Dixit - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLqhkfEngPg#at=84)

He sure does, all those offices and all those clients, yet the company has no money. Maybe because the two products in that video are not exactly revenue producing products.

[Joe_Shmoe]

Rajit is certainly getting around isn't he...

Stellarpoint Inc. CEO Rajiv Dixit - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLqhkfEngPg#at=84)

Comments & ratings disabled I wonder why?

Can any of the Banners Broker Victims tell us if they feel they have had Stellar service from Raj?

5529

[Mundorf]

Comments & ratings disabled I wonder why?

Can any of the Banners Broker Victims tell us if they feel they have had Stellar service from Raj?

5529

Good question...now many do not want to recognize them as victims and those who do,are already involved with other scams so the scammers are more concerned about outsiders I guess

[Della Cate]

Well, old Mr Dixit's Twitter page didn't last long.....

5537

Wonder why it went? I mean, surely he is not sensitive to comments from forums like this one??

[Della Cate]

On Simon "Roland Rat" Stepsys FB page -one called "Simons Stepsys Banners Broker Group" - he is no longer pushing BB.

There has been a flurry of activity over the past couple of days and he is now pushing other things, including something called "makemoney 247.com".

He's clearly moved on from BB.

IMO, these people are like fleas aren't they - they'll jump on any dog that will carry them!

[HARRISON]

Lisa Shoman is apparently NOT BB's lawyer? A posting on Banners Broker Ponzi Scam has just appeared saying so? But would make sense as she hasn't replied to all the messages about it...

5543

[hendyphilhendy]

From my colleague's talking BB forum access a 'pearls of wisdom' post from Jamie Waters

Definitely a load of waffle with little substance but shows he is still pushing this one, or at the very least, trying to show how credible he is before he pushes his next scam!


Its been a while since I’ve sat down and attempted to release my pearls of wisdom on the form and after reading the posts from the last few weeks and especially people frantically looking for updates and proof on the rumour/possibility (delete as appropriate) that payments have gone out over the weekend – I thought I’d chime in.

Almost 12 months ago to the day I posted ‘A sense of perspective’ (Login (http://talkingbb.com/index.php?topic=1295.0)) and talked about how the forum has grown and keeping things in, well, perspective.

I think, 12 months on, the same could still be said.

Now everyone has their own paradigm (a view on the world, based on their previous life experiences) and after reading the book by Steven Covey ‘The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People’ (http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-Habits-Highly-Effective-People/dp/0743269519) last year it made me more aware than ever of how everyone views the world in their own unique way, and how one view is not necessarily wrong, or not necessarily right.

What am I waffling about?

Well, we all know BB is a business. I know for some, especially on the forum, BB is/was their first venture into business. And I also know that that many (or probably most) were sold BB as a pure investment (remember the ‘guaranteed not to lose money with this business’ capture pages that were authorised’)?

This sadly created the false illusion that BB was perfect, infallible and not susceptible to the often harsh realities of being a business in the current times.

This also created the negative attention that many get caught up in, make it their ‘duty’ to defend BB to the hilt, thus fuelling the apparent hatred some have for the business. (On a personal note I haven’t visited any of these sites for well over 12 months and give no thought whatsoever what anyone (good or bad) has to say about me or the business - I'll be uploading a video to my YouTube channel tomorrow about 'Vaccinations for Entrepreneurs' that you might want to check out [sorry for the shameless plug]).

Sadly, because of the ‘guaranteed not to lose money’ hype that lasted for so long and possibly continued down the generations, many lost sight of the simple basic rule “Never spend more than what you can afford to lose”. Naturally, no one wants to lose anything – but I’ve heard stories of people getting huge loans, remortgaging their house, borrowing off friends, family or worse, spending their life savings.. every time, I cringe whilst dying to shake them and ask ‘why?!’. If things go wrong (note I said IF), they’ll look for someone to blame (after all we live in a blame culture), Chris, Raj, Ian, Kul, Lievan, the forum staff, their inviter… someone other than themselves.

- Never spend more than what you can afford to lose.

Its often said ‘treat BB like a business’ – but what does that actually mean? Personally, it would take it to mean have BB as part of a portfolio and to not rely on it. Relying on one income and one business is the same as relying on a job and we know how secure most jobs can be.

Its also often said that ‘BB keep changing the goalposts’ – yes, they do. And they always will. Again, that’s part of life and business and again we have to accept this fact in anything that we do. Any company you are with could change the compensation plan overnight and re write your income levels, BB is no different.

So what about those who have followed the golden rules of business? What about those who actually bought and used advertising? I’d suggest the paradigm for them is a little different and the view on the company and the current issues, a little more relaxed.

When I spent $140 on advertising in May 2011, I received BB signups from the early advertising and more recently excellent affiliate commissions and signups to other businesses that I promoted.

Why do I say this?

Well, its to ask if people have used, split tested and tested again the advertising that BB offer us. Its easy to run a Facebook ad and get no clicks and say ‘facebook advertising doesn’t work’ – but advertising to me is a science and it takes a lot of testing to get the formula right.

What about the future?

“Do not boast about tomorrow, for you don’t know what a day may bring forth.”
Proverbs 27:2

Ultimately, we don’t know what will happen in the future, about BB or any other business, or life in general. When things are out of our control, and when you accept that things are out of our control – again perception totally changes. I see the same with BB – none of us have any control over what happens with BB and the sooner we accept that and work with what we have, the sooner people see things differently

I’ve been in a fortunate position in my BB journey, I was in on conference calls and meetings with BB execs fairly early on which gave me a unique insight into what went on and later meetings in the Bradford office and then the Leaders Calls as well as meetings with Hooker, Lorenzo etc. I know and appreciate the paradigm I have is totally different from someone who has been to a few meetings and just catches the Friday Q and A call or doesnt even speak English.

Enough already Jamie

I occasionally get the odd Facebook message accusing me of scamming people, being a champion for BB (one even called me Chris’ puppet which was a scary mental image), asking why I’ve ‘ditched BB’ and all the rest – so what is it?

I tell things how they are, how I see it, from my point of view. I’m a businessman with a varied portfolio, both online and offline and both investments and companies and BB is firmly in there as one of my chosen advertising partners – it works for me and I would be crazy not to share it with my chosen students.

Sorry for what has turned out into a bit of an essay, I just wanted to put my thoughts and feelings to the forum and explain how I understand largely how people from every camp feels (including those anti BB) and how I firmly believe that given enough time and patience, BB will come through the other side and become a recognised name in the online advertising sector.

I hope you agree, but would also understand if you laughed and said ‘yea right!’

To the future

Jamie

[hendyphilhendy]

It was quite interesting to read some of the replies to the above. They were mostly backslapping but a couple did delve into it a bit further. This one below from NikSpoon was for me the most interesting.

Affiliates are clearly not happy with the new stance of not relying on BB


I couldn't decide whether to put this in a dedicated new topic but, on reflection, think that i is all part of a similar discussion to Jamie's original post.

I want to make it clear, from the outset, that my personal opinion of Banners Broker is that I believe they will come through this current period of 'challenges', better than ever and that we will all get paid in full, eventually.

However.....

There is something that has really been bugging me for the last few weeks.

It started when David Hooker did his weekly presentation on behalf of BB and he was advising members that it's not good to put all your eggs in one basket. He was not suggesting that the 'eggs' you currently have in BB are likely to break. It was seen more as sound business advise.

I understand that David Hooker is not employed by BB, but actually operates as part of Stellar Point and it's association with BB to provide support and training.

However, I think it is fair to say that if DH speaks about BB then people are right to think that whatever he is saying is probably sanctioned by BB management, including Chris Smith.

That's all well and good, and DH has done an incredible amount of good work for BB in terms of compliance and also, possibly even more importantly, for it's image and vastly improved perceived reliability and trustworthiness (if anyone had any doubts beforehand).

But, from the moment he gave the advice regarding having a varied portfolio of income streams and not relying solely on one single revenue source, I have had a big problem with it.

Namely, I find the original statement insensitive and ill thought out in it's delivery.

I also find the many similar comments on the same subjects with people agreeing that putting all your eggs in one basket is a mistake to be particularly patronising.

From a personal stand point, I DO have multiple income streams and have not put myself in a position where I rely solely on BB. I have also had my 'seed money' back many times over. That does not mean that I am indifferent and uncaring if anything happens to BB.

Far from it!

There are aspects of my life that have been put in place under the assumption that my well run BB account will be able to sustain it and finance it. Why shouldn't I have done this? I ran my account as per BB's ever changing guidelines and within their Terms of Service. I trust them when they say that they are here to stay and this is a fantastic opportunity for all.

For the last 6 months those plans have been either put on the back burner or destroyed completely.

I accepted this because I keep myself up to date with what is happening and think I have a good understanding of why they are happening and why it is taking so long to rectify and that it is largely out of Chris Smith's control.

I also field the complaints and concerns of my downline to try to keep re-assuring them about the current situation.

I would say about 90% of my downline are people for which this has been their first dabble into online business. They did not sign up under a whim. They only deposited an amount that they are comfortable to deposit and, if the worst happened, it would not be the end of the world for them if they never saw that money again.

But after many months of learning the business and operating their accounts successfully, it is not unreasonable when a member looks at his account, sees that it will earn, on average, at least $200 (or any figure you care to mention) every month, available to withdraw, and rely on that money. They will allocate it to something like a little luxury, or even an essential.

Whatever it has been earmarked for is irrelevant. The fact is they are in a business they trust and they are being successful.

These are not people that have 'multiple income streams' or 'eggs in many baskets' and, to be honest, why should they feel they need to be?

The message from Chris Smith and BB has always been, and continues to be, “Trust us guys. Be patient. We have problems that we will solve. We are in this for the long haul.”

Then along comes David Hooker and announces “It's probably not a good idea to put all your eggs in one basket” and is accompanied by many people trumpeting the same thing via this forum over the ensuing weeks.

It may be good advice but it is completely patronising and there is a huge percentage of BB affiliates that, whether you like it or not, that this does not apply to.

I would bet there are tens of thousands of affiliates for whom this is the first and only venture into their own online business. That does not mean they have put in a couple of hundred Dollars and don't really care if it works.

Many of these will have put in serious amounts of money, after being assured by people they trust that this is a good idea. (again, I want to stress that I personally STILL think BB is a good idea).

Even if people put in very small amounts at the start, that they would be prepared to lose, they have built up accounts that can now provide them with a genuinely realistic improvement in their own lifestyle and they have not done anything wrong in thinking that this will continue.

Or have they?

Personally, I don't think they have done anything wrong, if all you listen to is real information coming from the people that matter via the company webinars and reliable places such as this forum.

How many situations are there of people supplementing their old age pension via a BB account?

How do these people feel being told you should really look to add more revenue streams?

BB affiliates are not made up solely of seasoned online marketers or people with a shrewd business background. In fact I would suggest that those types of people are in a small minority of the 400,000 people involved in BB.

A huge majority of the affiliates are first time online business owners who were lucky enough to have the financial ability, strength, foresight and bravery to buy that first package.

It does not mean that all these people, after seeing their BB account grow steadily, then had the finances, time or even inclination to then start a few other online businesses, just in case.

People that already worked full time for low wages but saw BB as a way to improve their quality of life, wouldn't go out and get ANOTHER job, just in case.

Offer sound advise, by all means, but please have some sort of recognition about how what you say will be received by what is essentially the core of the BB affiliate family.

For me, to say to these affiliates that you shouldn't be putting all your eggs in one basket, is akin to saying to someone that says they have no money to just go and get another job, even though this person may already be working 60 hours a week to just keep their head above water.

Or, saying to the person that is struggling to find employment, 'well you should have worked harder at school'.

Totally, offensive, insensitive and patronising.

Keep us informed , BB, and just keep doing what you are doing to make sure this business lasts and thrives.

If you keep your end of the bargain then We hope there will not be the need for eggs or baskets of any description..

[littleroundman]

This sadly created the false illusion that BB was perfect, infallible and not susceptible to the often harsh realities of being a business in the current times.

No, Jamie, you lying little piece of human excrement.

It isn't a "business" and, never was a "business"

It has always been a fraudulent ponzi / pyramid scheme dressed up to look like a "business"

Unfortunately, the next crop of victims for the "next big thing" HYIP ponzi fraud is going to come from those who still cling to the belief Banners Broker was a (badly managed) "business"

Such is the way of the HYIP ponzi world.

[Ken Roklin]

No, Jamie, you lying little piece of human excrement.

It isn't a "business" and, never was a "business"

It has always been a fraudulent ponzi / pyramid scheme dressed up to look like a "business"

Unfortunately, the next crop of victims for the "next big thing" HYIP ponzi fraud is going to come from those who still cling to the belief Banners Broker was a (badly managed) "business"

Such is the way of the HYIP ponzi world.

Jamie also stated "- Never spend more than what you can afford to lose.". Now I'll guarantee you that he and his downline never told any prospective affiliate that there is a 99% chance they would lose their money and that it is an illegal "business". If he did I doubt he would have a downline of more than a couple who know HYIP's are extremely risky and illegal but play the game.

[Jerrygo]

Exactly. This is their get out clause. "Never spend more than what you can afford to lose." As if BB was always pushed as a gamble.
But how they actually did recruit people was with lies and impossible promises.
From BB UK FB. and others.

"IT’S IMPOSSIBLE NOT TO MAKE MONEY WITH THIS BUSINESS
Hard to believe ? Read On !!!
With the Banners Broker System, there’s no way you can lose and there’s no way you can NOT make money. No catches. No small print. It simply means that this system WILL make you money !"

The tune has changed.

[Mundorf]

It was quite interesting to read some of the replies to the above. They were mostly backslapping but a couple did delve into it a bit further. This one below from NikSpoon was for me the most interesting.

Affiliates are clearly not happy with the new stance of not relying on BB

What a deep scan, observation and expectation he has toward ponzi creators...what a philosophy of mind - "Totally, offensive, insensitive and patronising."...but then -"Keep us informed , BB, and just keep doing what you are doing to make sure this business lasts and thrives"....as saying - I smell fraud but I trust you BB - pure nonsence:pao:...he looks like a bomb that would love to explode but does not dare - can be seen only in scam world

[HARRISON]

They dont like akward questions Harrison. Very little for us to do now, apart from baiting BB pushers and SP apologists.
Its a bit of fun though when you get a reaction. Shows you have touched a nerve.

You got me thinking Jerrygo...Your right, there isn't much else we can do now, but as I read your reply all I could think of was how BB have made mugs of us all.
So, I thought, why not make 'MUGS' of them...
TARA TALKS: MY ZAZZLE STORE (http://taratalkstoday.blogspot.co.uk/p/zazzle.html)

[Jerrygo]

You take Paypal Harrison?. I'd like a raj mug. Large. Potty training size.

[HARRISON]

News just in...

We have been advised that as of today, our contract as the Irish Independent Contractor for Stellar Point is terminated.

Banners Broker International and Stellar Point have mutually agreed to end their contract. As a result Stellar Point have concluded all contracts for independent contractors worldwide to handle support and training for Banners Broker.

We are now obliged to cancel all bookings for training at the Cork office effective immediately.

If you have any additional training requirements, please log onto your Banners Broker account and refer to your Dashboard. Here, you will find recorded webinars relating to various aspects of the system, plus the Q&A updates by Chris Smith.

All support queries will now be handled by Banners Broker International. All existing queries have been forwarded and will be processed by the Belize office directly.

If you have any further account related queries please submit a support ticket via your back office. Banners Broker will advise shortly of a worldwide contact number if you wish to speak to customer support.

Although, it is with great regret that we received this news, we would like to thank Banners Broker affiliates for their support over the past two years.

Sincerely,

Maconne Team (( Got A Copy ))

[Della Cate]

News just in...

We have been advised that as of today, our contract as the Irish Independent Contractor for Stellar Point is terminated.

Banners Broker International and Stellar Point have mutually agreed to end their contract. As a result Stellar Point have concluded all contracts for independent contractors worldwide to handle support and training for Banners Broker.

We are now obliged to cancel all bookings for training at the Cork office effective immediately.

If you have any additional training requirements, please log onto your Banners Broker account and refer to your Dashboard. Here, you will find recorded webinars relating to various aspects of the system, plus the Q&A updates by Chris Smith.

All support queries will now be handled by Banners Broker International. All existing queries have been forwarded and will be processed by the Belize office directly.

If you have any further account related queries please submit a support ticket via your back office. Banners Broker will advise shortly of a worldwide contact number if you wish to speak to customer support.

Although, it is with great regret that we received this news, we would like to thank Banners Broker affiliates for their support over the past two years.

Sincerely,

Maconne Team (( Got A Copy ))

How amazing. SP trying to distance itself from BB (or the other way around?). All trying to wash their hands of this thing, are they?

[Della Cate]

Meanwhile, over on MMG, we have this extract from today's leaders' call (Thanks to Rooneyfenomeno)

First Chris mentioned that there will be a "new in-house support" located at head office in Belize, replacing Stellar Point
It would be both phone+email and it will have a cost (I should have heard NOT for executive), since there would be BB's employee no more SP's ones
(at the moment there are SPs employee in Belize)

He said payout will be paid starting from those who never received anything, " in a little while "

And this:-

Audience Question
Q: Do you hope V 3.0 will be up and running by October
A: yes

Audience Question
Q: will we still be using stellar point offices in the various countries for the I'C'S
A: for stellar point products not BB

Audience Question
Q: Shout to the world if you have been paid
A: yes indeed

Audience Question
Q: the monday training call has been cancelled.Why?
A: david hooker works for stellar point and he has been directed to focus more on stellar point initiatives

Audience Question
Q: uk office shutting???
A: yes stellar point closed their UK office. Banners Broker never had a UK office

Audience Question
Q: How confident are you Chris that BB will get out of this difficult time
A: i am very confident - a lot of changes are coming

Audience Question
Q: will they still be handling support in different countries?
A: all support will be handled by our head office in belize

Funny how everything is going to Belize, isn't it? Follow the money, eh? Get everything in one place and then....one day....it will just.....vanish

[NikSam]

Silly lies.

Stellar Point is and always was BB itself, just changed the sign on the door.

Isle of man's BBI has now no directors and no offices, ran like rats, technically abandoned company.


can find all the evidence in this thread.


Yeap, dear Chris will open an office in belize to run some company which doesn't exists.
Watch out for the jaguars Chris, they will be renting office on the next tree.

[Ken Roklin]

Silly lies.

Stellar Point is and always was BB itself, just changed the sign on the door.

Isle of man's BBI has now no directors and no offices, ran like rats, technically abandoned company.


can find all the evidence in this thread.


Yeap, dear Chris will open an office in belize to run some company which doesn't exists.
Watch out for the jaguars Chris, they will be renting office on the next tree.

There is no BBI in Isle of Man. Chris moved it to Belize. Raj and SP have distanced themselves from BBI ever since BBI stopped paying them for support and training and promoting BBI. They are 2 separate companies even though Raj bossed Chris around. Chris is a pathetic CEO and allowed that to happen. Raj, on the other hand figured that if he was going to base his company, SP, on BBI's revenue he better have a say in the company's direction and acted as though he was CEO of BBI. Chris didn't appear to object very much. However, it's all over and the 2 are going their separate ways.

I doubt either company will be in business for very long as neither one of them knows how to run a legit company.
No management, no money and no business sense.

[Jerrygo]

SP have distanced themselves from BBI ever since BBI stopped paying them for support and training and promoting BBI.

Are you certain of that being the reason for the distancing of the 2 arms of the operation Ken?
That was one of the reasons posited by observers, others were that the OSC had demanded or suggested the separation.
Or that this was always the planned scenario, that they would seperate with their gains when the thing started to implode.
Or just that Raj was trying to protect himself at this stage by disassociation.
Have you some inside info? or is it an educated guess?

[NikSam]

There is no BBI in Isle of Man. Chris moved it to Belize. Raj and SP have distanced themselves from BBI ever since BBI stopped paying them for support and training and promoting BBI. They are 2 separate companies even though Raj bossed Chris around. Chris is a pathetic CEO and allowed that to happen. Raj, on the other hand figured that if he was going to base his company, SP, on BBI's revenue he better have a say in the company's direction and acted as though he was CEO of BBI. Chris didn't appear to object very much. However, it's all over and the 2 are going their separate ways.

I doubt either company will be in business for very long as neither one of them knows how to run a legit company.
No management, no money and no business sense.

I see you started believing their smoke and mirrors yourself.

I repeat Raj was always and still is in charge of BB, always been.
Stellar point in Canada was created for the sole purpose of running BB scam, was even named Banners Broker before they changed the name to Stellar Point.

whatever is in Isle of man or Belize is a joke to anybody who is familiar with offshore crap.
The office size, even if they have one there is no bigger than my mailbox.
But even their fake "nominated" directors in Isle of Man, scared as hell and resigned.

When people start to see offshore company registrations for what they truly are? - just empty crap, with more than 90% of those created for pure fraud or tax evasions, offshores are criminal destinations, not just a tax efficiency for the last 10 years.


Chris is just dumb idiot who agreed to be a face of the "company" / a fall guy.

[Della Cate]

Remember February this year (I think it was)? Remember the announcement that SP had taken out a TEN YEAR LEASE on an office in Salford Quays? This was to be the EUROPEAN HQ of Stellarpoint! Yay!

Remember the pro-BB crowd - where are they all now, by the way? - shouting that this proved that BB was "here to stay" and "in it for the long haul" and "had longevity"?

And now it is mid August, some six months down the line and SP has closed its UK office......Convenient, really, because you CAN get 6 month leases and short term leases, particularly if your "office" is no more than one room or even just a post office mail box. And now the 6 months is up. If they ever did have a lease on anything, anywhere, of course.

Longevity? Long haul?

I think not.

[Della Cate]

Jamie Waters - that would be "Little Jamie" from wherever it is he hails from, would it? Another self professed businessman and entrepreneur. Like Mark Stokes and Simon Stepsys and all the rest of that crew.

Gentlemen (and ladies) I have news for you. You are NOT a businessman/woman and you are NOT an entrepreneur.

Alan Sugar is a businessman. James Dyson is an inventor and an entrepreneur. Richard Branson is an entrepreneur and businessman. Clive Sinclair was another.

On a more humble level, the self employed plumber, the two mums who run a catering company, the cake shop owner, the mobile hairdresser, the computer engineer who comes to your house and sorts out your computer issues, the man who has built up a successful software company and now employs 30 people, the couple who run a small hotel, the man who goes from market to market buying and selling second hand books, the man who built up and runs a chain of successful gyms/health clubs; all these can be classed as "businesspeople" or "entrepreneurs".

And what do they all have in common? From what I have seen, they all work incredibly hard, especially in the early years when they are building their business and their customer base. They know there is no short cut to success and that money is not easily come by. They often do not take any money from the business while it is still getting off the ground, and they rarely take time off. They don't boast that they have made £4,000 overnight and so today they are going to the beach or the golf course. They don't splash the cash on expensive cars and watches - at least, not until they are established - and, here's the key point, they all have a tangible product or service with which you can interact. If they run a catering company, they will supply you with cakes and sandwiches, if they run a plumbing business, they will come and unblock your sink, if they own a gym, you can go in there and use the running machine. There is a real product there.

Hustling pensioners and people who don't understand the internet and online advertising for £200 in a hotel room just off the motorway near Hull, Bristol, Manchester or Luton does not make you a businessman or an entrepreneur.

Watching coloured panels on a screen doesn't cut it.

Not in the same league as people who really DO run a business, so don't fool yourselves.

[littleroundman]

Strange as it may seem, there are STILL people on both sides of the fence talking as if parts of the Banners Broker fraud are "real"

Banners Broker says it has signed up 1000 people to its' "Create My Banners" programme, and there are STILL those who continue to discuss the implications of those 1000 memberships.

Why, after all the other lies, anyone would believe ANYTHING that comes out of a HYIP ponzi such as Banners Broker is one of those mysteries that will never be answered.

There's a very good reason why courts require witnesses in court proceedings to repeat: "I swear that the evidence that I shall give, shall be the truth, THE WHOLE TRUTH and nothing but the truth, so help me God"

What "whole truth" about Banners Broker would you be prepared to swear is 100% true (and verifiably so) and, even if it were true, what material difference would said "fact" make to whether or not Banners Broker is or was ever a legitimate business ??

For goodness' sake.

No one knows who the hell REALLY owns the bloody thing, much less who is REALLY pulling the strings or where the money is REALLY ending up.

All anybody knows is what the criminal fraudsters behind the whole scam have told them is the "truth"

[Brenda]

News just in...

We have been advised that as of today, our contract as the Irish Independent Contractor for Stellar Point is terminated.

Banners Broker International and Stellar Point have mutually agreed to end their contract. As a result Stellar Point have concluded all contracts for independent contractors worldwide to handle support and training for Banners Broker.

We are now obliged to cancel all bookings for training at the Cork office effective immediately.

If you have any additional training requirements, please log onto your Banners Broker account and refer to your Dashboard. Here, you will find recorded webinars relating to various aspects of the system, plus the Q&A updates by Chris Smith.

All support queries will now be handled by Banners Broker International. All existing queries have been forwarded and will be processed by the Belize office directly.

If you have any further account related queries please submit a support ticket via your back office. Banners Broker will advise shortly of a worldwide contact number if you wish to speak to customer support.

Although, it is with great regret that we received this news, we would like to thank Banners Broker affiliates for their support over the past two years.

Sincerely,

Maconne Team (( Got A Copy ))

just a few hmmms

did I read correctly that only the other day the same Paul Mc was publicly endosrsing BB on a webinar?

does this mean that he has no more need for the staff in Cork?

does this mean that his only income stream is derived from BB, as I would guess he must have been a big player/ personal introducer ( in other words, none currently)?

as BB has always told affiliates that the income on their laptops was real money, when applying for employment benefit, will the staff who have been presumably recruited their own downlines to increase their own income be advising Social Welfare that they earned the hundreds of thousands on their panels or they say nothing and be just a little failed Cork business? ( of course I already know the answer to this one) Guess Paul wont be drawing down the 10k a month pension they all spoke about, shame.

SP severing the ties so apparently, suddenly, with BB before they even had time to set up a new pretendy 'worldwide' phone number or new contact details! Wonder what ( or who) behind the scenes crisis prompted this?

To be fair to Paulie, he did get a good run at it. As he stated himself, his businesses normally only last 3 to 6 months. :scared_1:

no doubt this was all brought on by those pesky affiliates who should be ashamed of themselves for not believing in Chris though! (!)

[hendyphilhendy]

just a few hmmms


as BB has always told affiliates that the income on their laptops was real money, when applying for employment benefit, will the staff who have been presumably recruited their own downlines to increase their own income be advising Social Welfare that they earned the hundreds of thousands on their panels or they say nothing and be just a little failed Cork business? ( of course I already know the answer to this one) Guess Paul wont be drawing down the 10k a month pension they all spoke about, shame.



That would definitely be an interesting one as I would bet there are a lot of affiliates who still claimed employment benefit and also lots more that never registered for taxes.

I would be interested in seeing some of those tax returns from last year and how they did their accounting

[littleroundman]

I would be interested in seeing some of those tax returns from last year and how they did their accounting

Banners Broker never insisted on any Know Your Customer protocols and encouraged the use of anonymous offshore payment processors, so, I can't imagine there would be much of anything to "see", much less be "interesting"

[Jerrygo]

To be fair to Paulie, he did get a good run at it. As he stated himself, his businesses normally only last 3 to 6 months. :scared_1:
(!)

Well this one lasted a couple of years for Paul. And it has gained him a house extension, a new car, a healthy bank balance, and some nice trips abroad. All at the expense of thousands of scammed "affiliates".
I don't think Irish victims will be inclined to forgive or forget this man. Not easy to hide in Ireland.
He might decide to move somewhere more suitable to his new profession, Canada or Belize perhaps.

[Joe_Shmoe]

I wonder if Chris will bother turning up this week for the scaminar?
Don't seem a lot of point really. :RpS_smile:


I remember that Ash Campbell guy that theguardianuno posted about over on MMG crying about all the money & down line he lost when Zeek got shut down.

Keep on rockin' BB

[Ken Roklin]

Are you certain of that being the reason for the distancing of the 2 arms of the operation Ken?
That was one of the reasons posited by observers, others were that the OSC had demanded or suggested the separation.
Or that this was always the planned scenario, that they would seperate with their gains when the thing started to implode.
Or just that Raj was trying to protect himself at this stage by disassociation.
Have you some inside info? or is it an educated guess?

No payment to SP most certainly is the main reason, as in no money=cannot pay staff=no staff=no SP business. Since Raj paid cash for the building and owns it outright he is trying to build his business with products other than BBI.

The OSC when it does its investigations doesn't make suggestions as to how companies operate. They investigate and if they find anything illegal act on their findings, fine the companies and depending on the case shut them down.

Raj, right from the beginning of this scam tried to protect himself as much as possible. That is why the agreement to use SP for training and support. It is just common sense that when BBI implodes (Chris & Raj both knew it wouldn't last) that they separate and go their own ways. I am sure that Raj got a sizable cheque from Chris when they terminated their agreement.

Some of my comments are derived at using common sense and others from an "insider".

[Ken Roklin]

Well this one lasted a couple of years for Paul. And it has gained him a house extension, a new car, a healthy bank balance, and some nice trips abroad. All at the expense of thousands of scammed "affiliates".
I don't think Irish victims will be inclined to forgive or forget this man. Not easy to hide in Ireland.
He might decide to move somewhere more suitable to his new profession, Canada or Belize perhaps.

You forgot to mention Florida "According to the Florida Department of Law Enforcement, our state is a haven for white collar/financial crime."

Winters are better in Florid than Canada.

[NikSam]

...
Some of my comments are derived at using common sense and others from an "insider".

Where is Your common sense ?

In February 2012 Rajiv Dixit registers name for the company "Bannersbroker Limited" in Toronto.
Chris was a white man back then :)
In July 2012 Rajiv renames that company to "Stellar Point INC." and thats when the name appeared first.

https://www.ic.gc.ca/app/scr/cc/CorporationsCanada/fdrlCrpDtls.html?corpId=7250037&V_TOKEN=1353670012522&crpNm=bannersbroker&crpNmbr=&bsNmbr=


And Black Chris shows up a bit later.

[Jerrygo]

No payment to SP most certainly is the main reason, as in no money=cannot pay staff=no staff=no SP business. Since Raj paid cash for the building and owns it outright he is trying to build his business with products other than BBI.

The OSC when it does its investigations doesn't make suggestions as to how companies operate. They investigate and if they find anything illegal act on their findings, fine the companies and depending on the case shut them down.

Raj, right from the beginning of this scam tried to protect himself as much as possible. That is why the agreement to use SP for training and support. It is just common sense that when BBI implodes (Chris & Raj both knew it wouldn't last) that they separate and go their own ways. I am sure that Raj got a sizable cheque from Chris when they terminated their agreement.

Some of my comments are derived at using common sense and others from an "insider".

Your arguments are circular Ken. You know that Raj is a scammer. You know he started the BB ball rolling. you Know BB is a ponzi. You know that the only reason SP was set up, was to advance and facilitate the recruiting and fleesing of victims for BB. you know that every part of the BB scam was run from SP, and not from the maildrop in IOM or Belieze, and you know that Chris and Raj were collaborators in the scam.
But for some reason you always try to seperate them.
Or is it that you dont believe the OSC or other Canadian authorities will have the forensic expertise or effectiveness to uncover this?
On the buying of the SP building for cash, Does your insider know if that cash was from Raj's personal fortune? or from proceeds of the previous 2 years of BB victims money?

[Ken Roklin]

Where is Your common sense ?

In February 2012 Rajiv Dixit registers name for the company "Bannersbroker Limited" in Toronto.
Chris was a white man back then :)
In July 2012 Rajiv renames that company to "Stellar Point INC." and thats when the name appeared first.

https://www.ic.gc.ca/app/scr/cc/CorporationsCanada/fdrlCrpDtls.html?corpId=7250037&V_TOKEN=1353670012522&crpNm=bannersbroker&crpNmbr=&bsNmbr=


And Black Chris shows up a bit later.

Where is your common sense? This is all old news documented here a long time ago. The photo used was a stock photo. BBI was started before Raj changed the name from a numbered company to Banners Broker and then to SP. I don't believe I stated anywhere anything different. We aren't disagreeing so what is your point?

[Ken Roklin]

Your arguments are circular Ken. You know that Raj is a scammer. You know he started the BB ball rolling. you Know BB is a ponzi. You know that the only reason SP was set up, was to advance and facilitate the recruiting and fleesing of victims for BB. you know that every part of the BB scam was run from SP, and not from the maildrop in IOM or Belieze, and you know that Chris and Raj were collaborators in the scam.
But for some reason you always try to seperate them.
Or is it that you dont believe the OSC or other Canadian authorities will have the forensic expertise or effectiveness to uncover this?
On the buying of the SP building for cash, Does your insider know if that cash was from Raj's personal fortune? or from proceeds of the previous 2 years of BB victims money?

Proverbs 26:4-14 "When arguing with fools, don't answer their foolish argument..."

[Fat City, LA]

Proverbs 26:4-14 "When arguing with fools, don't answer their foolish argument..."

So...your right an everyone else who thinks your an imbecile...is an imbecile?

[Eponymous]

Great news everyone!

Banners Broker – $100,000 Total Earnings Achieved (http://billwillmott.com/banners-broker-100000-total-earnings-achieved/)

[Joe_Shmoe]

Great news everyone!

Banners Broker – $100,000 Total Earnings Achieved (http://billwillmott.com/banners-broker-100000-total-earnings-achieved/)

Yeah? Great Bill. Good luck with that. Where do I sign up? :RpS_lol::RpS_lol::RpS_lol:

[NikSam]

...
BBI was started before Raj changed the name from a numbered company to Banners Broker and then to SP. I don't believe I stated anywhere anything different. We aren't disagreeing so what is your point?

Who cares, whatever was registered in Isle of man,it is not a company, just a shell to hide the scam under.
My point is we have 2 serial scammers behind this scam Kul and Raj + new Chris.
IF SP was just a support company with some other clients etc, why would Raj even name it Banners Broker in the past ? Do you think Raj became a honest man and can only run the "support" for a scam?
Why do you think that Raj has some other clients with SP ? all those crapy clients were faked by him as well.
Why do you think that Chris is somehow important in all of this and not just a fall guy ?

so stop all that nonsense about 2 companies, it is group of scammers working together,
and that myth how SP is not really involved was made for the gullible.
Raj trying to save his ass, no more than that. You see , if Raj manages to prove that SP was only offering services to BBI and not a solicitor itself, OSC has no case against him and SP.


We have a group of several identified scammers, each of them is guilty, does it matter who of them registered some company somewhere and what for ?

I wonder why you trying to listen to their lies, analyze it and repeat as if you really believe them.

they are scammers, what they say on any point is mostly a lie, we can only see what is really going on by looking at verifiable facts or wait for court records.

[Jerrygo]

Yeah? Great Bill. Good luck with that. Where do I sign up? :RpS_lol::RpS_lol::RpS_lol:

Dont think Paul can take your application Joe.
5554

[Newto]

if Raj manages to prove that SP was only offering services to BBI and not a solicitor itself, OSC has no case against him and SP.

How you think he can "prove" that to the OSC if it takes ordinary people like me half an hour digging to find the facts?

[Jerrygo]

Reports on mmg of an affiliate mutiny on talkingbb forum, after hearing todays webinar.

[Ken Roklin]

Who cares, whatever was registered in Isle of man,it is not a company, just a shell to hide the scam under.
My point is we have 2 serial scammers behind this scam Kul and Raj + new Chris.
IF SP was just a support company with some other clients etc, why would Raj even name it Banners Broker in the past ? Do you think Raj became a honest man and can only run the "support" for a scam?
Why do you think that Raj has some other clients with SP ? all those crapy clients were faked by him as well.
Why do you think that Chris is somehow important in all of this and not just a fall guy ?

so stop all that nonsense about 2 companies, it is group of scammers working together,
and that myth how SP is not really involved was made for the gullible.
Raj trying to save his ass, no more than that. You see , if Raj manages to prove that SP was only offering services to BBI and not a solicitor itself, OSC has no case against him and SP.


We have a group of several identified scammers, each of them is guilty, does it matter who of them registered some company somewhere and what for ?

I wonder why you trying to listen to their lies, analyze it and repeat as if you really believe them.

they are scammers, what they say on any point is mostly a lie, we can only see what is really going on by looking at verifiable facts or wait for court records.

I think the only thing we disagree on is the fact that BBI and SP are two different legal companies. Does it matter? No, but it is a fact and something you have a problem with.

I have stated over and over again that Raj was as big a part of the Ponzi as Chris was. All the promoters are also as guilty as Raj and Chris of promoting a scam.

[EagleOne]

I think the only thing we disagree on is the fact that BBI and SP are two different legal companies. Does it matter? No, but it is a fact and something you have a problem with.

I have stated over and over again that Raj was as big a part of the Ponzi as Chris was. All the promoters are also as guilty as Raj and Chris of promoting a scam.

What do you mean they are two "legal" companies? They are both Ponzi's, both of them. Just because they registered the company names does not make them legal.

[NikSam]

How you think he can "prove" that to the OSC if it takes ordinary people like me half an hour digging to find the facts?

In canada, a lot possible, the only hope that some investigator at OSC is a real professional and will spend some time to look deeper and analyze things.
And canadians record is not great in that.

[waverider]

What do you mean they are two "legal" companies? They are both Ponzi's, both of them. Just because they registered the company names does not make them legal.

I think he meant 'legally registered'- you can be fully, legally and properly registered and still be running an illegal business...

Interesting how BB has chosen to 'headquarter itself' back in Belize, add to this that Vector was an offshoot of Capital First Bank (of Belize City).
For those of you who aren't aware of this, Belize is an offshore tax haven, similar to that in the Bahamas, Panama and elsewhere, though it's not as well developed as in those areas.
The same rules and warnings apply in Belize as elsewhere, there's no guarantee of complete secrecy in today's age of cybercrime, terrorism and money laundering, but Belize not being as developed as the Bahamas or Cayman Islands, it takes a bit more effort to wind up a company, or break the secrecy veil legally.

Zeek was shut down, weren't they domiciled in Canada? Wouldn't be so easy to shut them down if their HQ was in Belize or the Cayman Islands ....

The long arm of the law might want to take a closer look at all those payment processors like Payza, STP, etc - who is behind them. What's the probability of money laundering, funding terrorist operations, being done through processors such as those... ?

[Ken Roklin]

What do you mean they are two "legal" companies? They are both Ponzi's, both of them. Just because they registered the company names does not make them legal.

My bad. What I meant was legally incorporated companies, not companies operating a legal business.

[littleroundman]

"Legally registered corporation" is a term that has been used by HYIP ponzi fraudsters since the days of Charles Ponzi to fool naive victims into believing there is legitimacy attached to the fraud du jour

Registering a corporation on the Isle of Man costs next to nothing:

http://imageshack.us/a/img9/1867/ybc1.jpg

Isle of Man Government (http://www.gov.im/lib/docs/ded/companies/companiesReg/companiesregistryfees.pdf)

and can be done from the comfort of the applicants' desk:

http://imageshack.us/a/img854/8735/z4o5.jpg

Offshore Company Experts website (http://www.offshorecompanyexperts.com/en/offshorecompany/isle-of-man-offshorecompany.html)

The average man in the street sees"Legally registered corporation" and immediately thinks a legal company wouldn't be involved with something fraudulent

It should be remembered, HYIP ponzi fraudsters don't want people who ask too many questions.

They want people who see "Legally registered corporation" and immediately think the business is legitimate their money is safe

Sure, Banners Broker may have been a "Legally registered Isle of Man corporation" at one time.

BUT, what does that actually mean ??

What protection for members does that provide ??

Does it make it any easier for them to reclaim their losses ??

[Ken Roklin]

I think he meant 'legally registered'- you can be fully, legally and properly registered and still be running an illegal business...

Interesting how BB has chosen to 'headquarter itself' back in Belize, add to this that Vector was an offshoot of Capital First Bank (of Belize City).
For those of you who aren't aware of this, Belize is an offshore tax haven, similar to that in the Bahamas, Panama and elsewhere, though it's not as well developed as in those areas.
The same rules and warnings apply in Belize as elsewhere, there's no guarantee of complete secrecy in today's age of cybercrime, terrorism and money laundering, but Belize not being as developed as the Bahamas or Cayman Islands, it takes a bit more effort to wind up a company, or break the secrecy veil legally.

Zeek was shut down, weren't they domiciled in Canada? Wouldn't be so easy to shut them down if their HQ was in Belize or the Cayman Islands ....

The long arm of the law might want to take a closer look at all those payment processors like Payza, STP, etc - who is behind them. What's the probability of money laundering, funding terrorist operations, being done through processors such as those... ?

I believe Zeek was headquartered in Lexington, Kentucky.

I agree that the authorities should look at all these payment processors as the only clients the likes of STP, Payza have are HYIP's. If promoting a Ponzi is a crime then the payment processors who process their money should also be charged with assisting and promoting a Ponzi scheme and dealt with accordingly.

If it weren't for these PPs the number of HYIPs would be greatly reduced.

[EagleOne]

I believe Zeek was headquartered in Lexington, Kentucky.

I agree that the authorities should look at all these payment processors as the only clients the likes of STP, Payza have are HYIP's. If promoting a Ponzi is a crime then the payment processors who process their money should also be charged with assisting and promoting a Ponzi scheme and dealt with accordingly.

If it weren't for these PPs the number of HYIPs would be greatly reduced.

Zeek was located in Lexington, North Carolina

[okosh]

I believe Zeek was headquartered in Lexington, Kentucky.

I agree that the authorities should look at all these payment processors as the only clients the likes of STP, Payza have are HYIP's. If promoting a Ponzi is a crime then the payment processors who process their money should also be charged with assisting and promoting a Ponzi scheme and dealt with accordingly.

If it weren't for these PPs the number of HYIPs would be greatly reduced.

You may want to google LibertyReserve....E-Gold....E-Bullion.....And Stormpay....

[littleroundman]

If it weren't for these PPs the number of HYIPs would be greatly reduced.

They probably would - temporarily at least.

The main problem is, here in the real world, anonymous payment processors continue to exist.

It is yet another reason why forums such as REALSCAM.com (http://www.realscam.com) continue to exist and continue to warn readers that anonymous payment processors are generally NOT safe, are NOT secure and there is NO chance of rebates or refunds.

You can lead a horse to water, and all that.

[Della Cate]

This is over at MMG (thanks again to Rooneyfenomeno)

Friday Q and A and Updates, August 16, 2013

Fraser
Welcome to the call. I apologise for the delay, we've had some technical issues today hand over to Chris

Chris
A few updates about our support situation. BB started 2010 with just a couple of in-house individuals who handled support. Then we had a need to use a management company, Stellar-Point, to take on the support of BB because it grew so fast. In 2012 we had situations with the system and needed a large amount of support. We had 90 people, for different back office areas including ticketing and live chat. We know the importance of support. Over time, we have reduced the amount of people on board. As we gave our support personnel more tools to fix problems. These tools were very expensive and they will transfer to BBv3. In recent months, we further reduced the staff as there was no need for them. We have also been trying to tighten our belts and make sure that all the corporate spending is necessary. We have also cut down on the world tours. That brings us to the next phase. We are going to put support in house (Belize office). The BB and SP contract has come to an end. There are now new people being properly trained within the Belize office and we are trying to increase the speed of getting answers to you. Please continue to submit your support questions.

Independent Contractors (IC's). BB does not have any offices worldwide. The IC's had their own offices and their contract was with SP. Therefore, the IC's will no longer handle support for BB. In the future we may look at the situation with IC's again.

Pay-outs: I've received feedback from leaders' that they would like to see when payouts happen. More visibility. We will be looking at that.

Version 3 will make sure that BB lives on. There will be activities for the affiliates to do, such as: Surveys, videos, helping other advertising agencies. We will be part of the advertising channel.

Mark: We've been through some trying times. Patience is wearing thin with some affiliates. Be rest assured that BB is making great strides to put things in place. Not only does Chris have the plan, we are coming up to four of the biggest months of the year for advertising. With this and all the new changes with V3, it will make a big difference. We are in a situation where all of us are in this together. We can sit and point fingers and get into that negative mode of thinking. All of the affiliates need to come together. There are 3 or 4 negative bloggers doing damage. There are 400,000 of us and if we focus our energy as a united front, think of what we could do. Chris is still there, he's not hiding. This company is strong, we will come out winners. The problem is not the problem, it's your attitude that's the problem.

There were a couple of questions about pay-outs. Fraser explained that the only person who could answer those questions was Chris himself who had left the webinar to go to a meeting.

So, hmm, let me see....

They are sacking staff;
Affiliates are still not getting paid;
But BB will live on........in future affiliates will have to do more, like videos and surveys (??what??)
And if all else fails, remember "the problem is not the problem, it's your attitude that is the problem" - BRILLIANT!

Now come on, devoted BB followers - if any of you remain - does this sound like a company that is soundly based and in it for the long haul? Or does it sound like a venture that has failed?

[Della Cate]

Reports on mmg of an affiliate mutiny on talkingbb forum, after hearing todays webinar.

Yes, someone called "Grassy Knollington" has posted some quotes.

Banners Broker - bannersbroker.com (http://www.moneymakergroup.com/Banners-Broker-bannersb-t360913.html&st=10665)

Post number 10670. Worth a read, if you have time and inclination. People are moaning like mad. I especially liked the moderator's (Is that Ian Sherriff? - not sure) response:

QUOTE
This topic is running away from the forum purpose and rules.


Many of you have made it clear in the topic that you have no respect for the way we run it or for the integrity of the forum staff.
Many of you are taking yet another occasion to slam what we do here and why we do it.
As there is no information to impart at this time anyway and while I am considering how to respond directly to the points raised the forum is going to take a short break.

To be honest I am too angry and frustrated to trust what I will write at the moment..........................but doing nothing will allow the forum to break my No1 rule

" I will not allow the forum to become a source of harm to BB or to my business"


FORUM LOCKED DOWN!

I especially like the way his concern was for any possible harm that might be done to " BB or MY BUSINESS". Lots of concern for the affiliates then. Lovely.

[littleroundman]

QUOTE
This topic is running away from the forum purpose and rules.

" I will not allow the forum to become a source of harm to BB or to my business"


FORUM LOCKED DOWN!



http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/1151/5gum.jpg

[HARRISON]

...just a little reminder of Jo Spencers posts on her facebook page BB DEALER:

5555

[Jerrygo]

Its hard not to have a great sense of satisfaction now, in the decline of the bb scam.
Chris and Raj scrabbling with their head down, trying to cover their tracks. Deleting their twitter accounts, closing all offices, cancelling all ic's contracts, and dumping them. Trying to fake a seperation between SP and BB.
Heartening to see even the talkingbb sheeple in open revolt, and to see former cheerleaders regognising now that is is a ponzi, and is in terminal decline.
we will never again see Raj and Chris on a triumphant world tour, arrogantly pushing their "new google" to a sea of grey haired victims.
The pushers such as Paul McCarthy, who had not been known for scams before, will bear the stigma of BB fraud, and that blemish will always be attatched to them now.

Karma.

[Jerrygo]

Report on mmg that Anonymous hit TalkingBB last night

[Mundorf]

This is over at MMG (thanks again to Rooneyfenomeno)

Friday Q and A and Updates, August 16, 2013

Fraser
Welcome to the call. I apologise for the delay, we've had some technical issues today hand over to Chris

Chris
A few updates about our support situation. BB started 2010 with just a couple of in-house individuals who handled support. Then we had a need to use a management company, Stellar-Point, to take on the support of BB because it grew so fast. In 2012 we had situations with the system and needed a large amount of support. We had 90 people, for different back office areas including ticketing and live chat. We know the importance of support. Over time, we have reduced the amount of people on board. As we gave our support personnel more tools to fix problems. These tools were very expensive and they will transfer to BBv3. In recent months, we further reduced the staff as there was no need for them. We have also been trying to tighten our belts and make sure that all the corporate spending is necessary. We have also cut down on the world tours. That brings us to the next phase. We are going to put support in house (Belize office). The BB and SP contract has come to an end. There are now new people being properly trained within the Belize office and we are trying to increase the speed of getting answers to you. Please continue to submit your support questions.

Independent Contractors (IC's). BB does not have any offices worldwide. The IC's had their own offices and their contract was with SP. Therefore, the IC's will no longer handle support for BB. In the future we may look at the situation with IC's again.

Pay-outs: I've received feedback from leaders' that they would like to see when payouts happen. More visibility. We will be looking at that.

Version 3 will make sure that BB lives on. There will be activities for the affiliates to do, such as: Surveys, videos, helping other advertising agencies. We will be part of the advertising channel.

Mark: We've been through some trying times. Patience is wearing thin with some affiliates. Be rest assured that BB is making great strides to put things in place. Not only does Chris have the plan, we are coming up to four of the biggest months of the year for advertising. With this and all the new changes with V3, it will make a big difference. We are in a situation where all of us are in this together. We can sit and point fingers and get into that negative mode of thinking. All of the affiliates need to come together. There are 3 or 4 negative bloggers doing damage. There are 400,000 of us and if we focus our energy as a united front, think of what we could do. Chris is still there, he's not hiding. This company is strong, we will come out winners. The problem is not the problem, it's your attitude that's the problem.

There were a couple of questions about pay-outs. Fraser explained that the only person who could answer those questions was Chris himself who had left the webinar to go to a meeting.

So, hmm, let me see....

They are sacking staff;
Affiliates are still not getting paid;
But BB will live on........in future affiliates will have to do more, like videos and surveys (??what??)
And if all else fails, remember "the problem is not the problem, it's your attitude that is the problem" - BRILLIANT!

Now come on, devoted BB followers - if any of you remain - does this sound like a company that is soundly based and in it for the long haul? Or does it sound like a venture that has failed?

"There are 400,000 of us and if we focus our energy as a united front, think of what we could do".....what energy?...doing what?..swimming,running,jogging?..what other knowledge the united front has??...what could united front do really?..except taking a walk,ride or going in fitness room?...what do the real companies? - they sent people for occupational retraining...does Chris even care how looks the structure of knowledge the united front has?..the front that has learned and is trained to wait for miracles to happen..the front that is educated not to think with it's own head but rather to wait some wonder resolves all the problems...and now the army that wears only tshirts should reise over new horizons??..besides united front is one more dodge - numbers on the paper,in reality they all gone

[Joe_Shmoe]

Report on mmg that Anonymous hit TalkingBB last night

Perfect excuse for Iain & his gang of idiots to shut down TalkingBB. Surely it serves no purpose for these scammers anymore.

[Jerrygo]

Perfect excuse for Iain & his gang of idiots to shut down TalkingBB. Surely it serves no purpose for these scammers anymore.

Well he is banned from his own forum now LoL. The last believers will have nowhere to bolster each others fantasies now. Wonder who will be next on their list?

[Beethoven]

Well he is banned from his own forum now LoL. The last believers will have nowhere to bolster each others fantasies now. Wonder who will be next on their list?


The fact that at this point there are STILL people who REALLY WANT to believe that this dying Ponzi will make them rich if some small technical fixes are applied just beggars belief!

Example from Talking BB forum: "I don't want to sound negative, but......"

Priceless!

Face it people this is the endgame. There is NO business, never was.

You really couldn't make this stuff up. :duh:

[EagleOne]

I said this at MMG, here and a few other forum blogs back in January that BB died right after the big Christmas payout. The only problem was the members didn't know it, and didn't want to believe me. Not a big deal because they never want to believe me.

It is hard to get someone to accept the fact that they got duped, cheated, and their money stolen in a Ponzi. It is human nature to want to "believe," and we trick ourselves into believing the last strands of hope things will turn around and get better.

Now the whining, crying and anger will begin in earnest, but they are not going to praise any of us for warning them about BB being a Ponzi. In fact we will be the ones they blame the most while they are in the denial and anger stages.

The one statistic that sadly holds true is this one: There will be at least one suicide from someone involved in their Ponzi going bust; and that is the good news. Many times it is many more. I know of a few Ponzi's that there were five people who commited suicide.

There are going to be a lot of hurting people from BB's demise, and don't take offense when they lash out at you and are blaming you for BB crashing. All of us who have seen these events happen for a decade or longer have been hinting at the things to come to help prepare you for what is coming next. It is not going to be pretty, and like it or not, we are all going to be in the center of the firestorm that is coming; and be blamed for it. It is not the time for the "I told you so," even though we have been telling them for almost two years now.

My only reason for saying this is that I know some of you have friends in this that you have tried to warn them and they didn't listen. Support them in their time of need by just being there for them as a friend. They feel bad enough without you reminding them you were smarter than them. Just speaking from years of experience and seeing friendships destroyed over these matters because of ego's. For what it's worth.

[Della Cate]

Report on mmg that Anonymous hit TalkingBB last night

Forgive me for being dim, but who or what is Anonymous? Oh wait, is it a hacker's group?

[Jerrygo]

Forgive me for being dim, but who or what is Anonymous? Oh wait, is it a hacker's group?

Wikipedia anonymous (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anonymous_(group))

[Della Cate]

Wikipedia anonymous (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anonymous_(group))

Aha.

Thank you!

[path2prosperity]

Wikipedia anonymous (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anonymous_(group))

Very interesting indeed. Many thanks for this information. Excellent material for bloggers targeting off line groups. Bookmarked link.

[Julie Diligent]

It is hard to get someone to accept the fact that they got duped, cheated, and their money stolen in a Ponzi. It is human nature to want to "believe," and we trick ourselves into believing the last strands of hope things will turn around and get better.
http://d202m5krfqbpi5.cloudfront.net/authors/1322103868p2/1244.jpg (http://www.goodreads.com/author/show/1244.Mark_Twain) “It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled.” - Mark Twain

[Della Cate]

And according to the Guardianuno over on MMG (thanks G!) some people are STILL trying to recruit others into BB....see quotation below:-

BB Changing people’s lives around the world!
Date: Thursday 15th August 2013
Please note this is a PRIVATE presentation for anyone in Paul Sweeney's team only!
Do not promote this event to any channels or people outside this team they will not be allowed in.

ALL NEW GUESTS WELCOME!!!
Registration: 7pm
Presentation: 7.30pm prompt start
Guest speaker: Duncan Wood
Top Income Earner!!!
Following the presentation receive training tips from Duncan with tips on how to explode your business !!
Venue
Guildford Golf Club
High Path Road, Merrow, Guildford, Surrey GU1 2HL

Guests FREE
BB affiliates just £5 on the door to cover room hire.


Please prior to the event :- Please call Paul Sweeney on 07932 172 020 or email paul@sweeneyuk.com to book your place.

[Della Cate]

The Guardianuno has also posted an interesting email from Richard Maude, another BB-er. It's quite a long post, so I won't reporduce it here, but here is the link - look for posting number 10684:-

Banners Broker - bannersbroker.com (http://www.moneymakergroup.com/Banners-Broker-bannersb-t360913.html&st=10680)

In it, he berates people in his "team" for failing to manage their BB accounts. Here are a couple of extracts that will give a flavour:-

I can only assume that if you have stopped managing your BB account then you have done so simply because BB are currently not paying us and therefore believe that they will never pay us. With this in mind, I have to ask you...what actual business facts have you based that decision on??

Nothing in life is for certain but when I look at any business situation, I take out the emotion and look at the facts as they present themselves and this helps to minimise the risk of making bad decisions.

Yes BB aren’t paying us but we know the reason. They had a perfectly legitimate payment solution in the BB MasterCard but thanks to the bloggers, the card was suddenly taken away without any notice. If the BB card was still in place we would have all been paid by now...fact. Was the fact that the card was taken away BB’s fault? No it wasn’t and the CEO of Vector cards fought tooth and nail with MasterCard to get BB reinstated because they had done their in depth due diligence on BB and were 100% satisfied that BB are 100% genuine and that the decision of MasterCard was an incorrect one.


And again:-

Some of you may be thinking that they are not going to launch a payment solution. Well if you think this then you are assuming that Chris Smith and the others are simply massive fraudsters. Well again, nothing is for certain but is that really likely? They had a legitimate payment solution previously so why not get a new one? And why spend a fortune on launching BB version 3.0? If they don’t pay anyone then they don’t have a business so why do that??

I don't think there is anything I can usefully add to the above!

[hendyphilhendy]

Apparently the latest on the dashboard. The blind network (remember, the core to their alleged business) is no more.

Only choice network (the laughable sites) campaigns can now be set up.

I wonder how Iain and his gang will spin this one!



Blind NetWork Campaigns

August 16, 2013, 1:23 pm

As of Friday August 16th at 4pm EST, we will be de-activating the Blind Network Campaigns. The Blind Network will be de-activated for the time being. We are developing a more robust advertising system to meet your advertising needs. For information will be provided when available.
Please Note: All unused impressions will be returned to your impression bank.
Thank you for your continued patience.

[kiwichick]

This may be a silly question but has anyone contacted mastercard themselves for their position.
I called their american head office back in about Oct 2012 and there was some discussion way back in this thread about mastercard endorsements....so we all know that mastercard received some helpful suggestions from concerned people back then :-) which has prompted mastercard to look in to bb.......these helpful suggestions to action were successful, obviously because mastercard ditched bb......well done you know who you are:-) ..............

HOWEVER, BB is still using the brand 'mastercard' to enhance their reputation........by blaming bloggers and saying that mastercard was 'sweet as' (great kiwi saying) with bb/vector as a company until negative blogging.........bb is STILL CLAIMING MASTERCARD endorsement ..........but now that us 'nasty bloggers' are seen as having superpowers enough to 'make' mastercard do this, rather than mastercard not wanting to be a part of a scam's money laundering processess????....really affiliates ? really????:throw_computer:
anyways I digress....., I am thinking those same helpful people might want to alert mastercard to this 'business' using their brand in such a filthy way.....I think it is time they issued some form of press release maybe??? something to give the public mastercard's stance on "being happy to deal with bb/vector until blogging put them off" as opposed to a 'real' reason why a company as large as mastercard (a 'real' business) would discontinue business with bb/vector (a multimillioin dollar (!)'real' business?), no!!...no no no affiliates, no they probably don't make their business decision this way:pulling_hair_out:
The ONE THING bb has right is that Mastercard is unlikely to let the "3 or 4 negative bloggers out there ruin it for 400,000 bb affilates"...absolutely they are not !! multi millions?? think mastercard would probe a little deeper than that before deciding to ditch this bb they think is so freakin amazing? So can have mastercard issue an official statement?
I am quite confident that mastercard international will in fact have a ceo, he may be black or he may be white but she or he will be real, I am also quite confident mastercard international will also have some form of 'head of compliance' who will also be real and GOOD at their job (for a real company) so are thus able to and may actually want to make an official statement rather than blog back at us here.............again affiliates really??? really?
just some thoughts and wondering if this type of action may allow some of the victims to 'accept' this is a scam in time to action a chargeback
Kiwi chick

[kiwichick]

Also...are there any others reading this forum from New Zealand? If so I would appreciate you messaging me.....
and..............
can anyone tell me if there is a way to pursue those who boast that they have withdrawan the money they put in many mnay many many times over while promoting bb ........which is very definately NOT "sweet as" at all...kiwi

[littleroundman]

If Mastercard (or any credit card company) had to go after every low life associating its' name with their particular fraud, it would cost them millions of dollars and billions of staff hours.

Without a full criminal investigation, there is no guarantee they would be able to find out exactly who is behind the fraud.

Even then, if someone has just ripped off several hundred thousand people for several million dollars, it's highly unlikely they are going to be worried about Mastercard telling them to stop using its' name, much less have the Mastercard name removed from the thousands of blog sites repeating the lies started by the original fraudsters.

[NikSam]

there was another reason for MC dropping cards, Vector Card Services (Nevada corp.) was a dissolved company at time when they issued cards and was never authorized by MC to print cards.
The underwriter for those cards was Choice Bank of Belize (almost every questionable online site uses that Bank for debit cards) if Choice bank did employ some company (Vector) to produce the cards they had to make sure that
company is on the approved MC vendor list and Vector was not, never had any license and in fact was officially dissolved company.

MC is refusing to give an official statement. If they do will make them look bad that they let it happen.


there was no fault of BB or bloggers for the end of those cards, BB noise just made MC to discover Vector.

[littleroundman]

The Guardianuno has also posted an interesting email from Richard Maude, another BB-er. It's quite a long post, so I won't reporduce it here, but here is the link - look for posting number 10684:-

Banners Broker - bannersbroker.com (http://www.moneymakergroup.com/Banners-Broker-bannersb-t360913.html&st=10680)

In it, he berates people in his "team" for failing to manage their BB accounts. Here are a couple of extracts that will give a flavour:-

I can only assume that if you have stopped managing your BB account then you have done so simply because BB are currently not paying us and therefore believe that they will never pay us. With this in mind, I have to ask you...what actual business facts have you based that decision on??

Nothing in life is for certain but when I look at any business situation, I take out the emotion and look at the facts as they present themselves and this helps to minimise the risk of making bad decisions.

Yes BB aren’t paying us but we know the reason. They had a perfectly legitimate payment solution in the BB MasterCard but thanks to the bloggers, the card was suddenly taken away without any notice. If the BB card was still in place we would have all been paid by now...fact. Was the fact that the card was taken away BB’s fault? No it wasn’t and the CEO of Vector cards fought tooth and nail with MasterCard to get BB reinstated because they had done their in depth due diligence on BB and were 100% satisfied that BB are 100% genuine and that the decision of MasterCard was an incorrect one.


And again:-

Some of you may be thinking that they are not going to launch a payment solution. Well if you think this then you are assuming that Chris Smith and the others are simply massive fraudsters. Well again, nothing is for certain but is that really likely? They had a legitimate payment solution previously so why not get a new one? And why spend a fortune on launching BB version 3.0? If they don’t pay anyone then they don’t have a business so why do that??

I don't think there is anything I can usefully add to the above!

Poor ol' Richard Maude.

He's either the worlds' biggest HYIP ponzi pimp or he's swallowed so much Kool-Aide his common-sense-ometer has been flushed down the toilet.

All it takes is "Chris Smith said" or "Banners Broker management said" and Richard takes it as being a "fact" or "proof"

I can't imagine any fraudster coming out and saying "we have only taken a six month lease on our new offices, because we don't expect to be around any longer than that"

Just as I can't imagine a situation where someone keeps running a multi million dollar fraud for ten years because he doesn't want to break his lease.

Yet, here we have poor Richard Maude trumpeting the fact Banners Broker "SAID" they took a ten year lease on Salford Keys as being some sort of proof it will be here "for the long run"

Richard apparently STILL lives in a world where if Chris Smith says it, then it must be true.

Some people really ARE easy to fool.

[kiwichick]

If Mastercard (or any credit card company) had to go after every low life associating its' name with their particular fraud, it would cost them millions of dollars and billions of staff hours.

Without a full criminal investigation, there is no guarantee they would be able to find out exactly who is behind the fraud.

Even then, if someone has just ripped off several hundred thousand people for several million dollars, it's highly unlikely they are going to be worried about Mastercard telling them to stop using its' name, much less have the Mastercard name removed from the thousands of blog sites repeating the lies started by the original fraudsters.

I wasn't meaning mastercard go after bb, nor if bb would care, i was meaning that an official statement from mastercard would allow those who are naive something outside of bb to support those of us who try to warn others

[kiwichick]

there was another reason for MC dropping cards, Vector Card Services (Nevada corp.) was a dissolved company at time when they issued cards and was never authorized by MC to print cards.
The underwriter for those cards was Choice Bank of Belize (almost every questionable online site uses that Bank for debit cards) if Choice bank did employ some company (Vector) to produce the cards they had to make sure that
company is on the approved MC vendor list and Vector was not, never had any license and in fact was officially dissolved company.

MC is refusing to give an official statement. If they do will make them look bad that they let it happen.


there was no fault of BB or bloggers for the end of those cards, BB noise just made MC to discover Vector.

Hi thanks for that, yes i realise bloggers had nothing to do with it, that was my point, to have something written by ms for the die hard believers, to try and protect some victims, anyways thanks for your response...........yes that does make sense that ms would want to keep that 'slip up' to themselves.....but has anyone asked them though, they may want to distance themselves if their own ms customers became distressed about the constant referring by bb...

[Jerrygo]

Well we are all misfits and spoilers, from the dark side. According to Iain Sherrif. Here his statement on his regained talkingbb forum.


"TalkingBB was hacked at 01.30 UK time 17/08/2013.

The forum staff have located the hacker account and the IP's used. This attack was a response to my posts (reproduced below) regarding behaviour on the forum under the present situation.


01/08/2013

It defies logic that people here cannot realise the knife edge position of BB, or any business would be in BB's position at this time, when faced with hurdles it has. I have always assumed (wrongly I know with hindsight) that all TBB members want BB to fall to the right side of the knife as time goes.

TBB is a good, probably the best, source of qualified information that exists. It can be that without discussion BUT that's not what the forum staff want it to be.
The forum rules are carefully placed to allow open discussion WITHOUT the forum being a harm to BB or to our own Affiliates businesses.
The rules will continue to be enforced and, though regrettable, if people don't want to follow them we prefer that they go somewhere else.

I will NOT allow TBB to be a source of harm. If it goes that way I would prefer to see all discussion removed and it become a pure source of information. The options would to be clamp down to an extent where the forum looses credibility or simply to close it all together. That would not be my decision but it would be a decision I would support given the wrong circumstances.


17/08/2013

It doesn't seem to matter how many times I (I'm not going to presume to speak for the other forum staff) say such as the post above from a few weeks ago it makes no difference.
No matter how many times I say/acknowledge that there are problem at this time : and that communication is crap : that we run the forum the way we do for a reason and that will NOT change it makes no difference.

To me today's webinar was crap, absolutely useless, complete waste of time. Yesterday's leaders call was good. I was very pleased to hear that I don't have to help support Stellar Point anymore. Today's webinar confirmed this information so it should have been good for you.

You should all know by now that payment information is going to come when it comes. Saying the same things about payments week after week is pointless and achieves nothing............both Chris and Affiliates!! The foundation precept of the forum means that the forum as a body will (until PROOF is given to the contrary) continue to believe that Chris is doing the best for us that he can, on payments as well as everything else.
Chris HAS to say something about payments because he would be castigated more for saying nothing. We do not HAVE to say anything.

It has been said quite a few times here, in webinars and in leader's calls that it time to "put up or shut up" or "draw a line in the sand", however it has been said the meaning is the same.................................

BB has issues. Affiliates have issues with BB.
If you don't believe the issues will be resolved because BB is real and Chris will find way it is time to accept that as fact and move on. I make no personal comment on whether that is right/acceptable or not but it is fact as far as my position within TBB is concerned.


I'll say again, TBB is here to help BB Affiliates achieve success with there BB businesses. It is NOT here to help Affiliates find a way to do anything else. Any Affiliate who does not believe BB and Chris has their best interests at heart and is trying to make this work does not see a future for their BB business and therefore does not need help from TBB any more.

I'm not going to go over this again in another few weeks. so..........

Take this as final advice.

Think about how you write what you post.
TBB will no longer accept posts written in a way that shows the poster knows they should not be posting what they are about to.
TBB will no longer accept posts written in a way that are purposely written to have double meaning as a way of disguising what the poster really thinks. We WILL assume the worst and act accordingly.
TBB will no longer accept posts trying to blame the forum rules for causing misinformation.

The forum HAS drawn a line in the sand. There will continue to be problems and issues for some time yet and if forum members can't accept that AND remain within the forum rules they need to move elsewhere.

There is plenty of free good forum software available to start another if you want to "speak more freely". I will help (with advice) setup another if that is what is wanted tho I will take no part in running it.

I am writing this post as me, Iain Sherriff. The rest of the forum staff may not agree with my feeling and position on the future. Any of the staff have the ability to delete this or to post their own views. I know and accept that this is not my forum, it is OUR forum that Paul continues to provide for our use. I have no more to say on this, it's been done to death as far as I am concerned.
I hope I have made my position clear.






This is my opinion based on the facts that I know. You need to decide for yourself wether I am right or not. I know the darkside will copy and post this and use extracts to twist my meaning. If they don't have any facts to twist they will stuff up anyway.........I don't care anymore. Time will show them to be a bunch of inconsequential missfits and spoilers.


All right thinking people know how devious and twisted the minds of these poor souls are. TalkingBB has always been a place were open discussion can be made UNDER THE PREVAILING CONDITIONS. TalkingBB is part of civilised society and all civilised societies have rules and conditions in place so they remain civilised."

[Ken Roklin]

there was another reason for MC dropping cards, Vector Card Services (Nevada corp.) was a dissolved company at time when they issued cards and was never authorized by MC to print cards.
The underwriter for those cards was Choice Bank of Belize (almost every questionable online site uses that Bank for debit cards) if Choice bank did employ some company (Vector) to produce the cards they had to make sure that
company is on the approved MC vendor list and Vector was not, never had any license and in fact was officially dissolved company.

MC is refusing to give an official statement. If they do will make them look bad that they let it happen.


there was no fault of BB or bloggers for the end of those cards, BB noise just made MC to discover Vector.

Unless I am mistaken, Vector Card Services just dissolved their US branch. They are headquartered in Oakville, Ontario and are still in business. Vector was started just prior to BBI and BBI was their first client and I am sure was started just to be BB's payment processor. Since the MC fiasco, Vector has removed any reference to MC and the Choice Bank from their website. Their partner now for pre-paid card services is a company called "i2c Inc." Looking at i2C we find that one of their partners is The Choice Bank in Belize.

Now, what are the chances that Chris has done a deal with Vector and i2C for their new payment processor. I'd say pretty good.

[NikSam]

Unless I am mistaken, Vector Card Services just dissolved their US branch. They are headquartered in Oakville, Ontario and are still in business. Vector was started just prior to BBI and BBI was their first client and I am sure was started just to be BB's payment processor. Since the MC fiasco, Vector has removed any reference to MC and the Choice Bank from their website. Their partner now for pre-paid card services is a company called "i2c Inc." Looking at i2C we find that one of their partners is The Choice Bank in Belize.

Now, what are the chances that Chris has done a deal with Vector and i2C for their new payment processor. I'd say pretty good.

If Vector was ever registered in Canada please let me know a company number,
as far as i know they were only registered in Nevada and nowhere else, BB cards were also mailed from Las Vegas, Nevada, in any case neither of those are on authorized MC service providers.

I2C is just electronic service to link it all together, Vector was always using them, just an accounting link between Vector and the Choice bank.


And yes Vector and BB are closely married, but Raj is a key in that deal, not Chris.

[littleroundman]

(until PROOF is given to the contrary)

When you think about it, whoever is really behind Banners Broker would have to be pretty stupid fraudsters if "proof" was so easy to find a bunch of amateurs on an internet discussion forum could do it.

If it comes to "proof" I wonder what absolute "proof" Iain Sherrif has that says the sun will appear in east tomorrow morning.

[HARRISON]

5568


PANEL MUG | Zazzle.co.uk (http://www.zazzle.co.uk/panel_mug-168454264537512197)

[Ken Roklin]

If Vector was ever registered in Canada please let me know a company number,
as far as i know they were only registered in Nevada and nowhere else, BB cards were also mailed from Las Vegas, Nevada, in any case neither of those are on authorized MC service providers.

I2C is just electronic service to link it all together, Vector was always using them, just an accounting link between Vector and the Choice bank.


And yes Vector and BB are closely married, but Raj is a key in that deal, not Chris.

The Oakville office in Ontario is an executive centre where they probably have a 8x10ft. office as many companies do when starting out. It's an inexpensive way to give a company an executive office address and phone service.

As for registration I can't find an Ontario one, but that in itself doesn't mean it's not registered. I tried doing a search of one of my Ontario registered corporations and can't find it either, even after searching it using the Business number used for paying tax. Strange. It is possible Vector is just registered in Belize and Oakville is just where he works out of since it is close to where he lives. He doesn't need to incorporate the company in Ontario to run it from Ontario. However, I believe every Bank will require incorporation information in order to open a Bank account so it has to be registered somewhere.

I agree Raj was the key player in setting this all up.

[Jerrygo]

When you think about it, whoever is really behind Banners Broker would have to be pretty stupid fraudsters if "proof" was so easy to find a bunch of amateurs on an internet discussion forum could do it.

If it comes to "proof" I wonder what absolute "proof" Iain Sherrif has that says the sun will appear in east tomorrow morning.

Ah the little hitler, stifling any akward questions or comments. Banning people for "negative posts".
How much proof does he need? BB ponzi falling down around his ears.
It walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck. But he insists that it is an eagle. Talkingbb members at last start to see that it is indeed a duck, and he goes into hysterics and shuts down the forum!!
No amount of proof would ever be enough for this agitated emotional martinet.
Well there is an age old proverb "The proof of the pudding is in the eating" By that measure BB has been a very bitter dish indeed.

[Della Cate]

Well, as recently as June this year, recruitment was still ongoing in Southampton (UK).....

Banners Broker – unofficial opportunity meeting (http://billwillmott.com/banners-broker-unofficial-opportunity-meeting/)

And in Cornwall (UK) in April....

Banners Broker Make Money Fast: April 2013 (http://bannersbrokerfastcash.blogspot.co.uk/2013_04_01_archive.html)

Assuming these meetings did go ahead, of course.

[Della Cate]

Re posting by Jerrygo....Mr Sherrif's comments (extract below)

This is my opinion based on the facts that I know. You need to decide for yourself wether I am right or not. I know the darkside will copy and post this and use extracts to twist my meaning. If they don't have any facts to twist they will stuff up anyway.........I don't care anymore. Time will show them to be a bunch of inconsequential missfits and spoilers.

All right thinking people know how devious and twisted the minds of these poor souls are.

My response?


5607

[HARRISON]

Well, as recently as June this year, recruitment was still ongoing in Southampton (UK).....

Banners Broker – unofficial opportunity meeting (http://billwillmott.com/banners-broker-unofficial-opportunity-meeting/)

And in Cornwall (UK) in April....

Banners Broker Make Money Fast: April 2013 (http://bannersbrokerfastcash.blogspot.co.uk/2013_04_01_archive.html)

Assuming these meetings did go ahead, of course.

And three weeks ago there was a BB meeting in Manchester attended by around 3000 people! Where are these meetings advertised?

[Della Cate]

And three weeks ago there was a BB meeting in Manchester attended by around 3000 people! Where are these meetings advertised?

Harrison, I wish I knew! It doesn't seem to matter what is really happening in the world of BB - there are people out there who will still try to recruit, it seems. Something to watch out for, I think........but do they put posters up? Advertise in local newspapers, shop windows, or is it just word of mouth?

Mysterious.

[Jerrygo]

And three weeks ago there was a BB meeting in Manchester attended by around 3000 people! Where are these meetings advertised?

I doubt that there was any BB meeting with 3,000 people at this stage Harrison. All the evidence points to recruitment having dried up.
There are still a few diehards trying to gather a few victims together, but even if they can gather a couple of dozen in a dingy hotel room, I think the percentage of those actually signing up is miniscule. Hence the recent consolidation back to belieze, and the break up of their ring of accomplices.

[Mundorf]

And three weeks ago there was a BB meeting in Manchester attended by around 3000 people! Where are these meetings advertised?

Maybe I am wrong but in the moment when BB is more a pure disaster then a program,how comes that dead scam can attract more people then meeting in Manchester in February when payments were still happening?I rather think the scope is the same they have with implementing the new payment processor - big words,great show ,fake stories just to persuade as much victims as possible to join and to invest...3000?..I doubt..the question is..was any meeting held at all or it was good staged?..if it was staged then it was not advertised at all.

[Dreamstealer]

I said this at MMG, here and a few other forum blogs back in January that BB died right after the big Christmas payout. The only problem was the members didn't know it, and didn't want to believe me. Not a big deal because they never want to believe me.

It is hard to get someone to accept the fact that they got duped, cheated, and their money stolen in a Ponzi. It is human nature to want to "believe," and we trick ourselves into believing the last strands of hope things will turn around and get better.

Now the whining, crying and anger will begin in earnest, but they are not going to praise any of us for warning them about BB being a Ponzi. In fact we will be the ones they blame the most while they are in the denial and anger stages.

The one statistic that sadly holds true is this one: There will be at least one suicide from someone involved in their Ponzi going bust; and that is the good news. Many times it is many more. I know of a few Ponzi's that there were five people who commited suicide.

There are going to be a lot of hurting people from BB's demise, and don't take offense when they lash out at you and are blaming you for BB crashing. All of us who have seen these events happen for a decade or longer have been hinting at the things to come to help prepare you for what is coming next. It is not going to be pretty, and like it or not, we are all going to be in the center of the firestorm that is coming; and be blamed for it. It is not the time for the "I told you so," even though we have been telling them for almost two years now.

My only reason for saying this is that I know some of you have friends in this that you have tried to warn them and they didn't listen. Support them in their time of need by just being there for them as a friend. They feel bad enough without you reminding them you were smarter than them. Just speaking from years of experience and seeing friendships destroyed over these matters because of ego's. For what it's worth.

Well said. Our friends need support not point scoring.

[HARRISON]

I doubt that there was any BB meeting with 3,000 people at this stage Harrison. All the evidence points to recruitment having dried up.
There are still a few diehards trying to gather a few victims together, but even if they can gather a couple of dozen in a dingy hotel room, I think the percentage of those actually signing up is miniscule. Hence the recent consolidation back to belieze, and the break up of their ring of accomplices.

There WAS a meeting...I know someone who was there. They could be lying about numbers of course. But Flexkom meetings are attracting lots of ex- BB members so the grapevine is alive and well somewhere...

[DevaEboracum]

Harrison, I wish I knew! It doesn't seem to matter what is really happening in the world of BB - there are people out there who will still try to recruit, it seems. Something to watch out for, I think........but do they put posters up? Advertise in local newspapers, shop windows, or is it just word of mouth?

Mysterious.


I regularly get emails from the person I initially signed up under. I've tried to attach the latest one I have but I'm having trouble doing it, but the jist of it is that it is on Wed 21st Aug at the Best Western Firgrove Hotel, Knutsford Old Road, Grappenhall, Warrington WA4 2LD. Registration is 7pm and 7.30pm prompt start.

It is Pete Pinnington who appears to be running it with Duncan Wood as guest speaker. Compere, MC, Facilitator, Event Host & Services | Pete Pinnington Presents (http://www.petepinnington.co.uk/)

[HARRISON]

I regularly get emails from the person I initially signed up under. I've tried to attach the latest one I have but I'm having trouble doing it, but the jist of it is that it is on Wed 21st Aug at the Best Western Firgrove Hotel, Knutsford Old Road, Grappenhall, Warrington WA4 2LD. Registration is 7pm and 7.30pm prompt start.

It is Pete Pinnington who appears to be running it with Duncan Wood as guest speaker. Compere, MC, Facilitator, Event Host & Services | Pete Pinnington Presents (http://www.petepinnington.co.uk/)
They are all emailing each other but no-one is talking, for whatever reason. Chris and Raj won't know whats hit them when these loyal members finally realise the truth...

[Della Cate]

Over on the BB blog.........Alan Sills has surfaced today, 19th August, with a NEW OPTIMISTIC VIDEO! Yay!

Haven't watched it myself yet - not sure if I want to.

Banners Broker (http://bannersbroker.blogspot.co.uk/)

[HARRISON]

Taken from the OBTAINER dated August 12th 2013:


In recent months OBTAINER has carried reports about the online advertising agency Banners Broker, particularly about unending reports of catastrophe which would seem to support the hypothesis that the company is operating a thoroughly fraudulent snowball system. The latest news follows exactly the same lines: allegedly Banners Broker's affiliates are receiving their commission late, only partially or not at all anymore.

At the moment thousands of reports from affiliates of the online advertising agency are piling up on the Internet that Banners Broker isn't paying out commission, or isn't paying the full amount or is doing so late. In view of the mass of reports it can be assumed with a probability bordering on certainty that there is an element of truth at the heart of these reports. And if, in addition, you take into account the negative reports of recent months, Banners Broker seems to be facing a future that isn't particularly rosy.
What's happened so far…

In our article “The remarkable case of Banners Broker,” which we published in January 2013, we reported about the Canadian online advertising agency and the inconsistencies in the company's business, which were already numerous at that time. Banners Broker, whose head office is in the Canadian city of Toronto, attracted attention at the start of the year primarily because of one thing – the remarkable contradictions that the company management was able to sweep under the carpet with ever increasing lack of success.

Banners Broker describes itself as an online advertising agency which earns money through banner advertising on relevant websites oriented toward specific target groups. Clients of the agency and website operators were given the opportunity to earn commission by placing banner advertising. By paying a fee Banner's Broker's affiliates are able to register for what is called a Pub Combo Package, which unifies all advantages for advertisers and website operators and allegedly “offers six different opportunities to earn money.” Banners Broker is positioned in dozens of markets worldwide such as, for example, the USA, Ireland, Poland and India.

In and of itself the business model seemed to be quite innovative and forward-looking at first glance. Today advertising is a market worth tens of billions and initially the combination of online business with MLM aspects came across as a stroke of genius. But the legality of Banners Broker was rapidly called into question for a whole series of reasons.

One stumbling block was the prominent role played by Rajiv Dixit as CEO of Banners Broker. In Canada Dixit is anything but an unknown figure because he was one of the orchestrators behind the now defunct company IFC World Homes. IFC was subject to a detailed investigation by the Canadian Competition Bureau, which was quite literally unable to ascertain that the company had any legitimate sources of income. As a result IFC World Homes was closed down because the company was operating a snowball system as it ultimately transpired. It might be objected that this alone didn't have to be a compelling reason for suspecting that Rajiv Dixit was planning a similar scam with Banners Broker, however, there were other incidents that reinforced more and more the suspicion that Banners Broker may very well be a snowball system after all.
Already at the end of last year Banners Broker attracted the attention of the authorities and the media in several countries – though not in a positive sense. First of all, the accusation was made in India that the company was breaching the Prize Chits and Money Circulation Schemes (Banning) Act 1978 with its business practices. The starting point for this was a charge laid by one of Banners Broker's Indian affiliates, who maintained that the company wouldn't pay out commissions promised or profits on investments. The consequence was that after investigating Banners Broker the local police compulsorily shut down several offices in the Indian state of Goa. However, this closure was played down on the part of the company. The offices had only been closed temporarily due to “some of our affiliates and an ex-employee explaining the compensation plan of Banners Broker incorrectly thus not only causing confusion but breaking the very strict Policies and Procedures of Banners Broker,” said Don Hooker, Chief Compliance Officer at Banners Broker. At this point it must, however, be pointed out that it wasn't just Banners Broker that was targeted by the Indian authorities but also other direct sales companies.

Another incident in Ireland aroused unwanted interest by the media on the Emerald Isle and beyond. At a business meeting of the company Paul McCarthy, an Irish affiliate of Banners Broker, promised profits of up to 400% on investments made. “If you are in this room tonight and you are an affiliate with Banners Broker, after seven days you’re making money. (...) Every day you are involved in the company, you wake up the next day and you are richer again,” said McCarthy literally at the aforementioned meeting in Cork, Ireland. The meeting had been filmed by an undercover journalist – so in this case Banners Broker wasn't able to use its tried and tested downplaying tactics. Instead Paul McCarthy was made a scapegoat and David Hooker did some rapid backpedaling:

“...It is also important to always bear in mind that there is no guarantee regarding fixed income within the compensation plan and that commission payments are paid purely on the basis of a satisfactory completion of a campaign within the Blind Network, based upon the traffic the website receives. Because traffic varies, Banners Broker International never guarantees a timeline of when an Affiliate will earn revenue...”

Meanwhile in North America the Ontario Securities Commission started to take an interest in Banners Broker and arranged an investigation of the business. In addition, the authority even explicitly warned the public against the company.
But the series of bad news didn't end here – instead it has continued unchecked. In March it became known that the online payment service Vector had terminated cooperation with Banners Broker at short notice. Affiliates were requested to withdraw their balance as quickly as possible. In the continuing discussion about the lawfulness of Banners Broker's business model the company had repeatedly invoked the collaboration between Banners Broker and the possibility of paying using the globally accepted MasterCard via Vector Card. Since MasterCard is accepted by numerous reputable companies, this was apparently intended to give the appearance of a business model that was also reputable. Vector Card's withdrawal has, however, shattered this argument. Shortly afterward Banners Broker's online services disappeared from the net – allegedly because of hosting problems. Relevant records gave the impression that the company had changed its hosting provider even if it wasn't disclosed what the reasons for this were. Since Vector Card had ended its collaboration with Banners Broker directly before this happened, there is reason to suspect that the previous hosting provider had terminated its collaboration with the company, which was now beginning to appear quite dubious.

All in all the picture has increasingly begun to emerge of a company whose business model was lacking in transparency, a company that was increasingly running out of explanations for what could most charitably be called remarkable incidents, a company that was attracting the interest of authorities all over the world and a company whose management apparently has anything but clean hands.

The Infernal Trio

Banners Broker was set up by Chris Smith and Kul Josun in November 2010. In recent months Chris Smith, David Hooker (Chief compliance Officer) and Rajiv Dixit (CEO) have adopted a high profile as the faces of Banners Broker.

Rajiv Dixit quickly came under suspicion that he was operating a similar scam to the one he ran at that time with IFC World Homes. In the meantime he has disappeared – his whereabouts are unknown and he doesn't appear in public as CEO of Banners Broker anymore. It is claimed that he changed his name on Facebook to Rajeeve Eswar Rao, presumably to attain some kind of anonymity, before apparently deleting his profile completely.
By contrast, Chris Smith is still active in public and is “the last defender of Banners Broker and he's either deluded enough or well enough paid to continue pulling the wool over the eyes of affiliates,” as it says in a blog that has been following the development of Banners Broker since the end of last year. Smith seems to lack the criminal intelligence to have designed the Banners Broker model – however, he seems to be happy in the role of frontman, according to the blogger quoted. It appears far more likely that Rajiv Dixit is the person really pulling the strings, one who prudently keeps in the background.

And last but not least, there remains David Hooker, who as Chief Compliance Officer has been increasingly faced with challenges as it has been his task to mollify annoyed affiliates and to find explanations for Banners Broker's business, which has been appearing more and more dubious as time passes. At the beginning of the year when the first rumors emerged that Banners Broker was a fraudulent snowball system, OBTAINER approached the company and David Hooker on several occasions in order to get to the bottom of these rumors. Unfortunately, there was no reaction to our numerous inquiries on the part of Banners Broker.

In terms of public explanations David Hooker is now increasingly being replaced by Chris Smith, who apart from that has again and again made statements about the late or even completely absent commission payments.

Where are the commissions?

The complaints from the company's affiliates about late, partial or even total non-payment of commission have taken on a worrying volume and vehemence. The statements are clear and impossible to misunderstand. “Banners Broker is dead. Game over!” they say. Or “If you invest money in Banners Broker today, you'll never see it again!” Or: “To maintain that Banners Broker is in difficulties at the moment is more or less the same as saying the Titanic got a bit wet.”

Nevertheless, Chris Smith isn't getting tired of finding more or less illuminating explanations for the late, partial or non-payment of commission to affiliates. Here is a small selection:
On May 23, 2013 Chris Smith explained that delayed payments were the result of two reasons. “With Payza, it’s an Excel sent to the system and it pays based on that file. I created this file and put it together. It is date order, but if someone has say 4 pay requests, we will pay one and move to other members. When I did this, I sorted by ID’s, and I forgot to sort by Date (by person). So someone may have received an April payout and March is still pending. By design, due to the OSC investigation, we did choose some of the members who have never been paid before, so that everyone got their money back.”

Just savor this wording for a moment. So at Banners Broker they are actually working with manually produced Excel files for commission payments – and that with a claimed 160,000 affiliates? Extremely unbelievable or incredibly unprofessional. In view of this system it's no wonder that commission payments are late or partial or even non-existent. And the fact that inspection by the Ontario Securities Commission leads to long neglected commission payments being prioritized shows how chaotically work is carried out in the management of Banners Broker.

But it goes on. On May 31, 2013 Chris Smith announced that because of mistakes in the aforementioned Excel files and consequent functional errors in the system, the payment of commission would only be possible after delays. But the errors should be resolved as soon as possible.A week later on June 7, 2013 Chris Smith was offering conciliatory noises anew because the problem with commission payments still existed. “If you haven’t received yours you will be on the next run. Payza is coming up shortly. I hate to give definitive dates. But it will be soon.” Delaying tactics?

Yet again one week later some affiliates may have been really surprised because Banners Broker had reorganized its commission system without further ado. Chris Smith now spoke of a points system which ought to give older payments a higher priority – more recent ones, on the other hand, a lower one. In plain language that meant that the affiliates now had to patiently compose themselves because Banners Broker let it be known that the payment process would now have to be begun again in order to get things back on track.

On June 21, 2013 things sounded similar. Again the affiliates were asked to be patient.

“We were hoping to get Payza out last weekend. We cannot send it out if it’s not accurate. I am very confident that if it’s not today, then it will this weekend. I will make it a point to see that it goes out. (...) We are going in a point system order, predominantly by date, so everyone will not get a payment. However, everyone will get paid so please be patient.”
But since Banners Broker wasn't able or didn't want to solve the problem in the following four weeks, Chris Smith turned anew to the company's affiliates on July 19, 2013:

“The good news is that I mentioned we have our new (payment) solution in place. It is a long process, however we are making good strides to get that done. That will be ready shortly. We are sending out payments, and those who get them, please share the news. These are not scheduled, but are indeed going out. The order is heavily on the date, but with some fairness, so, for example, you will get 1 from your batch of withdrawals, then others will get theirs, then back to your second one. This is based on a point system as explained several times.”

In and of itself this wasn't anything new – patience continued to be requested. What then happened caused eyes to widen and jaws to drop – unfortunately not in a positive sense: “We have had many people offer to help us to get BB back in shape. Some have offerred ideas. One idea is to have a $1,000 max payout. Some have suggested having a clean slate where we would start fresh. IC’s (Independent Consultants) are frontline in their field and they know what will fly and what will not.”

A list of more than fantastic explanations, attempts to pacify, excuses and ultimately disturbing announcements. The bottom line is that late payment of commission always means that a company isn't solvent. And as a rule that's the preliminary to bankruptcy. In the case of Banners Broker this is the most up-to-date and clearest indication that Banners Broker could very well be a snowball system that's on the verge of collapse. If sufficient new affiliates who pay into the system can no longer be gained, it's no longer possible to pay out to older affiliates.

But what possibilities do those who've already invested money have? Is there a chance that they'll get back what they've invested? Meanwhile there's a Facebook page specifically set up for this purpose where affiliates can exchange information and join forces.

A group of British affiliates claim they have been able to successfully implement a procedure which has so far been quite promising. According to their statements it was sufficient to threaten Banners Broker with legal proceedings in the Ontario Small Claims Court. As a result several letters were issued by the company's legal department but – since the British affiliates stuck to their guns – these ultimately led to repayment of the initial investment. Apparently Banners Broker wishes to avoid any contact with the legal system – it may justifiably be asked why this is so.In this context it is inadvisable to make contact with the Banners Broker Support Team because fees are being charged for every query made. Again an indication of dubious business practices because which serious company has asked you to pay even once for each query made to the Customer Service Department.
What remains?

The developments of the last six months speak a clear and unambiguous language. Banners Broker appears to have run into acute difficulties and the suspicion present from the very start that the company was operating an illegal snowball system seems to be confirmed by every statement made by the Banners Broker management.

In the terms and conditions it seems that provisions have already been made for the worst case scenario. There it says: “In the event of the company closing, the company reserves the right to sell or transfer the intellectual property, programming code, and affiliate database at its sole discretion.” Does this finally mean that affiliates will be deprived of their commission and that in addition their data will also be sold in order to provide Banners Broker with a financially satisfactory exit?

Whether Banners Broker will manage to change its ways and be able to place its business model on a solid foundation remains to be seen – even if at the moment its prospects aren't particularly rosy.
- See more at: Banners Broker (http://www.obtainer-online.com/news/en/banners-broker-game-over.html#sthash.g8Hi8EGs.dpuf)


TARA TALKS: BREAKING NEWS (http://taratalkstoday.blogspot.co.uk/p/breaking-news.html)

[Della Cate]

Have now watched the Alan Sills video. That's six minutes of my life I won't get back again. Gosh, he's irritating.

Usual woffle.....oh, we are told that Chris Smith "the genius who is also a programmer" has been "wearing his programmers hat to create BB v3" which will solve all the problems. Great! And the usual cries of "be patient!"

Bit of an unfortunate mention of the blind network there though, Alan.

That's about it really folks.

[OfficerEdgarMallory]

So tell me guys, which day suits you the best for me to bring you to jail ?

5615

[Jerrygo]

Bit of an unfortunate mention of the blind network there though, Alan.



Yes. "The blind network", that Terry used to come over and lecture us on, as the source of BB's amazing supposed profits. The same Terry who told us that he would not take a dime in wages, untill all affiliates had been paid.
No more blind network cr*p now, so we won't have to ask "where are the ads" any more.
We can find them all now in 5 minutes, on buzzunga and uncleanseme.com.
BB The new google.

[waverider]

.....oh, we are told that Chris Smith "the genius who is also a programmer" has been "wearing his programmers hat to create BB v3" which will solve all the problems. blah blah
That's about it really folks.
there you go :)
5616

[littleroundman]

The same TERRY who told us that he would not take a dime in wages, untill all affiliates had been paid.

Now, there's a blast from the past.

Gets me all teary thinking of days gone by.


"Memories, light the corners of my mind.

Misty watercolour memories.

Of the way we were"

[Mundorf]

Have now watched the Alan Sills video. That's six minutes of my life I won't get back again. Gosh, he's irritating.

Usual woffle.....oh, we are told that Chris Smith "the genius who is also a programmer" has been "wearing his programmers hat to create BB v3" which will solve all the problems. Great! And the usual cries of "be patient!"

Bit of an unfortunate mention of the blind network there though, Alan.

That's about it really folks.

BB v3 will be shortly v4..or v3 mk2...or v3 SE (special edition)...more it will sink into the abyss,more it will be special..one more example of never-ending scam policy - even if they bury you,announce a new wedding....on the very bottom of any scam out there,it's pure arrogance & spite that drive corpse beside cemetary with only intention to leave the crime as a genius & saver.

[Poyol]

Funny picture here ... sent to my by a contact in Canada found on a bus stop there!

http://i.imgur.com/AxZdTzR.jpg?1

Now when you all stop rolling on floor ... that's cheap!

[Ken Roklin]

Funny picture here ... sent to my by a contact in Canada found on a bus stop there!

http://i.imgur.com/AxZdTzR.jpg?1

Now when you all stop rolling on floor ... that's cheap!

Well, let's see at about $1,500 per panel (on a bus shelter) per month SP will need to sign up 125/m/panel just to break even. Not what I call a huge revenue generator. Add in the cost to support those clients and it looks like another losing venture.

[Brenda]

Funny picture here ... sent to my by a contact in Canada found on a bus stop there!

http://i.imgur.com/AxZdTzR.jpg?1

Now when you all stop rolling on floor ... that's cheap!

just googled them, unfortunately for some reason I wasn't able to bannersbroker them lol Yep, looks like they have a sale on, 50% off !

They actually have very outdated looking banner ads on their site !

On a serious note, is this all about pretending to look legit enough in an attempt to stay out of jail? Even pretendy ignorance is not a defense.

[Ken Roklin]

As per BB's website:

Support

For support information please go to:
bannersbroker.com/adpubcombo_help/live_support
You must be logged in.

Affiliates from North America please call: 647 497-9233

Here is what I found re-the phone number:

NAVKAR FOODS
Listing ID: 77760 Posted on 21-Jan-13
Contact Details:
Contact: JOYTI VORA
Phone: 905-497-9233
905-497-9233


Address:
6 HEFFERON COURT
Brampton Ontario L6Y5J3
Driving Direction


Report Abuse

Are you looking for Authentic Indian Jain HOME FOOD

Contact :-- JYOTIBEN
(905-497-9233/ 647-328-0416)
(PICK-UP ONLY )

We provide fresh and delicious jain veg.food as per your taste by order only.
we are specialist of PANIPURI & KHASTA KACHORI
We are also provide SAREVDA ( khichiya papad )( RICE PAPAD )
CHAPATI (ROTI ),PURI(all Kinds like masala, farsi, etc.)

All food is made by canola oil

*100% pure and vegetarian food

* Tasty and hygienic food

If you need more information contact us by phone or e-mail

NAVKAR FOODS (PICK-UP ONLY)
PLEASE PLACE YOUR ORDER 1 DAY BEFORE PRIOR TO YOUR REQUIREMENT

Regards,

Jyoti & Purvi Vora
RAYLAWSON AND MAVIS
905-497-9233 /647-328-0416

Now that makes sense, if you want tech support phone a food distribution company. I wonder why Google or IBM haven't thought of that.

[HARRISON]

You should know by now that numbers aren't Chris's strong point lol.

[Julie Diligent]

As per BB's website:

Support

For support information please go to:
bannersbroker.com/adpubcombo_help/live_support
You must be logged in.

Affiliates from North America please call: 647 497-9233

Here is what I found re-the phone number:

<SNIP>

Contact :-- JYOTIBEN
(905-497-9233/ 647-328-0416)
(PICK-UP ONLY )

<SNIP>

Looks like you forgot to enclose the BB number in quotes before you searched, Ken; the BB number is a composite of parts of the two Jyotiben numbers. No dots to connect, there, I'm afraid.

[EagleOne]

I just thought they were offering banners to go.

[Brenda]

I just thought they were offering banners to go.

it's starting to look more like Buddy can you spare a dime!

That said, I don't understand why they are looking at building such a cheap operation, why not just another ponzi dressed as a whatever, to get the big bucks rolling in again?

[Ken Roklin]

Looks like you forgot to enclose the BB number in quotes before you searched, Ken; the BB number is a composite of parts of the two Jyotiben numbers. No dots to connect, there, I'm afraid.

Well Julie you are absolutely correct. It is a Toronto area number and the number for the food company is a house in Brampton, an East India neighborhood, so at first glance it looked like something Chris / Raj would use for support.

[EagleOne]

it's starting to look more like Buddy can you spare a dime!

That said, I don't understand why they are looking at building such a cheap operation, why not just another ponzi dressed as a whatever, to get the big bucks rolling in again?

They have to disappear for 6-9 months at least before starting a new Ponzi. They have to find a domain name that has been parked for a long period of time to make it look like they have been in business for a long time, get a new script because they can't do the same type of Ponzi again or people will know its them. Sometimes, depending on how much money they were able to steal, they will disappear for 12-18 months before starting anew. And of course they have to come up with new names for all of them.

Besides, they are still raping people that are joining this and why stop the cash flow when you don't have to pay anyone only promise to do so? A win-win for BB just not for the members.

[HARRISON]

Found this little video from 'Yawn, Yawn, Al'. Its called 'Banners Broker and Human Psychology' which he made weeks after joining. Usual Al crap, but just loved this first bit lol:

5622

[HARRISON]

I've just received this notification:

5625

which is listed as:

5626

[waverider]

I just thought they were offering banners to go.

buy one get one free :duh:

[Beacon]

Looks like you forgot to enclose the BB number in quotes before you searched, Ken; the BB number is a composite of parts of the two Jyotiben numbers. No dots to connect, there, I'm afraid.

Although the food company is not related , if i recall correctly from earlier unpublished research , after raj worked in electrical retail in Seattle he was involved in "health food" supplements? I think that was Raj's first MLM gig.

[Beacon]

The following is been offered on Linkedin as a reason to suppose BB is worth billions.
bannersbroker.com (http://bannersbroker.com.w3snoop.com/)
Basically they are claiming that because w3snoop says the domain is worth billions it is.

Anyone have a short response as to how the traffic stats are artificial/ doctored and not actual transactions other than a clickfest of robots and bb affiliates?

[HARRISON]

So snoop are saying that BB is STILL earning $3.8 million dollars A DAY?
NINE months (270 days) of NO payments is about :duh: roughly 100 billion dollars? :shocked:
They could eradicate world poverty with that little lot couldn't they..or make EVERY affiliate a millionaire? :RpS_lol::RpS_lol::RpS_lol::RpS_lol::RpS_lol:

[littleroundman]

Anyone have a short response as to how the traffic stats are artificial/ doctored and not actual transactions other than a clickfest of robots and bb affiliates?

The traffic figures are probably not doctored.

If HYIP ponzi history is anything to go by, any increase in numbers will be due to the number of remaining "true believers" desperately checking their account/s 4 or 5 times daily for any signs of life, rather than a large number of prospective new victims members visiting the site.

[Beacon]

The traffic figures are probably not doctored.

If HYIP ponzi history is anything to go by, any increase in numbers will be due to the number of remaining "true believers" desperately checking their account/s 4 or 5 times daily for any signs of life, rather than a large number of prospective new victims members visiting the site.

I can't accept that because I reckon the "true believers" are in the thousands at best.
The stats however state : bannersbroker.com (http://bannersbroker.com.w3snoop.com/)
Daily Unique Visitors: 873,992,856
Monthly Unique Visitors: 26,601,589,376
Yearly Unique Visitors: 319,007,392,491

Given June 2012 : 2,405,518,376 internet users
World Internet Users Statistics Usage and World Population Stats (http://www.internetworldstats.com/stats.htm)
That's about one in every three internet user ever day accessing banners broker
Even a their claimed "hundred of thousands" of members would have to access it ten thousand times a day!
As it is my estimated thousands of members would each have to access it a ten million times a day! that I reckon is about a hundred times a second.
By the way I noted this on the Linkedin reply:
here is another Ponzi Scam that Raj Dixit was involved in:
icfworldhomes.com (http://icfworldhomes.com.w3snoop.com/)

"Apparently... although this was closed down as a Ponzi several years ago it is earning 50k a year " according to w3snoop.
So I suspect some bot is operating this access rate, or the stats are just wrong.

[Jerrygo]

I can't accept that because I reckon the "true believers" are in the thousands at best.
The stats however state : bannersbroker.com (http://bannersbroker.com.w3snoop.com/)
Daily Unique Visitors: 873,992,856
Monthly Unique Visitors: 26,601,589,376
Yearly Unique Visitors: 319,007,392,491

So I suspect some bot is operating this access rate, or the stats are just wrong.


Just plain wrong. Laughable in fact. Something wrong with the W3 "algorythm"
This (https://siteanalytics.compete.com/bannersbroker.com/) would seem more plausible.
US data only. 10% And Russia stats down from 22.5% to 18%.
But it still seems too high. probably some manipulation going on. We are not talking about a legit company after all.
And Alexa report that 22% of visitors came from within the site. http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/bannersbroker.com/user/adpubcombo_dashboard.

[littleroundman]

I can't accept that because I reckon the "true believers" are in the thousands at best.
The stats however state : bannersbroker.com (http://bannersbroker.com.w3snoop.com/)
Daily Unique Visitors: 873,992,856
Monthly Unique Visitors: 26,601,589,376
Yearly Unique Visitors: 319,007,392,491

Daily Unique Visitors: 873,992,856

Are you kidding me ?? 874 MILLION unique visitors a DAY ??

Compare that number to Facebooks' own statistics:



Total number of Facebook users: 1.15 billion (http://investor.fb.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=780093) (Tweet this stat (http://clicktotweet.com/8w68c))
Daily active Facebook users: 699 million (http://investor.fb.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=780093) (Tweet this stat (http://clicktotweet.com/6elzG))
Total number of Facebook pages: 50 million (http://files.shareholder.com/downloads/AMDA-NJ5DZ/2301311196x0xS1326801-13-3/1326801/1326801-13-3.pdf) (Tweet this stat (http://clicktotweet.com/x6L8F))
Average number of monthly posts per Facebook page: 36 (http://www.socialbakers.com/blog/1561-cutting-through-the-crowds-on-facebook-news-feeds) (Tweet this stat (http://clicktotweet.com/4gMIc))
Total number of Facebook groups: Still searching
Monthly active Facebook mobile users: 819 million (http://investor.fb.com/releasedetail.cfm?ReleaseID=780093) (Tweet this stat (http://clicktotweet.com/xKH86))
Total number of Facebook apps: 10 million (http://files.shareholder.com/downloads/AMDA-NJ5DZ/2301311196x0xS1326801-13-3/1326801/1326801-13-3.pdf) (Tweet this stat (http://clicktotweet.com/wfbUO))
Total number of Facebook friend connections: 150 billion (http://files.shareholder.com/downloads/AMDA-NJ5DZ/2301311196x0xS1326801-13-3/1326801/1326801-13-3.pdf) (Tweet this stat (http://clicktotweet.com/3EkSG))
Average number of friends per Facebook user: 141.5 (no link, just simple math) (Tweet this stat (http://clicktotweet.com/9Mief))
Total number of Facebook likes since launch: 1.13 trillion (http://newsroom.fb.com/imagelibrary/downloadmedia.ashx?MediaDetailsID=4227&SizeId=-1) (Tweet this stat (http://clicktotweet.com/cW0cb))
Average daily Facebook likes: 4.5 billion (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151908376831729&set=a.10151908376636729.1073741825.20531316728&type=1&theater) (Tweet this stat (http://clicktotweet.com/ZW5v4))

[Jerrygo]

By the way I noted this on the Linkedin reply:
here is another Ponzi Scam that Raj Dixit was involved in:
icfworldhomes.com (http://icfworldhomes.com.w3snoop.com/)

"Apparently... although this was closed down as a Ponzi several years ago it is earning 50k a year " .
Yes and another baby of his Kibotec.
And his warm up (http://tbog.net/)site before refining it into BB

[littleroundman]

Yes and another baby of his Kibotec.
And his warm up (http://tbog.net/)site before refining it into BB

And, doesn't try to hide the association, either:

http://imageshack.us/a/img716/6207/soqb.jpg
http://imageshack.us/a/img825/3161/j99l.jpg


One gets the impression Mr Dixit is not the least worried the Canadian authorities will be acting against him any time soon

[Brenda]

Although the food company is not related , if i recall correctly from earlier unpublished research , after raj worked in electrical retail in Seattle he was involved in "health food" supplements? I think that was Raj's first MLM gig.

Not so sure but definitely, David Hooker was involved in Herbalife for a number of years, also discredited as a scam.

[Jerrygo]

They have to find a domain name that has been parked for a long period of time to make it look like they have been in business for a long time,

In this respect Raj has under his different alias's, emails, and dixit consulting, already got 46 domains registered. (All by the same Sibername registrants). So I would not be surprised if he has the next scam prepared and ready to go when the heat dies down. Scamming is his profession now, and he is not going to change his spots at this stage of his life.
(Unless he gets a couple of years in the clink)

[Ken Roklin]

So snoop are saying that BB is STILL earning $3.8 million dollars A DAY?
NINE months (270 days) of NO payments is about :duh: roughly 100 billion dollars? :shocked:
They could eradicate world poverty with that little lot couldn't they..or make EVERY affiliate a millionaire? :RpS_lol::RpS_lol::RpS_lol::RpS_lol::RpS_lol:

Here's another valuation of BB's site.

Valuation Report by http://www.evaluateanywebsite.com/ for:

Banners Broker (http://bannersbroker.com)
Your Site is worth:
$23,036

We use publicly available information to estimate the value of websites. We are confident of our estimate, but understand that it is an automated estimate. This is the website estimate ... not the whole business!
Some Data:

Alexa Traffic Ranking: 77767
Google Page Rank: 3
Backlinks found: 17
Value Ranking : 328280

[Jerrygo]

Here's another valuation of BB's site.

Valuation Report by http://www.evaluateanywebsite.com/ for:

Banners Broker (http://bannersbroker.com)
Your Site is worth:
$23,036



Thats more like it. But I dont think you could actually sell it for $1000. With BB's reputation Who would buy it?
Sp is worth $4. Must have dismal traffic.

[HARRISON]

The website updated its terms and conditions yesterday and now no longer has the Isle of Man address. They are now 'officially' a BELIZE based company:
5632

I've also noticed this info about requesting the BACK OF A BANK CARD photocopy which obviously contains the security number. Very dangerous...:NO::NO::NO::NO:


5633



TARA TALKS: BREAKING NEWS (http://taratalkstoday.blogspot.co.uk/p/breaking-news.html)

[Della Cate]

Funny picture here ... sent to my by a contact in Canada found on a bus stop there!

http://i.imgur.com/AxZdTzR.jpg?1

Now when you all stop rolling on floor ... that's cheap!

NOOOOO....that's a class act that is - advertising by posters attached to bus stops!

[Joe_Shmoe]

NOOOOO....that's a class act that is - advertising by posters attached to bus stops!

It's the future don't you know? Oh! hang on a min Raj. It's the PAST. :RpS_smile:

[Della Cate]

It's the future don't you know? Oh! hang on a min Raj. It's the PAST. :RpS_smile:

You'd think they might have banner ads on websites. Banner ads advertising banner ads!

After all, don't they have links with a company that specialises in that?

[Jerrygo]

Nice video posted over on BBPS page. Banners Broker scammed my sis in law 3,000 in Qld Au - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5Gpt6ms4Ow&feature=youtu.be)

[littleroundman]

Don't be shy:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&amp;v=O5Gpt6ms4Ow

[Joe_Shmoe]

Stokes is back in the saddle after the very recent death of his sister.

5657

Stokesy is now getting involved in a "5 trillion dollar industry" LOL although he says in this youtube video that some of his online businesses haven't been doing too well.
Says he had to go back to work. One of them wouldn't be Banners Broker would it Mark? :RpS_smile:

Published on 22 Aug 2013
IML (http://tidyurl.com/teamletsgo)
to get started in a 5 trillion dollar industry working 2 minutes a day all done for you by the experts enter your details here for more details http://tidyurl.com/teamletsgo (http://www.youtube.com/redirect?q=http%3A%2F%2Ftidyurl.com%2Fteamletsgo&session_token=FrskwIVvN02ZZS5QUG28ieefdit8MTM3NzMw MzE5NkAxMzc3MjE2Nzk2)



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tzi-Yi2PAF8

[littleroundman]

Would you buy a used car from this man ??

http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/8333/ufvx.jpg

NO ???

Then why listen to his investment advice ??

[Gregg]

Looks like the runner up in a Benito Mussolini look alike contest.

[Dreamstealer]

Would you buy a used car from this man ??

http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/8333/ufvx.jpg

NO ???

Then why listen to his investment advice ??

Also, can someone better educated than me have a liok at the 'lets' I would have thought it should be let's? As in 'let us' . As it is it sounds like a description of what his team would be doing to their cash, dignity and marbles if they listened to him.

[Poyol]

Also, can someone better educated than me have a liok at the 'lets' I would have thought it should be let's? As in 'let us' . As it is it sounds like a description of what his team would be doing to their cash, dignity and marbles if they listened to him.

Let's is a contraction of the two words 'let' and 'us' - you're right. I'm sure we all make the odd grammar mistake though! Even big corporations do (some of which I've emailed in about!)

[Beacon]

Also, can someone better educated than me have a liok at the 'lets' I would have thought it should be let's? As in 'let us' . As it is it sounds like a description of what his team would be doing to their cash, dignity and marbles if they listened to him.

Have a "liok" is that short for "like to have a look"?
Anyway as to your request Maybe there is a team called "lets" of whom Marks thinks they should to go into living digital life?
Or a team "lets go" who are now living a digital life.
Or Maybe it is a flashback to the ICF World Homes scam with an announced view to bring teams of people together to let them property - team lets- but the scam collapsed and now they dont have reall property just virtual property so they are living a virtual life.

I hope Stoksey doesn't intend real people also live on virtual food as well as virtual shelter with their "virtual" income they get from BB.
(!)

[Mundorf]

Looks like the runner up in a Benito Mussolini look alike contest.

He looks like a football player Jimy from one MontyPayton's scatch where the player was interviewed.The guy is rich but is unable to answer simple questions about football except that he is opening a boutique...mega funny:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sw8ZL_gcTSM&feature=player_detailpage

[Jerrygo]

Report with screenshots by Guardianuno, over on mmg. Where Mark Ghobril is skyping that he is doing todays webinar instead of Smith.
Chris gone into hiding? Or he cant think of a new way to say "Be patient, payments soon, BB here for the long run" ?

[Joe_Shmoe]

Report with screenshots by Guardianuno, over on mmg. Where Mark Ghobril is skyping that he is doing todays webinar instead of Smith.
Chris gone into hiding? Or he cant think of a new way to say "Be patient, payments soon, BB here for the long run" ?



It must be nice for Chris knowing he has got some useful idiots to do his bidding whilst he runs away.

[HARRISON]

Proof from Barclays that a photo copied version of the back of your bank card is definitely fraud:

5663

http://taratalkstoday.blogspot.co.uk/p/breaking-news.html

[Newto]

Friday Q&A Webinar - 8/23/13

CEO Chris Smith not present today:

(I'm not sure who the Presenter was today. Sorry) (Most of what is below is the speaker's opinion based on notes from Chris)

Good morning. I was going to play a message from Chris. Unfortunately he is traveling and was unable to send that. He has forwarded a message to me which I will read.

Support has fully transitioned to the office in Belize. BB thanks the great people at Stellar Point for helping over the years. Just to quash any rumors, the management of BB and Stellar Point are still friends and colleagues. The decision to split was a business decision only.

All country support is now handled by head office. In the future BB may do country support.

Payouts --

A Payout will be made this week in priority order. First those who have never been paid, then date order. I know it seems like payouts have not gone out, but I can assure you payments have gone out. Chris has listened to feedback and will be posting payout status messages on the dashboard.

BB 3.0 is shaping up nicely. This will be a lot easier to navigate. Create My Banners is doign great in its first 2 weeks. It can now track referrals, so that's a good thing.

Version 3 is just around the corner. Along with 3.0 a new payout processor will be integrated with this.

(Speaker's opinion) The next few months heading into the Christmas season is usually the busiest time of the year.

2 Guest speakers:

(Please listen to the replay in your back office for these testimonial speeches)

Presenter: Sometimes we forget how great it is that our CEO speaks to us each week. Chris has been the sole CEO of BB International from day one. The company has never changed ownership. The vision has never changed. He would not be putting out Version 3, spending the money that he is to put this in place unless he was serious about getting everything straightened out.

I maintain faith in Chris and it's because of Chris that I am as confident as I am. I am proud to have him as a friend and business colleague.

(end of webinar)
(Notes prepared by Linda Lane - not official BB transcripts)
(Please listen to the replay of the webinar for detailed words/comments)

[HARRISON]

Below are extracts from the recently updated
Terms and Conditions - 20th August 2013

Banners Broker International defends its brand and reputation vigorously and will take all steps to rectify any and all damage caused through courts of law.

Banners Broker have NEVER taken anyone to court.

“Banners Broker International and its affiliate companies do not guarantee the income of any person(s) or entity participating in its program. Incomes earned will be in direct proportion to the amount of time and effort put forth by participants. The “typical” income of a “typical” Affiliate is approximately $39.58 per month/$475.00 per year. Testimonies given regarding income are the personal testimonies of the persons giving, such testimonials are not sanctioned by Banners Broker International and their accuracy is not guaranteed by Banners Broker International.”

Banners Broker was sold as a 'straightline, cycler doubler'. Turn $20 into $10,000.

Applications must be submitted with a photo ID (Driver’s License, National Identity Card or Passport) as well as a photo copy of the front and back of the credit card being used for payment.

Asking for this information is fraudulent which has been confirmed by Barclays Bank.

Banners Broker International has the right to terminate an Affiliate account without prior notice.

They are saying that regardless of how much money you have given them, they now have the right to close your account and take any money that you have given them.

The maximum withdrawal amount is $10,000 USD per month.

NOBODY has been paid for at least nine months.

Banners Broker International holds the rights to deny any withdrawal request submitted.

...which is the real reason why nobody has been paid.

Charge backs, returns and reversals may lead to an account being locked, immediate account termination and loss of commissions.

The 'chargeback' system of legitimate refunds through your bank or credit card company is proving to be successful and BB have issued this notice to deter you from proceeding any further.

Each Affiliate bears the responsibility for the reporting and filing of taxes. Banners Broker International does not offer tax advice and we strongly recommend that you seek guidance from a local taxation consultant.

You must pay tax on the amount of money you have 'earned' with Banners Broker. Please get financial advice urgently.

EXIT CLAUSE
In the event of the company closing, the company reserves the right to sell or transfer the intellectual property, programming code, and affiliate database at its sole discretion.

Banners Broker can close and all the information that you've given them:
..***Name, Address, email, signature, photocopied ID of driving license/passport/recent utility bills/bank account details and your cards SECURITY CODE****
can be SOLD TO SOMEONE ELSE.

Banners Broker International does not sell or otherwise transfer personal information to unaffiliated third parties except where you specifically authorize us to do so.

You agreed to abide by Banners Brokers terms and conditions when you joined. So you HAVE authorised them to do this.

All refund and cancellation requests must be sent to the following address:

Mailing Address:
P.O. Box 1865
Belize City
Belize
Central America

These requests are going to a MAIL BOX. There is no email address listed. No phone number. No dept. No address.

Banners Broker International’s due diligence includes confirming the identity of our Affiliate’s by means of:
Government-issued photo ID
Proof of residential or business address
Corporate documentation
Business registration information
Any other applicable documentation

When capturing Affiliate ID, we will accept a passport or other government issued photo ID and the most recent proof of address (e.g. Utility bill, bank statement, mailed within the last 3 months with the residential address, etc.).

This amount of information is not requested by legitimate companies.

Our financial partner understands Banners Broker International must know who their customers are and provide adequate information to the company.Our financial partner has an established protocol where they process our customer information into further detail such as: customer name, source of money being transmitted as well as proper identification (passport, driver’s license, etc.)

WHAT financial partner? Stellarpoint and Banners Broker are supposed to have 'split up'.

Banners Broker International Head Office
Physical Address: 35 Barrack Road, Suite #203
Belize City
Belize
Central America

Mailing Address: P.O. Box 1865
Belize City
Belize
Central America(Head Office is open to the public by appointment only)

They are now officially based in BELIZE.
No email address is given.
No phone number is given.
No contact name is given.
...but you may make an appointment to see them.



TARA TALKS: TERMS AND CONDITIONS: (http://taratalkstoday.blogspot.co.uk/p/ne.html)

[Della Cate]

Quote:

"Presenter: Sometimes we forget how great it is that our CEO speaks to us each week. Chris has been the sole CEO of BB International from day one. The company has never changed ownership. The vision has never changed. He would not be putting out Version 3, spending the money that he is to put this in place unless he was serious about getting everything straightened out.

I maintain faith in Chris and it's because of Chris that I am as confident as I am. I am proud to have him as a friend and business colleague."

Oh, FFS! Why don't you roll over and let Chris tickle your tummy while you're at it?

[Della Cate]

Quote (again - thanks Harrison!)

They are now officially based in BELIZE.
No email address is given.
No phone number is given.
No contact name is given.
...but you may make an appointment to see them.

Now that's going to be dead easy isn't it? Just take time off work, jump on a plane, go over to Belize and hope to see them? Like your average affiliate from Europe, or Australia, or NZ, is going to be able to do that at the drop of a hat.

As Harrison points out, no other way to contact them.....and if you DID go over there, just what would you find? Swish offices full of busy workers - or a mailbox? I mean, call it a touch of the bleedin' obvious, but I'm betting that they don't WANT to be contacted.

It MUST be clear now to even the most blinkered true believer what this is, surely?

[littleroundman]

It MUST be clear now to even the most blinkered true believer what this is, surely?

Nah, not even close to that happening yet.

It's not until you've seen "true believers" still maintaining the innocence of their HYIP idol 2 years AFTER he has exhausted every avenue of appeal, changed his plea to guilty, been convicted and begun his sentence in a Federal prison that you come to realize exactly what the term "delusional" really means.

[Della Cate]

According to Guardianuno over at MMG (thanks G!) Stepsys, Stokes, Waters, Wild, Wood etc are now pushing something called IML (imarketslive) to people, including former BB-ers (of whom they must have lots on their lists of potential "customers").

There's also Rippln and Flexkom and goodness knows what else. Up until 10 months ago, I never even knew this world existed, so it has been a bit of a shock but a welcome education to me!

Do these people NEVER give up?

I've been scratching my head over all this.

You see, I would NEVER try to recruit someone into something that I was in, even if I thought it was great. I wouldn't do that, just in case it all went wrong, because then I would feel responsible.

I might recommend a nice restaurant, a hotel, a hairdresser or a cleaning product to someone who asked; but I would never suggest anything where people had to gamble with their money. But some people clearly don't think like that, they will recommend (push) one thing after another regardless of the consequences.

Don't they ever think that this might be, well, wrong?

On the plus side, at least it tells the rest of us what to look out for and what to avoid! Because to my way of thinking, it former Bb promoters and apologists are now saying something else is great - well, we all know that it's bound to be RUBBISH! And to be avoided at all costs.

These people, these serial promoters, should be aware that their names are all out there now. They cannot run forever. One day, their past deeds will all catch up with them. As Johnny Cash puts it (no, I'm not a fan, but I do like this song):-

Well you may throw your rock and hide your hand
Workin' in the dark against your fellow man
But as sure as God made black and white
What's done in the dark will be brought to the light

You can run on for a long time
Run on for a long time
Run on for a long time
Sooner or later God'll cut you down
Sooner or later God'll cut you down

Go tell that long tongue liar
Go and tell that midnight rider
Tell the rambler, the gambler, the back biter
Tell 'em that God's gonna cut you down

[Della Cate]

Yes, Simon darling, a "bank full of money", but you only have one suit - the pinstriped one that makes you look like a spiv. Oh, wait a minute.....

5670

Have you actually got any of that money yet? Naturally, I am sure you have reported it all to HMRC too. If not, as you are a busy man, there's loads of people out there only too happy to help by reporting it to the tax man. After all, you've posted it on FB, so it must be true and not a secret, hmmm?

And when are you going to answer Tilly's question?

[Della Cate]

Anybody else think that Chris Smith has, well, run away?

His "webinar" bit last week was recorded, this week he is alledgedly "travelling".

Oh yeah?

[Joe_Shmoe]

Mark Stokes' victim Arthur Crank still confident BB will sort everything out long after stokes himself ran from Banners Broker.

Banners Broker (http://irishtaxi.org/forum/index.php/topic,23209.495.html)

[Ken Roklin]

Anybody else think that Chris Smith has, well, run away?

His "webinar" bit last week was recorded, this week he is alledgedly "travelling".

Oh yeah?

He's probably in Belize, training all his new support staff, training locals on how to use a spreadsheet and how to color panels, shuffling money into different bank accounts, sitting at a beach bar working on his next scam.

[Mundorf]

[QUOTE=Della Cate;59853]

I might recommend a nice restaurant, a hotel, a hairdresser or a cleaning product to someone who asked; but I would never suggest anything where people had to gamble with their money. But some people clearly don't think like that, they will recommend (push) one thing after another regardless of the consequences.

Don't they ever think that this might be, well, wrong?

[QUOTE]

Well said but what are the consequences for most of them?..maybe 1 of 1000 will be processed while mega army of scammers freely move around opening and closing their adventures.In so huge unpunished gray area it's not strange that WRONG is translated and seen as business oportunity and FRAUDULENCE as a risk like any real business has...when bad is not properly punished for any reason,it tends to seek the legality

[HARRISON]

Stellar Point Productions - Animation and Motion Graphics (http://www.stellarpointproductions.com/index.php/services/video-productions/animation-and-motion-graphics)

Is it just me or does anybody else get this?

5674

[Joe_Shmoe]

Stellar Point Productions - Animation and Motion Graphics (http://www.stellarpointproductions.com/index.php/services/video-productions/animation-and-motion-graphics)

Is it just me or does anybody else get this?

5674

Works for me, try a different Browser I'm using Google Chrome.

[littleroundman]

Works for me using Firefox.

Very slow loading and jerky, but works.

[Ken Roklin]

Stellar Point Productions - Animation and Motion Graphics (http://www.stellarpointproductions.com/index.php/services/video-productions/animation-and-motion-graphics)

Is it just me or does anybody else get this?

5674

Another SP product/service. They claim they outperform the competition yet their only clients to date are SP/BB themselves. Under their latest creations all they show is their $1/m web hosting promotion. The "testimonial" section is not active. It's a tough business to get into especially if you have no staff with a track record in this industry.

I'm using Safari and have no problem viewing it. Now, a professional studio would ensure it viewable by all browsers.


"About Us
We out perform the competition with our industry leading green screen productions and outstanding audio production skills. Your project is our main focus, we will deliver the best quality video available for your desired end result whether it be for web, home, event or cinema."

[HARRISON]

They have there own facebook page. SEVEN likes already..

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Stellar-Point-Ad-Network/454217341336861

[Jerrygo]

So Stellar Point is an ad network now?? And is it Banner ads that they are networking?? And will they be brokering those banners?? On the blind network?
Nothing new then.

[Brenda]

So Stellar Point is an ad network now?? And is it Banner ads that they are networking?? And will they be brokering those banners?? On the blind network?
Nothing new then.

One can only hope that anyone looking to do business with this company will do their homework first. It;s association with BB is there for all to see. Raj Dixit's previous history is also there for all to see. Surprisingly, when you do a google search, the first negative comment is all the way down the bottom of page one.

[littleroundman]

Surprisingly, when you do a google search, the first negative comment is all the way down the bottom of page one.

It's not surprising at all to long time observers of the HYIP ponzi fraud world.

If you think back to the early days of Banners Broker, there was a concerted campaign by HYIPers to keep its' Google presence sanitized, even going so far as to fill the first 2 or 3 pages of any Google search using the terms "Banners Broker scam" with pimping.

It's called "online reputation management"

[Brenda]

It's not surprising at all to long time observers of the HYIP ponzi fraud world.

If you think back to the early days of Banners Broker, there was a concerted campaign by HYIPers to keep its' Google presence sanitized, even going so far as to fill the first 2 or 3 pages of any Google search using the terms "Banners Broker scam" with pimping.

It's called "online reputation management"

I remember ! When I was doing my due diligence, I was very confused by what I thought it was and the views of the supporters, particularly on youtube. A quick glance could equally have swayed anyone hoping for confirmation that it was a good thing! What made it a 'red flag' for me was the fact that those youtube promotional videos were also recruitment grounds. They were all page 1 on google searches. Now at least, when you google, page one is full of alerts! Some are actually using BB 's downfall to recruit ohers into other scams ! Beggars belief that there are that many sheep!

http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=banners%20broker&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&ved=0CDkQtwIwAg&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D_1j b25lGjmo&ei=2KUaUrrzN8m52AXHoYG4CA&usg=AFQjCNG5mI2x28-2gGMKLykyOz_yX-fckA

[littleroundman]

Readers can see the tactic being used for themselves.

The Empower Network is flavour of the month with get-rich-quickers at the minute.

Simply type "Empower Network scam" into Google and see for yourself how many of the resulting links are Empower Network members trying to recruit new victims......err.....recruits

[Della Cate]

They have there own facebook page. SEVEN likes already..

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Stellar-Point-Ad-Network/454217341336861

Yes, they started it 28th May.

Do you know what mit reminds me of? David Hooker's page. Those "inspirational" pictures/messages about sucess are so him. I'm not saying he is behind it, of course - just that it looks as if it has his fingerprints on it!

[Della Cate]

Here's a quote - a tip to help attract more customers - from the NEW Stellaproint FB page (not to be confused with the OLD one started 21/12/12):-

"When you sell a product or service, it is a good idea to help your clients/customers understand what product or service you are selling." **

No sh*t, Sherlock! So it I am selling razor blades, I shouldn't let people think I am selling potatoes? Riiiiigggghhhhtt.....I get it now.

With stirling advice like that, I can see just what sort of a company this is.

(** for companies that sell real products only. Does not include ventures selling coloured panels on a computer screen.)

[Della Cate]

Useful posting over on MMG - thanks to Guardianuno:-

Banners Broker - bannersbroker.com (http://www.moneymakergroup.com/Banners-Broker-bannersb-t360913.html&st=10815)

Look for post 10816. Helpfully identifies, with photos, some present and former BBers. They call themselves "Team Funtastic" - https://www.facebook.com/groups/IMLTF/.

We should get together a "rogues gallery" of BBers abd BB apologists, for future reference!

[Della Cate]

On this site - MoneyProof (http://money-proof.com/) - I found this useful illustration which all potential "home business entrepreneurs" should study and memorise!

5681

[Joe_Shmoe]

Funny picture here ... sent to my by a contact in Canada found on a bus stop there!

http://i.imgur.com/AxZdTzR.jpg?1

Now when you all stop rolling on floor ... that's cheap!

This advert makes absolutely no financial sense at all unless this particular region of Canada is crammed full of people requiring $1 web hosting which I doubt, or it is a pathetic attempt by Raj to make his "company" look like a legit company to the Canadian authorities

Another slightly strange thing I have noticed...

Who hosts the Go Daddy web hosting site?

Go Daddy of course.


5682


Who hosts StellarPoint.com ?

Go Daddy again.

5683

Who Hosts StellarPointWebhosting.com ?

5685

BELL.CA Slightly strange for a web hosting company I would have thought?

[littleroundman]

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/5610/1vwa.jpg

[Brenda]

This advert makes absolutely no financial sense at all unless this particular region of Canada is crammed full of people requiring $1 web hosting which I doubt, or it is a pathetic attempt by Raj to make his "company" look like a legit company to the Canadian authorities

Another slightly strange thing I have noticed...

So, me being a novice and all, could be reading this all wrong, but, if they are using godaddy as a host and they are then piggy backing and offering their services as web hosts and they are paying $1.00 for godaddy's services ( see link) then every individual that SP sign up is a $1.00 profit to them? In other words, sign up 100 and you earn $99.00?

Web Hosting | Lightning Fast Hosting & One Click Setup - GoDaddy (http://www.godaddy.com/hosting/web-hosting.aspx?gclid=CPLkncSKm7kCFY5cMgodOFEAbg&isc=hos1ca13&currencytype=CAD&ef_id=Jr5O3Na4LAkAAMin:20130826121138:s)

Who hosts the Go Daddy web hosting site?

Go Daddy of course.


5682


Who hosts StellarPoint.com ?

Go Daddy again.

5683

Who Hosts StellarPointWebhosting.com ?

5685

BELL.CA Slightly strange for a web hosting company I would have thought?




[/SIZE]
So, me being a novice and all, could be reading this all wrong, but, if they are using godaddy as a host and they are then piggy backing and offering their services as web hosts and they are paying $1.00 for godaddy's services ( see link) then every individual that SP sign up is a $1.00 profit to them? In other words, sign up 100 and you earn $99.00?

Web Hosting | Lightning Fast Hosting & One Click Setup - GoDaddy (http://www.godaddy.com/hosting/web-hosting.aspx?gclid=CPLkncSKm7kCFY5cMgodOFEAbg&isc=hos1ca13&currencytype=CAD&ef_id=Jr5O3Na4LAkAAMin:20130826121138:s)
[/SIZE]

I'm going with the trying to make it look like a legit business !

[Ken Roklin]

[/SIZE]
So, me being a novice and all, could be reading this all wrong, but, if they are using godaddy as a host and they are then piggy backing and offering their services as web hosts and they are paying $1.00 for godaddy's services ( see link) then every individual that SP sign up is a $1.00 profit to them? In other words, sign up 100 and you earn $99.00?

Web Hosting | Lightning Fast Hosting & One Click Setup - GoDaddy (http://www.godaddy.com/hosting/web-hosting.aspx?gclid=CPLkncSKm7kCFY5cMgodOFEAbg&isc=hos1ca13&currencytype=CAD&ef_id=Jr5O3Na4LAkAAMin:20130826121138:s)
[/SIZE]

I'm going with the trying to make it look like a legit business !

All their services/products they advertise are legitimate (crappy but legit) products. I think Raj was feeling the heat from the OSC investigation plus he knew that after a couple of years BB was going to be history so why not try and go legit for a while and use this time to come up with a new scam in a couple of years when BB blows over.

[NikSam]

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/5610/1vwa.jpg

This IP Address is residential Symmetric DSL service, so site is in someone's basement or in a bedroom :)
It does not mean that the hosting/reselling it advertised will be on that same computer, but strange for a "hosting" company to host it's company website at home.

[Brenda]

All their services/products they advertise are legitimate (crappy but legit) products. I think Raj was feeling the heat from the OSC investigation plus he knew that after a couple of years BB was going to be history so why not try and go legit for a while and use this time to come up with a new scam in a couple of years when BB blows over.

Not so Ken, surely SP's first and most infamous of business's was BB. Raj is all over BB from the start, it is pure semantics to suggest that SP is legitimate when you look at the name changes and all the similarities of etc. Setting up SP suited a purpose for a pretense of legitimacy IN AN ATTEMPT TO perpetrate and continue the recruitment of it's sister company BB and that in itself is a fraud! Raj will need to do better than this if he thinks he can fool the OSC. It's akin to robbing a bank and then depositing the money back in that bank and expecting the bank to be grateful!

How do we even know what Raj may be thinking, we don't even have any facts about the OSC or their contacts or not with BB/SP or in fact if they are even investigating this whole pathetic lot of gangsters and thieves.

[littleroundman]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLqhkfEngPg&amp;feature=player_detailpage

Stellar Point Inc CEO, Rajiv Dixit (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLqhkfEngPg)

[littleroundman]

Just in case any of our friends from the Land of the Long White Cloud are feeling neglected, here's one of NZs' remaining Banners Broker true believers:

http://imageshack.us/a/img18/7919/c5eg.jpg

mike.leitchheggie on Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/mike.leitchheggie)

http://imageshack.us/a/img14/3835/yyxg.jpg

Mike Leitch-Heggie@ MikeLeitchHeggie on Twitter (https://twitter.com/MikeLeitchHeggi)

http://imageshack.us/a/img18/48/n8t9.jpg

The Mike Leitch-Heggie profile on LinkedIn (http://nz.linkedin.com/pub/mike-leitch-heggie/47/287/496)

http://imageshack.us/a/img10/8228/kqeh.jpg

Mike Leitch-Heggie on ProLink Central NZ (http://www.prolinkcentral.co.nz/prolink/business/network.php?tid=1)

[Brenda]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLqhkfEngPg&feature=player_detailpage

Stellar Point Inc CEO, Rajiv Dixit (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLqhkfEngPg)

Ah, LRM, how do I find those pics taken inside Carlow Court that were posted here after Christmas showing the cough, back office?

World Headquarters! There is a guy who owns a pet shop down the street, it's his world headquarters too! Seriously, is there no one in the UK that lives in the region of those Salford offices that can put paid once and for all, whether it is still there, if someone answers a phone etc?

Those Banner ads on Stellar Points website are so flipping annoying !

[NikSam]

Ah, LRM, how do I find those pics taken inside Carlow Court that were posted here after Christmas showing the cough, back office?

...

Bannersbroker Ponzi Scheme Busted With Stories Again | InternetCyberCrime.com (http://internetcybercrime.com/bannersbroker-ponzi-scheme-busted-with-stories-again/)

[Joe_Shmoe]

LOL I was thinking along the same lines Raj has either been doing some serious decorating at Carlow Court, or has got his green screen out.



BEFORE
568656875688
AFTER :RpS_lol::RpS_lol::RpS_lol:
5689

[NikSam]

Oh, that one is one of the presets for the Green Screen presentations, widely used (just in case someone seriously thought for a second it is a real office):

5690


5691

[Joe_Shmoe]

(!) Next you'll be telling us that these people in Raj's video, completing a business deal aren't real either? :RpS_confused:



5692

[NikSam]

(!) Next you'll be telling us that these people in Raj's video, completing a business deal aren't real either? :RpS_confused:



5692

hate to do it, bummers!!! :)

Business people meeting legal team - 2609192 | Shutterstock Footage (http://footage.shutterstock.com/clip-2609192-stock-footage-business-people-meeting-legal-team.html)


:)

[Brenda]

Oh, that one is one of the presets for the Green Screen presentations, widely used (just in case someone seriously thought for a second it is a real office):

5690


5691


haha Niksam, you weren't talking about me were you ;) It doesn't take too much effort to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear all the same !

[Ken Roklin]

Not so Ken, surely SP's first and most infamous of business's was BB. Raj is all over BB from the start, it is pure semantics to suggest that SP is legitimate when you look at the name changes and all the similarities of etc. Setting up SP suited a purpose for a pretense of legitimacy IN AN ATTEMPT TO perpetrate and continue the recruitment of it's sister company BB and that in itself is a fraud! Raj will need to do better than this if he thinks he can fool the OSC. It's akin to robbing a bank and then depositing the money back in that bank and expecting the bank to be grateful!

How do we even know what Raj may be thinking, we don't even have any facts about the OSC or their contacts or not with BB/SP or in fact if they are even investigating this whole pathetic lot of gangsters and thieves.

I don't believe I disagreed with you on SP's first business being BB. In fact I have stated many times that even though BB was a company legally owned by Chris, Raj was behind it from day one. BB was set up as an offshore company to make it harder to get prosecuted while SP was set up as a 3rd party to do BB's dirty work. Raj has now distanced himself from BB as BB has run out of funds (he knew it wasn't going to last more than a couple of years) and BB is history and is making an effort to get products in that are legit products and services. I don't see how anyone can dispute that. That doesn't mean he is off the hook for his involvement with BB. In fact SP will have a tough time going legit and staying in business because of him and his reputation. He will forever be linked to running scams.

I guess only Raj knows what he is thinking, but I occasionally have a pint with some senior people within SP at my local and do sometimes get info that isn't made public. After a bad day at the office and a couple of pints they seem to want to share more than they should.

And yes, the OSC has definitely investigated BB and SP but nobody knows if it's still ongoing or not as the OSC has not publicized anything yet as to their findings.

[PPBlog]

Bannersbroker Ponzi Scheme Busted With Stories Again | InternetCyberCrime.com (http://internetcybercrime.com/bannersbroker-ponzi-scheme-busted-with-stories-again/)

All that posed, "happy pointing" shown in graphics at the link NikSam posted above reminds me of another "happy pointer." He is shown "happy pointing" in this video (and in a photo below the third paragraph) here:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-505123_162-57586453/feds-bust-online-currency-firm-in-$6b-money-laundering-scheme/

Here is the CBS caption below the photo: "Federal prosecutors charged a gang of cyber thieves with robbing banks around the world of $45 million. Two of the suspects show off the cash in a photo."

They reportedly have alleged links to the $6 billion money-laundering conspiracy of Liberty Reserve.

Not sure how much longer "happy pointing" will be effective for BB.

PPBlog

[HARRISON]

OMG...he touched my hand! This god...this genius.

Chris Smith at the Banners Broker World Tour Manchester 2013 - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6VffozLmOPc)


...pass the sick bag.

[Joe_Shmoe]

Top 10 material here (good for a laugh)

https://soundcloud.com/willie-mcbey

5701

[Brenda]

Top 10 material here (good for a laugh)

https://soundcloud.com/willie-mcbey

5701

funny til you read his tweets. The man is a serial offender and scammer of the worst kind, the ones that go from scam to scam. By the looks of it, BB is just one of his interests

https://twitter.com/WillieMcBey

According to his facebook page, his BB panels capped to the tune of 4940 on the 6th April. It's not a scam folks, oh and sign up here ! lol

[Brenda]

I don't believe I disagreed with you on SP's first business being BB. In fact I have stated many times that even though BB was a company legally owned by Chris, Raj was behind it from day one. BB was set up as an offshore company to make it harder to get prosecuted while SP was set up as a 3rd party to do BB's dirty work. Raj has now distanced himself from BB as BB has run out of funds (he knew it wasn't going to last more than a couple of years) and BB is history and is making an effort to get products in that are legit products and services. I don't see how anyone can dispute that. That doesn't mean he is off the hook for his involvement with BB. In fact SP will have a tough time going legit and staying in business because of him and his reputation. He will forever be linked to running scams.

I guess only Raj knows what he is thinking, but I occasionally have a pint with some senior people within SP at my local and do sometimes get info that isn't made public. After a bad day at the office and a couple of pints they seem to want to share more than they should.

And yes, the OSC has definitely investigated BB and SP but nobody knows if it's still ongoing or not as the OSC has not publicized anything yet as to their findings.

Ken, I can only imagine that your senior SP people that you have a pint or two with have no idea that you are a poster here although I did think that you mentioned that they were loyal and not inclined to discuss SP business with you? Sorry, if my memory is not remembering this correctly.

[Ken Roklin]

Ken, I can only imagine that your senior SP people that you have a pint or two with have no idea that you are a poster here although I did think that you mentioned that they were loyal and not inclined to discuss SP business with you? Sorry, if my memory is not remembering this correctly.

No, they have no clue that I post anywhere. They were loath to discuss BB business but don't seem to have a problem talking about the legit products at SP.

[Joe_Shmoe]

Suprise suprise!
Another Banners Broker pimp Lee Oakey, one of Mark Stokes' pals in the US has added ILM to his list of many scams.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSji9eg0qio#t=3667

[Julie Diligent]

Suprise suprise!
Another Banners Broker pimp Lee Oakey, one of Mark Stokes' pals in the US has added ILM to his list of many scams.

What's your evidence that IML is a scam, Joe?

[HARRISON]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=yiq4MZ6vm0s

[Della Cate]

Top 10 material here (good for a laugh)

https://soundcloud.com/willie-mcbey

5701

Ah yes. And here's a FB page by Mr McBey:-

https://www.facebook.com/WillieMcbeyOnlineBusiness?fref=ts

It's what you might call a mixed bag. "Online opportunities".....computer backup systems.....make money online.....pictures of dogs......a smattering of motivational messages....picture of a camel.......his wedding photos at Gretna Green........and, er," a proven potty training method" - what??

Sigh. I don't think Sir Richard Branson has to worry about a rival entrepreneur yet, do you?

[Della Cate]

Do you know, I am starting to get a feeling of nausea when I see these videos and You Tube presentations and general stuff from these various people who are constantly, relentlessly, pushing "online opportunities".

These people seem to think they are very busy - apart from the fact that they also boast that they can spend time at the beach or golf club because they have "killed the 9 to 5" - but they are not busy doing anything of any worth in my book. In fact I would say that they are actually LAZY, because they are always seeking to make money the easy way, without breaking into a sweat, and they don't seem to care how they make that money. They look down on people who do an ordinary job, but let me tell them now that the person doing the most humble job you can think of is STILL 100 times better than these online entrepreneurs.

So, you lazy bunch - GO AND GET A REAL JOB AND STOP PREYING ON OTHER PEOPLE! 'COS IF ANYONE IS A SCROUNGER, IT'S YOU!

Thank you. I will now get off my soapbox and go and lie down in a darkened room!

[littleroundman]

The key here is the word "SAY" Della.

They "SAY" they have beaten the 9 to 5

They "SAY" they have the car / holiday / lifestyle / pots of cash

Always remember, when it comes to the HYIP ponzi and get-rich-quick worlds, ANYONE who believes ANYTHING is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth is setting themselves up for failure.

[Della Cate]

The key here is the word "SAY" Della.

They "SAY" they have beaten the 9 to 5

They "SAY" they have the car / holiday / lifestyle / pots of cash

Always remember, when it comes to the HYIP ponzi and get-rich-quick worlds, ANYONE who believes ANYTHING is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth is setting themselves up for failure.

Ah yes, LRM - words are indeed cheap. I just wish they would stop saying them!

I believe nothing, but as we know some people believe anything.

Depressing.

[Mundorf]

Ah yes. And here's a FB page by Mr McBey:-

https://www.facebook.com/WillieMcbeyOnlineBusiness?fref=ts

It's what you might call a mixed bag. "Online opportunities".....computer backup systems.....make money online.....pictures of dogs......a smattering of motivational messages....picture of a camel.......his wedding photos at Gretna Green........and, er," a proven potty training method" - what??

Sigh. I don't think Sir Richard Branson has to worry about a rival entrepreneur yet, do you?

So that's it...wedding costs paid by BB affiliates.What other pleasures were paid by others?What is next?..camel?..who are the victims who will pay for him to buy or ride the camel?..for sure not BB once...they are drained till the very last drop

[Della Cate]

Brenda, you asked this:-

"Ah, LRM, how do I find those pics taken inside Carlow Court that were posted here after Christmas showing the cough, back office?"

So here's my personal favourite......isn't it lovely?

5705


The worker on the step ladder is an especially nice touch, I think.

[Ken Roklin]

What's your evidence that IML is a scam, Joe?

You just have to look at the people promoting the program. All of the ones mentioned don't get involved in any business that isn't a HYIP. That's clue 1.

[Ken Roklin]

Brenda, you asked this:-

"Ah, LRM, how do I find those pics taken inside Carlow Court that were posted here after Christmas showing the cough, back office?"

So here's my personal favourite......isn't it lovely?

5705


The worker on the step ladder is an especially nice touch, I think.
I particularly like the floor tiling. That must have cost Raj a bundle.

[Julie Diligent]

You just have to look at the people promoting the program. All of the ones mentioned don't get involved in any business that isn't a HYIP. That's clue 1. I'm inclined to think they'll gravitate towards whatever they believe will pour rich-quick bucks into their accounts... though this time not accounts opened with the Monopoly Money Bank, they'll be hoping... whether that be a sock-puppety Ponzi or Pyramid, or even a legitimate bizopp.

[Della Cate]

Well, well. Our old friend Simon "Roland Rat" Stepsys seems to have an old alter ego on Facebook - as one "Russell Ramos" (in 2011). BB is mentioned in a posting dated 30/11/2011.

Joke maybe?Still pushing schemes though......and yet has the Simon Stepsys photos we all know and love.

https://www.facebook.com/russell.ramos.585?fref=pb&hc_location=friends_tab

He has even posted a picture of his electricity bill (why?) which clearly shows the name of Simon Stepsys and address at 96 Welsh Row, Nantwich! Russell Ramos claims to have studied at Concordia University, Irvine, which is in California.

Very, very odd.....but maybe useful if anyone has come across him in this guise?