Banners Broker HYIP ponzi scam

[Finix]

Hard money, easy money..piffle. It's "somebody else's money" that they're stealing that makes it wrong.
Wrong? From whose perspective? Your's? Society's? This scene operates outside the social norms.

[Finix]

Oh,I would not say that.Any other people's money would be hard earned money ( from my point of view) for the simple reason it's not my money and jet I have it
That's why you are not a HYIP admin :P Seriously, if you want to understand the scene, I mean really understand it, you have to suspend everything you know and consider normal, ethical, etc.

[Hypanor]

Has the BB Australia Facebook page gone? I can't find it anymore.

Perhaps the authorities have finally started poking around from the complaints made about offering 'Financial Services'.
Lucky someone has plenty of screenshots and background information on the page admin should they need it....

[Beacon]

Wrong? From whose perspective? Your's? Society's? This scene operates outside the social norms.

One can look at it from the point of view of nature.
somethings are always wrong. for example abusing a child. Yes there are those who say "if society decided (child abuse/rape/gassing concentration camp inmates) was okay then it would be acceptable"
Natural Law would say clearly it would NOT be right it would always be wrong. that in the absence of laws about it what the Nazis did was wrong. In fact the Nazis made laws which in fact said what they were doing was right. They made these laws in their own democratically elected parliament.

So the idea of "social norms" while appealing are not absolutes. Yes people should respect peoples traditions but if those traditions support child abuse rape slavery or genocide then they are wrong.

So where does this lead us? Well it isn't from my perspective or yours or anyones relative subjective perspective. Nor indeed from any societies perspective. What they are doing is wrong, just as exterminating people was wrong when Nazis did it. That is called the "natural law" argument and gets around the "ther is no law against it so it cant be wrong" issue and the arguments of moral relativism and subjective norms.

that said i dont think the instigators of Banners Broker put as much thought into their ethics as the Greek Philosophers or Early Christians or fathers of democracy put into their systems.

[Beacon]

That's why you are not a HYIP admin :P Seriously, if you want to understand the scene, I mean really understand it, you have to suspend everything you know and consider normal, ethical, etc.
But one does not have to become evil in order to understand evil. I dont like using words like "evil" because it may well bog us down in "really understanding" what is meant by "evil" and the subjective argument of personal interpretations of "evil" but I think I have shown the counter argument against moral relativism. In order to assert a "real understanding" you would have to begin by saying that the thing you understand is the same thing that they do and can be objectively described and /or measured. So in a sense you yourself have already rejected moral relativism.
But more to the point I would argue BB management are aware of the wrong but chose to ignore it because they dont care about the harm they do to others if it wins them money. The argument that they suspend ethics I reject. One for example could claim some Nazis who were totally sane believed in the cause and thought they were making the world better. These were few in number. Most knew they were persecuting others but didnt care because it meant they were living off the suffering of others e.g. inheriting the local Jew's big house when they "sent the family away".

[Whip]

There seems to have been a little confusion over this option, so to help alleviate that confusion we have re-worded the payout 'day limit' to read 'calendar days' as opposed to 'work days', which seemed to be the source of that confusion.

Didn't they just say it was going to be 'business days' and not weekends days about a week ago?

[EagleOne]

All Ponzi's are lies. Everything about them is a lie. There is nothing truthful about them. It is stealing, and it makes no difference from what perspective you want to look at it. These are not real businesses. Their whole purpose is to steal as much money they can while pretending to be a real business and the illusion they are telling the truth.

There are players and promoters/pimps who have no conscious and could care less they are stealing as long as they get theirs; no matter what the cost to others.They lie just like the admins lie, and in some cases even more than the admin lies. Whatever it takes to make sure they get theirs they will do. The promoters and players are just as guilty as the admions who run these Ponzi's. They deserve to go to prison just like the admins do, and hopefully starting with Zeek that will begin to happen. For until it does, these will never go away. They need to know if you play you will pay.

The moment the Ken Russo's, Faith Sloans, Strosdegoz, Rayda Roundy, Sara Mattoon, Barb Alford, Laura Pont, Aaron-Shara, Barb McIntrye, Arnie Strom, Chad Foss, Brad Weinman, Terralynn Hoy, Todd Disner, Dwight Schweitzer, Robert Fava, Pastor Troy Winters, Clarence Busby, Nanci Jo Frazer, Frabi, racer, Blondie, and the list goes on and on are made to pay for their involvement, the sooner these Ponzi's will disappear.

[baylee]

All Ponzi's are lies. Everything about them is a lie. There is nothing truthful about them. It is stealing, and it makes no difference from what perspective you want to look at it. These are not real businesses. Their whole purpose is to steal as much money they can while pretending to be a real business and the illusion they are telling the truth.

There are players and promoters/pimps who have no conscious and could care less they are stealing as long as they get theirs; no matter what the cost to others.They lie just like the admins lie, and in some cases even more than the admin lies. Whatever it takes to make sure they get theirs they will do. The promoters and players are just as guilty as the admions who run these Ponzi's. They deserve to go to prison just like the admins do, and hopefully starting with Zeek that will begin to happen. For until it does, these will never go away. They need to know if you play you will pay.

The moment the Ken Russo's, Faith Sloans, Strosdegoz, Rayda Roundy, Sara Mattoon, Barb Alford, Laura Pont, Aaron-Shara, Barb McIntrye, Arnie Strom, Chad Foss, Brad Weinman, Terralynn Hoy, Todd Disner, Dwight Schweitzer, Robert Fava, Pastor Troy Winters, Clarence Busby, Nanci Jo Frazer, Frabi, racer, Blondie, and the list goes on and on are made to pay for their involvement, the sooner these Ponzi's will disappear.

Excellent post and one that I agree with 1000%. I hope it happens soon, the sooner the better!

[littleroundman]

Didn't they just say it was going to be 'business days' and not weekends days about a week ago?

Therein lies the problem.

"They said"

Anyone who believes ANYTHING said in the HYIP ponzi world is going to be disappointed.

Regular HYIP ponzi players know, once you've sent your money, anything after that is pure luck.

[Brenda]

From the BB Netwrok Facebook page, posted an hour ago (apologies if you have seen this):-


(The bold emphasis is mine)

BBI is excited to announce an all new membership option coming soon called Executive. So for those of you looking to grow your business even further, there will now be three options: Standard, Premium and Executive. Aspects of this exciting new Executive option will be released soon, but it'll be worth the wait. (Don't you love being teased?)

With the new membership option there will also be a new panel level launched, called Prestige! There will be no colour with this panel level but rather a pattern to spruce things up. (Matching wardrobe not included)

Affiliates in India now have a reason to celebrate, because we now have a new provider for pay outs who will be able to wrap up the bank deposit slip issue ASAP. The bank option will be removed for India today, but will be made available again in a couple of weeks as we get the system ready for our provider there.

Regarding the panel speeds, we recognize that over the holidays they did not run at the same speed they have throughout the rest of the year, however there's no reason to be alarmed. This is not something under our control, this just has to do with a drop in internet usage, as less people are online at this time of year, but also keep in mind, that panels don't move at real-time. Also BBI does not guarantee any set times for panels to complete, but as the holiday season is now behind us sufficiently, traffic has once again increased across the net, and it will gradually be reflected in the panels.

Payouts have unfortunately fallen behind, but it's also nothing to worry about. We are rapidly catching up in all aspects, Payza, STP, as well as US Bank deposits.

As of Feb 1, 2013, in order to successfully with draw funds to the BB card you will need to have proper ID uploaded to the system. We are now completely up to date on ID approvals.

Here is some exciting news regarding the BB prepaid card. We have moved this system over to a more automated system to quicken the process for withdrawals. We are currently about a week behind, but again, now that the changes have been made we are catching up rapidly. Our IT team is constantly working to improve your experiences, and we're sure you'll appreciate their efforts. There will also be an announcement soon regarding a reverse option for the e-Wallet. There seems to have been a little confusion over this option, so to help alleviate that confusion we have re-worded the payout 'day limit' to read 'calendar days' as opposed to 'work days', which seemed to be the source of that confusion.

That's all for now so stay tuned. We're constantly working to improve your experience with Banners Broker International, and we appreciate your being a part of our family.

As an aside, or looking at this communication in a different light

- new option, Executive, new panel level, change of payment method for India ( not been paid since Nov???) all require major IT team to coordinate
- if 30% of affiliates looked to withdraw once a month, that would be 100,000 requests, currently being done manually, large volume support ticket team required
- catching up on payouts, that is, payza, STP, US bank deposits, never mind the mastercard! another team of data entry required
- ID's up to date, phew, the uploaders finished, what another massive undertaking in terms of resources.
- BB credit cards, can only go from 'manual to automated' having been manually imputed first, another team of busy bees.

the point I'm trying to make here, Stellarpoint claim to be the PR arm of BB, so they are not staffing the business, therefore, BB must have a business employing real people to do all they say they are doing. So, where are all these staff? Where are they working from? This is not a rhetorical question, I think I know the answer, but anyone doing due diligence, please stop and think this through!

BTW, US BANK DEPOSITS?? US? Thought they couldn't operate there?

[Justin Casey]

All this Ponzi malarkey is new to me but quite fascinating. Judging by the incredible proliferation of YouTube videos – 23,000-plus, with dozens more being uploaded every day – there appears to be life in BB yet. Some have hundreds of thousands of views, a couple more than a million. That’s just the results from an English-language search “Banners Broker”. Quite a few Cyrillic alphabet results, but there must be thousands more in Arabic and various other languages and alphabets. Add to that all the blogs, Facebook pages and Twitter accounts and that’s an overwhelming amount of propaganda. It must be enough to maintain a steady stream of new income. After that it’s a question of maintaining the illusion by distributing “earnings” on a geographically optimum basis. I’m sure somebody, maybe a computer genius, could work out an algorithm for that.

Some of the pitches are hilarious: “What I want to do is give you a brief overview of how Banners Broker actually works and it is very, very simple... What I want you to do is not dig around at the roots but to pick the flowers. Because if you were to try and work out just how Banners Broker manage to do this you’ll never do it in a million years. It is very simple and I want to keep it as simple as I possibly can.” Quite.

Banners Broker Scam - Ignorance is Bliss? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ra_Q7SxOI58)

The most slick pitch is the Leadership Call hosted by David Hooker on January 21 which has been re-posted numerous times and, it appears, dubbed into other languages. It aims to anticipate objections, for example: “97 per cent of revenue from Google comes from advertising, about 37.3 billion dollars. Yet they don’t really have a product.” It all seems almost plausible, if you can stand Hooker’s unctuous delivery, up until about fifteen minutes in when the legerdemain happens. By then most people will have been bamboozled enough to make their excuses and leave. Just kidding! Quite the opposite unfortunately.

2013-01-21 Leadership Call - Hosted by David Hooker (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXnLyreIXA0)

However, you won’t find the most relevant YouTube video under a “Banners Broker” search. It’s actually the video that any prospective “affiliate” must watch!

DePonzification 101 – Lesson #1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wng-eSUk9I0)

If you can’t figure out how that might apply to you, then by all means sign up at once. Because you’re worth it. No, really. :RpS_smile:

[okosh]

The moment the Ken Russo's, Faith Sloans, Strosdegoz, Rayda Roundy, Sara Mattoon, Barb Alford, Laura Pont, Aaron-Shara, Barb McIntrye, Arnie Strom, Chad Foss, Brad Weinman, Terralynn Hoy, Todd Disner, Dwight Schweitzer, Robert Fava, Pastor Troy Winters, Clarence Busby, Nanci Jo Frazer, Frabi, racer, Blondie, and the list goes on and on are made to pay for their involvement, the sooner these Ponzi's will disappear.

You'd think that Chad Foss and the others would have learned a lesson after the CEP clawbacks.....
SEC v. Colon End Parenthesis Trust LLC (http://www.wfperkinsforcep.com/)

[Gregg]

You'd think that Chad Foss and the others would have learned a lesson after the CEP clawbacks.....
SEC v. Colon End Parenthesis Trust LLC (http://www.wfperkinsforcep.com/)

That's the rub. Chad did learn, and learned well. You see, Foss was a net winner of just shy of $46,000 but only had to pay back $20,000 on an initial investment of less than $500. So while the investors who were net losers got back I think about 3-5% of what they put in, Shad got to keep all of his investment and $26,000 profit. He didn't get slapped down, he just had to give up less than half his profit. Had he been a net loser, he would have gotten back $15-$25, but instead he got $26,000.


I like Bill Perkins, and at the time it was revolutionary for someone to go after the net winners for clawbacks, but letting them keep a single penny turned out to be a bad idea. All that it did was establish that if they fought the receiver, they end up keeping most of their stolen money.

[Gregg]

I started a new post, but still on the same rant.

As I said, CEP was the first time I recall that the winners faced clawbacks. But look at the various settlements made. Dustin Fennel (who was the admin of another ponzi that collapsed and he folded his downlines into CEP) "made" $104,000 and only had to pay back $30,000. Dustin put NO MONEY of his own into the scheme, he just delivered the sheep from his own failed ponzi and in the end kept $74,000!
Marvin Bailey (who had accounts also for his wife and son) was in profit to $77,000 and paid back only $4,400 (no there is not a typo with a digit missing there) keeping 82% of his ill gotten profits.
Greg Ducket and wife Mary made $98,000 and got to keep $97,000 of it. That's just an outrage.

Go read the documents section of the CEP site, look for the 3 "proposed settlements" but I warn you, it might very well make you sick.

[littleroundman]

I couldn't agree with you more, Gregg.

From the outside, it "seems" there has been a hardening of attitudes, both from the authorities and receivers in the past few prosecutions.

One can only hope someone, somewhere has realized the enormity of the problems being created for world economies by the HYIP ponzi "industry" and decided enough is enough.

IM(very)HO, the involvement of the Presidents' Task Force on organized crime and money laundering in the last few HYIP prosecutions is an encouraging sign the times are indeed a changin'

[okosh]

That's the rub. Chad did learn, and learned well. You see, Foss was a net winner of just shy of $46,000 but only had to pay back $20,000 on an initial investment of less than $500. So while the investors who were net losers got back I think about 3-5% of what they put in, Shad got to keep all of his investment and $26,000 profit. He didn't get slapped down, he just had to give up less than half his profit. Had he been a net loser, he would have gotten back $15-$25, but instead he got $26,000.


I like Bill Perkins, and at the time it was revolutionary for someone to go after the net winners for clawbacks, but letting them keep a single penny turned out to be a bad idea. All that it did was establish that if they fought the receiver, they end up keeping most of their stolen money.

With the Zeek receiver now going after the net winners one can only hope that he doesn't let them off one cent.....Hope he makes them sell their assets to pay back the lot.....

[noname999]

Still trying to find out what the max a member could take out in a month if he used more than one method? (if that is allowed)

Also, do people remember when they decided that you had to give 3 months notice of a withdrawal of over 10k, was that per month or per payment?

[Mundorf]

That's why you are not a HYIP admin :P Seriously, if you want to understand the scene, I mean really understand it, you have to suspend everything you know and consider normal, ethical, etc.

It's not a big deal.Believe me, it's quite easy.Anything you do or say to others just ask yourself - would you like the same done or said to you by others?If I would be faced with challenge to create a program like BB ,the first thing I would take in consideration is - would I like (would I feel good) to be recruited by who knows whom with my money invested by knowing all possible consequences?

[Poyol]

Still trying to find out what the max a member could take out in a month if he used more than one method? (if that is allowed)

Also, do people remember when they decided that you had to give 3 months notice of a withdrawal of over 10k, was that per month or per payment?

I assume that'll be each payment.
The admins have a longer amount of time to get money together then ... or should I say the new recruits do.

Jason

[noname999]

I assume that'll be each payment.
The admins have a longer amount of time to get money together then ... or should I say the new recruits do.

Jason

I wonder. It would seem to me that if the cap is every month rather than every payment it would slow things down more. No?

[AshKen1]

Mate tells me that every time he signs in, the bit about synchronisation takes place regardless. There is an option to skip that... but you don't get to hit it as by that time it's finished synchronising.......



Activation FeeJanuary 30, 2013, 9:41 amPreviously, the $35 BannersBroker Prepaid Master Card Activation Fee had not been being charged. On January 29th, all affiliates that have an active card were charged this fee.


So now they're putting through the activation fee? Wonder how many affiliates that little move will put into a "negative balance"

There is a good British saying about organising a drinking session in a place that makes beer (this is the polite version) and it strikes me that BB are totally incapable to doing anything. I know you'll all say this is part and parcel of the ponzi scheme, but surely some of the affiliates must be waking up and smelling the coffee???

*Sigh*

[littleroundman]

I know you'll all say this is part and parcel of the ponzi scheme, but surely some of the affiliates must be waking up and smelling the coffee???

I think you're missing the point.

At this stage, Banners Broker WANTS to shake off members.

The real money has been made, any money coming in now is cream to those behind Banners Broker.

The more members who drop out of their "own" accord, the better it will be for Banners Broker when the inevitable collapse finally happens.

[AshKen1]

Anyone want information on the Advertising Co-ordinator option?

[AshKen1]

I think you're missing the point.

At this stage, Banners Broker WANTS to shake off members.

The real money has been made, any money coming in now is cream to those behind Banners Broker.

The more members who drop out of their "own" accord, the better it will be for Banners Broker when the inevitable collapse finally happens.

Yup you're right, I was missing the point: can you explain it a bit more please? Just for the benefit of anyone looking in.

[waverider]

Hit the nail on the head, Ashken1, what a bunch of thievin' bastards, I thought I'd be slugged the anticipated $35 fee about the time I received my BB card, on or around the time I received and activated the card, but SIX months down the track???? WTF???? That's it, shut them down. They're obviously a scam! How dare they give interest-free credit to their affiliates for 6 months on the $35 card fee???? I been a "premium member" since december but haven't been slugged the appropriate $100 per month premium member charge, just the once last month, but not retrospective for the previous five months. How dare they extend interest-free credit to their affiliates on fees and charges disclosed to them at the point of sale. I can only hope the authorities act swiftly on this unauthorized act of generosity.

[AshKen1]

Hit the nail on the head, Ashken1, what a bunch of thievin' bastards, I thought I'd be slugged the anticipated $35 fee about the time I received my BB card, on or around the time I received and activated the card, but SIX months down the track. That's it, shut them down. They're obviously a scam! How dare they give interest-free credit to their affiliates for 6 months on the $35 card fee???? I been a "premium member" since december but haven't been slugged the appropriate $100 per month premium member charge, just the once last month, but not retrospective for the previous five months. How dare they extend interest-free credit to their affiliates on fees and charges disclosed to them at the point of sale. I can only hope the authorities act swiftly on this unauthorized act of generosity.

Hey waverider, you're back!! How ya doin'?

:RpS_smile:

[Finix]

With the Zeek receiver now going after the net winners one can only hope that he doesn't let them off one cent.....Hope he makes them sell their assets to pay back the lot.....
By the time they are done paying Ira Sorkin to defend themselves from clawbacks, there might not be anything left to go after.

[Finix]

The moment the Ken Russo's, Faith Sloans, Strosdegoz, Rayda Roundy, Sara Mattoon, Barb Alford, Laura Pont, Aaron-Shara, Barb McIntrye, Arnie Strom, Chad Foss, Brad Weinman, Terralynn Hoy, Todd Disner, Dwight Schweitzer, Robert Fava, Pastor Troy Winters, Clarence Busby, Nanci Jo Frazer, Frabi, racer, Blondie, and the list goes on and on are made to pay for their involvement, the sooner these Ponzi's will disappear.
That's wishful thinking. Scams were a part of the society from the moment the society existed. They will be a part of the society until the human race disappears from this planet.

[Finix]

But one does not have to become evil in order to understand evil.
See how you had to shift from "wrong" to "evil"? Those are very different concepts.

[Finix]

But more to the point I would argue BB management are aware of the wrong but chose to ignore it because they dont care about the harm they do to others if it wins them money.
The admins who get involved under their real names are stupid enough to believe their own BS about helping the little man and such. They are toys in the hands of big time players whose real names you will never see in the open.

[Poyol]

See how you had to shift from "wrong" to "evil"? Those are very different concepts.

Wrong

Noun
An unjust, dishonest, or immoral action.

Verb
Act unjustly or dishonestly toward (someone): "the people I have wronged"

Ponzis are wrong.

[Finix]

Ponzis are wrong.
I'm not disagreeing with this, but what does it add to the fact that they exist and will continue to exist?

[Poyol]

I'm not disagreeing with this, but what does it add to the fact that they exist and will continue to exist?

Nothing. Nothing at all.
It seemed as though you were defending Ponzis; I apologise.

Jason

[Finix]

What's wrong for one is right for another. UncleFesta will tell you that they are a nice wealth-redistribution mechanism, and in his own twisted way he is correct as well.

"Ponzies are illegal" is a much better framework for the discussion.

[noname999]

Ah waverider, welcome back. We have missed you. I've a very simple question for you. Hopefully you can answer it. Now that you are a premium member, I'm sure the words will flow easily:

How do BB make money?

(No cheating now, answer it yourself.)

[Della Cate]

Ah, here's a comment from my favourite BB affilate! Good to see he's still plugging away. Apparently he is boasting (but not to me) that he will soon have £100k in his e-wallet.

Yes, you idiot, but do you have it in your hand???

Interesting that anti BB blogs are now exercising the mind.



Yesterday's Bristol meeting presented by David Hooker was really worthwhile. A simple straight forward presentation to around 100 people with about a third of them being guests. Good news that the Company has committed to a 10 year lease on the new headquarters in Manchester; that's confidence for you for the long term.

My impression now is that the negative bloggers/scamming sites are a parasitic industry of their own; they feed on the life-blood of others. They make money by attracting as many people as possible to their sites, on which they also have adverts. So they get a click everytime someone goes there. It seems to me that the soundness of their information is not important, just so long as they can stay marginally within the libel laws. It's all based on the principle that people love finding anything negative, even when there is so much evidence to the contary, and particularly when it's a new idea. Did you know that when franchising first started it was considered a very dirty business model? And look at it now.

As the old saying goes, 'Dogs bark but the caravan moves on'. With membership having gone from 135,000 to some 300,000 in just four months let the dogs bark. The 1,000,000 members target is now in view, in my opinion.

[Della Cate]

Oh, and from the same affiliate's site, info divulged at a meeting in Bristol last night (I think 1st Jan 2013 is a typo and he means 1st Feb or 31st Jan - it has only been posted in the last 15 hours or so)

1st January 2013

MANCHESTER OFFCE

At Salford Quays, Manchester, on a 10 year lease. Opening on 25th February. Corporate training team will be over from Canada.

INTERNATIONAL OFFICES

David Hooker says that BB will be opening an office in Brazil in March and that there is now a Bangladeshi office and two in the West Indies, one of which is in Trinidad.


GROWTH

The business apparently went from some 135,000 to 300, 000 members in just four months! 1st target is 1,000,000 members.


INTERNATIONAL CONVENTION

The Convention will probably be either at the end of Jun or, in July this year, at Niagara Falls

[Hypanor]

Banners Broker Network (http://www.facebook.com/bannersbrokernetwork) News Update!

Great news the prepaid card payments are now fully automated. Going forward if your card is notarised you will be able to withdraw 4 times a month. Until recently Chris was manually taking care of all the payments and he honoured all payments requested on the same day. Now as this is automated request must be made 7 calendar days apart. For example if you wish to withdraw $10,000 you must request $2,500 every 7 days.

If you are availing of the ACS service you must submit a support ticket and they will look after your withdrawal.
Wednesday at 03:57 · 2

Nice job 'Chris', manually looking after the payments for 300,000 affiliates all on your own! I'm guessing you can do it now by just pressing a button on your phone?

[Finix]

'Dogs bark but the caravan moves on'.
That sums it up pretty well as far as the 'industry' as a whole goes. However, when even the ponzi promoters say a program is dead, there is nothing that will resurrect it.

[noname999]

This scam is not dead. I don't know why you think it is.

[Mundorf]

I'm not disagreeing with this, but what does it add to the fact that they exist and will continue to exist?

It adds the determination to fight the wrong whenever it is possible

[Mundorf]

That's wishful thinking. Scams were a part of the society from the moment the society existed. They will be a part of the society until the human race disappears from this planet.

I agree.But first you must build ideal condition,aim if you want to take maximum from your doings

[Finix]

It adds the determination to fight the wrong whenever it is possible
It's a fight you can't win. One scam goes down, ten more appear in its place. I would look into legalizing the online 'industry', so that it can be removed from the sphere of criminal enterprise, taxed and regulated, but I don't think people are ready for that.

[Mundorf]

It's a fight you can't win. One scam goes down, ten more appear in its place. I would look into legalizing the online 'industry', so that it can be removed from the sphere of criminal enterprise, taxed and regulated, but I don't think people are ready for that.

Yes you right but if the people are not ready for that you might think ,legalizing the online industry is a fight you can't win and jet you are suggesting in fact good thing...I just wanted to say..any fight is good - it opens the door for the fight we could win

[Poyol]

It's a fight you can't win. One scam goes down, ten more appear in its place. I would look into legalizing the online 'industry', so that it can be removed from the sphere of criminal enterprise, taxed and regulated, but I don't think people are ready for that.

I'll help to try and keep cutting the Hydra's heads off as much as I can.
Someone has to try and help - if we all took the same approach ... well, who knows.

Jason

[Finix]

it opens the door for the fight we could win
That's true. You can keep telling people that what they are walking into is a criminal enterprise and that it can ruin their lives in more ways that they can imagine and regardless of whether they make money or lose money. Some might even listen.

[littleroundman]

Good news that the Company has committed to a 10 year lease on the new headquarters in Manchester;

Yeah, right.

Banners Broker have ripped off around 100,000 people for multiple millions of dollars and they are going to be worried about reneging on a 10 year lease.

Only a HYIP ponzi member could see an announcement like that as meaning anything.

[littleroundman]

Yup you're right, I was missing the point: can you explain it a bit more please? Just for the benefit of anyone looking in.

Read the post following yours from Waverider. http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index260.html#post44146

There are still members who believe Banners Broker is a badly run legitimate company.

If it closes suddenly, they "may" complain to the authorities or, more than likely, hope someone else does it for them.

If Banners Broker do it this way, not only will none of them complain, many of the remaining members will accept Banners Brokers' explanations, blame themselves for not keeping the faith and probably follow their uplines into their "next big thing" opportunity

[Hypanor]

Discussions about the deeper meaning of life and Ponzi's would be better suited to another thread - this one is about Banners Broker. As I see it, sites like this serve two purposes - to gather information to inform the unwary or cautious (should they decide to read any of it), and to gather information on people actively promoting the scam on the off-chance some legal or civil action may one day occur. If in some parallel universe, Banners Broker turns out not to be a scam, well I'm sure they'll be pleased about the free adverts.

With that in mind, this Facebook page (http://www.facebook.com/MyBannersBrokerSuccess) has 600+ followers so is worthy of being posted here... was there some talk somewhere of BB not operating in the US? Why was that?

2945

The page is administered by Laurence Bealer (http://www.facebook.com/lbealer)

2943

[Mundorf]

That's true. You can keep telling people that what they are walking into is a criminal enterprise and that it can ruin their lives in more ways that they can imagine and regardless of whether they make money or lose money. Some might even listen.

I remember people asking Mr.Edison why was he trying and endless trying after 5000 experiments the mission that was impossible as they were thinking.He answered - Only I know 5000 reasons why the bulb is not working...so I think determination is the key word...sorry for being offtopic

[littleroundman]

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc153/thelittleroundman/scams%202/Bealer-FB_zpscd90c905.jpg

Well, well, what a surprise...... NOT....

Amy Jacobellis, serial cash gifter and owner of the newly launched HYIP pyramid / ponzi Money For Causes (http://behindmlm.com/companies/money-for-causes-review-weekly-fee-pyramid-scheme/) as reviewed this week by OzSoapbox on BehindMLM.com (http://behindmlm.com/)

[Hypanor]

Another USA page (http://www.facebook.com/BannersBrokersSuperstars), with 1000+ likes

2946

Admin by Nancy Neubauer (http://www.facebook.com/nneubauer)

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[marsh56]

Any sign of Marsh? I'd like to get his thoughts on the state of play now.
You rang? :RpS_wink:

My opinion is that BB is doing everything it can right now to keep more funds on their side of the ledger leading up to the next "world tours".

Then as they bring in more new money, panels will suddenly "speed up" and withdrawals will as well.

Honestly this one fooled me and I am at least mildly intelligent and have some real world business savvy. There is no doubt in my mind BB is a Ponzi but it is a masterful one. Time will tell just how long it will last.

Actually it is reminiscent of PIPS from days gone by. Their principals traveled the world and eventually were shut down.

Mark

[Poyol]

Off-topic:

But when people threaten you for posting against Banners Broker - you shouldn't always take them for granted.

Always be vigilant.

BBC News - Aamir Siddiqi: Hitmen Jason Richards and Ben Hope guilty (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-21276423)

Jason

[Finix]

With that in mind, this Facebook page (http://www.facebook.com/MyBannersBrokerSuccess)


The best way of learning about anything is by doing It doesn't apply to scams. The only thing you are going to learn by doing is "don't do it".

[Hypanor]

Many posts still from India and Pakistan of not being paid. Here's a small selection:

2949

2950

2951

2952

2953

[Nourjan]

I would look into legalizing the online 'industry', so that it can be removed from the sphere of criminal enterprise, taxed and regulated, but I don't think people are ready for that.


That is a very interesting idea you're proposing.Perhaps you should open a thread to further discuss this,or point me to the relevant threads should anyone have already initiated this topic.

[path2prosperity]

That sums it up pretty well as far as the 'industry' as a whole goes. However, when even the ponzi promoters say a program is dead, there is nothing that will resurrect it.

Crime is the fastest growth industry on the planet. It always has been and always will be. Crime prevention is the second largest and the gap is closing faster than ever before.

I am not interested in academic arguments with you Finix but I advised Jason to listen to you and he is holding his own. I do not come into BB thread very often so I am not going to debate the matter. My washing machine is playing silly B's and I am more concerned about that than academic arguments. I have had my say FOR TODAY.

[Finix]

I actually agree with Hypanor that this doesn't belong in BB thread and apologize for my part in off-top. Let's ask the admins to move it to another thread if people are interested in discussing general industry issues.

[AshKen1]

Quote from someone on FB page

https://www.facebook.com/bannersbrokernetwork?ref=ts&fref=ts

2961

In particular see this bit:


...
Yellow taking about 40 days to cap out ....

[Finix]

This scam is not dead. I don't know why you think it is.
We have very different definitions of what is dead and what is not, that's why.

[Della Cate]

From BB Facts and Updates 1 hour ago;

Banners Broker International Withdrawal Policy
Amended February 1, 2013

Effective February 1st 2013, the only way to get paid is the Banners Broker Prepaid MasterCard.
If the Banners Broker Prepaid MasterCard is not available in your country please note:
The first $5 000 of the requested withdrawal will be paid via your country’s payout option(s) as per the website.
The remaining amount of the withdrawal will be paid via bank wire with the same guidelines and restrictions .

Any withdrawal amounts exceeding $10, 000 will be governed by the following guidelines:
Withdrawal requests (exceeding $10 000) will only be processed if you have uploaded notarized I.D., that has been approved by Banners Broker Corporate, in your back office.

The balance will only be wired to a Business account, which must be registered in the same country as registered by the affiliate on their account. The business bank account must also be located in the same country of registration.

An invoice drafted requesting publisher revenue owed, on a company letterhead, must accompany each withdrawal request. The invoice must be addressed to Banners Broker International, International Head Office 35 Road Belize City, Belize C.A. You may email these documents to fax@bannersbroker.com, fax them to (1) 905 674 5957 or mail them to Stellar Point who handles all correspondence for Banners Broker International, at 5 Carlow Ct. Whitby, Ontario L1N 9T7.

Processing time is 90 days and funds must be available in the EWallet at the time of each request.

Please note that for your withdrawal request to be issued you must have loaded at least $10 000 onto your Banners Broker prepaid MasterCard within 5 weeks of the date of the expected wire.

Accounts must have a positive dollar amount and be in good standing for the withdrawal request to be processed.

This Withdrawal Policy applies to all current and future affiliates and is a legally binding document. Banners Broker International holds the rights to deny any withdrawal request submitted

[Della Cate]

So.....is this now the end game? You have to invoice them in Belize? And note the last bit:-


This Withdrawal Policy applies to all current and future affiliates and is a legally binding document. Banners Broker International holds the rights to deny any withdrawal request submitted

[AshKen1]

So.....is this now the end game? You have to invoice them in Belize? And note the last bit:-


This Withdrawal Policy applies to all current and future affiliates and is a legally binding document. Banners Broker International holds the rights to deny any withdrawal request submitted

So BBI we know about.... who is/are/were


Banners Broker CorporateSee your previous post Della.

"legally binding document"

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahah

[AshKen1]

The following is the information on the Advertising Coordinator option. I have italicised and made bold the interesting points. Feel free to pick this to pieces.

"Our experts will provide professional guidance on how to maximize your advertising within our extended network of publishing sites – using targeted keywords, search engine optimization, efficient tracking tools, and increased visibility. Together we can create a marketing solution that works specifically for you.


Product
Price
(Based on your highest active package)
Years of Contract
(Minimum 1 year)


Advertising Coordinator

https://bannersbroker.com/images/adcoordinator.png
$xx.x

Years:
1 2 3




Fee structure:
When you purchase this service, Banners Broker will charge you 10% of the highest package you purchase initially or 10% of EWallet funding of your account in the last 2 months, whichever is more. Then each month you will be charged 10% of whatever goes to your E-wallet.
Every time you fund your account, 10% is taken as a fee



Banners Broker Advertising Coordinator Guidelines
Goal of this service:


To bring a worldwide policy to accounts manage
To ensure this service is promoted properly
To ensure longevity of Banners Broker
To ensure that each account is managed the same way and with the same expectations
To ensure pricing is fair and the same worldwide

For your account to be coordinated to its maximum potential, Banners Broker recommends that you do not make any withdrawal requests within the first year of signing up for the Advertising Coordinator service. If you withdraw within the first year of sign up, this has the potential to limit the continual growth of your account.
Guidelines for each Advertising Coordinator


Whatever amount is spent, the largest package available must be purchased.

Example:$600 funded - Professional package must be purchased
$2000 funded - Enterprise package must be purchased


If Affiliate funds account within 30 days, the account must be upgraded depending upon the amount
If Affiliate funds account after 30 days the account must purchase the next color panel if funds are available before managing the account
All communications with clients will be done by Advertising Coordinator Customer Service
All managed accounts must have an active campaign, these campaigns will use the choice network only
Please, fill in the following questions.

What is your monthly financial goal with our Ad Coordinator service?



Would you like the advertising coordinator to manage your account until you have achieved that goal?



What is the timeline you hope to achieve in?



Briefly describe the business your campaign will be based on.



What is the demographic (age, location, interests etc.) of your intended audience?



Describe your business background and financial goals for your campaign.



How did you hear about our advertising services at Banners Broker?




What is the destination URL for your banner ads?




Do you intend to use this campaign for any illegal or unapproved content by Banners Broker International or any of its correspondents?




Are there any additional comments or requirements you would like us to know before developing your campaign?







I am sure that the professionals on here would be thrilled to sign up to this wonderful package. Enjoy!!

[Buster Gutt]

Yeah, right.Banners Broker have ripped off around 100,000 people for multiple millions of dollars

Wow, that is wonderful news littleroundman. You can of course prove that claim? I'd hate to be posting incorrect information on my blog.

[Joe_Shmoe]

So.....is this now the end game? You have to invoice them in Belize? And note the last bit:-


This Withdrawal Policy applies to all current and future affiliates and is a legally binding document. Banners Broker International holds the rights to deny any withdrawal request submitted

Them's some hoops ya' gotta jump through only for them to say right at the end of the 90 days "computer says no" :RpS_rolleyes:

[noname999]

Wow, that is wonderful news littleroundman. You can of course prove that claim? I'd hate to be posting incorrect information on my blog.

Hi Buster. Are you a member of BB?

[Della Cate]

Another post from the BB Facts and Updtes Facebook site (38 minutes ago):-

Chris Smith speaking :) YAY!

Updates:

UK World Tour - Manchester, England
Special guest will speak about it today as a guest.
Martin Wilde speaking:
I've been with BB 14 months. Manchesters is my hometown, and making sure you will have a wonderful time at UK World Tour here. We are working hard. Welcome to Manchester. Bring an umbrella. Please visit the link on your dashboard for the http://bbtour.com/
We are short on time, but you may get tickets online. Tickets will go fast. From past BB World Tour meetings you know what a wonderful experience it will be. I am one of the BB Millionaires. I am committed to everything I do, so please do what you can to get to Manchester. Your business will go to a whole new level. 30 pounds for ticket.
Gala Dinner is separate ticket. 45 pounds. The Gala will sell out fast, you will get your money's worth. It is not a Black-tie dinner, but jacket and tie is fine.
30 pounds -- BB World Tour UK
45 pounds -- Gala Dinner (CC only)
75 pounds -- Events + Gala
Live Band
DJ
Awesome Dance Floor
Bar open until 1:00 AM
Chris and all Leaders will be at the Gala dinner (and dancing ;) )
We look forward to seeing you there. It will be an outstanding weekend!!

Chris speaking:

Promo video for UK World Tour is on the dashboard and on YouTube

You will need to get two separate tickets on the website. You can use your eWallet for the UK Event, but must use a Credit Card for the Gala Dinner.

Payouts:

STP adn Payza have been going out over the last few days. More going out over the last few days. We are behind but we are catching up as fast as we can.

The internal message on the dashboard was for the IT guys and it was poorly worded, we apologize. Everything is fine with BB Cards.

Beginning February 1st, BB Card will be the only method of payout. Please see our BB Blog. This was announced on the Blog last week.
Banners Broker (http://bannersbroker.blogspot.ca/)

ID approvals are caught up. 24 hour approval now. Please order your card and get it activated. Please activate your card as soon as you get it, even before you load it. There is a link at BB site for activation. Or you may activate at the Vector website.

Please order your card soon.

New country available - Virgin Islands. Banking information - you can now have only 2 letters for first and last name.

Version 2.9 We are almost done and are in testing stage. Will be live sometime in February. More info will be available to you in during February.

Dashboard has new information. Please visit it often. Twitter is being updated often. The new presentation by David Hooker is now available under Recorded Webinars. Also the PowerPoint is available on your dashboard. Events are also on your dashboard. We have lots of events going on, so please visit our events page. Banners Broker Events - Stay up to date with BB (http://events.bannersbroker.com/)

Q&A

One of the problems that we had with withdrawals to BB card is people were doing several loads on one day. Each load is max of $2500. The maximum load monthly is $10,000. Do not do muliple loads per week. We are now doing one load per week. Must be 7 days between each load.

If you are making more than $10,000, we have a form for you to follow, and have several options for you to receive that.

Good news for India affiliates. The last pay run is in progress right now. If you had pending bank deposits they are being paid now.

Backoffice how to purchase tickets. There is a Purchase link and a dropdown for Purchase Tickets

BB India Tour - we will get back to you on that. We are in the process of

USA bank deposits are in process as well. You will see them any day now in your account.

BB India - we will have more withdrawal options soon.,

why is $10,000 max load on card? This is mastercard's limit. This will be fine for 80-90% of our affiliates.

We will be adding more Q&A to the website for those questions not answered. Friday's call synopsis will be on our blog.

Please be at the UK World Tour.

Ticket sales will be on site today.

End of webinarM

[noname999]

Martin Wilde, Poyol. He crawled out from under his rock.

[waverider]

Terry Stern answered that question (and others) both here as well as over at Finch's blog.

Please understand that I'm an affiliate that is located on the other side of the planet, and I haven't as yet had the pleasure of visiting BB's head office and meeting up with their senior people, such as Terry, Chris, etc

Subsequently, any answers I'd post here would be irrelevant, a waste of my time and a waste of space on this forum, as I'd simply be repeating what Terry Stern pointed out previously. If you're looking for proof that there is in fact advertising and advertising revenue, I'm not a company insider but an affiliate, therefore I'm going to have to refer you to Terry Stern.

My personal opinion on this, however, is that I believe your chances of getting that proof would be about the same as getting the Coca Cola company to reveal their drink's secret formula, or KFC to reveal what 11 herbs and spices they put on their chicken pieces...

Glad you guys missed me ;) but my apologies for not being able to add anything constructive at this stage, but I will add that I am however working on debunking this once and for all, one way or another using a different approach. No guarantees, but I'm confident. Don't ask for specifics, as this would jeopardise my plans and processes, but like the RealScam logo says on the top of the page, it either is, or it isn't and you'll be able to decide.


Ah waverider, welcome back. We have missed you. I've a very simple question for you. Hopefully you can answer it. Now that you are a premium member, I'm sure the words will flow easily:

How do BB make money?

(No cheating now, answer it yourself.)

[noname999]

Terry didn't answer the question. That is why I am asking you. Of course, I may have missed him answering the question. If so, you might be kind enough to copy and paste the section where he explained it. Of course, its a very simple question. You should be able to answer it vey quickly and easily. I'll look forward to your response.

By the way, regarding your comparison with Coca Cola or KFC, the major difference is they have a product. I would also point out that there are no issues regarding payments in relation to those two companies. The same can definitely not be said about the banners broker scam.

[Gregg]

How do BB make money?

They take in money from new and existing affiliates, lop a percentage off the top, take a few more percent in itemized fees, payout the rest to affiliates as "profits", and then wash-rinse-repeat until the new incoming cash is less than what the outgoing requests for payments. Then they disappear to someplace where you can't find them.

In order for the "business model" to work a few things must be assumed.

1) The ICs who used their real names etc.. have to get tossed under the bus in the end, so you can't let them know your real name. Come up with a very common stage name, like Chris Smith perhaps...so when they try to find you every search throws them a phonebook worth of answers.

2) Mathematically, at least 88% of the affilliates have to lose money, most of them, ALL of their money. Sorry about that, it's just immutable maths...

3) You need to find and exploit tens of thousands of people with the right combination of stupidity and greed to promote the program.

[noname999]

You are making it too easy for them Gregg! :RpS_smile:

[waverider]

Terry didn't answer the question. That is why I am asking you. Of course, I may have missed him answering the question. If so, you might be kind enough to copy and paste the section where he explained it. Of course, its a very simple question. You should be able to answer it vey quickly and easily. I'll look forward to your response.

By the way, regarding your comparison with Coca Cola or KFC, the major difference is they have a product. I would also point out that there are no issues regarding payments in relation to those two companies. The same can definitely not be said about the banners broker scam.

I think you might have missed it, it's a fair way but I've got a copy handy :

QUOTE

BB buys ad space from ad networks with the understanding that they're going to package that ad space up and resell it to their network of affiliates. These packages contain panels, each panel has a certain value and each has a specific time period it will take for that panel to mature, some as little as 2-3 weeks and some take 5-6 months or more.

Each panel also requires a specific amount of traffic to mature. Each panel also has 2 values, what BB paid for it and what it's charging the affiliate for it.

With me so far?

As BB sells the panels through their packages, they require traffic for these panels to generate revenue, which BB purchases in order to service the traffic needs of the panels. In return for purchasing the panels, BB pays a dividend to the affiliate once the panel matures, however, that panel is generating live revenue as the panel is running from the ad network. So BB is generating revenue from the sale of packages to affiliates, as well as from the ad network for serving ads. The ads appear on the ad space BB has purchased from the Broker in the blind network, as well as on publisher sites BB has attracted. Whether BB has 1 site, 100 sites or 100,000 sites in their network , they've already purchased ad space through their affiliation with the ad network, and that ad space rests on sites within the ad blind network. So no matter what, there's advertising that will satisfy the panel needs. Since BB is paid every 2 weeks from the ad networks they do business with, and the panels mature at staggered intervals, BB is constantly serving ads and generating income. Now, it's understood no business will pay on its products what it gets paid to sell them, so BB reduces the amount it's paid by the ad networks for that advertising so it can afford to pay its affiliates and generate a profit.

Now since it takes traffic to generate ad revenue, BB purchases bulk traffic from the ad networks as well, which generate upwards of 3 Billion impressions per day. Again, since no company will sell a product for what it pays, it marks up the cost of the traffic to resell to the affiliate, the difference of course is profit for BB, and as BB owns the space and ads keep running, this revenue flows to BB. As it takes impressions to activate panels, and impressions for panels to mature, those impressions or traffic must be purchased up front. Now, an affiliate isn't required to use all their traffic up front, but they must purchase it up front, like a variety store can't buy individual cans of soda, it must buy cases. Since the purchased traffic represents a specific amount, and since each panel requires a different amount to activate, traffic purchases are constantly being made, and since BB only pays for what it uses, there's always going to be a surplus, which represents profit for BB.

So, if we look at things together, BB generates revenue from the banners placed in the space it purchases, and through the amount of time it takes for the panels (which is a virtual representation of an ad space BB purchased in the blind ad network) to mature, it generates revenue from the sale of traffic that it takes to activate those panels, and since it only pays for the traffic it actually uses, that's where the revenue BB generates comes from. Since it pays less to the affiliate than what it earns from the ads, and (to use an analogy) it pays on the cans of soda used not the cases bought, there's a surplus of revenue that represents profit that it can now turn around and pay its affiliates with while maintaining profitable growth.

Any advertising generated either through the site or through affiliates is passed through to the ad networks, BB takes a commission on that sale, and passes 10% to the affiliate for bringing in the business. When it comes to publishers (people looking to monetize their websites with ad revenue), those sites are added to the BB internal or "choice" network, and leveraged with the ad blind network to get better pricing deals. The affiliate is paid 10% of the revenue generated by the ads revenue to the publisher with BB and the publisher splitting the balance.

This is how BB works in a nutshell. We've already established what the Blind Ad Network is, and it can be easily researched. It's easily discovered that these companies all offer the ability for companies to
"resell" their products (ads and traffic) to other resellers. It comes down to packaging really and how these initial "resellers" package what these networks provide to them to add enough value to resell others.

UNQUOTE

[waverider]

As for the assertion that KFC or Coca Cola have a product and BB do not, there's a post on Finch's blog that's worth repeating here:

KFC: Their key product, chicken pieces, and their unique taste, are a result of the machines in which they are cooked, and the 11 secret herbs and spices that the late Colonel Harland Sanders apparently came up with. You eat the chicken, you taste the chicken, but if you’re doing to demand proof from the company that there IS in fact 11 herbs and spices, you’re going to be sadly disappointed.

Follow me?

BB: Their product is on-line advertising, With KFC, you eat and taste the chicken, but the vast majority of people don’t question whether there really are in fact 11 herbs and spices that make up the distinctive KFC flavour, similarly in BB, I see profit being generated into my eWallet over time by my managing my inventory of advertising campaigns running within the blind advertising networks, which is represented in my BB back office by various coloured panels of different values, I have about as much reason to demand from the company as to where the ads are and who their ad networks are as I would have demanding from KFC the chicken I’m about to eat actually contained 11 herbs and spices. There’s the ad panels, there’s the chicken. If you really liked the taste of KFC, would you stop going there if there were in fact only 5 secret herbs and spices, not 11 ?

It’s the taste of KFC that matters, similarly, with BB, it’s the profit generated by the advertising inventory that matters.


Hope this helps, I'd stick around, but I feel my time is better spent with my family than wasting too much time here, so have yourselves a great weekend and have fun doing what you do best I suppose....

I would like to add, however, my disappointment at both RealScam and the Finch blog, I was really expecting to find something of value added here in my absence, something that could be construed as 'concrete proof', but it's just more of the same trivial 'going around the circles stuff' - 314 pages of mostly trivial fluff is all I can see here.

[noname999]

You are making no sense. I asked you to show me where Terry showed how BB make money. that message doesn't do that.

And your comparison doesn't make any sense. You are not comparing like for like. You are comparing real products with imaginary profits. Try harder...

[noname999]

By the way, does anyone know if Paul Mc did the webinar on Thursday?

[Finix]

I see profit being generated into my eWallet over time
Seeing is believing, isn't it? It's just too damn bad it's a scam, and you being paid is a part of it. Whether you know it or not makes no difference.

[Theseus]

As for the assertion that KFC or Coca Cola have a product and BB do not, there's a post on Finch's blog that's worth repeating here:

KFC: Their key product, chicken pieces, and their unique taste, are a result of the machines in which they are cooked, and the 11 secret herbs and spices that the late Colonel Harland Sanders apparently came up with. You eat the chicken, you taste the chicken, but if you’re doing to demand proof from the company that there IS in fact 11 herbs and spices, you’re going to be sadly disappointed.

Follow me?

BB: Their product is on-line advertising, With KFC, you eat and taste the chicken, but the vast majority of people don’t question whether there really are in fact 11 herbs and spices that make up the distinctive KFC flavour, similarly in BB, I see profit being generated into my eWallet over time by my managing my inventory of advertising campaigns running within the blind advertising networks, which is represented in my BB back office by various coloured panels of different values, I have about as much reason to demand from the company as to where the ads are and who their ad networks are as I would have demanding from KFC the chicken I’m about to eat actually contained 11 herbs and spices. There’s the ad panels, there’s the chicken. If you really liked the taste of KFC, would you stop going there if there were in fact only 5 secret herbs and spices, not 11 ?

It’s the taste of KFC that matters, similarly, with BB, it’s the profit generated by the advertising inventory that matters.


Tell me, Roger, when you go into KFC do they hand you a physical product for your money, or do they tell you that your lunch is somewhere, but they can't tell you where?

Also, to be 100% accurate you'd also have to be paying $2000 for your box of dead chicken bits and the KFC staff would have bought it, at a reduced rate, five minutes before it was due to go in the bin, from the Hungry Jack's next door...

[waverider]

ummm? What exactly doesn't make sense? I got my 15yo daughter to read the post, and she understands it, and when I got her to explain it back to me, it was along these lines:
* BB buys ad space from ad networks
* BB sells the panels through their packages to its members (affiliates), these panels require traffic which BB purchase
* BB buys the ad space, and re-sells them at a higher price, this creates a profit
* A proportion of that profit is shared with its members (affiliates), the rest is retained by the company, that's how they make money.

And yes, it's not really comparing 'like for like' - one is a real (tangible) product, you can feel it, touch it, etc the other is intangible, just because you can't feel it, touch it, etc, doesn't mean it isn't real.

Sorry can't try any harder. My daughter's 15 and she understands it quite well, and in the scheme of things just another average kid with mostly average grades.




You are making no sense. I asked you to show me where Terry showed how BB make money. that message doesn't do that.

And your comparison doesn't make any sense. You are not comparing like for like. You are comparing real products with imaginary profits. Try harder...

[waverider]

If there's somebody here not making sense, it's Theseus - don't want to offend, but from that last post, I reckon you need to lay off the wacky weed and get that THC out of your system, dude, seriously...

[Papaponzi]

By the way, does anyone know if Paul Mc did the webinar on Thursday?

He used to be a regular on FB and the blogs until he went to canada, plenty of pics of him at the empty warehouse/200 man IT hub @ 5 Carlow.

If anyone has heard or seen of Paul Mc, head of banners brokers ireland and de-facto head of BBUK then please tell him his mummy, and real scam would like to know he is ok

[Whip]

Therein lies the problem.

"They said"

Anyone who believes ANYTHING said in the HYIP ponzi world is going to be disappointed.

Regular HYIP ponzi players know, once you've sent your money, anything after that is pure luck.

Just wanted to make sure it didn't go unnoticed. :)

[Gregg]

ummm? What exactly doesn't make sense? I got my 15yo daughter to read the post, and she understands it, and when I got her to explain it back to me, it was along these lines:
* BB buys ad space from ad networks
* BB sells the panels through their packages to its members (affiliates), these panels require traffic which BB purchase
* BB buys the ad space, and re-sells them at a higher price, this creates a profit
* A proportion of that profit is shared with its members (affiliates), the rest is retained by the company, that's how they make money.

And yes, it's not really comparing 'like for like' - one is a real (tangible) product, you can feel it, touch it, etc the other is intangible, just because you can't feel it, touch it, etc, doesn't mean it isn't real.

Sorry can't try any harder. My daughter's 15 and she understands it quite well, and in the scheme of things just another average kid with mostly average grades.
'
It only makes sense to her because she knows as much about internet advertising as most 15 year old girls do, which is about nothing.
I called the company that took care of my internet advertising for the small business I used to own (which was primarily an internet business and I sold for a 7 figure sum) and then just to make sure a small business isn't radically different from a big business I put in a call to someone I went to school with who works for J Walter Thompson, one of the world's largest advertising agencies. JWT - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JWT)

My old "ad broker" looked at an earlier version of the above explanation and her general answer was "and people are stupid enough to believe this stuff?" She was amazed that no one had even bothered to Google the phrase "buy online advertising" and seeing how companies REALLY do it. Which is a good suggestion.

My friend at JWT hasn't got back to me, when he does I'll embarrass you even more.

[Hypanor]

...
* BB buys ad space from ad networks (From Who?)
* BB sells the panels through their packages to its members (affiliates) (At incredibly inflated (unsustainable) prices), these panels require traffic which BB purchase
* BB buys the ad space, and re-sells them at a higher price, this creates a profit (To Who?)
* A proportion of that profit is shared with its members (affiliates), the rest is retained by the company, that's how they make (Scam) money.

And yes, it's not really comparing 'like for like' - one is a real (tangible) product, you can feel it, touch it, etc the other is intangible, just because you can't feel it, touch it, etc, doesn't mean it isn't real.

Sorry can't try any harder. My daughter's 15 and she understands it quite well, and in the scheme of things just another average kid with mostly average grades.
Your daughter is a prime candidate for being scammed by BB, they like people with the thinking ability of a 15 year old. Have you signed her up yet?

[Finix]

* BB sells the panels through their packages to its members (affiliates)
No one buys those ad packs strictly to advertise, the price is too high. The only reason members are buying them at such prices is because they hope to make a return on their investment. When they stop hoping (when the program starts having payment issues), they stop buying. When they stop buying, the program starts having even more payment issues, and so on.

[littleroundman]

Wow, that is wonderful news littleroundman. You can of course prove that claim? I'd hate to be posting incorrect information on my blog.

Why would I bother "proving" anything ??

This is a discussion forum, not a courtroom.

What I say here or you say on your blog is of no consequence.

We are both observers of something which is happening completely outside our sphere of influence.

If people choose to not listen or listen to anything I have to say, fine by me.

If we get right down to it, when somebody chooses to believe it's possible to repeatedly double their money or be paid 1% per day ROI why would I think they're going to listen to anything I say ??

I'm certainly not here to save the world.

[Theseus]

ummm? What exactly doesn't make sense? I got my 15yo daughter to read the post, and she understands it, and when I got her to explain it back to me, it was along these lines:
* BB buys ad space from ad networks
* BB sells the panels through their packages to its members (affiliates), these panels require traffic which BB purchase
* BB buys the ad space, and re-sells them at a higher price, this creates a profit
* A proportion of that profit is shared with its members (affiliates), the rest is retained by the company, that's how they make money.

And yes, it's not really comparing 'like for like' - one is a real (tangible) product, you can feel it, touch it, etc the other is intangible, just because you can't feel it, touch it, etc, doesn't mean it isn't real.

Sorry can't try any harder. My daughter's 15 and she understands it quite well, and in the scheme of things just another average kid with mostly average grades.

The bit in bold is the important bit, and the one that relates directly to the $2000 chicken burger in my analogy. Let's say, just for the sake of argument, that the banners exist. The figures that are being bandied about would mean than BB have a margin,the difference between what they pay their supplier and what they charge their customer, of over 36000%. Not even Columbian drug lords have that sort of mark-up, yet here you, and Teflon Terry are, telling us that not only do BB achieve this, but they do it over and over and over again, week in week out.

The question therefore, given that the every industry analyst states that the market for banner adverts is in freefall with prices decreasing almost daily, is where are all these sales coming from?

Do you really believe that someone charged with purchasing advertising space for a large national or multinational organisation (remember the claims, including yours, are of blue chip clients) is going to pay THREE HUNDRED AND SIXTY times the going rate? Remember the claim isn't just that ONE customer does, but that hundreds or thousands do. No wonder BB won't say who their clients are, their media buyers would all be queued up outside the job centre the very next morning.

What really amuses me though is that the more you, Teflon Terry, or the Happy Hooker try and explain it, the more preposterous the whole thing sounds. I almost look forward to hearing the next excuse for where the money comes from.

I'd imaging it won't be long before the claim is not that BB are like Google, but that they are Google, a secretive philanthropic section of the company that tours the world helping the poor and hard of thinking to achieve millionaire status in a few short weeks...

[waverider]

That's assuming that BB is in fact a scam, as is alleged here, however to this date there isn't a single shred of evidence both here and on the Finch blog that this is the case. What is clearly evident here, without any reasonable doubt, is that there's a lot of people who either don't understand how the whole thing works, or don't want to understand, and this is clearly evident in Hypanor's post above and the question whether I've signed up my daughter yet, asserting that she is a prime candidate for being scammed by BB.

No, I haven't signed her up yet, even though she really, really wants to. She did ask why, and I told her she must be over 18 before she can join, and referred her to this page
BannersBroker (http://bannersbroker.com/main/privacy_policy_int) in particular the second paragraph which states :
The Banners Broker Privacy Policy applies to EVERYONE at Banners Broker International, INCLUDING YOU, OUR CUSTOMER. YOU HEREBY SWEAR THAT YOU ARE AT LEAST 18 OF AGE AND CAPABLE TO ENTER INTO A BINDING CONTRACT. YOUR USE OF THIS WEBSITE CONSTITUTES YOUR AGREEMENT TO THIS PRIVACY POLICY AND ANY SUBSEQUENT MODIFICATIONS THERETO. IF YOU DO NOT WISH TO BE BOUND BY THIS PRIVACY POLICY, PLEASE DISCONTINUE YOUR USE OF THE BANNERS BROKER WEBSITE.

* BB buys ad space from ad networks (From Who?)
* KFC buys the so-called 11 secret herbs and spices from who? Who supplies them with their secret ingredients? I do know 'Steggles' is one of their suppliers for the chicken, but exactly where they source their 11 herbs and spices (and what are they?) is a closely guarded secret, as is where BB buys their ad space from. Company secrets are none of your business. Does Coca Cola reveal who supplies them with the ingredients for their drink's formula? Ummm? Grow up mate, or stop smoking that wacky weed, mate.
* BB sells the panels through their packages to its members (affiliates) (At incredibly inflated (unsustainable) prices), these panels require traffic which BB purchase
* Good ol' KFC sells a 9-pack of their chicken pieces around here for about $AUD20, how much do they pay for their chicken??? I know for a fact that as a retail customer I can buy chicken drumsticks for $2.99/kg, wings for $1.99/kg, Chicken Maryland for $5.99/kg, now a big corporate giant like KFC would get those chicken pieces for a fraction than what me, the little retail customer, pays for them at the local butcher. I conclude (and agree with) that both BB and KFC are selling their product at incredibly inflated prices, but are they unsustainable? KFC's been around since before I was a kid about the age of my daughter, 15yo, and are still going strong. On the same token, unless they go belly-up for some reason, BB may well be still around when my 15yo daughter reaches my age (48)... Sorry, but that concludes that argument.... ;)
* BB buys the ad space, and re-sells them at a higher price, this creates a profit (To Who?)
* Never mind the thinking ability of a 15 year old. It seems here we're dealing predominantly with the thinking abilities of a 9 year old - Mr Terry Stern clearly pointed out when he explained how BB works, that the ad space is re-sold to AFFILIATES.... (reading is one thing, understanding is another, but I suspect THC might be a contributing factor to what's being discussed here)
* A proportion of that profit is shared with its members (affiliates), the rest is retained by the company, that's how they make (Scam) money.
* ...how they make (Scam) money... please elaborate, to this date, there's been nothing posted here, or over on Finch's blog, that could be construed as concrete proof that BB is a scam. A track record of being somewhat poorly managed and structured, yes. Rapid growth = growing pains = potential problems. Not all that uncommon in the business world, and some companies have in fact fallen by the wayside due to them becoming a victim of their own success, unable to cope with excessively rapid growth. When I joined BB in August last year, there were 100'000 affiliates, now it's somewhere around the 300'000 mark. That's an increase of around 200'000 in about six months !!! If that's not rapid growth in your books, show me any affiliate-based company on the face of this planet that's experienced that level of growth, and without significant growing pains !

Gotta love technology, here I am sitting @ the beach with my family, tapping away, girlie girl peeking over my shoulder, "dad, I've read all that crap, why do you even bother, they (BB) can flop out full disclosure, who they deal with, fully audited financials, proving otherwise, and these morons (her words) still wouldn't get off their case because it's outside their reality that it's possible to make money like this in on-line advertising"

It's becoming clearly evident that the critics have made up their mind and nothing will change that.

What astounds me is the complete lack of understanding, or willingness to even try to comprehend how this thing works, like "where are the ads", I mean this has been answered again, and again, and this simply doesn't sink in, in that they’re serviced by the ad networks as part of the agreement BBI has. Since the resellers the ad networks use aren’t advertising companies in themselves, the network services the ads, and through the resellers, can service more ads because they’re servicing more space.

Where does the money come from is another point, explained again and again, yet this forum and Finch just keeps sinking their crediblity down by a few more notches, by going around in circles as their forums length grow exponentially with fluff and anti-BB "hype" when the facts have been explained over and over again, and as Terry pointed out quite clearly, is that the brokers charge their clients a certain amount for the traffic that they’re looking for. The broker then services those clients, however, there’s a product called “remnant inventory” which the brokers pass to their resellers to generate revenue from. There’s a considerable amount of it, so there’s no worry about whether it can be sustained or not. Rather than lose the advertiser because the broker couldn’t service their needs, they use the resellers to fulfill the remainder of those contracts, which makes complete sense. The resellers get discounted rates on the ads run through them, but are allowed to mark-up those rates to any resellers they attract through their businesses. So the broker is tier one in this instance, and reseller (BBI for example) is a tier two, and any affiliates would be tier three. So the tier one broker sells space to the advertiser at market price, passes remnant inventory to the tier two resellers at a discount and pays them a discounted rate on servicing that inventory, who discount it even further and pay the tier three affiliate who purchases the ad space through packages. This is where BBI makes the bulk of their revenues, and how it can afford to pay an affiliate up-to twice the initial inventory purchase value back as commission and still earn a profit themselves.

Next comes traffic, because no revenue is earned by anyone without the ads actually being seen. The broker charges the advertiser a set amount for the traffic they want to have see their ads. The broker pays their in-house publisher network a certain amount for the number of ads shown, we’re all familiar with this model. When it comes to resellers however, that rate changes. The broker pays their tier two resellers a set amount for the amount of traffic they serve. Since the amount of traffic is based on what’s actually used, the more a tier two reseller uses, the better price they get on purchasing traffic. Tier two resellers are allowed to sell traffic to their tier 3 resellers or affiliates in any denomination they choose, at whatever pricing they choose, so obviously, in order to make a profit, the tier two reseller is going to mark up the cost of that traffic before selling it. BBI does this in the form of “traffic boosters” or “traffic packs” as you’ve seen them called. BBI pays for what it uses with the broker, but, charges the tier three affiliate up-front. BBI doesn’t require that the affiliate use all that traffic all at once however, they’re allowed to ‘bank’ it for use later if they wish. This gives the affiliate some flexibility in how they manage their ad space or ‘panel’ inventory. This is the second way BBI generates the bulk of its revenue.

You can make the incorrect argument that BBI generates the bulk of its revenue through affiliate sign-ups, however, with BBI having to constantly purchase both space and traffic, until they receive their commissions from the broker for the ad revenue generated, they require capital to purchase the space/traffic. The fees collected by BBI for the packages of space and traffic from its affiliates goes toward augmenting the available capital to purchase space and traffic from the brokers. No company in existence uses 100% its own capital to purchase products, it leverages its profits and sales revenue towards the continuous replenishing of inventory.


I'm going back in the water, to join my family, the iPad battery's in the red, got better things to do than try to argue with a bunch of people that appear to have the thinking ability of a 9 year old.... Sorry if that offended, but that's the impression you're sending out to the rest of the world.


Your daughter is a prime candidate for being scammed by BB, they like people with the thinking ability of a 15 year old. Have you signed her up yet?

[waverider]

FYI - the above text, in bold blue, is an extract from an official statement by Mr. Terry Stern from the Stellar Point Corporate Team in response to forums/blogs who are experiencing some difficulty in understanding BB and how it works, and who are engaged in spreading false information and speculation, or just suggesting that BB is not what it says it is, so here's the full response:


Hello Everyone, my apologies for the absence. My job requires that my attention go to other avenues, so I’ll address a couple of issues further, then I will take my leave.

Second, it’s after reading hundreds of posts on dozens of websites that I’ve realized, none of you actually have looked at BBI the way I’ve been trying to explain you should be, you’ve all been looking at it from the perspective that it’s an advertising company, attracting advertiser dollars to the ad spaces, and not actually getting that it’s a brokerage for ad space and traffic.

So, let’s try this once more, and I’m going to ask that you actually read what I’ve written rather than just skip through it and try and tell me I’m an idiot and unaware of what I’m doing. After almost 20 years in dealing with MLM companies, looking at affiliate programs and helping companies transition from one market to another quite successfully, I have a better understanding of things than you might think. You’re also going to have to start all over and use different eyes if you’re going to want to understand who BBI is and how it works. Grab a coffee, this is going to be a long post.

Banners Broker International, is an online broker of web ad space and traffic impressions. We are NOT an advertising company, nor do we actively solicit advertising from companies. We offer an access point to companies looking to advertise online through their website, but, don’t get involved in the actual process other than to provide access to the brokers we deal with.

The ad space BBI purchases, is done through the broker’s we deal with who own reseller programs, however, BBI isn’t restricted to the specific terms those agreements state, due to a unique system created by Chris Smith. It’s already been stated, that initially when approached, most ad networks didn’t want to work with BBI because they weren’t interested in the program being offered, however, one did.

Now, the program we deal with takes the ad space purchased, breaks the space into ‘panels’ (which are virtual representations of the ad space), and then packages them into different packages. Each ‘panel’ has a different period of time that is required in order for a particular ‘panel’ to cap. Some can take as little as 2-3 weeks, some can take up-to 6+ months to cap. The advertising that is needed to service these ‘panels’ is provided through the ad networks as per the specifics of their program. If you want to know why the ad networks use resellers, ask them, it’s their program, as for why BBI uses affiliates? That’s easy. It’s a great distribution model for a company that wants to move its product quickly across a global landscape. BBI is a direct sales company, not an advertising company, so as such, we don’t subscribe to the traditional advertising model, because it was never intended to be such.

So you’re asking yourself, “where are the ads that go in the spaces we buy?”, the answer is, they’re serviced by the ad networks as part of the agreement BBI has. Since the resellers the ad networks use aren’t advertising companies in themselves, the network services the ads, and through the resellers, can service more ads because they’re servicing more space.

The next issue is traffic, where is it coming from then? The Brokers attract publishers who want to generate revenue from the traffic they attract, but in order to be part of the broker’s network, they need to meet certain criteria. You’ll have to ask them what that criteria is, because we aren’t directly involved in that either, however, once again, we do accept publishers looking to generate revenue, but they’re also passed through to the ad networks for servicing. Any options BBI provides to publishers or advertisers is done so through the software provided to us by the broker, it’s not BBI specific.

Ok, so you’re curious as to where the money comes from.

The brokers charge their clients a certain amount for the traffic that they’re looking for. The broker then services those clients, however, there’s a product called “remnant inventory” which the brokers pass to their resellers to generate revenue from. There’s a considerable amount of it, so there’s no worry about whether it can be sustained or not. Rather than lose the advertiser because the broker couldn’t service their needs, they use the resellers to fulfill the remainder of those contracts, which makes complete sense. The resellers get discounted rates on the ads run through them, but are allowed to mark-up those rates to any resellers they attract through their businesses. So the broker is tier one in this instance, and reseller (BBI for example) is a tier two, and any affiliates would be tier three. So the tier one broker sells space to the advertiser at market price, passes remnant inventory to the tier two resellers at a discount and pays them a discounted rate on servicing that inventory, who discount it even further and pay the tier three affiliate who purchases the ad space through packages. This is where BBI makes the bulk of their revenues, and how it can afford to pay an affiliate up-to twice the initial inventory purchase value back as commission and still earn a profit themselves.

Next comes traffic, because no revenue is earned by anyone without the ads actually being seen. The broker charges the advertiser a set amount for the traffic they want to have see their ads. The broker pays their in-house publisher network a certain amount for the number of ads shown, we’re all familiar with this model. When it comes to resellers however, that rate changes. The broker pays their tier two resellers a set amount for the amount of traffic they serve. Since the amount of traffic is based on what’s actually used, the more a tier two reseller uses, the better price they get on purchasing traffic. Tier two resellers are allowed to sell traffic to their tier 3 resellers or affiliates in any denomination they choose, at whatever pricing they choose, so obviously, in order to make a profit, the tier two reseller is going to mark up the cost of that traffic before selling it. BBI does this in the form of “traffic boosters” or “traffic packs” as you’ve seen them called. BBI pays for what it uses with the broker, but, charges the tier three affiliate up-front. BBI doesn’t require that the affiliate use all that traffic all at once however, they’re allowed to ‘bank’ it for use later if they wish. This gives the affiliate some flexibility in how they manage their ad space or ‘panel’ inventory. This is the second way BBI generates the bulk of its revenue.

You can make the incorrect argument that BBI generates the bulk of its revenue through affiliate sign-ups, however, with BBI having to constantly purchase both space and traffic, until they receive their commissions from the broker for the ad revenue generated, they require capital to purchase the space/traffic. The fees collected by BBI for the packages of space and traffic from its affiliates goes toward augmenting the available capital to purchase space and traffic from the brokers. No company in existence uses 100% its own capital to purchase products, it leverages its profits and sales revenue towards the continuous replenishing of inventory.
At no point does BBI state that any affiliate will “turn $100 to $10,000 overnight”, or any other such get-rich-quick garbage. It states, that if the affiliate sticks with the
program, and develops a strategy, that they can generate substantial earnings over time, with most requiring 8-12 months to elapse before any such returns.

Then there’s the arguments about BBI being a ‘straight-line cycler doubler’, or affiliates using the word ‘purchase’ to describe getting involved. Every company makes mistakes as they grow. Google started in a garage and didn’t do everything right the first time, and they still make mistakes, yet over time they managed to fix things to enable them to grow to where they are today. BBI recognizes that there were initially incorrect verbiage used to describe the BBI program, which is not at all unusual in start-up companies, and as BBI has grown, this verbiage has been adjusted to comply with international rules and regulations. Through the implementation of internal compliance offices, official documentation is being re-worded to correct any misleading statements, and hundreds of affiliates have already been contacted about their websites, blogs, twitter accounts, facebook pages, youtube videos, etc – and are being instructed to either take them down, or correct them to state the proper terminology…and they’ve been very co-operative in complying with our requests. That’s what the International Compliance and International Public Relations departments were created for. It’s going to take time, but it’s happening.

There’s also the issue of people not being paid on time. BBI made the decision, that unless a payment method is universally acceptable for each country they do business in, it’s not an option. There are also international money laundering regulations that an off-shore company has to address in order to comply with the international banking regulations in each country it does business in. This is why PayPal and direct bank deposits aren’t options, because they aren’t universally accepted payment options. STP and Payza were chosen along with the BB pre-paid cards because they complied with our payment needs, however, over time, it’s been realized, that using 3rd party payment processors has created new payment issues, so that’s also changed. Effective Feb 1st, the BB prepaid card will be the only payment option available. Why? Because it’s universally accepted everywhere we do business, and it allows BBI to pay more regularly. Since delays are the #1 issue, switching to this payment method will reduce the time it takes to pay their affiliates and solve these issues.

Lastly, there are some that claim they’ve never been paid. This could be true, but there’s more to the story than you’ve been told. If an affiliate hasn’t been paid, they’ve also been told the reason why. The reasons being: a) their account was in the negative when it came time to issue payment, b) their ID wasn’t complete in their profile, c) they chose the BB card and didn’t have room on card for payment, d)they didn’t activate their BB Card, e) they violated the Terms and Conditions and their accounts were locked. You might think (e) isn’t legal, however you’d be wrong. Companies are allowed to institute penalties on their clients/customers/members in order to protect themselves from damages, or to recover damages that might have been inflicted against them. When someone for example openly posts negative comments on a blog such as this, those comments damage the company, so the company can lock the account of the abusing member, and the member forfeits any fees paid and revenues earned to compensate the company for any damage their comments have caused. You can call it unfair, but, how else is the company to retrieve their losses at the hands of people that would openly do them harm? You would do the same thing, but in this case because it’s being done to you, it’s wrong? Sorry, but you read the T&C’s, knew the consequences, didn’t play by the rules and lost. Next time play by the rules and you’ll be fine. If you haven’t been paid, and none of the above apply, then my question is, why haven’t you contacted support? They’re at worst 3 days behind in answering tickets, and with over 90% of our affiliates regularly paid, what’s preventing you from getting your situation solved?

So there you have it. Every accusation, assumption, myth, irregularity, misleading comment, anonymous story, about Banners Broker International being a ‘ponzi’ or ‘scam’ all debunked and in the open for all to see, with plain facts anyone can verify if they do their research.

Anyone who still insists that BBI isn’t what it claims to be, has a hidden agenda, is maliciously causing trouble, and doesn’t want to understand.

I no longer feel that my presence is required to address any of the inaccurate claims or accusations placed against the company or its product, but if you would like to contact me you may do so, or you can visit the official company blog for more information.

Thank you.


end of Terry Stern's official post.

[okosh]

This scam is not dead. I don't know why you think it is.

Prove it....Go on....Here is your big chance to show how you are right and how all the old hands are wrong....

Mortgage your house.....Withdraw all your savings....Max out your credit cards and deposit the lot in BB which you say is not dead....

Then come back and tell us how you made out......

I'm not proud....I'll be happy to admit that I was wrong and you were right.....

[littleroundman]

That's assuming that BB is in fact a scam, as is alleged here, however to this date there isn't a single shred of evidence both here and on the Finch blog that this is the case.

It would be a pretty poor fraud, indeed, if a band of amateur forum posters could find the sort of "proof" required by their critics.

There will be no "concrete proof" unless and until someone gets access to the inner workings of Banners Broker.

Even then, as has happened in the AdSurf Daily and Zeek Rewards cases, there will be those who won't accept the evidence, in the AdSurf Daily HYIP, even AFTER it's instigator pleaded guilty and began his sentence.

IM(very)HO, attempting to "prove" anything to the "waveriders" of the world is as pointless as trying to explain quantum physics to someone who believes the sun revolves around the earth and evil spirits cause influenza.

[okosh]

I am not interested in academic arguments with you Finix but I advised Jason to listen to you and he is holding his own. I do not come into BB thread very often so I am not going to debate the matter. My washing machine is playing silly B's and I am more concerned about that than academic arguments. I have had my say FOR TODAY.

LOL....Smart move Judy.....As I'd bet the farm on Finix.....And I'd win that bet :RpS_laugh:

[okosh]

If there's somebody here not making sense, it's Theseus - don't want to offend, but from that last post, I reckon you need to lay off the wacky weed and get that THC out of your system, dude, seriously...

Hahahahahahaha.....Too funny....

[littleroundman]

FYI - the above text, in bold blue, is an extract from an official statement by Mr. Terry Stern from the Stellar Point Corporate Team

Before we get to the statement,

explain to us all how "Mr Terry Sterns" statement is any different than a statement put up by someone pretending to be the official spokesperson of a pretend organization doing pretend business.

[waverider]

And your point? You're just sinking the credibility of this forum down further by going around and around in circles, adding more fluff and hype with no concrete proof. What we have is (what appears to be) an official representative of the company making a public statement, and a good one at that, however, the critics continue to stand their ground, asserting this is some kind of scam. It's a pointless exercise and a waste of time to convince the critics otherwise, and full disclosure on the part of BB by way of fully audited financials and open books will convince the critics otherwise, what's hilarious is they don't realize they're sinking their reputation (and that of the blogs they post on) down further. Maybe you should ask for share in the profits generated from ebook sales both here and over at finch's blog?


Before we get to the statement,
explain to us all how "Mr Terry Sterns" statement is any different than a statement put up by someone pretending to be the official spokesperson of a pretend organization doing pretend business.

[okosh]

And your point? You're just sinking the credibility of this forum down further by going around and around in circles, adding more fluff and hype with no concrete proof. What we have is (what appears to be) an official representative of the company making a public statement, and a good one at that, however, the critics continue to stand their ground, asserting this is some kind of scam. It's a pointless exercise and a waste of time to convince the critics otherwise, and full disclosure on the part of BB by way of fully audited financials and open books will convince the critics otherwise, what's hilarious is they don't realize they're sinking their reputation (and that of the blogs they post on) down further. Maybe you should ask for share in the profits generated from ebook sales both here and over at finch's blog?

I see you are fluent in "scammer talk"......Don't worry shill.....Your proof will come.....But as is ALWAYS the case it will come long after you have stuffed your pockets full of other peoples money.....Long after the people you suckered into this scam find out that their money is gone.....Long after it will make any difference...

CEP....ASD....LEGISI.....PIPS....And a host of others has shills like you who demanded proof.....LOL...Even after the admins plead guilty in court some of you shills still didn't think that was proof enough to call the program a scam.....

Go away shill....Go back to TG, MMG and facebook and use your scammer talk there cos it aint gonna work on anyone here.....

[waverider]

Excellent post there okosh, and one that is muchly appreciated - it adds absolutely nothing of value to this forum, well done.

Why don't you 'go away' - not in the sense you're speaking of, but since you show you're from beautiful Tasmania, why don't you look up that Super Granny - real name Mary Bosveld, she's located in a little town called Wynyard, she'd love to share her BB experiences with you over a cup of coffee, and reveal that she's being paid, and most of the time pretty much on-time, and she's continuing to build her team. I suppose it all boils down to the bottom line, who are you going to believe? A bunch of non-believers who talk big but produce little, or 300'000 or so affiliates who believe this is a great idea?

When all else fails and the ammo runs out, I suppose all that's left is to say "Go away shill....Go back to TG, MMG and facebook and use your scammer talk there cos it aint gonna work on anyone here....." lol


I see you are fluent in "scammer talk"......Don't worry shill.....Your proof will come.....But as is ALWAYS the case it will come long after you have stuffed your pockets full of other peoples money.....Long after the people you suckered into this scam find out that their money is gone.....Long after it will make any difference...

CEP....ASD....LEGISI.....PIPS....And a host of others has shills like you who demanded proof.....LOL...Even after the admins plead guilty in court some of you shills still didn't think that was proof enough to call the program a scam.....

Go away shill....Go back to TG, MMG and facebook and use your scammer talk there cos it aint gonna work on anyone here.....

[Gregg]

I in fact do know what the 11 herbs and spices are, it was published in a book 20 years ago by someone who took a job at KFC, pocketed a bag of the batter mix, took it to a food lab and had it analyzed. As could any of their competitors done. (you can assume that many have really) The "big secret" is more advertising hook than anything. Ditto for Coca Cola, and just for giggles the biggest difference between it and Pepsi is the citric acid in one is derived from lemons, and the other oranges...... (the book is 'Big Secrets', available on Amazon)

Another problem is you think I am trying to prove anything to you. You're somewhere on that "Stupid to Greedy" scale where you're beyond any redemption and all I hope for you is either clawbacks or your downline debating whether to sue you or kick the crap out of you, so you might want to hope you recruited your family and not the guys at the local biker bar.

My intention here is preserve for the record what a lying sack of **** you are, and every post you make just provides more "empirical evidence" of that.

And I don't have the right kind of access here, but if the IP you're posting from resolves to an area with a beach, I'll give $100 to your favorite charity. LRM can you check that?

[waverider]

There will be no "concrete proof" unless and until someone gets access to the inner workings of Banners Broker.

Spot on, and even if BB reveals the complete inner workings of their business model, complete with fully audited financials and everything, the critics will still not be convinced, and will continue to assert it's a scam, just as on the other side of the BB fence trying to prove it's a scam.

The only people who are benefiting from all this are the owners of this site, and the Finch blog site, who are riding high in the search engine rankings, and raking in good $$$ from ebook sales in the process. With almost 6500 posts here, you're a significant contributor to this site, and eagle-one should be sharing some of his profits with you and fellow posters with post counts so high. Just a thought...

[Gregg]

Oh hell, I can't even stand it anymore. The '11 herbs and spices" turned out to be lying as much as your average ponzi pimp. The only things in KFC original recipe are milk, eggs, flour, salt, pepper, maltodextron and MSG.

[Gregg]

Spot on, and even if BB reveals the complete inner workings of their business model, complete with fully audited financials and everything, the critics will still not be convinced, and will continue to assert it's a scam, just as on the other side of the BB fence trying to prove it's a scam.

The only people who are benefiting from all this are the owners of this site, and the Finch blog site, who are riding high in the search engine rankings, and raking in good $$$ from ebook sales in the process. With almost 6500 posts here, you're a significant contributor to this site, and eagle-one should be sharing some of his profits with you and fellow posters with post counts so high. Just a thought...


I devoted 10 years of my life to calling out lying pigs like you, and have never gotten a dime for it. This site does not collect any revenue. Toss out any red herrings lately?

[littleroundman]

You're just sinking the credibility of this forum down further

Now, isn't that a strange phenomena ??

According to a HYIP ponzi shill our "credibility" is sinking, yet, our member numbers and reader numbers are climbing.

http://traffic.alexa.com/graph?w=400&h=220&o=f&c=1&y=r&b=ffffff&n=666666&r=3m&u=realscam.com&

Personally, I find the fact our trailing 3 month numbers show an increase as the number of Banners Broker victims desperately look for answers as to why their cash cow has dried up no coincidence.

Then again, unlike "waverider" I don't stand to profit or lose, whatever happens to Banners Broker members.

[waverider]

Hi, Gregg,

You might be right about the 'advertising hook' bit, but as for asserting my downline debating about suing me or kicking the crap out of me, I hate to say it, but you'll be sadly disappointed, as I have only two members in my team, as you can see from the below screen capture from my BB back office. Note that neither of them are paid-up members, as they show up as "free". At this stage in the BB game, I'm not interested in recruiting anyone, as my objective in joining BB was to prove to the rest of the world that it is in fact possible to earn revenue on-line WITHOUT recruiting a single member.

2965

I can confirm, however, that I am located in an area very close to a beach, about a 5 minute walk in fact, and since you've offered to give $100 to my favourite charity, may I ask you give it to this one, the Red Cross - Queensland Floods Appeal 2013 | Australian Red Cross - The Power Of Humanity (http://www.redcross.org.au/qld-floods-2013.aspx) - to help the people affected by the recent floods, particularly those in Bundaberg, which has copped it the worst. Please be a man of your word, Gregg, and back up that promise by posting your payment receipt here for all to see.

By the way, name-calling, by calling me "a lying sack of ****" is not very professional and does not add to the credibility of this forum, if you could kindly refrain from such childish actions, that would be muchly appreciated. I'd like to think we're all adults here, and that we're able to act rationally and make our comments, opinions, experiences and such in a professional manner without resorting to such childish tactics. Not that I'm complaining, keep going if you want to, you're just helping to sink the credibility of this forum, and by doing that you're not exactly helping the cause from your side of the BB fence.




I in fact do know what the 11 herbs and spices are, it was published in a book 20 years ago by someone who took a job at KFC, pocketed a bag of the batter mix, took it to a food lab and had it analyzed. As could any of their competitors done. (you can assume that many have really) The "big secret" is more advertising hook than anything. Ditto for Coca Cola, and just for giggles the biggest difference between it and Pepsi is the citric acid in one is derived from lemons, and the other oranges...... (the book is 'Big Secrets', available on Amazon)

Another problem is you think I am trying to prove anything to you. You're somewhere on that "Stupid to Greedy" scale where you're beyond any redemption and all I hope for you is either clawbacks or your downline debating whether to sue you or kick the crap out of you, so you might want to hope you recruited your family and not the guys at the local biker bar.

My intention here is preserve for the record what a lying sack of **** you are, and every post you make just provides more "empirical evidence" of that.

And I don't have the right kind of access here, but if the IP you're posting from resolves to an area with a beach, I'll give $100 to your favorite charity. LRM can you check that?

[waverider]

Not really a strange phenomena when one considers that BB ranks extremely high on Alexa, currently 437, which means you're riding off the back of the popularity of another site. There's a big difference between credibility and popularity, otherwise on the same token those of us on this side of the BB fence can just go out there saying that BB is legit and a company with credibility because of their high ranking on Alexa. That is simply not the case. Not a single person on this site, or Finch's, have any concrete evidence to prove whether BB is a scam or not, because none of us have direct access to the inner workings of the company, its business model and financials. What we do have here, however, are quite a number of unsubstantiated, yet compelling views and opinions from both sides of the fence, but no real proof.

For as long as BB's member numbers are increasing, so will your member numbers and reader numbers, as more people become exposed to BB, and search google for more information.

As you're one of the admins, may I suggest you consider making it a rule for people to refrain from irrational and unprofessional actions such as name-calling and the like?


Now, isn't that a strange phenomena ??

According to a HYIP ponzi shill our "credibility" is sinking, yet, our member numbers and reader numbers are climbing.

http://traffic.alexa.com/graph?w=400&h=220&o=f&c=1&y=r&b=ffffff&n=666666&r=3m&u=realscam.com&

Personally, I find the fact our trailing 3 month numbers show an increase as the number of Banners Broker victims desperately look for answers as to why their cash cow has dried up no coincidence.

Then again, unlike "waverider" I don't stand to profit or lose, whatever happens to Banners Broker members.

[littleroundman]

As you're one of the admins, may I suggest you consider making it a rule for people to refrain from irrational and unprofessional actions such as name-calling and the like?

No,

insulting HYIP ponzi shills and pimps is what we do.

[littleroundman]

LRM can you check that?

Can I "prove" anything, no I can't.

Can I "reasonably assume" waverider is yet another incarnation of a Queensland based HYIP shill known to us all ??? Yes, I can.

Is said "waverider" leaving behind a trail of "clues" a blind man could follow ??? Yes, he/she is.

Am I convinced the trail is not deliberately laid ??? No, I'm not.

Do I care ???

Not in the least.

Banners Broker is "not paying" a great majority of its' victim/members.

[Grandão]

It's a fight you can't win. One scam goes down, ten more appear in its place.

Mundus vult decipi...

[okosh]

Excellent post there okosh, and one that is muchly appreciated

Why thank you waverider.....You are too kind :RpS_smile:

FYI....The only thing I hate more than a shill who is fluent in "scammer talk" is an AUSSIE shill who is fluent in "scammer talk":NO:

[Dreamstealer]

Nice job 'Chris', manually looking after the payments for 300,000 affiliates all on your own! I'm guessing you can do it now by just pressing a button on your phone?

Seems strange that this computer prodigy couldn't have automated it more. It's so strange it almost seems...untrue?

[Mundorf]

Did you noticed that almost all ponzi like to speak about TRAINING?We have great training week....The training was outstanding...Great training day it was....it seems that BB needs only affiliates with special skills - 300 000 well trained specialst.Probably because of the hard work that is to be done in BB in aim to earn and because more and more needed waiting-patient-payments skills...and...we should not forget...gala parties around the world...dancing skills higly needed...and the training of all the trainings...to train people how to open back office and not to press the withdrawal knob.

[okosh]

but since you show you're from beautiful Tasmania, why don't you look up that Super Granny - real name Mary Bosveld, she's located in a little town called Wynyard, she'd love to share her BB experiences with you over a cup of coffee, and reveal that she's being paid, and most of the time pretty much on-time, and she's continuing to build her team.

I did look her up....Then I looked up and contacted the Wynyard Police......Then I looked up the closest AFP(Aussie Federal Police) which is in Hobart....Then I looked up their online "report a crime" page....
https://forms.afp.gov.au/online_forms/report_a_crime

Then I looked up the date of the Wynyard Show(The whole town goes to the show)......Maybe I'll drive up there...With a bunch of flyers that has her name, address and how she steals money from innocent victims via the BB ponzi scheme....Might stick one to every pole in the town.....
I might even stand at the gate and hand one to every person as they enter the show....

Only thing I'm not sure about....Will I need 5000 flyers or 10000??......Maybe you can advise me....))

[Dreamstealer]

My personal opinion on this, however, is that I believe your chances of getting that proof would be about the same as getting the Coca Cola company to reveal their drink's secret formula, or KFC to reveal what 11 herbs and spices they put on their chicken pieces...

Because proof that a company actually has a business is exactly the same as protecting a recipe or a bit of technology. Now I understand.

[Grandão]

Food for thought for BB-lovers... Assuming I'm unsatisfied with my Google Adsense earnings, and assuming I therefor want a decent alternative for my Adsense account, and assuming Banners Brokers is not a ponzi, but a legit company with a sustainable business model, read: ad space is really bought, banners are really placed, profit is legal... When I Google for "Adsense alternatives" why is Banners Broker NOT appearing in any of the result lists I'm getting back from Google? Even on page 10 I don't see Banners Broker popping up in any of the lists presented. Why are all of these people NOT convinced of the Banners Broker model? Why is Banners Broker so clearly ignored by ALL online marketing and advertising specialists?

[AshKen1]

Did you noticed that almost all ponzi like to speak about TRAINING?We have great training week....The training was outstanding...Great training day it was....it seems that BB needs only affiliates with special skills - 300 000 well trained specialst.Probably because of the hard work that is to be done in BB in aim to earn and because more and more needed waiting-patient-payments skills...and...we should not forget...gala parties around the world...dancing skills higly needed...and the training of all the trainings...to train people how to open back office and not to press the withdrawal knob.

Mundorf,

All this training means that the BB followers accelerate through the "BBelt" system (specially set up for followers). Top ranked is the Stealth Ninja award... that's when they are allowed to visit forums like this one here

Heading off on a tangent of my own, because I can. Someone somewhere put up a comment about Chris Smith dealing with the panel movement all on his own (remember he pressed the button at Dublin that got everyone so excited?). I think CS is the dogsbody who has had to "manually" make the changes to the panels. He's actually nobody important at all :RpS_smile:

PS I take I back - Waverider, can't you go off a surf elsewhere for a while?

[Papaponzi]

@waverider, I agree with okosh, bannersbrokers is 100% legit and genuine, you should remortgage yourself up to the eyeballs, put in everything you have, in fact the return is so great it would make sense to finance it with creditcards, & payday loans, get your friends and family to max out their credit too, your gonna be richer than your wildest dreams, in one banners brokers video I saw that you can make 3 trillion dollars from BB if you put in 5000usd, (after 4 years because you see its not a get rich quick scheme) thats TRILLION which is a thousand billion, and I know thats the gods honest truth because it was even in a video on youtube, youtube is a global corporation like mastercard and they operate in every country and if they had a video of something that was a scam do you think they would still exist??? exactly!!!! BB is here to stay, anyone that thinks that it is a scam is gonna miss out big time, the internet is WORLDWIDE, there is unlimited growth, banners will be paying out So much money I just had to check on wikipedia to see what is more than a trillion, you know what is... Quadrillion! then Quintillion then all the way up to Centillion which has 303 "0" s! ... now THATS COOL! and banners brokers will be paying even much more than that, so while we are sluggin away at our day jobs , you will be living in a solid gold palace with your very own powerstation that burns 100 dollar bills to heat your olympic size outdoor pool in the winter... in Finland!, talk about changing lives!!! quickly waverider put in as much money as you can get your hands on, sell a kidney if you have too, sell the car, the house, ebay your clothes, go round to your friends houses and strip the copper from the walls an lead from the roofs and buy panels, they will thank you my friend!, hurry now, dont let the dreamstealers and the negative types get you down, this is your destiny! Chris Smith choose YOU my friend

[Unknown_S]

That's assuming that BB is in fact a scam, as is alleged here, however to this date there isn't a single shred of evidence both here and on the Finch blog that this is the case.
Nor is there evidence of ads. Any legitimate business has no problem proving so. BB is a ponzi. If it weren't true, you'd have proved it by now. If I sat here claiming Google was not the business they say they are, I could be proven wrong very quickly. But instead, I'll just sit here stating BB is a ponzi scam! ponzi! scam!!!¡¡¡! And you hate the fact there's nothing you can do about it. You can't shut me up, and you can't prove me wrong.

[noname999]

Ah waverider. You are such a liar. One minute your battery is running out and then you continue to post for two hours more. If you lie about the simple things, imagine the lies you are telling about the scam that has your money trapped.

Still waiting for you answer to how BB makes money. Not the story that a 16 year old (and more worryingly, you) would fall for. But an answer that actual adults with a brain would believe.

[Finix]

That's assuming that BB is in fact a scam
That's the only realistic assumption one can make when dealing with online programs. How can they be anything else? To assume otherwise, you'd have to assume that (1) there are some unknown characters appearing out of nowhere who (2) have figured out the way of making returns no one else can make and that (3) they want to share it with the public out of the goodness of their hearts. But wait, they want YOUR money FIRST. Too many freaking assumptions.

[Topdog]

Hello
Recently i was invited by a friend to look into banners broker.
I cannot find any mention of a external governing body to which BB are governed by on national or international level ?
I cannot find any trace of companies associated with BB (10 large brokers refused but 1 saw the oppertunity) still no name !
Thanks to you people providing this forum
Any BB supporters please show credible names of above

[WealthBoy]

I could not really understand why you guys here are debating about BB...of course it is a ponzi program but BB has just become a little bit sophisticated to make the program last longer (or maybe become a little bit stable though many would be raising eyebrows here).

Now, you might say that am a critic of BB. No, I am also an investor in BB. I invested in there last April or May 2012 and so far I already got back my initial investment and some profits.

Is this a big ponzi? Yes, it is...no question on that. Let's call a ponzi a ponzi so that people will be careful if ever they would invest with BB.

[noname999]

Your honesty is refreshing.

[littleroundman]

Let's call a ponzi a ponzi so that people will be careful if ever they would invest with BB.

Sounds easy, doesn't it ???

All anyone would have to do is display a "This is a HYIP ponzi, play at your own risk" banner on the front page of their website and all the problems would be solved.

But of course, they're not.

Their intent is to steal as much money as possible from as many people as possible while pretending to be a legitimate business.

All the "shoulda, woulda, couldas" in the world can't disguise the fact Banners Broker (and any other HYIP ponzi) are fraudulent.

[Topdog]

Indeed thanks for your honesty !
At a time when when tax revenues are at an all time low your due payment of capital gains (profits)will be greatly appreciated !

[Joe_Shmoe]

I could not really understand why you guys here are debating about BB...of course it is a ponzi program but BB has just become a little bit sophisticated to make the program last longer (or maybe become a little bit stable though many would be raising eyebrows here).

Now, you might say that am a critic of BB. No, I am also an investor in BB. I invested in there last April or May 2012 and so far I already got back my initial investment and some profits.

Is this a big ponzi? Yes, it is...no question on that. Let's call a ponzi a ponzi so that people will be careful if ever they would invest with BB.

So are you saying that if you know Banners Broker is a Ponzi scheme, it's okay to steal other peoples money? Bearing in mind that many/most don't know they are in fact joining a Ponzi scheme, Banners Broker do their damnedest to hide the fact it's a Ponzi Scheme with all the advertising BS.


OH! and by the way you do know that Ponzi schemes are illegal whether disguised or not don't you?

[Gregg]

Hi, Gregg,
~snip~

By the way, name-calling, by calling me "a lying sack of ****" is not very professional and does not add to the credibility of this forum, if you could kindly refrain from such childish actions, that would be muchly appreciated. I'd like to think we're all adults here, and that we're able to act rationally and make our comments, opinions, experiences and such in a professional manner without resorting to such childish tactics. Not that I'm complaining, keep going if you want to, you're just helping to sink the credibility of this forum, and by doing that you're not exactly helping the cause from your side of the BB fence.

I'm terribly sorry. I'm an educated man, with a large vocabulary, but when I picture you in my minds eye, well, that's all I got.

[path2prosperity]

I actually agree with Hypanor that this doesn't belong in BB thread and apologize for my part in off-top. Let's ask the admins to move it to another thread if people are interested in discussing general industry issues.

I was rude to you Finix dear. Apologies! My ex employment agent's instincts speak now and then. You are somebody with star quality but you do need somebody to help you find the best niche for your skills and I am too old for that job! Will send you a PM as I would like to get to know you better.

[AshKen1]

I'm terribly sorry. I'm an educated man, with a large vocabulary, but when I picture you in my minds eye, well, that's all I got.

I too am educated, and I don't have an issue with the words you used Gregg. Works for me perfectly well.

:RpS_wink:

[PPBlog]

I could not really understand why you guys here are debating about BB...of course it is a ponzi program but BB has just become a little bit sophisticated to make the program last longer (or maybe become a little bit stable though many would be raising eyebrows here).

Great. There is a "sophisticated means" sentencing enhancement under U.S. guidelines.


Now, you might say that am a critic of BB. No, I am also an investor in BB. I invested in there last April or May 2012 and so far I already got back my initial investment and some profits.

Great. You invested in a Ponzi scheme knowing full well is was a Ponzi scheme that "has just become a little bit sophisticated to make the program last longer."

Story about a fraud scheme in which prosecutors called for a "sophisticated means" sentencing enhancement:

Wasendorf should get maximum embezzlement sentence, government says | TheGazette (http://thegazette.com/2013/01/22/wasendorf-should-get-maximum-embezzlement-sentence-government-says/)

Here's what happened:

FBI — Peregrine Financial Group CEO Sentenced to 50 Years for Fraud, Embezzlement, and Lying to Regulators (http://www.fbi.gov/omaha/press-releases/2013/peregrine-financial-group-ceo-sentenced-to-50-years-for-fraud-embezzlement-and-lying-to-regulators)

BTW, there also is a "mass marketing" sentencing enhancement under U.S. guidelines: U.S.S.G. § 2B1.1(b)(2)(A)(ii)

"The Guidelines define 'mass-marketing' to include fraudulent schemes 'conducted through solicitation by . . . the Internet . . . to induce a large number of persons to . . . invest for financial profit.'"

One such case in which the "mass marketing" sentencing enhancement was applied:

07-3514: USA v. Jeffrey Heckel :: Seventh Circuit :: US Court of Appeals Cases :: Justia (http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/ca7/07-3514/07-3514-2009-06-22-opinion-2011-02-25.html)

From United States of America v. Jeffrey Heckel, U.S. Court of Appeals for the Seventh Circuit (bolding added):

"Application of the mass-marketing enhancement was appropriate because Heckel used the Internet to conduct large-scale advertising to attract bidders to his fraudulent online auctions . . ."

PPBlog

[Justin Casey]

One can only assume, judging by the reams of nonsensical gibberish that they post, that BB "apologists" are being paid by the word. I hope that they are being paid via E-wallet. That would be so funny, lulz in fact.

[PPBlog]

Probably should add there is a sentencing enhancement for "vulnerable victims" such as senior citizens. Story on case from Tennessee:

EDITORIAL: Recruiting Seniors Into Your Downline? Why Ponzi-Forum Purveyors And Pimps Should Pay Attention To Dennis Bolze’s Failed Bid To Have His 27-Year-Prison Sentence Reduced (http://www.patrickpretty.com/2012/01/10/editorial-recuiting-seniors-into-your-downline-why-ponzi-forum-purveyors-and-pimps-should-pay-attention-to-dennis-bolzes-failed-bid-to-have-his-27-year-prison-sentence-reduced/)

PPBlog

[noname999]

Prove it....Go on....Here is your big chance to show how you are right and how all the old hands are wrong....

Mortgage your house.....Withdraw all your savings....Max out your credit cards and deposit the lot in BB which you say is not dead....

Then come back and tell us how you made out......

I'm not proud....I'll be happy to admit that I was wrong and you were right.....

Why would I put all my money into something that I know is a scam?

[Whip]

The bit in bold is the important bit, and the one that relates directly to the $2000 chicken burger in my analogy. Let's say, just for the sake of argument, that the banners exist. The figures that are being bandied about would mean than BB have a margin,the difference between what they pay their supplier and what they charge their customer, of over 36000%. Not even Columbian drug lords have that sort of mark-up, yet here you, and Teflon Terry are, telling us that not only do BB achieve this, but they do it over and over and over again, week in week out.

The question therefore, given that the every industry analyst states that the market for banner adverts is in freefall with prices decreasing almost daily, is where are all these sales coming from?

Do you really believe that someone charged with purchasing advertising space for a large national or multinational organisation (remember the claims, including yours, are of blue chip clients) is going to pay THREE HUNDRED AND SIXTY times the going rate? Remember the claim isn't just that ONE customer does, but that hundreds or thousands do. No wonder BB won't say who their clients are, their media buyers would all be queued up outside the job centre the very next morning.

What really amuses me though is that the more you, Teflon Terry, or the Happy Hooker try and explain it, the more preposterous the whole thing sounds. I almost look forward to hearing the next excuse for where the money comes from.

I'd imaging it won't be long before the claim is not that BB are like Google, but that they are Google, a secretive philanthropic section of the company that tours the world helping the poor and hard of thinking to achieve millionaire status in a few short weeks...

There is also the argument that was used in the ASD ponzi case. Why haven't the huge, legitimate corporations also gotten invested in this and reaped far more rewards then they currently are acting legally?

[Della Cate]

Oh dear, someone on BB Facts and Updates is not happy!

His account, if he has one, will be closed!

2967

[Whip]

Prove it....Go on....Here is your big chance to show how you are right and how all the old hands are wrong....

Mortgage your house.....Withdraw all your savings....Max out your credit cards and deposit the lot in BB which you say is not dead....

Then come back and tell us how you made out......

I'm not proud....I'll be happy to admit that I was wrong and you were right.....

I've noticed the scammers are using a 'rotation' for their visitors to this site. I forget who should be up next though.

[Whip]

Nor is there evidence of ads. Any legitimate business has no problem proving so. BB is a ponzi. If it weren't true, you'd have proved it by now. If I sat here claiming Google was not the business they say they are, I could be proven wrong very quickly. But instead, I'll just sit here stating BB is a ponzi scam! ponzi! scam!!!¡¡¡! And you hate the fact there's nothing you can do about it. You can't shut me up, and you can't prove me wrong.

The fact they think they can state major corporations are advertising without knowing at all where their ads are even going is laughable.

[Brenda]

One can only assume, judging by the reams of nonsensical gibberish that they post, that BB "apologists" are being paid by the word. I hope that they are being paid via E-wallet. That would be so funny, lulz in fact.

'the reams of nonsensical gibberish' in an attempt to justify this perfect system that is running so smoothly that it's secrecy is paramount to protect it from being copied and lucrative enough to make millionaires from mere average Joe's. In fact, it's happily working away while the affiliates sleep.

Then look at what they are saying in the webinars, BB fb announcements, etc and they all start with apologies for systems issues, problems with making payments, nonsensical excuses for unreliable payment dates, promises of systems improvements.

What they say and what we KNOW , black and white. You couldn't make it up!

[AshKen1]

One can only assume, judging by the reams of nonsensical gibberish that they post, that BB "apologists" are being paid by the word. I hope that they are being paid via E-wallet. That would be so funny, lulz in fact.

Of course they're being paid via the e-wallet. Alternatively, it could be a fast-track payment to the pre-paid card.... which at the current speed should get there in about 12 months time, if they're lucky.

But yeah, lulz :RpS_wink:

[kiwichick]

Hi all, found someone called Doria Johnson on linkedin and another person Elizabeth Spooner, both promoting bb in nz, shame on you kiwi's have none of you done any due diligence?
to any kiwi's reading this forum contact the commerce commission and they will inform you that bb is in fact a pyramid scheme, come on kiwi's one simple phone call then decide for yourselves who you will believe, banners broker (strangers overseas out to con you) or our very own commerce commission who ensure that all companies abide by the rules of our FAIR TRADING ACT!

[TheDozor]

Hi yall!
Im a long time lurker, but I decided to finaly create an account just to tell you that I love this thread!
A friend of mine tried to get me sucked into BB and I wanted to se if there was any info about it, so I found this page.
I cant contribute with anything to the discussion, just wanted to tell you that I really like what you are doing here.
Hopefully, BB will go down before more poor souls get scamed, hopefully...

[Finix]

I was rude to you Finix dear. Apologies! My ex employment agent's instincts speak now and then. You are somebody with star quality but you do need somebody to help you find the best niche for your skills and I am too old for that job! Will send you a PM as I would like to get to know you better.
Don't worry about me. I already had the best job in the industry - being an exchanger. I don't want to be anything else online, and short of running a program, I've already done everything else the industry has to offer.

[path2prosperity]

I've noticed the scammers are using a 'rotation' for their visitors to this site. I forget who should be up next though.

Same old!!"

Don't you remember the Krimm mod rotation. First the "nice guy "jerry1530 or some name like that then the guy beginning with T, then wiseowl and last but not least Brookie. Then they all joined forces and became Mod Squad!

SBM had something to say about them.

Mod Squad in action (http://www.realscam.com/f13/realscam-its-admins-have-fan-club-we-do-conspire-expose-scammers-949/index2.html)

The other in krimm mod rotation was the Tonik.

This saga is a new version of Bob Krimm and his mod squad. Krimm threatened to sue me. I ignored the threats and wrote more "libel" about him.

Krimm's mods or cronies ganged up and called themselves "Mod Squad." The five or six in the motley crew squad tried to get into the news and win the sympathy vote by taking over NetSurfMonitor. They said the owner had given them permission to tell their story about the injury to Krimm which was being caused by one old woman in UK.

The owner of NetSurfMonitor Gary something or other flunked out and sold his monitor to David Estes. David would not publish malicious gossip about anybody without evidence, so that fell flat. Krimm's mod squad could not get any support from online journalists so they united and threatned to sue me as a group.

Where are the Krimm mods now? Wiseowl's picture is being circulated on every underground network. I am pretty sure that Jerry (only talk facts) has shown his nose in here. These fake law students and church members who originated from Adlandpro could easily be ex Krimm members. They are completely effete and doomed to failure like Krimm's Mod Squad. The Tonik ( a Krimm mod) opened a forex training school around the same time as Jill Bachman opened hers. She gave that up pretty quickly so where is The Tonik?

[path2prosperity]

Why thank you waverider.....You are too kind :RpS_smile:

FYI....The only thing I hate more than a shill who is fluent in "scammer talk" is an AUSSIE shill who is fluent in "scammer talk":NO:

Like sharkeyshark who was going to polish you off in one gulp.

[Finix]

All anyone would have to do is display a "This is a HYIP ponzi, play at your own risk" banner on the front page of their website and all the problems would be solved.

But of course, they're not.
Not true. It's been done in the past, and on several occasions. A straight up game for gamblers that says it's a game.

There are a lot more admins who would do it, but admitting to running an illegal scheme right on the site complicates the matters. What's the point of being honest if it's only going to hurt you?

Now if the games were legalized, such warnings on sites would be a norm.

[Theseus]

I've noticed the scammers are using a 'rotation' for their visitors to this site. I forget which of Roger Stockburger's personalities should be up next though.

Edited for truth :RpS_wink:

[baylee]

Like sharkeyshark who was going to polish you off in one gulp.

I completely forgot about that pimp/shill. I always hoped that Martin Brody with Quint and Cooper's help would have killed Sharkeyshark! LOL

[Finix]

Tell me, Roger, when you go into KFC do they hand you a physical product for your money, or do they tell you that your lunch is somewhere, but they can't tell you where?

Also, to be 100% accurate you'd also have to be paying $2000 for your box of dead chicken bits and the KFC staff would have bought it, at a reduced rate, five minutes before it was due to go in the bin, from the Hungry Jack's next door...
You forgot to mention what the compensation plan for the staff looks like. It's even more hilarious than what the customers get.

[Whip]

Edited for truth :RpS_wink:

lol.......

[okosh]

Same old!!"

Don't you remember the Krimm mod rotation. First the "nice guy "jerry1530 or some name like that then the guy beginning with T, then wiseowl and last but not least Brookie. Then they all joined forces and became Mod Squad!

SBM had something to say about them.

Mod Squad in action (http://www.realscam.com/f13/realscam-its-admins-have-fan-club-we-do-conspire-expose-scammers-949/index2.html)

The other in krimm mod rotation was the Tonik.

This saga is a new version of Bob Krimm and his mod squad. Krimm threatened to sue me. I ignored the threats and wrote more "libel" about him.

Krimm's mods or cronies ganged up and called themselves "Mod Squad." The five or six in the motley crew squad tried to get into the news and win the sympathy vote by taking over NetSurfMonitor. They said the owner had given them permission to tell their story about the injury to Krimm which was being caused by one old woman in UK.

The owner of NetSurfMonitor Gary something or other flunked out and sold his monitor to David Estes. David would not publish malicious gossip about anybody without evidence, so that fell flat. Krimm's mod squad could not get any support from online journalists so they united and threatned to sue me as a group.

Where are the Krimm mods now? Wiseowl's picture is being circulated on every underground network. I am pretty sure that Jerry (only talk facts) has shown his nose in here. These fake law students and church members who originated from Adlandpro could easily be ex Krimm members. They are completely effete and doomed to failure like Krimm's Mod Squad. The Tonik ( a Krimm mod) opened a forex training school around the same time as Jill Bachman opened hers. She gave that up pretty quickly so where is The Tonik?

Thank you Judy for that trip down memory lane.......

For those wanting to read more about it.....Program was called 15hits daily and the name tri-star was also used.....
IMO that scam and Robert Krimm were way ahead of their time.....If started today it could have been one of the biggest ever.....
LOL...I wish I'd have bought some of them Tri-Star coffee mugs when I had the chance :RpS_laugh:

[okosh]

Like sharkeyshark who was going to polish you off in one gulp.

Sharkeyshark is just one of many scammers in the club of those who promised to polish me off.....

And just this week we added the newest member to the club.....

For those who have not read it yet it seems that a scammer in the USA wants to sue me for calling him a scammer......

http://www.realscam.com/f9/integrity-wealth-builders-group-706/index2.html#post44181

[okosh]

Why would I put all my money into something that I know is a scam?

Never a smart move to ask the question if you not going to like the answer :RpS_wink:

[littleroundman]

For those who have not read it yet it seems that a scammer in the USA wants to sue me for calling him a scammer......

http://www.realscam.com/f9/integrity-wealth-builders-group-706/index2.html#post44181

Wouldn't ya just love it if one of those wombats ever decided to walk the talk and actually follow through with their B/S threats ???

Can you imagine Goddie Ude on the front page of the local paper explaining how his recommending and participating in HYIP ponzi fraud aligns with his Christian beliefs ???

[Unknown_S]

Edited for truth :RpS_wink:

I can understand why Roger's a little upset. He came late to the game, and only just received his BB mastercard in Sept 2012. So he'd be rushing to con as many victims as possible before the collapse. How inconsiderate of the people here to get in the way of his masterplan. :RpS_biggrin:

[Theseus]

I can understand why Roger's a little upset. He came late to the game, and only just received his BB mastercard in Sept 2012. So he'd be rushing to con as many victims as possible before the collapse. How inconsiderate of the people here to get in the way of his masterplan. :RpS_biggrin:

Lest anyone forgets just what a complete tool Roger is....

Banners Broker Update - Card has arrived !!!! - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VvPCMM_WKA)

[hendyphilhendy]

Not sure how much influence this site has but came across this article

The Suspicious Case of Banners Broker (http://www.obtainer-online.com/news/en/the-suspicious-case-of-banners-broker.html)

[Theseus]

Not sure how much influence this site has but came across this article

The Suspicious Case of Banners Broker (http://www.obtainer-online.com/news/en/the-suspicious-case-of-banners-broker.html)

Need an account to view the article....

[hendyphilhendy]

Waverider

I wanted to go back to your issue of audited accounts. You say that this wouldn't be good enough evidence for 'us'.

I disagree as this would give good evidence of what is happening with the money and would be audited by a big accounting firm.

However, it appears that by basing themselves how they do they deliberately avoid any talk of audited accounts etc. Surely it would be worth having this done if only for the publicity benefit.

Genuine companies have nothing to be afraid of.

[hendyphilhendy]

Need an account to view the article....

I know but it took two mins to register.

When on computer will post article. Was more interested in the credibility of the site and if it is a well known one.

[hendyphilhendy]

Stokes again - a retired Chartered Accountant approves BB and knows all about MLM.


Banners Broker Accountant Interview - Video Dailymotion (http://touch.dailymotion.com/video/xx5em0_banners-broker-accountant-interview_tech)

More members of the 'golden generation'

[littleroundman]

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc153/thelittleroundman/scams%202/leslie_zpsd970c687.jpg


http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xx5em0_banners-broker-accountant-interview_tech

Banners Broker on DailyMotion (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xx5em0_banners-broker-accountant-interview_tech#.UQ4wMPLhcQY)

[Theseus]

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc153/thelittleroundman/scams%202/leslie_zpsd970c687.jpg




How appropriate that Stokes' eyes are closed, that's how most of his aged victims go into BB....

[noname999]

Never a smart move to ask the question if you not going to like the answer :RpS_wink:

I just wish I was as clever as you.

[kiwichick]

Hi from nz to all the intelligent bloggers I got to know before I was forced outside into the gorgeous nz summer sun :RpS_thumbup: ,,,,,,,,,,,,,Clearly the cold miserable weather is affecting the mood and content of this forum........... thankfully I found very informative posts with quality sources provided to guide my own due diligence during 2012 when bannersbroker first arrived down here.............I fear for my fellow kiwis who are full of the hype of bb at the crucial 2 year+ point............

Those I remember...................poyol, philhendy, theseus, eagleone, hypanor, Brenda, martin88 ....to name a few but particularly those in uk etc. (where is IS NOT 1.30 AM!!! and back to work/schools etc. business as usual in just a few hours, the worst Monday morning ever!!! , summer fun is over :crying_2:) ..........can I ask you guys to have a look at this site I found earlier..........
Hi! Would you perhaps know if Banners Broker International - JustAnswer (http://www.justanswer.com/fraud-examiner/7envl-hi-perhaps-know-banners-broker-international.html)..........not a nz site but comes up when I do a google.co.nz search as most new believers here will be running

certainly seems to me legal expert could update her response.......can you who know how please re-explain (for the benefit of the new believers) what info is credible and not ....eg whois, better business beauau, etc. what are these and what do they mean....... I read all the posts before I started posting as kiwichicknz but now 317 pages is a big ask!!! but a credit to realscam overall........the most recent pages appear now as just there is many pages of blah blah blah easily discredited when first googling for answers.........I always check the googlenz search for bannersbroker and would appreciate very much any regulars help to save the kiwi........and yes for those of you who aren't aware our native bird the kiwi is at risk of extinction.....save the kiwis who are probably the last few currently getting sucked in ........
any update from Australia on the facebook dissapperance?

[path2prosperity]

Thank you Judy for that trip down memory lane.......

For those wanting to read more about it.....Program was called 15hits daily and the name tri-star was also used.....
IMO that scam and Robert Krimm were way ahead of their time.....If started today it could have been one of the biggest ever.....
LOL...I wish I'd have bought some of them Tri-Star coffee mugs when I had the chance :RpS_laugh:

I have just discovered another story about a master criminal which I had missed on PatrickPretty blog The unfortunate John Gaze who escaped with his life when Sasha DeHoughton kidnapped him and tried to rob him of his stately home was pre Internet but it is a brilliant illustation of how Police and other legal authorities do get the bastards in the end. If people come forward and report the facts there is no need to be scared.

I have just placed a comment on PatrickPretty blog and invited people who have encountered people like Sasha DeHoughton, BobKrimm and BannersBroker scumbags, who think the law will never catch up with them, to join RealScam. They do not get away with it. DeHoughton is rotting in jail with the likes of TrevorCook and AndyBowdoin. The story of John Gaze's escape when he ran naked into the street and reported the crime makes me shudder as it could have been me or my husband that the man wanted to kidnap and murder.

Patrick's article (http://www.patrickpretty.com/2011/05/10/recommended-readingviewing-washington-postbloomberg-report-on-the-ponzi-schemer-next-door-finraaarp-share-tale-of-purported-bank-president-who-lured-victims-while-craving-cocaine-at-p/)

[kiwichick]

BannersBroker – Corporate Message Terminations (http://www.businessforhome.org/2012/09/bannersbroker-corporate-message-terminations/)
and this one came up as well ............thought they weren't an advertising company mr stern?


Banners Broker – Corporate Message Terminations

by Ted Nuyten on September 6, 2012

Terminations

I am not very pleased with an online opportunity were corporate management is hiding. Banners Broker is such an UK – Canada based online opportunity and I observed a lot of former Zeeklers went in. Time will learn if Banners Broker is legit. I have my doubts but I am not specialized in legit or not-legit. You decide.

Anyway in July 2012 Chris Smith founder and CEO has send this message out:

Dear BB Affiliates,

There comes a time in business where difficult decisions have to be made for the betterment and longevity of the organization. Kuldip Josun, our VP of Corporate Sales has been relieved of his duties and is no longer affiliated with Banners Broker or any Banners Broker partner companies.

It has become apparent that the direction Mr. Josun wanted to proceed with is not the same vision of Banners Broker. Banners Broker is an online advertising company and will grow in the direction of providing online sales and marketing tools.

We wish Mr. Josun the best of luck in his future endeavours.

To address some important points, first and foremost, it is business as usual for all Affiliates, Leaders, Resellers and Independent Contractors. Chris Smith is the sole owner of Banners Broker International since inception and is the sole signing officer for the Banners Broker International bank accounts.

As we continue to grow, Rajiv Dixit will be handling corporate sales for the interim, and we will be hiring a new on-the-road sales and presentation specialist for long term. Due to a breach of contract, Mr. John Rock is no longer assisting Banners Broker Canada with compliance and is no longer affiliated with Banners Broker or any Banners Broker partner. All decisions that have been made are final.

We are extremely excited about the 2nd convention on Sunday, July 15th and we are expecting a huge crowd. This convention will be bigger and better than the first. Looking forward to seeing all of you there!

Sincerely,
Chris Smith,
CEO Banners Broker International

and close up photos of all
Chris Smith Founder and CEO Banners Broker Ian Driscoll Banners Broker Kuldip Josun Rajiv Dixit Banners Broker
Chris Smith – CEO Ian Driscoll – Sales Kuldip Josan Rajiv Dixit

interesting how 'chris smith' apart from the bs he also refers to himself in the third person?

[path2prosperity]

Sharkeyshark is just one of many scammers in the club of those who promised to polish me off.....

And just this week we added the newest member to the club.....

For those who have not read it yet it seems that a scammer in the USA wants to sue me for calling him a scammer......

http://www.realscam.com/f9/integrity-wealth-builders-group-706/index2.html#post44181

BobKrimm, TerryThe W no Sorry "TerryThe Banker," NickSmirnow, Bogdan Fiedur, Diane Bjorling and a few others are fond of this game. We will have fun when the case comes up in court. Hope it is in UK as we could have lunch at some of the fascinating little wine bars around Lincolns Inn fields or the Inns of Court!

[Brenda]

BannersBroker – Corporate Message Terminations (http://www.businessforhome.org/2012/09/bannersbroker-corporate-message-terminations/)
and this one came up as well ............thought they weren't an advertising company mr stern?


Banners Broker – Corporate Message Terminations

by Ted Nuyten on September 6, 2012

Terminations

I am not very pleased with an online opportunity were corporate management is hiding. Banners Broker is such an UK – Canada based online opportunity and I observed a lot of former Zeeklers went in. Time will learn if Banners Broker is legit. I have my doubts but I am not specialized in legit or not-legit. You decide.

Anyway in July 2012 Chris Smith founder and CEO has send this message out:

Dear BB Affiliates,

There comes a time in business where difficult decisions have to be made for the betterment and longevity of the organization. Kuldip Josun, our VP of Corporate Sales has been relieved of his duties and is no longer affiliated with Banners Broker or any Banners Broker partner companies.

It has become apparent that the direction Mr. Josun wanted to proceed with is not the same vision of Banners Broker. Banners Broker is an online advertising company and will grow in the direction of providing online sales and marketing tools.

We wish Mr. Josun the best of luck in his future endeavours.

To address some important points, first and foremost, it is business as usual for all Affiliates, Leaders, Resellers and Independent Contractors. Chris Smith is the sole owner of Banners Broker International since inception and is the sole signing officer for the Banners Broker International bank accounts.

As we continue to grow, Rajiv Dixit will be handling corporate sales for the interim, and we will be hiring a new on-the-road sales and presentation specialist for long term. Due to a breach of contract, Mr. John Rock is no longer assisting Banners Broker Canada with compliance and is no longer affiliated with Banners Broker or any Banners Broker partner. All decisions that have been made are final.

We are extremely excited about the 2nd convention on Sunday, July 15th and we are expecting a huge crowd. This convention will be bigger and better than the first. Looking forward to seeing all of you there!

Sincerely,
Chris Smith,
CEO Banners Broker International

and close up photos of all
Chris Smith Founder and CEO Banners Broker Ian Driscoll Banners Broker Kuldip Josun Rajiv Dixit Banners Broker
Chris Smith – CEO Ian Driscoll – Sales Kuldip Josan Rajiv Dixit

interesting how 'chris smith' apart from the bs he also refers to himself in the third person?

thanks Kiwi!
Never heard of John Rock before so did a little googling myself, seems himself and Kul are bossom buddies and leading a new healthier (cough) lifestyle

The Owners | (http://kulroc.com/about-us/who-we-are/)

and here's a little of what is being said about their new venture, Sisel

http://www.scam.com/showthread.php?t=33589

population of toronto c6,000,000. Hardly a coincidence that most involved in BB are living beside each other, Pickering , Oshawa, Whitby.

[Brenda]

and a little bit more on ex BB;s head of compliance, lol

Business Profiles and Company Information | ZoomInfo.com (http://www.zoominfo.com/#!search/profile/person?personId=749201862&targetid=profile)

Pyramid Scheme Alert (http://www.pyramidschemealert.org/PSAMain/news/CanadasHomeGrownSchemes.html)

when we can find out the backgrounds so easily about this so called guru's of their trade, used by BB to establish of all things, credibility, one can only imagine what really lurks behind the secret life of Chris Smith, mystery man extraordinaire!

[path2prosperity]

Thank you Judy for that trip down memory lane.......

For those wanting to read more about it.....Program was called 15hits daily and the name tri-star was also used.....
IMO that scam and Robert Krimm were way ahead of their time.....If started today it could have been one of the biggest ever.....
LOL...I wish I'd have bought some of them Tri-Star coffee mugs when I had the chance :RpS_laugh:

I think "wiseowl" was an Aussie. They all thought she could not be prosecuted as the rest of the thugs were North American and "wiseow" was too far away to be connected to any North American scams.

Nancetta knows a fair bit about "wiseowl." Hope she will spill some beans!

Have you seen this mug shot as it is rather well photographed.

She was going to sue me but the writ has not arrived yet.

Wiseowl (http://path2prosperity.com/images/wiseowl.jpg).

[Della Cate]

Here's another photo of Chris Smith, this time with a Polish (I think he is) affiliate at the new Stellar Point offices. Please note the sophisticated surroundings. And the ladder, to the left, is a nice touch.


2968

[Hypanor]

Not sure how much influence this site has but came across this article

The Suspicious Case of Banners Broker (http://www.obtainer-online.com/news/en/the-suspicious-case-of-banners-broker.html)


The Suspicious Case of Banners Broker
Published: 31 January 2013

Ever since it was founded in 2010 by Chris Smith and Kul Josun, there has been a cloud of suspicion hanging low over Banners Broker with people questioning the legality of the Banners Broker system. In recent weeks this suspicion has gained traction globally as the Banners Broker business model, and the legitimacy thereof, came under scrutiny by governments and began to raise a few eyebrows.

Banners Broker is an online advertising agency based in Toronto, Canada, which currently operates in dozens of markets around the globe, including the US, Ireland, Poland, and India. The agency currently offers advertisers the opportunity to advertise their products on relevant, target-orientated websites, and, simultaneously offers publishers the opportunity to generate a secondary revenue stream by placing designated ads on selected pages. Affiliates are, however, encouraged to sign up to an Ad-Pub combo, which combines the benefits offered to advertisers and publishers and also supposedly offers ‘six ways to earn more’.

The legitimacy of the business model and opportunity has been called into question for numerous reasons:
.
.
Usual stuff - ICF, India, Irish Press, Paul Stuffing Up (his four-fold return comment), not forthcoming about explaining the income model
.
.
Is Banners Broker operating an illegal ponzi-style business model? Only time will tell. OBTAINER will be keeping a very close watch on developments at Banners Broker over the coming weeks.

Attempts were made by the OBTAINER editorial team to contact Banners Broker and Banners Broker Compliance Officer, David Hooker, for an interview. At time of publication, OBTAINER was unsuccessful in gaining a reply.

..........

[Theseus]

Attempts were made by the OBTAINER editorial team to contact Banners Broker and Banners Broker Compliance Officer, David Hooker, for an interview. At time of publication, OBTAINER was unsuccessful in gaining a reply.

And yet Telflon Terry was more than happy to post reams and reams of utter gibberish here....

[Gregg]

Here's another photo of Chris Smith, this time with a Polish (I think he is) affiliate at the new Stellar Point offices. Please note the sophisticated surroundings. And the ladder, to the left, is a nice touch.


2968

That shot was taken out in the warehouse, were they keep the produ....Umm, no, wait a second

[marsh56]

PPBlog, thanks for the links regarding PFG and others. I had a trading account more than once with PFG and am grateful that I withdrew all of my funds both times.

With a background in trading currencies, I constantly warn other traders that funds are at 100% risk AT ALL TIMES in a trading account. The authorities simply cannot watch everyone. The PFG guy is 64 years old and will now be serving a 50-year federal sentence with no parole. What good will all of his ill-gotten gains do him now?

In BB's case, the fact that it may be "sophisticated" should indeed mean more jail time for those responsible should they be caught. What is scary to me is how many frauds are being perpetrated as we speak and the fraudsters have yet to be caught.

In the end, the attraction is "free" and "easy" money. Of course there is no such thing. Those like waverider who believe this nonsense are delusional at best. Then again, perception equals reality.

In spite of Terry Sterns hype in long, drawn out posts (that really say nothing by the way), there is zero "work" involved with BB. In addition, to say their purported ads are a "product" is insulting to anyone who is fair-minded and reasonably intelligent.

The sad truth is that now that we are in a global economy, there is probably a sucker born every nano second as opposed to every minute!

Mark

[noname999]

I think a huge factor with the global economy is that with scams like this you may never have to face your downline when the scam collapses. In times past, with ponzi schemes, there was always a certain degree of responsibility towards those you recruited. With these online scams that sense of responsibility is majorly diminished.
I have discussed this with one BB member that was quite open in admitting that he is delighted that he will probably never have to meet half his downline as they 'live half way round the world, and couldn't afford to travel to find him anyway.'

[Whip]

Here's another photo of Chris Smith, this time with a Polish (I think he is) affiliate at the new Stellar Point offices. Please note the sophisticated surroundings. And the ladder, to the left, is a nice touch.


2968

Is he the white one on the right this time or still the gentleman on the left?

[RockLion]

Why thank you waverider.....You are too kind :RpS_smile:

FYI....The only thing I hate more than a shill who is fluent in "scammer talk" is an AUSSIE shill who is fluent in "scammer talk":NO:

Especially an Aussie without any friends
from View Profile: waverider - RealScam.com - Is it, or isn't it? You Decide. (http://www.realscam.com/members/waverider/)
"waverider has not made any friends yet"

[Joe_Shmoe]

Somebody's been busy.

I'm getting this warning in Google Chrome when I navigate to Realscam.com

Is this what Banners Broker meant by fighting back on the forums & Blogs?

Anybody else getting this?




Advisory provided by
http://safebrowsing.clients.google.com/images/malware_logo.gif


Safe Browsing

Diagnostic page for realscam.com


What is the current listing status for realscam.com?
Site is listed as suspicious - visiting this web site may harm your computer.

What happened when Google visited this site?
Of the 10 pages we tested on the site over the past 90 days, 0 page(s) resulted in malicious software being downloaded and installed without user consent. The last time Google visited this site was on 2013-01-25, and suspicious content was never found on this site within the past 90 days.This site was hosted on 1 network(s) including AS26496 (PAH) (http://safebrowsing.clients.google.com/safebrowsing/diagnostic?site=AS:26496&client=googlechrome&hl=en-US).

Has this site acted as an intermediary resulting in further distribution of malware?
Over the past 90 days, realscam.com did not appear to function as an intermediary for the infection of any sites.

Has this site hosted malware?
No, this site has not hosted malicious software over the past 90 days.

How did this happen?
In some cases, third parties can add malicious code to legitimate sites, which would cause us to show the warning message.

Next steps:


Return to the previous page. (http://safebrowsing.clients.google.com/safebrowsing/diagnostic?site=http%3A%2F%2Frealscam.com%2F&client=googlechrome&hl=en-US#)
If you are the owner of this web site, you can request a review of your site using Google Webmaster Tools (http://www.google.com/webmasters/tools/). More information about the review process is available in Google's Webmaster Help Center (http://www.google.com/support/webmasters/bin/answer.py?answer=45432).

Updated 7 hours ago




© Google - Google Home (http://www.google.com/)


2970

[Nourjan]

Somebody's been busy.

I'm getting this warning in Google Chrome when I navigate to Realscam.com

Is this what Banners Broker meant by fighting back on the forums & Blogs?

Anybody else getting this?




Advisory provided by
http://safebrowsing.clients.google.com/images/malware_logo.gif


Safe Browsing

Diagnostic page for realscam.com


What is the current listing status for realscam.com?
Site is listed as suspicious - visiting this web site may harm your computer.

What happened when Google visited this site?
Of the 10 pages we tested on the site over the past 90 days, 0 page(s) resulted in malicious software being downloaded and installed without user consent. The last time Google visited this site was on 2013-01-25, and suspicious content was never found on this site within the past 90 days.This site was hosted on 1 network(s) including AS26496 (PAH) (http://safebrowsing.clients.google.com/safebrowsing/diagnostic?site=AS:26496&client=googlechrome&hl=en-US).

Has this site acted as an intermediary resulting in further distribution of malware?
Over the past 90 days, realscam.com did not appear to function as an intermediary for the infection of any sites.

Has this site hosted malware?
No, this site has not hosted malicious software over the past 90 days.

How did this happen?
In some cases, third parties can add malicious code to legitimate sites, which would cause us to show the warning message.

Next steps:


Return to the previous page. (http://safebrowsing.clients.google.com/safebrowsing/diagnostic?site=http%3A%2F%2Frealscam.com%2F&client=googlechrome&hl=en-US#)
If you are the owner of this web site, you can request a review of your site using Google Webmaster Tools (http://www.google.com/webmasters/tools/). More information about the review process is available in Google's Webmaster Help Center (http://www.google.com/support/webmasters/bin/answer.py?answer=45432).

Updated 7 hours ago




© Google - Google Home (http://www.google.com/)


2970

Yes , me too.

My message was this website contains malware.

[Joe_Shmoe]

I'm getting this in Firefox. Somebody really hates this site.

2974

[littleroundman]

The problem has been fixed.

The warning should be removed once Google has reviewed the site.

[Joe_Shmoe]

The problem has been fixed.

The warning should be removed once Google has reviewed the site.

Yeah looks okay now. That was a pretty pathetic attempt to stop people accessing the site.

[littleroundman]

Yeah looks okay now. That was a pretty pathetic attempt to stop people accessing the site.

Comes with the territory.

When you come to realize these guys are defending millions of dollars in illegal profits, anything is possible.

[Beacon]

See how you had to shift from "wrong" to "evil"? Those are very different concepts.

See how I dealt with the problems of using the word "evil" in my following lines ( the ones you omitted)?
See how I addressed subjective morals as well in that argument ( in case you take up a position that wrong depends on the perspective)?

REference http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index311.html#post44105 and the message immediately before it.

[Beacon]

What's wrong for one is right for another. UncleFesta will tell you that they are a nice wealth-redistribution mechanism, and in his own twisted way he is correct as well.

"Ponzies are illegal" is a much better framework for the discussion.

No we dealt with htis already and you are now re entering the moral relativism argument. What the Nazis did was LEGAL in Germany! They changed laws to say Jews were lesser people. What the LEGAL slavery laws did in the US was wrong just as what the Nazis did was wrong. Making them legal would still not make them right. at the same time we operate within the law for not to do so may also be wrong.

[Beacon]

Do you really believe that someone charged with purchasing advertising space for a large national or multinational organisation (remember the claims, including yours, are of blue chip clients) is going to pay THREE HUNDRED AND SIXTY times the going rate? Remember the claim isn't just that ONE customer does, but that hundreds or thousands do. No wonder BB won't say who their clients are, their media buyers would all be queued up outside the job centre the very next morning.

What really amuses me though is that the more you, Teflon Terry, or the Happy Hooker try and explain it, the more preposterous the whole thing sounds. I almost look forward to hearing the next excuse for where the money comes from.

I'd imaging it won't be long before the claim is not that BB are like Google, but that they are Google, a secretive philanthropic section of the company that tours the world helping the poor and hard of thinking to achieve millionaire status in a few short weeks...

Another central issue about this and the message just before it is that BB shills somehow claim there is some "balance" where realscam have to prove a scam. In fact ( in spite of realscam showing the evidence about this scam anyway) the thing is the other way around! RS are not charging anyone any money. BB are! It is for BB to prove it is not a scam by for example showing their audited accounts proving what money is coming in and from where. They have produced ZERO evidence as to any BB account anywhere showing that advertising is being bought or sold!

http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index314.html#post44261

Continues in this vein it begions with "That's assuming that BB is in fact a scam, as is alleged here, however to this date there isn't a single shred of evidence both here and on the Finch blog that this is the case." . this is just a clearly unsupported OPINION not a FACT and it is thrown out as if the burden of evidence is on RS and not BB. furthermore it is clearly WRONG as RS have provided court records, business registrations, industry standards past history of major players etc. which are established FACTS.

[baylee]

LOL, I should have read this thread before I PMed SBM and LRM about this.

[kiwichick]

The problem has been fixed.

The warning should be removed once Google has reviewed the site.
can you also request that google's pr team provide some explanation of bb's similarities to google?

[kiwichick]

yes I had a malware warning come up on google chrome a while back, asked some regular members about this and they assured me message untrue, had the same thought that this is what bb meant by the 'blogging war. I also get A LOT of phishing spam to the email address used for webinars etc. ...I report these as spam but what is done about these reports and those doing it?

[Beacon]

LOL, I should have read this thread before I PMed SBM and LRM about this.
Investing Smart from the Start: Five Questions to Ask Before You Invest (http://www.sec.gov/investor/pubs/fivequestions.htm)

[AshKen1]

May just be me, but got a warning message from Google about RS today.

[Joe_Shmoe]

May just be me, but got a warning message from Google about RS today.
Me too, somebody must keep reporting this site for Malware, must have a "vandette" against Realscam can't think why.

[Hypanor]

Odd, I use Chrome and haven't ever had any warnings whatsoever.

Edit: Well, it let me post that message, then I got the warning partway through browsing another thread! lol!

[Beacon]

Odd, I use Chrome and haven't ever had any warnings whatsoever.
Must be your settings. When I use chrome I get a warning message all the time.

Incidentally for those trumpting the imminent demise of BB, assuming they are only scamming a few hundred votes at most, there are still thousands of people who "believe" BB is an actual legit business
The Top Direct Selling Companies In The World In 2013 (http://www.businessforhome.org/2012/12/the-top-direct-selling-companies-in-the-world-in-2013-poll/)

That said, there are probably thousands who believe the Earth is flat or is run by lizard people from outer space.

[Joe_Shmoe]

Must be your settings. When I use chrome I get a warning message all the time.

Incidentally for those trumpting the imminent demise of BB, assuming they are only scamming a few hundred votes at most, there are still thousands of people who "believe" BB is an actual legit business
The Top Direct Selling Companies In The World In 2013 (http://www.businessforhome.org/2012/12/the-top-direct-selling-companies-in-the-world-in-2013-poll/)

That said, there are probably thousands who believe the Earth is flat or is run by lizard people from outer space.

Notice the picture of "Chris Smith" (or whatever his name is) in that line-up is taken by Mark Stokes on his mobile phone. :RpS_lol::RpS_lol::RpS_lol:
For a company with supposedly 300,000 affiliated the only have just over 4000 votes.

[Theseus]

Anyone else get this?


G'day mate,

You'll notice I've pulled that card video (and the others). I surf, and I'm a wave rider, but I'm not 'waverider' nor am I Jack O'Neill or anybody else you care to think of. Aside from a couple of posts on a BB-related FB page, the only time I've ever made public comment about BB was in scam.com but for some reason these threads have disappeared without a trace.

I know Mary Bosveld (super granny) personally, we launched a product called 'drinkACT' into Australia back in 2005 together, and I can confirm she never posted here on RS, so we have another imposter and impersonator within RS.

My master plan is to get back as much of the $600 I've ploughed into BB as soon as possible, at the moment I'm keeping my fingers crossed that I'll get my first withdrawal of $300 which has been pending for a week.

If you're ever on the Gold Coast, give me a holler, we'll have a coffee at one of Broadbeach's coffee lounges, and I'll bring my macbook and show you by way of logging into my BB that I actually have just the two freebie members, one from the UK, the other from the Philippines. No grand masterplan of recruiting, I got into BB and the plan was to be passive for 9-12 months or so, and then if all is sweet, commence a recruiting drive, with proof that one is able to build a revenue stream with BB without recruiting.

With all the negative publicity that's floating around cyberspace, I'm not comfortable doing that, nor will I be making any public comment about BB. I sell ASIC-compliant investment products, which include Self-Managed Super Funds and options auto-trading (which is performing well), and I'll make shitloads more money doing that than I ever will with BB, so my energy is focused elsewhere.


cheers mate and take care

[Joe_Shmoe]

Anyone else get this?
No not recieved that PM.

Wow & he was such a staunch supporter of Banners Broker.
People finally seeing the light?

[Dreamstealer]

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc153/thelittleroundman/scams%202/leslie_zpsd970c687.jpg


http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xx5em0_banners-broker-accountant-interview_tech

Banners Broker on DailyMotion (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xx5em0_banners-broker-accountant-interview_tech#.UQ4wMPLhcQY)

Unbelievable- preying on the old as usual. I am a NON retired CA and i can say that i disagree with almost everything this retired CA said. As well as quoting the old "Mastercard approved us " crap and then "compliant in 108 countries" (because presumably not being shut down = compliant) he tries to tell us he thoroughly investigated. BS. Had to laugh that his proof that people were taking out money and that it was REAL money was that he knew a person who was paying a shitload for traffic packs each month. When the interviewer said "and so presumably he is taking a lot out" the answer was "well he could do". Sounds real to me. Not.

As he has been in it for 12 months though and as a retired CA i am sure he has put it on his tax return. Care to share if you are reading?

[kiwichick]

latest message from finch's scam update blog

"The shills have gone pretty quiet in the last few weeks.

A few belated attempts at bending half-truths, but I think most individuals connected to BannersBroker are now aware of what they’re dealing with, if they weren’t already.

It certainly seems that way by the search traffic finding it’s way to this site.

Whereas 2 months ago traffic came from terms like:

Banners Broker
Is Banners Broker legit?
Make money with Banners Broker
Banners Broker success
XXX per month Banners Broker

The majority of traffic now comes from…

Banners Broker no payments
Banners Broker scam
Banners Broker slow panels
Banners Broker not paying
Banners Broker ponzi
Report banners broker
Banners Broker fraud
Raj Dixit fraud
Chris Smith scammer

If search traffic is an indicator of public sentiment, that sentiment has most definitely turned sour.

Oh, and while checking blog stats, I’ve noticed multiple visits from anti-fraud agencies in Holland, India and Canada. Including the office of the General Attorney in Canada (searching for info on a ‘Banners Broker scam’ no less).

Say what you like, trolls and shills.

The net is closing, and your game is almost up"

great news finch, well done

[Joe_Shmoe]

One of our old pals Iain Sherriff has posted on the Mirror site. Banners Broker accused of being Ponzi scheme - Investigations (http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/investigations/2013/01/banners-broker-accused-of-bein.html)

IAIN SHERRIFF (http://www.uklows.com/forum) SAID:
Where are the Ads you say?
Well I have them on my site UKLows - Index (http://www.uklows.com/forum)
As Bannersbroker link with new partners they do not appear for a few hours sometimes but they are there. I have been accused of fabricating the Ad Network to defraud people into joining BB.........which is laughable to anyone who knows me and the level of skill I have in such things. The Ads you see are run through my Publisher Portal and provide an extra income for me as a Bannersbroker Affiliate. My site has limited traffic (around 300k a month) and such sites do not provide the funds used to recompense Affiliates. Nor do these funds come from new Affiliates. The income to Bannersbroker's core business is derived from it's partnership with major Global Networks and it is this that recompenses the growing number of Affiliates.

February 3, 2013 10:42 AM (http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/investigations/2013/01/banners-broker-accused-of-bein.html#comment-669208)

[Joe_Shmoe]

From Friday another old friend of ours,
Banners Broker senior scammer Martin Wilde trying to sucker more victims into Banners Broker.
Don't say anything nasty about this particular scumbag or he may threaten you. (seriously):shocked:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=E-gjIJ-BN8Y

[Theseus]

One of our old pals Iain Sherriff has posted on the Mirror site. Banners Broker accused of being Ponzi scheme - Investigations (http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/investigations/2013/01/banners-broker-accused-of-bein.html)

IAIN SHERRIFF (http://www.uklows.com/forum) SAID:
Where are the Ads you say?
Well I have them on my site UKLows - Index (http://www.uklows.com/forum)
As Bannersbroker link with new partners they do not appear for a few hours sometimes but they are there. I have been accused of fabricating the Ad Network to defraud people into joining BB.........which is laughable to anyone who knows me and the level of skill I have in such things. The Ads you see are run through my Publisher Portal and provide an extra income for me as a Bannersbroker Affiliate. My site has limited traffic (around 300k a month) and such sites do not provide the funds used to recompense Affiliates. Nor do these funds come from new Affiliates. The income to Bannersbroker's core business is derived from it's partnership with major Global Networks and it is this that recompenses the growing number of Affiliates.

February 3, 2013 10:42 AM (http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/investigations/2013/01/banners-broker-accused-of-bein.html#comment-669208)




So what the portly pensioner is asking us to believe is that BB generates millions and millions of dollars in revenue every month from adverts on sites like his that,at its busiest, only ever had 192 unique visitors?

2975

[kiwichick]

So what the portly pensioner is asking us to believe is that BB generates millions and millions of dollars in revenue every month from adverts on sites like his that,at its busiest, only ever had 192 unique visitors?

2975

and 191 of them are probably just those checking to see if there is an actual bb ad anywhere!!!

[Brenda]

From Friday another old friend of ours,
Banners Broker senior scammer Martin Wilde trying to sucker more victims into Banners Broker.
Don't say anything nasty about this particular scumbag or he may threaten you. (seriously):shocked:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=E-gjIJ-BN8Y

at 11.35, did he take a leak??? lol

does anyone have any info on the message that went public in error?

[AshKen1]

and 191 of them are probably just those checking to see if there is an actual bb ad anywhere!!!

You have to be kidding!! Was probably the same person looking over and over again for the non-existent ad :RpS_smile:

[silly sally]

So what the portly pensioner is asking us to believe is that BB generates millions and millions of dollars in revenue every month from adverts on sites like his that,at its busiest, only ever had 192 unique visitors?

2975

Weren't other people's legit sites rejected as carriers for BB ads because they didn't have enough traffic? Laughable.

[kiwichick]

@ theseus, poyol or hypanor (those I know can post screen shots here) can you please post this one from nz for me
Banners Broker – Automated Posting Software for Classified Ads | Carl Lucas's Empower Network Blog (http://www.empowernetwork.com/homeincomesystem/blog/banners-broker/?id=homeincomesystem)

I have emailed this guy several times and he knows this is a scam and told me he stopped promoting it ......we can add real-estate agents to the old list of "occupations in common" for the bb promoters.................bet this will be deleted otherwise......

[Papaponzi]

@activerog the lurker, hows about you post a screenshot of your earnings, dont forget to include all of it including the withdrawn history bit, and if you had anything withdrawn also show us the card statement as proof , not just the BB virtual money, come on mate give us a giggle it will be funny

[Della Cate]

I'm getting this in Firefox. Somebody really hates this site.

2974

Yes, I had it too, on phone, home and work computer - glad it is now fixed! Odd though.

[littleroundman]

Yes, I had it too, on phone, home and work computer - glad it is now fixed! Odd though.

In this biz. it's sort of "normal"

There was no danger to readers of the forum and the problem was fixed around 24 hours ago.

We then had to inform Google, which re crawled the site thoroughly before it would remove the warning.

All part of the service.:RpS_wink:

[littleroundman]

No new postings in the Banners Broker thread on the Talkgold HYIP ponzi forum since January 29.

The end really IS near.

[Finix]

you are now re entering the moral relativism argument.
Prove moral absolutes exist.

BTW, I find the comparison between money games and Holocaust to be morally reprehensible. You, evidently, don't. Here we are again, what's right for one is wrong for another. :P

[Mundorf]

Come back on stage....opening the site could harm your computer...oh well...who is the third partie,no need to say.It seems that ponzis still perform some kind of work

[littleroundman]

@ theseus, poyol or hypanor (those I know can post screen shots here) can you please post this one from nz for me
Banners Broker – Automated Posting Software for Classified Ads | Carl Lucas's Empower Network Blog (http://www.empowernetwork.com/homeincomesystem/blog/banners-broker/?id=homeincomesystem)

http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/8919/carl2.gif

[Brenda]

No new postings in the Banners Broker thread on the Talkgold HYIP ponzi forum since January 29.

The end really IS near.

then why the meetings and gala dinners in Manchester? Despite the fact that there appears to be a groundswell of anti BB supporters who want to 'visit' them in Manchester, it seems that it's business as usual. If the end really is near and we are not just wishful thinking, is it not risky for Smith Lorenzo and Hooker to be out of their home turf and in the UK? Would have thought that it would be so much easier to put off Manchester with an excuse for now, til it blew over and stay closer to home? With so many reports of non payment to affiliates, isn't this odd to not only flog a dead horse, but to leave yourself so vunerable?

As an aside, anyone hear anything from McCarthy? Is he still keeping the head down?

[littleroundman]

Never underestimate the egos of those involved in HYIP ponzi fraud.

Why did Paul Burks allow himself to be busted in the U.S. when he could have walked at any time with millions in his pocket ??/

Why did the Marsdens of P.I.P.S. infamy not only allow their fraud to run out of money but then compounded their problems by staying in Malaysia to be caught and jailed ???

[TacticalNuclearPenguin]

Well well well.
I've been a very occasional lurker on this forum from time to time. So when I receive a text from a friend that wakes me up at 3am asking if I know anyone who wants to invest in BB, I knew where to come first.

He has mentioned BB to me before. Like any new investor in these things, he was full of tales of unlimited earning potential and a life of easy living. I brushed it off at the time as a potential Ponzi (I have a nose for these things ;) ) and thought nothing of it. Two weeks later, I see him again and learn he's put forward £1.5k alongside a friend and alarm bells start ringing. I've urged him to be careful and see that these things are not always what they claim to be. Now it looks like he's getting itchy for a new person to join. It shocks me a bit that he's been so eager to sign up to these things but you have to give it to things like BB, they can look awfully convincing if you're in the market to be convinced. Thankfully I'm a bit of a sceptic so came here!

Firstly, I'm p***ed off that my friend has interrupted my sleep. I don't sleep well at the best of times and seemed to be doing OK tonight.

Secondly, it exasperating to see my friend getting caught up in this. I don't believe he has invested enough to ruin him (and may even be one of those who makes a bit of money, payments permitting!) but nevertheless it's sad to see.

Thirdly, and most importantly, I believe this forum does a fantastic job in making people aware of this type of scam. The level of detail in some of the posts is remarkable and I can't express how glad I am that I came here first!
To each and every one of you who does the digging on scams like BB, THANK YOU. Your hard work is much appreciated!

[Hypanor]

Welcome to Realscam, TNP!

I very much doubt your friend will be getting much out of this program if he's only recently invested. He can look forward to slow panel movements, payment delaying tactics, and possible account seizure if he says anything remotely negative.

As you say, its sad to see people fall for this false pipe dream of an endless income for the rest of their lives. Best you can do is to keep track of who his upline is, for possible civil action when it all goes pear-shaped. Feel free to post names and info here for safe keeping!

[Della Cate]

then why the meetings and gala dinners in Manchester? Despite the fact that there appears to be a groundswell of anti BB supporters who want to 'visit' them in Manchester, it seems that it's business as usual. If the end really is near and we are not just wishful thinking, is it not risky for Smith Lorenzo and Hooker to be out of their home turf and in the UK? Would have thought that it would be so much easier to put off Manchester with an excuse for now, til it blew over and stay closer to home? With so many reports of non payment to affiliates, isn't this odd to not only flog a dead horse, but to leave yourself so vunerable?

As an aside, anyone hear anything from McCarthy? Is he still keeping the head down?

Good point Brenda, but of course the dinner etc has not actually happened yet, and Smith, Dixit and co have not actually set foot in Manchester yet, as far as we know. Other meetings planned have been cancelled at very short notice. Be interesting to see if this event really does go ahead.

[Theseus]

Good point Brenda, but of course the dinner etc has not actually happened yet, and Smith, Dixit and co have not actually set foot in Manchester yet, as far as we know. Other meetings planned have been cancelled at very short notice. Be interesting to see if this event really does go ahead.

You need to remember that the majority of those who would potentially attend the "Gala" are the hardcore BB-faithful. Tales of it being a scam, or of late/non payment mean nothing to them. Faced with the (ever-growing mountain of) evidence that BB is a dying ponzi they will still prefer to believe the word of some sharp-suited Canadian conmen over the voice of reason.

[okosh]

In this biz. it's sort of "normal"

There was no danger to readers of the forum and the problem was fixed around 24 hours ago.

We then had to inform Google, which re crawled the site thoroughly before it would remove the warning.

All part of the service.:RpS_wink:

And part of the education....Just shows how far these scammers will go.....

Also shows what a great job everyone here at realscam is doing:RpS_wink:

[Dreamstealer]

Prove moral absolutes exist.

BTW, I find the comparison between money games and Holocaust to be morally reprehensible. You, evidently, don't. Here we are again, what's right for one is wrong for another. :P

Sorry Finix, not sure i understand you. By "money games" do you mean scamming a lot of people that will lose their life savings and could end up killing themselves?
I don't think Beacon was trying to diminish the holocaust- the argument was to disprove the logic in your point that making ponzi's legal would solve the problem. Beacon merely pointed out that legally jews had no rights in Nazi Germany but this didn't make the inherent "wrongness" of the nazi acts right.

[Poyol]

latest message from finch's scam update blog

"The shills have gone pretty quiet in the last few weeks.

A few belated attempts at bending half-truths, but I think most individuals connected to BannersBroker are now aware of what they’re dealing with, if they weren’t already.

It certainly seems that way by the search traffic finding it’s way to this site.

Whereas 2 months ago traffic came from terms like:

Banners Broker
Is Banners Broker legit?
Make money with Banners Broker
Banners Broker success
XXX per month Banners Broker

The majority of traffic now comes from…

Banners Broker no payments
Banners Broker scam
Banners Broker slow panels
Banners Broker not paying
Banners Broker ponzi
Report banners broker
Banners Broker fraud
Raj Dixit fraud
Chris Smith scammer

If search traffic is an indicator of public sentiment, that sentiment has most definitely turned sour.

Oh, and while checking blog stats, I’ve noticed multiple visits from anti-fraud agencies in Holland, India and Canada. Including the office of the General Attorney in Canada (searching for info on a ‘Banners Broker scam’ no less).

Say what you like, trolls and shills.

The net is closing, and your game is almost up"

great news finch, well done

Same types of agencies visiting my blog - it's not as good as Finch's - but I can see 'em!

Jason

[Poyol]

From Friday another old friend of ours,
Banners Broker senior scammer Martin Wilde trying to sucker more victims into Banners Broker.
Don't say anything nasty about this particular scumbag or he may threaten you. (seriously):shocked:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=E-gjIJ-BN8Y

Thought he'd disappeared from the scene.
Maybe not then ...

His threats were quite hilarious - backpedalling and whatnot.

[okosh]

Beacon merely pointed out that legally jews had no rights in Nazi Germany but this didn't make the inherent "wrongness" of the nazi acts right.

Again this topic comes up here in the BB thread??....I really wish you'd make another thread so that I don't have to read this offensive bullshit :RpS_rolleyes:

[Theseus]

No-one here seems to be familiar with Godwin's Law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law) :RpS_wink:

[Poyol]

No-one here seems to be familiar with Godwin's Law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law) :RpS_wink:

I'm very familiar with it ... heard about it a few years ago at 4Chan.

Anyway, I'm tired and grouchy - anything good happening at the moment?

Jason

[Theseus]

Getting back on topic....

Haven't BB banned the publishing of/boasting about "earnings"?

2977

somebody needs to tell this dickhead that...

2978

With all that money he must drive something mighty impressive, right?

2979

That looks like about one yellow panel's worth :RpS_lol:

[Theseus]

2980

Teflon Terry must have posted another set of responses somewhere that I haven't read...

[CommodityTrader]

If the authorities are snooping around Finchy's and Poyol's blogs surely you have a right to ask them why they are doing this? This could give us the heads up on how deep they are looking and if some real action against BB is going to take place?

As it is so quiet with no shills or teflon bombarding this site with rubbish, I get the feeling BB is fading into insignificance as predicted by many on the expereinced contributors to this site.

Any news on Mastercard payments? The people I know who are in this are still waiting for their first matercard hit due to 'glitches' in the system. The have been waiting a good month now.

CT

[Papaponzi]

@ Theseus, the $12.920.78 withdrawal shown is what he has TRIED to withdraw, he most likely withdrew a small figure early on to test it, and since the panic in December he has tried to draw down the full 10k cardload, which he is likely still waiting patiently for.

Of course Dave Menzies will shortly read this, and he could give us a screenshot of his card statement to prove otherwise.

[Finix]

By "money games" do you mean scamming a lot of people that will lose their life savings and could end up killing themselves?
This is a really bad line of argument if morality is your topic. Suicide is a sin according to several major ethical systems. As is greed which is the main driving force behind wanting to be deceived.

[Unknown_S]

Getting back on topic....

Haven't BB banned the publishing of/boasting about "earnings"?

2977

somebody needs to tell this dickhead that...

...

With all that money he must drive something mighty impressive, right?

...

That looks like about one yellow panel's worth :RpS_lol:

Pfft that's nothing. I make more in my sleep

2981 :RpS_wink:

Just checked out the MMG forum. Holy cow! I could feel my I.Q. slipping by the second. So much optimism in regards to payments. Something interesting I've noticed over the past couple of days (unless they're lying), is panels being capped again. So exciting for BB members, except for one small problem. There's no way to withdraw! I'd say this really is the last roll of the dice for BB, and they're allowing panels to cap knowing that no one will be payed, but still giving them enough hope to possibly pump some more cash before it really is the end. Gotta hand it to Dixit and co., they really know how to milk it to the last dying seconds.

[Unknown_S]

Not sure how legit this is, but someone claiming to be from Banners Broker UK with documents to upload. They posted on the official BB Facebook page.

Hi Guys - Quick update I am part of the banners broker team in the UK office. However i have just found out some important details! I CAN CONFIRM THAT BANNERS BROKER is a ponzi/pyramid scheme. Banners broker are doing a number of worldwide tours in which they will recuirt 1000s of more people. When these people INVEST into Banners Broker you guys who are waiting for your payment will be paid and the cycle starts again. This is the reason why BB is doing tours on a MONTHLY cycle. I DONT CARE what any hardcore BB fan says, I will upload some office documents i found when we moved to manchester later today. You can decide for yourself. BANNERS BROKER YOU CAN TRY REMOVE THIS COMMENT BUT I WILL COME BACK AGAIN AND AGAIN. Guys please get your money out, as soon as. Add me for the lastest news

http://www.facebook.com/paradss.loos

[Hypanor]

$2.5 Million Dollar Mans (https://www.google.com.au/search?source=ig&rlz=&q=hmei7#hl=en&tbo=d&sclient=psy-ab&q=simon+stepsys+banners+broker+2.5&oq=simon+stepsys+banners+broker+2.5&gs_l=serp.3...5248.6180.2.6811.4.4.0.0.0.0.961.269 6.3-1j0j1j2.4.0.les%3B..0.0...1c.1.2.serp.6_Mf6PS8VMM&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.&bvm=bv.41867550,d.aGc&fp=bbcfab0fc51ad70f&biw=1366&bih=681) new Facebook page - http://www.facebook.com/SimonStepsysBannersbroker

2982

[Theseus]

Not sure how legit this is, but someone claiming to be from Banners Broker UK with documents to upload. They posted on the official BB Facebook page.

Hi Guys - Quick update I am part of the banners broker team in the UK office. However i have just found out some important details! I CAN CONFIRM THAT BANNERS BROKER is a ponzi/pyramid scheme. Banners broker are doing a number of worldwide tours in which they will recuirt 1000s of more people. When these people INVEST into Banners Broker you guys who are waiting for your payment will be paid and the cycle starts again. This is the reason why BB is doing tours on a MONTHLY cycle. I DONT CARE what any hardcore BB fan says, I will upload some office documents i found when we moved to manchester later today. You can decide for yourself. BANNERS BROKER YOU CAN TRY REMOVE THIS COMMENT BUT I WILL COME BACK AGAIN AND AGAIN. Guys please get your money out, as soon as. Add me for the lastest news

http://www.facebook.com/paradss.loos

You think that is really from someone that is "part of the Banners broker team in the UK office"? Honestly?

[Justin Casey]

True BB believers now have their own forum where they can associate with others of their kind, shielded from reality:

Banners Broker Forum (http://www.bannersbrokerforum.net/forum/forum.php)

[littleroundman]

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc153/thelittleroundman/scams%202/steve_zpsdb5ed474.jpg

[Theseus]

True BB believers now have their own forum where they can associate with others of their kind, shielded from reality:

Banners Broker Forum (http://www.bannersbrokerforum.net/forum/forum.php)

Open page, video loads and the first thing the **** does is call it "Banner Brokers" :RpS_lol:

[Unknown_S]

You think that is really from someone that is "part of the Banners broker team in the UK office"? Honestly?

Not really, but I'll keep an eye on the profile for now anyway, just to see if they come with anything relevant or new.

[Justin Casey]

Here's an interesting little item from SBWire, the soi-disant "small business newswire" (BSWire would be more appropriate):

Why High-Profit Companies Like Banners Broker and Google Locate Themselves Offshore (http://www.sbwire.com/press-releases/why-high-profit-companies-like-banners-broker-and-google-locate-themselves-offshore-198244.htm)

...But companies such as Google, Facebook, Microsoft and Banners Broker are going offshore for good reason: these high-profit companies are enjoying much lower tax rates... Similarly, Banners Broker has established an affiliate program that's quite similar to Google's tremendously successful program. And like Google, Banners Broker enjoys a high profit margin on advertising, which enables for high payouts to its members. And like Google, Banners Broker has opted to maintain an offshore corporation registration for tax purposes because as a high-profit company, it stands to take a significant tax hit – funds that could otherwise be reinvested into the company and used to reimburse affiliates.

The byline for this nonsense is Michael Finch, "the author of a popular internet marketing blog". However, a click on Mr Finch's link leads to Banners Broker Blog (http://bannersbroker.blogspot.ie/).

The owner of BSWire, Daniel Jones, claims that: "I spent a good portion of my career as a journalist, so I understand how important it is that our news comes from reliable, trustworthy sources". Well, it made me laugh anyway. :RpS_smile:

[Hypanor]

True BB believers now have their own forum where they can associate with others of their kind, shielded from reality:

Banners Broker Forum (http://www.bannersbrokerforum.net/forum/forum.php)

I see from the guest posts that Nancy Neubauer (http://www.realscam.com/f8/banners-broker-hyip-ponzi-scam-897/index313.html#post44177) is an admin, along with Michael Lucas.

[Topdog]

If its not too much to ask could you please show proof of Fraud agencies looking at this forum ?

[Dreamstealer]

This is a really bad line of argument if morality is your topic. Suicide is a sin according to several major ethical systems. As is greed which is the main driving force behind wanting to be deceived.
So a ponzi is a money game and victims who are driven to suicide are morally wrong? What a lovely person you are.

[Finix]

and victims who are driven to suicide are morally wrong?
Curiously, from the perspective of the same ethical systems based on which ponzies are morally wrong.

[Nourjan]

Again this topic comes up here in the BB thread??....I really wish you'd make another thread so that I don't have to read this offensive bullshit :RpS_rolleyes:

Be thankful no one tried to link that to the current Palestine-Israeli conflict.Discussions tends to get unbearably hairy after that point.


No-one here seems to be familiar with Godwin's Law

There is a really funny Inverse Godwin's Law where I come from.It's is a lot stupider than it sounds.
Of course none of this have any bearing of sort to the crux of this thread:The Banners Broker Ponzi.

Thread drifting aside,I'm sure a lot of us would like to chip in if you guys kindly opens a new thread/topic to talk about general perception of right and wrong and that of morality dissonance. Lets keep the focus on the BB bullshit here.

[Finix]

Lets keep the focus on the BB bullshit here.
Yep. Personally, I enjoyed the comparison between BB and KFC the most. Once you purchase your boxed chicken for 2K, you become a member of the KFC staff and your wages are what you are able to make from pimping the 2K boxes of chicken to others.

[Beacon]

Prove moral absolutes exist.


dont have to! Im not making the relativist argument. You are AFAIK. Im just pointing out the alternative
But if you want proof then are you suggesting that for example an adult of sound mind and body having sex with a six year old child is not ALWAYS wrong?
Can you actually claim that such a thing it not absolutely always wrong?



BTW, I find the comparison between money games and Holocaust to be morally reprehensible. You, evidently, don't. Here we are again, what's right for one is wrong for another. :P

So you think that the idea of what the Nazis did in the Holocaust could be "right for them"? Or that a forty year old adult having relations with a six year old child could even be "right for them"?

This is what happens when you try to cloud the issue with moral relativism.

Some things are wrong - always wrong! ALWAYS! They are not just wrong for some people and right for another. They are wrong ALL the time Always!

You can not claim Banners Broker might be morally justifiable for the scammers. Well you can claim it but you would be WRONG! Always! Just as they are. Always.
That is what is the same about the comparison. They are doing wrong - always - the level of harm they do is not the issue.

And the fact you find it morally reprehensible in comparing some moral absolutes with other moral absolutes is a logical fallacy since your entire argument is based on "what is wrong for some is right for others"

It seems you fall into the same category as the anti Nazis who believe in free speech and toleration of others - except Nazis. You are happy to announce that all moral positions are equally valid but at the same time insist your moral position is superiour to others which are morally repugnant to you.

How did your moral position become so morally absolute as to announce anyone else's as "morally reprehensible"?

[Beacon]

No-one here seems to be familiar with Godwin's Law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law) :RpS_wink:
Im quite familiar with it. I am also familiar with moral relativism trying to explain away wrongdoers actions.
By the way I didnt refer to Hitler and I specifically referred to slavery and the Nurnberg Laws or the likes of the Pass Laws in South Africs which were not the Holocaust. The specific treatment I referred to was not the gas chambers but the Legislation which came before that which did eventually lead to the "Final solution" these were laws passed by a democratically elected Parliament saying certain people had less rights than others. If you are going to espouse moral relativism and you dont support anarchy then eventually you are confronted with this type of issue - i.e. if ther are no things which are not always wrong what is to stop someone at some time in the future passing laws allowing things which are wrong?
The relativist argues that "wrong" is just dependent on what people think. So? what if a majority think slavery or child abuse or Ponzis are not wrong and want to make that legally enshrined?