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Doc Bunkum
07-23-2010, 04:19 PM
Some of you may have seen this thread iamwil started over on scam.com this morning:


Imagine creating world wide MLM organizations....

With folks in your downline from all over the world.

Imagine MLM companies starting in North Korea, Iran, Somalia, selling products the world is interested in and needs, and the people of these countries pulling themselves out of their current conditions due to their organizations around the world.

Pick whatever country, whatever continent and imagine you have some of your upline and some of your downline in that country.


Who would want to shoot their downline?

World Peace thru MLM...

Join MLM and support peace today...

Peace on earth...good will toward man.

Now I'm not sure if Will was serious or not when he posted that, or just having fun, but it sure didn't take Chrispy to pick up on the idea:


In all seriousness it is a great idea. When the communist countries gave up on those politics, MLM expanded like crazy...I'm thinking of Poland for example, who Amway signed up tens of thousands in a very short time.

It's a great idea?

Amway signed up tens of thousands in Poland in a very short time?

Seriously, where do you even start with people that post stuff like that? :RpS_confused:

BruceShuell
07-23-2010, 04:59 PM
Wil is doing a great job of making MLMs look stupid and unrealistic. I'm sure all those starving Somalians can't wait for his cactus juice at 50.00 a bottle.

Whip
07-23-2010, 05:21 PM
I'm surprised there isn't an MLM selling 'whirled peas'.
Perhaps this is what they really meant.

Emet
07-23-2010, 05:29 PM
I'm surprised there isn't an MLM selling 'whirled peas'.
Perhaps this is what they really meant.

http://www.bigcheesebadges.com/images/visualize_whirled_peas.png

:RpS_thumbsup:

A Life Aloft
07-23-2010, 05:42 PM
Wil is doing a great job of making MLMs look stupid and unrealistic. Well, you have to look at the source. He is stupid and unrealistic himself. Not to mention a liar. He has no credibility whatsoever and neither does Chrissy or Heiney. I mean look at these losers. They have no jobs. They sit on the internet 24/7, weekends and holidays included, posting total lame, trolling b.s. When would they have any time left to actually be earning a living in a real job/career or even in any MLM? If they were making money, why would they spend all their free time glued to some forum on the internet to begin with? No lives, no hobbies, no family, no friends, no activities, no exercise, no vacations, no nothing? It's pathetic.

They start threads that on any other decent forum would be ridiculed, deleted and they would be booted. They cannot even respond to one decent question or point with an ounce of intelligence or integrity. They go off on the same old tired rants, attacking posters and go off topic and include particulars that have nothing to do with what they are even responding to. I've seen some clueless idiots in my life, but those three are in a category all to themselves. Their childish bull crap isn't even worth reading. The three amigos lost touch with reality a long time ago. A five year old child has better critical thinking skills and is more logical and rational than those three morons. What's even sadder, is that they have no idea how much they are embarrassing themselves on a daily basis. It's really dumbfounding.

King
07-24-2010, 09:06 AM
Didn't you guys know??

http://networking4africa.com/

It's already started!

Whip
07-24-2010, 10:10 AM
So I guess this is just another fake charity just like has been tried once already by someone else.

Earl Lee Tobed
07-24-2010, 12:02 PM
Didn't you guys know??

Networking 4 Africa : Home (http://networking4africa.com/)

It's already started!

This charity was only registered on 28th June 2010,so is barely a month old.
Lets hope its genuine.

DomainNetworking 4 Africa : Home
IP address:
69.72.189.2 IP-Location:
- US - United States Response-Code:
HTTP/1.1 200 OK Server-Type:
Apache Content-Type:
text/html
Meta-Keywords:
networking4africa,networkingforafrica,poverty,busi ness opportunity,network marketing
Meta-Description:
Networking 4 Africa has been established to raise funds to support poverty stricken and orphaned children in Africa.
Whois results:
=-=-=-=
Visit AboutUs.org for more information about networking4africa.com
AboutUs: networking4africa.com

Registration Service Provided By: MattieBlazeHosting
Contact: support@mattieblazehosting.com
Visit: http://www.MattieBlazeHosting.com

Domain name: networking4africa.com

Registrant Contact:

Steven McGregor ()

Fax:
61 Prince Alfred St
Pietermaritzburg, KZN 3201
ZA

Administrative Contact:

Steven McGregor (networking4africa@gmail.com)
+27.0837941504
Fax:
61 Prince Alfred St
Pietermaritzburg, KZN 3201
ZA


Creation date: 28 Jun 2010 21:54:00
Expiration date: 28 Jun 2011 16:54:00

Emet
07-24-2010, 12:17 PM
This charity was only registered on 28th June 2010,so is barely a month old.
Lets hope its genuine.

Well, it's not "a charity" per se, it's an MLM that purports to "use all its profits to help African projects that care for homeless, vulnerable and orphaned children".

That being said, IMHO, a separate thread might perhaps be started to discuss it.

Respectfully submitted,
Emet

Earl Lee Tobed
07-24-2010, 12:32 PM
Well, it's not "a charity" per se, it's an MLM that purports to "use all its profits to help African projects that care for homeless, vulnerable and orphaned children".

That being said, IMHO, a separate thread might perhaps be started to discuss it.

Respectfully submitted,
Emet

May I respectfully suggest you press the great RED ADMIN BUTTON and launch the new thread?

Earl Lee Tobed
07-25-2010, 04:19 AM
On reflection,perhaps a thread about false charities in general would be a good idea.
Has anyone noticed the conspicuous abscence of posts by DoyleyBoy and Heimey on this particular MLM topic on that other forum?
Generally they jump in headfirst to defend and support all things MLM! Kinda speaks volumes---.

iamwil
07-26-2010, 03:09 PM
So glad you all are enjoying it...
Wil is doing a great job of making MLMs look stupid and unrealistic. I'm sure all those starving Somalians can't wait for his cactus juice at 50.00 a bottle. Ah, but those pirates...they need a place to launder their money...


Well, you have to look at the source. He is stupid and unrealistic himself. Not to mention a liar. He has no credibility whatsoever and neither does Chrissy or Heiney. I mean look at these losers. They have no jobs. They sit on the internet 24/7, weekends and holidays included. Now who exactly is lying. I have a job, a commute, a 40 hour work week, and some real estate ventures and mlm, and coach soccer, and asst. scoutmaster...

Yes I'm stupid and unrealistic...considering the source. Tis quite alright whatever you think and post...no problems to me.


On reflection,perhaps a thread about false charities in general would be a good idea.
Has anyone noticed the conspicuous abscence of posts by DoyleyBoy and Heimey on this particular MLM topic on that other forum?
Generally they jump in headfirst to defend and support all things MLM! Kinda speaks volumes---. Wasn't it just said that this is a month old...so it blends in with the thousands of MLMs out there? Many of us that are working with our MLM company happily are not looking for another...some are though and I'm sure it will come up someplace.

iamwil
07-26-2010, 03:18 PM
Some of you may have seen this thread iamwil started over on scam.com this morning:

Now I'm not sure if Will was serious or not when he posted that, or just having fun, but it sure didn't take Chrispy to pick up on the idea:

It's a great idea?

Seriously, where do you even start with people that post stuff like that? :RpS_confused:Maybe I should have simultaneously posted it here?

Would that be preferable...or would you guys like to select the words of wisdom you prefer?

are you all anti whorled peas as well?

Doc Bunkum
07-26-2010, 03:27 PM
Maybe I should have simultaneously posted it here?

Would that be preferable...or would you guys like to select the words of wisdom you prefer?

are you all anti whorled peas as well?

No, yes and no -

- to whatever it is you're talking about. :RpS_confused:

A Life Aloft
07-27-2010, 06:25 PM
So glad you all are enjoying it... Ah, but those pirates...they need a place to launder their money...

Now who exactly is lying. I have a job, a commute, a 40 hour work week, and some real estate ventures and mlm, and coach soccer, and asst. scoutmaster...

Yes I'm stupid and unrealistic...considering the source. Tis quite alright whatever you think and post...no problems to me.

Wasn't it just said that this is a month old...so it blends in with the thousands of MLMs out there? Many of us that are working with our MLM company happily are not looking for another...some are though and I'm sure it will come up someplace.Bullshit. If you were doing even half of what you claim, you couldn't be the addicted board whore that you are, just over on scam alone. Your posts have the times and dates on them. What total drivel.

Join Date: 11-17-2009
PostsTotal Posts: 3,218 (12.77 posts per day)
Last Post:

So are you posting while you are commuting and working that 40 hours a week and working your worthless MLM and are involved in "real estate ventures", involved with the boy scouts and coaching soccer? ROTFL!! Yeah right, I really believe that crap. You are on Scam all day and evening long and the weekends and on several forums there. Save the b.s. for Heiney, Chrissey and Jeb who also have no jobs and no life, are into and pro MLMs and will believe anything. That fairy tale just isn't going to fly here.

A Life Aloft
07-27-2010, 06:39 PM
Hell, you made 44 posts today alone on Scam starting early this morning and continuing all day long. I guess your "boss" at your "job" is paying you to do that. Not to mention 20 posts yesterday and 44 on Friday and 27 on Thursday. Must be slow at "work". Lmao

Doc Bunkum
07-27-2010, 07:04 PM
From a 2000 report:


The day started with a first for Russia: a seven-mile-long MLM parade through Red Square. Jinuyan Li, president of The Tianshi Group, China's largest MLM, led the parade. Waving to astonished Russians from the sunroof of his limousine, Li was accompanied by Michael Sheffield. Following the limousine were 40 brand new BMW automobiles that would later be awarded to top company distributors.

Capitalist Addresses Networking Communists (http://www.mlmconsultantadvice.com/sheffield_14.html)

A seven-mile-long MLM parade through Red Square, you say?

Try that in some banana republic where some starving family gave up their meager life savings to sell some questionable product, only to find out they'd been had.

Watch them reach for their AK-47's with live rounds as that seven-mile-long MLM parade passes their mud hut.

World Peace thru MLM my ass.

Whip
07-27-2010, 07:14 PM
From a 2000 report:



Capitalist Addresses Networking Communists (http://www.mlmconsultantadvice.com/sheffield_14.html)

A seven-mile-long MLM parade through Red Square, you say?

Try that in some banana republic where some starving family gave up their meager life savings to sell some questionable product, only to find out they'd been had.

Watch them reach for their AK-47's with live rounds as that seven-mile-long MLM parade passes their mud hut.

World Peace thru MLM my ass.

Fascinating no one would think to film this extravaganza. Surely it was worth real media coverage right?

iamwil
07-28-2010, 07:55 AM
Hell, you made 44 posts today alone on Scam starting early this morning and continuing all day long. I guess your "boss" at your "job" is paying you to do that. Not to mention 20 posts yesterday and 44 on Friday and 27 on Thursday. Must be slow at "work". Lmao
yup...has been slow...slowest in 15 years...so glad to have another fan following my every move...

iamwil
07-28-2010, 09:43 AM
You have no fans anywhere except for Heiney and Chrissie. What you clearly have on both forums, are people who are calling you out on your continued b.s. statements, nonsense and lies. You really should consider a career in writing fiction. You've certainly had enough practice and experience in that by now.

Ah, your just sayin that....so sweet of you.

A Life Aloft
07-28-2010, 09:55 AM
yup...has been slow...slowest in 15 years...so glad to have another fan following my every move... In truth, you have no fans anywhere except for Heiney and Chrissie of whom you have so much in common with. Same lack of credibility, failure and dishonesty. What you clearly have on both forums, are people who are calling you out on your continued b.s. statements, nonsense and lies. You really should consider a career in writing fiction. You've certainly had enough practice and experience in that by now.

BTW, while you were busy commuting to "work" and being at "work" today, you've already managed to have time for 9 posts on here and at Scam this morning thus far and counting and you are logged on both forums and viewing different threads. lmao With 51 posts on Scam yesterday alone, I think you might have just broken Chrissie's former record. Yes, you really are living a full, worthwhile and busy life. lol

iamwil
07-28-2010, 10:10 AM
In truth, you have no fans anywhere except for Heiney and Chrissie of whom you have so much in common with. Same lack of credibility, failure and dishonesty. What you clearly have on both forums, are people who are calling you out on your continued b.s. statements, nonsense and lies. You really should consider a career in writing fiction. You've certainly had enough practice and experience in that by now.

BTW, while you were busy commuting to "work" and being at "work" today, you've already managed to have time for 9 posts on here and at Scam this morning thus far and counting and you are logged on both forums and viewing different threads. lmao With 51 posts on Scam yesterday alone, I think you might have just broken Chrissie's former record. Yes, you really are living a full, worthwhile and busy life. lolYou are just enamoured with my life aren't you.

Just to keep you updated I also participated in an online safety webinar, replaced a couple of light bulbs, had a pear and a fried egg sandwich, checked on a couple of permits, spoke with an architect and two engineers, practiced a little four club juggling, flossed, called my mom, asked my kids to clean the kitchen before they went out kayaking, checked out RCI's $199 deals on timeshares, considered one in North Carolina, reviewed some information on solar cells, batteries and inverters, made some plans about an australia trip, and a half a dozen other little business phone calls, and had a nice bowel movement.

Would you like a picture of it for your scrap book?

A Life Aloft
07-28-2010, 10:20 AM
Un huh, of course you did dear. Why dont you just start off all of your posts wth, "Once Upon A Time" and get it over with. A little early to still be posting even with the time difference for your lunch break at your "job" isn't it? Going for a new record today while at "work" today? lol

Whip
07-28-2010, 11:39 AM
yup...has been slow...slowest in 15 years...so glad to have another fan following my every move...

Many people will observe the kid toucher in the neighborhood also....doesn't mean they are 'fan' of him. You, along with most mlmers think way too much of yourselves.

iamwil
07-28-2010, 01:42 PM
Un huh, of course you did dear. Why dont you just start off all of your posts wth, "Once Upon A Time" and get it over with. A little early to still be posting even with the time difference for your lunch break at your "job" isn't it? Going for a new record today while at "work" today? lolAh just woke up from my afternoon nap...

I see another thousand in sales...that's nice... some notes regarding some zoning issues...oh and look my stalker is still watching...

Hi fly boy! (waves)

Live&Learn
07-28-2010, 02:34 PM
Some of you may have seen this thread iamwil started over on scam.com this morning:



Now I'm not sure if Will was serious or not when he posted that, or just having fun, but it sure didn't take Chrispy to pick up on the idea:



It's a great idea?

Amway signed up tens of thousands in Poland in a very short time?

Seriously, where do you even start with people that post stuff like that? :RpS_confused:

With the massive failure rate of MLM companies, and the high failure rate of people who join MLM, wouldn't this idea be more likely to promote World War???

Unsaved Trash
07-28-2010, 04:34 PM
Ah just woke up from my afternoon nap...

I see another thousand in sales...that's nice... some notes regarding some zoning issues...oh and look my stalker is still watching...

Hi fly boy! (waves)

Here's your other stalker asking you to answer the same question I've now asked you seven times. Here it is again: http://www.realscam.com/f9/sound-familiar-130/#post2844

A Life Aloft
07-28-2010, 07:11 PM
Now who exactly is lying. I have a job, a commute, a 40 hour work week, and more blah, blah, blah bullshit.
I think everyone can easily tell just who the pathological liar here, pal. You expect people to believe that you commute to a 40 hour a week job and that your employer allows you to take naps and be an internet forum board whore all day long every day of that work week and that is what he is paying you for? ROTFL!!!! I especially enjoyed the bullshit about making money while you were sleeping. Where have we heard that MLM bull speak before? lol Seriously, you should seek some professional help. Either that or take your comedy act on the road.

Unsaved Trash
07-28-2010, 07:13 PM
I think everyone can easily tell just who the pathological liar here, pal. You expect people to believe that you commute to a 40 hour a week job and that your employer allows you to take naps and be an internet forum board whore all day long every day of that work week and that is what he is paying you for? ROTFL!!!! I especially enjoyed the bullshit about making money while you were sleeping. Where have we heard that MLM bull speak before? lol

I guess that's why he won't answer my question. He's swamped.

A Life Aloft
07-28-2010, 07:32 PM
ROTFL! And delusional to boot! It's amazing how much he seems to enjoy making a complete fool of himself in public on a daily basis and being caught in one lie after another. I wonder if he is actually disturbed enough to believe half of the crap he posts, let alone think that anyone else would.

I picture him getting up everyday, getting dressed for "work" and then just settling down at his home puter, believing he is working and at 5pm getting up and changing his clothes and telling everyone what an exhausting day he had. lmao I wonder if he packs a sammie and has a name plate on his tiny desk at home? This would make a great movie about a mentally disturbed guy caught between the imaginary life he leads and his actual life. Yikes!

Whip
07-28-2010, 08:19 PM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v649/Whip412/Office-Space.jpg

A Life Aloft
07-28-2010, 09:11 PM
ROTFL!!!! You gotta love that pic!

iamwil
07-29-2010, 08:58 AM
Here's your other stalker asking you to answer the same question I've now asked you seven times. Here it is again: http://www.realscam.com/f9/sound-familiar-130/#post2844Okee dokee, I missed it and responded...thanx for the link... You asked it seven times?? Seriously? Which means you can provide me six more links and I'll answer each and everyone of those.


lol Seriously, you should seek some professional help. Either that or take your comedy act on the road. I've done some standup...it is fun...but doesn't pay diddly. I couldn't imagine the grind of doing it city by city night by night, club by club. I left the entertainment biz...when the kids were born. Still have a number of friends who are active though...

I guess that's why he won't answer my question. He's swamped. No, just missed it.

ROTFL!!!! You gotta love that pic! Truly that would be livin the dream. But my other streams of income don't yet exceed my expenses... I use the day job to max out the over 50 401k catchup contributions and pay my insurance, pay taxes and the bills...

Someday I'll have the laptop under the cabana...I just ain't there yet. Still got two kids to put through college and they haven't even started yet! (of course my son has got some schools offering him a free ride....if my daughter could do the same that day might just come earlier)

iamwil
07-30-2010, 08:11 AM
Yo, Unsaved Trash,

Per your request, I answered your queerie over on that other thread...

But all it seems to have done is have our in house pilot move to that thread to lambast me, instead of this one.

Of course this post will most likely instead of institute a response from you either here or there simply bring him out of the woodwork or sky for yet another rant against me.

Unsaved Trash
07-30-2010, 12:42 PM
Yo, Unsaved Trash,

Per your request, I answered your queerie over on that other thread...

But all it seems to have done is have our in house pilot move to that thread to lambast me, instead of this one.

Of course this post will most likely instead of institute a response from you either here or there simply bring him out of the woodwork or sky for yet another rant against me.

I read your response. It didn't really warrant a comment, but since you're begging for one, here goes.

Do you think it's dishonest to post online while you're being paid to do otherwise? You would have to be at your regular job to post as frequently and often as you do.

Why isn't the business you work for, the 9-5 job, licensed with the State of MD? It's quite possible that it is and I can't find it. But I don't think so.

There is no BBB report on your employer. Why is that?

The reasons I'm asking the questions above is because it's about integrity, much lacking in the MLM world and the people involved.

In your online resume, your main claim to fame is TriVita over your paid job. You've been with them for 11 years and still haven't made a profit. In all honesty, do you think that's a wise move to continue with something for 11 years that is supposed to generate an income but hasn't? When do you call it quits? 11 years of no profit equals 11 years of zero profit and wasted time.

Do you actually believe that you could sell your TriVita business right now and if so, why? Who would buy it?

iamwil
07-30-2010, 01:14 PM
I read your response. It didn't really warrant a comment, but since you're begging for one, here goes. Evidently it answered the question you claim to have asked seven times. And if you'll show me where the other six posts are I'll answer those as well.


Do you think it's dishonest to post online while you're being paid to do otherwise? You would have to be at your regular job to post as frequently and often as you do.

Why isn't the business you work for, the 9-5 job, licensed with the State of MD? It's quite possible that it is and I can't find it. But I don't think so.

There is no BBB report on your employer. Why is that?

The reasons I'm asking the questions above is because it's about integrity, much lacking in the MLM world and the people involved.

In your online resume, your main claim to fame is TriVita over your paid job. You've been with them for 11 years and still haven't made a profit. In all honesty, do you think that's a wise move to continue with something for 11 years that is supposed to generate an income but hasn't? When do you call it quits? 11 years of no profit equals 11 years of zero profit and wasted time.

Do you actually believe that you could sell your TriVita business right now and if so, why? Who would buy it? As I said, work is slow, slowest its been in 15 years. I know what the business would sell for and know folks who who would be interested in buying it. You decide what you waste your time with, and I decide what I waste my time with. Creating revenue and value in mlm is not a waste of time to me. Like I said, this year it will provide the revenue for me to expand my business into Australia....that will be new, fun and exciting to me. And not at all a waste of time.

As to whether or not my employer has a bbb listing, I don't know. I perform my job, to the approval of our clients, we bill them, they pay my employer, my employer pays me. It is a very unique system. Only the way construction and other industry has proceeded for ever. I think they built the Empire State Building and Hoover Dam the same way. Now if our clients didn't pay us...my employment would be shortened by the company...and if my employer didn't pay me, my employment would be shortened by me. Again, a relatively new concept.

Unsaved Trash
07-30-2010, 02:13 PM
Evidently it answered the question you claim to have asked seven times. And if you'll show me where the other six posts are I'll answer those as well.

It was the same question, so there isn't any need. And that question went back as far as being posted at scam.com.


As I said, work is slow, slowest its been in 15 years.

That wasn't my question and your answer didn't even relate to it. I asked you if your employer pays you to post on the internet during working hours and if you feel that is ethical. Also, obviously business has been slow since Nov. of last year with the amount of posts you've racked up. And your employer has paid you to post on the internet about TriVita, politics, MLMs, and just about everything else? Or are you working on commission?


I know what the business would sell for and know folks who who would be interested in buying it.

Examples please. Can you show me even one person in TriVita that has sold his/her business?


You decide what you waste your time with, and I decide what I waste my time with. Creating revenue and value in mlm is not a waste of time to me. Like I said, this year it will provide the revenue for me to expand my business into Australia....that will be new, fun and exciting to me. And not at all a waste of time.

But you've been with TriVita for 11 years and haven't made a profit. So there is no "creating revenue and value." Can you justify those claims if you've failed to make a profit in 11 years?

Australia? I believe you said somewhere that you were going there to recruit. I'm not a tax expert, but I'm fairly certain that you will not be able to make that a tax write-off since your TriVita business would be classified as a hobby with the IRS. If you haven't made a profit in the USA in 11 years, do you actually think it's going to be any different in AU? Since your answer will most likely be "yes," please elaborate.


As to whether or not my employer has a bbb listing, I don't know. I perform my job, to the approval of our clients, we bill them, they pay my employer, my employer pays me. It is a very unique system. Only the way construction and other industry has proceeded for ever. I think they built the Empire State Building and Hoover Dam the same way. Now if our clients didn't pay us...my employment would be shortened by the company...and if my employer didn't pay me, my employment would be shortened by me. Again, a relatively new concept.

You once again failed to address the issue of your employer being licensed by the State of MD. Construction companies are required to be licensed in MD. Correct me if I'm wrong. Yes, Wil, even subcontractors are required to be licensed. Why do you think your employer is exempt from that? THAT is not a relatively new concept. As for the BBB, all you have to do is a search. There is no listing with the BBB. That is unusual.

iamwil
07-30-2010, 02:39 PM
Again, my employers businesss is his business. While you love to get into my business, I have no need of getting ito his. If I were working for xerox, IBM or Bill Gates, I'd just do the job and get a check...I wouldn't look into their BBB rating or licensing after 15 years....

Any commissions I earn in the AU are paid to me by the INTL HQ in the USA.

Again, I am here to discuss and answer you guys honestly, you don't like that.

Let's see what would sound better that I made hundreds of thousands in profits, drove a ferrari and commuted from my bedroom to the den everyday or the truth?

The truth is I have made revenue, my expenses meet or exceed the revenue therefor little if any profit, therefor I work everyday to pay bills, and drive a little American car...

So obviously what sells me as a big time networker would be the lies you are wishing I would make. You don't like the truth, but are just so enamoured with knowing everything about me wishing to search me out. I'm just an American Joe trying to make a living... so shoot me.

Unsaved Trash
07-30-2010, 03:02 PM
Again, my employers businesss is his business. While you love to get into my business, I have no need of getting ito his. If I were working for xerox, IBM or Bill Gates, I'd just do the job and get a check...I wouldn't look into their BBB rating or licensing after 15 years....

I was into my employer's business because if they weren't on the up and up, I wouldn't have had anything to do with them. So I feel my question is valid and I'm sure that if you invested any length of time researching for an explanation as you do posting, you might have an answer. It's all relative to ethics and the laws.


Any commissions I earn in the AU are paid to me by the INTL HQ in the USA.

That is not even remotely related to what I asked you.


Again, I am here to discuss and answer you guys honestly, you don't like that.

No Wil, I think you're really, really good at avoiding the questions posed. You gloss over them and pretend you didn't see them or read them.


Let's see what would sound better that I made hundreds of thousands in profits, drove a ferrari and commuted from my bedroom to the den everyday or the truth?

The truth is I have made revenue, my expenses meet or exceed the revenue therefor little if any profit, therefor I work everyday to pay bills, and drive a little American car...

So let's say you break even, after 11 years in TriVita, do you have anything of value to show for those 11 years? That is the question. Much like the question you've failed to answer about being able to sell your business.


So obviously what sells me as a big time networker would be the lies you are wishing I would make. You don't like the truth, but are just so enamoured with knowing everything about me wishing to search me out. I'm just an American Joe trying to make a living... so shoot me.

If you put it out there, then why shouldn't we question it? You're the one making the claims, correct? It's not us. I've yet to call you a scammer, a liar, or anything like that. I'm asking you questions to validate what you claim. You fail to do that. In other words, if you make the claims, be able to back them up. You seem to take offense to that.

James R
07-30-2010, 03:48 PM
So let's say you break even, after 11 years in TriVita, do you have anything of value to show for those 11 years? That is the question.



He won't break even or make a profit until after the trip to Austrailia. Sound familiar?

How many freakin' launches can you have of the same crap? I would imagine there have been a few after an illustrious 11 year career peddling TriVita's mystery juice and who knows what else.

You asked a very good and relevant question. If you can't expand your business in your own backyard...how in the hell are you going to do it in Austrailia?

Are the poeple in Austrailia more anxious and willing to peddle the latest mlm mystery juice? Of course the answer to that will go something like this..

"Our juice is a unique antioxidant blend of 7 special herbs only found in the sub-tropical rainforrests of BumFuK Egypt....blah...blah....blah....more bullshit.....blah.... blah.....additional bullshit......and we have a money back gurantee"

"You can't find this in Australia .....blah....blah.....additional bullshit......."

11 years later in the year 2021...REPEAT ABOVE.

Unsaved Trash
07-30-2010, 03:50 PM
He won't break even or make a profit until after the trip to Austrailia. Sound familiar?

How many freakin' launches can you have of the same crap? I would imagine there have been a few after an illustrious 11 year career peddling TriVita's mystery juice and who knows what else.

You asked a very good and relevant question. If you can't expand your business in your own backyard...how in the hell are you going to do it in Austrailia?

Are the poeple in Austrailia more anxious and willing to peddle the latest mlm mystery juice? Of course the answer to that will go something like this..

"Our juice is a unique antioxidant blend of 7 special herbs only found in the sub-tropical rainforrests of BumFuK Egypt....blah...blah....blah....more bullshit.....blah.... blah.....additional bullshit......and we have a money back gurantee"

"You can't find this in Australia under.......blah....blah.....additional bullshit......."

11 years later in the year 2021...REPEAT ABOVE.

You pretty much hit the nail on the head. But I would hate to be a dream stealer.

iamwil
07-30-2010, 03:58 PM
Oh, my I claim I work. You'd prefer I am amongst the ranks of the unemployed.

Oh my I claim I have expenses with my business that often exceed my revenue. This is exactly what anti-mlmers often claim happens and consider this being a loser. You all here are perfectly happy calling me a loser. And I am perfectly happy with what I am doing...and you just don't seem happy with that.

Thank you JamesR for your contribution......My business is steadily increasing, hence the revenue to pay for the trip...

I'd like to see my revenues continue to go up and have to go to New Zealand, Hong Kong, Taiwan, it would be wonderful...

Unsaved Trash
07-30-2010, 06:54 PM
Oh, my I claim I work. You'd prefer I am amongst the ranks of the unemployed.

Oh my I claim I have expenses with my business that often exceed my revenue. This is exactly what anti-mlmers often claim happens and consider this being a loser. You all here are perfectly happy calling me a loser. And I am perfectly happy with what I am doing...and you just don't seem happy with that.

Thank you JamesR for your contribution......My business is steadily increasing, hence the revenue to pay for the trip...

I'd like to see my revenues continue to go up and have to go to New Zealand, Hong Kong, Taiwan, it would be wonderful...

How can your revenue pay for your trip when you don't make a profit?

iamwil
08-02-2010, 07:41 AM
How can your revenue pay for your trip when you don't make a profit?profit is what is left after expenses are taken out....

Unsaved Trash
08-02-2010, 01:51 PM
profit is what is left after expenses are taken out....

Since you have not made a profit in TriVita, your revenue would be flat. Now if you choose to go to AU as stated, that would entail that you spend your own money to go, will most likely not add to your revenue, and it is not tax deductible because you have yet to make a profit in the 11 years you've been with the company. The IRS would declare this to be a hobby and not allow that deduction.

And your reasoning is?

iamwil
08-02-2010, 02:45 PM
Since you have not made a profit in TriVita, your revenue would be flat. Now if you choose to go to AU as stated, that would entail that you spend your own money to go, will most likely not add to your revenue, and it is not tax deductible because you have yet to make a profit in the 11 years you've been with the company. The IRS would declare this to be a hobby and not allow that deduction.

And your reasoning is? Maybe my language is incorrect? I receive comission checks weekly and monthly. I use the comission checks to increase my comission checks. I have been saving some of the comission checks lately to prepare for a trip to Australia...So I've got this weekly, monthly revenue, and then I've got business expenses...after expenses...what is left over I call profit...actual cash for me to use outside of my business expenses. My trip to australia will be paid for out of revenue....any money left at the end of the year after the trip, after advertising, after going to conference, after reward gifts to my affiliates...that will be profit...if there is any.

I guess I'm using different terminology? Maybe you'd like to use gross profit...which I recieve and net profit that left over after expenses?

Unsaved Trash
08-02-2010, 05:43 PM
Maybe my language is incorrect? I receive comission checks weekly and monthly. I use the comission checks to increase my comission checks. I have been saving some of the comission checks lately to prepare for a trip to Australia...So I've got this weekly, monthly revenue, and then I've got business expenses...after expenses...what is left over I call profit...actual cash for me to use outside of my business expenses. My trip to australia will be paid for out of revenue....any money left at the end of the year after the trip, after advertising, after going to conference, after reward gifts to my affiliates...that will be profit...if there is any.

I guess I'm using different terminology? Maybe you'd like to use gross profit...which I recieve and net profit that left over after expenses?

Yes, you should. No profit means zero. So regardless of your revenue, after you deduct everything, it equals zero. So if you dip into the revenue and you're already not making a profit, your trip will cost you money the same as a vacation would. You cannot use it as a tax deduction.

Example: Revenue from TriVita = $10,000
Expenses = $10,000
Profit = 0
Trip to AU = $6,000
Loss = $6,000

Or am I missing something?

A Life Aloft
08-02-2010, 07:45 PM
Maybe my language is incorrect? I receive comission checks weekly and monthly. I use the comission checks to increase my comission checks. I have been saving some of the comission checks lately to prepare for a trip to Australia...So I've got this weekly, monthly revenue, and then I've got business expenses...after expenses...what is left over I call profit...actual cash for me to use outside of my business expenses. My trip to australia will be paid for out of revenue....any money left at the end of the year after the trip, after advertising, after going to conference, after reward gifts to my affiliates...that will be profit...if there is any.

I guess I'm using different terminology? Maybe you'd like to use gross profit...which I recieve and net profit that left over after expenses?This is laughable and embarrassing for you. You claim to own and run a business and be a businessman, yet you do not even understand simple and basic accounting and bookkeeping terms? Seriously? You are kidding right? There is no "different terminology". Everyone in business, every business and corporation and any small business, I don't care what type of legit business that it is, uses the exact same terminology. Then you guess at the terminology, which you are still using incorrectly, and use question marks. Holy cow. That's all I can say.

WTF does "I use commission checks to increase my commission checks" mean exactly? ROTFL! You have no clue what you are even talking about do you?

Unsaved Trash
08-02-2010, 10:17 PM
My trip to australia will be paid for out of revenue....any money left at the end of the year after the trip, after advertising, after going to conference, after reward gifts to my affiliates...that will be profit...if there is any.



Why do I keep hearing this from the MLMers that don't make any money? What you're really saying is that in 11 years of not turning a profit with TriVita, this year will be different. How many years have you been saying that and how many years are you going to give it before you throw in the towel?

Here is another example for you. Every weekday a woman takes her 2 kids to daycare at a cost of $500 per week. She earns $550 per week. It costs her $50 per week for gas and to maintain the car. Unless she received health benefits, she would be working for free or at a loss after taxes. Welfare would be a better option for her. In your case, there is a word for it.

iamwil
08-03-2010, 12:32 PM
Yes, you should. No profit means zero. So regardless of your revenue, after you deduct everything, it equals zero. So if you dip into the revenue and you're already not making a profit, your trip will cost you money the same as a vacation would. You cannot use it as a tax deduction.

Example: Revenue from TriVita = $10,000
Expenses = $10,000
Profit = 0
Trip to AU = $6,000
Loss = $6,000

Or am I missing something?Yup...

revenue 10 k
expenses 10k
trip to AU (6k included as expenses in above 10K)
profit...0

eg...I'm making enough to pay for the trip...


This is laughable and embarrassing for you. You claim to own and run a business and be a businessman, yet you do not even understand simple and basic accounting and bookkeeping terms? Seriously? You are kidding right? There is no "different terminology". Everyone in business, every business and corporation and any small business, I don't care what type of legit business that it is, uses the exact same terminology. Then you guess at the terminology, which you are still using incorrectly, and use question marks. Holy cow. That's all I can say.

WTF does "I use commission checks to increase my commission checks" mean exactly? ROTFL! You have no clue what you are even talking about do you? I said it repeatedly you and yours didn't get it...I was laughing long before you...tis ok you caught up...but in case you didn't lets try again.

Billy gives me 5 rubber duckies for my efforts...

I trade away 4 rubber duckies for future rubber duckies...

That leaves me 1 rubber duckie now...

Get it? Now quit fartin in the tub.


Why do I keep hearing this from the MLMers that don't make any money? What you're really saying is that in 11 years of not turning a profit with TriVita, this year will be different. How many years have you been saying that and how many years are you going to give it before you throw in the towel?

Here is another example for you. Every weekday a woman takes her 2 kids to daycare at a cost of $500 per week. She earns $550 per week. It costs her $50 per week for gas and to maintain the car. Unless she received health benefits, she would be working for free or at a loss after taxes. Welfare would be a better option for her. In your case, there is a word for it. I could choose to reduce my effort and not see increased sales over the course. I could sit on my laurels and collect a check for a year or two...I choose to do that at this juncture.

Seems to me that is my choice...and has little bearing on you fellas, but you seem to think otherwise.

Unsaved Trash
08-03-2010, 02:20 PM
Yup...

revenue 10 k
expenses 10k
trip to AU (6k included as expenses in above 10K)
profit...0

eg...I'm making enough to pay for the trip...

Wil, you truly are an idiot. No, really. You cannot be "making enough" to pay for the trip if you have no profit. It would be a loss. You cannot reason. If you own a store and your revenue is 10K per month and your expenses are 10K per month, you have no profit. Revenue and profit are tied together. So your trip to AU will net you a loss. Right? So using your own example above:

revenue 10 k
expenses 10k
trip to AU (6k included as expenses in above 10K)
profit...0
LOSS $6K

Duh!


Seems to me that is my choice...and has little bearing on you fellas, but you seem to think otherwise.

It does have a bearing on us "fellas" when you attempt to justify the benefits of being in TriVita for 11 years and have zero to show for it. This is typical with MLM dolts. In those 11 years, you obviously haven't recruited enough people to have a downline that is even giving you a slight profit. You're a failure at it.

Furthermore, you failed to answer my question again. You've been in TriVita for 11 years without making a profit. How many years are you going to give it before you see the light and realize you're throwing away not only your time and money and make the decision to throw in the towel? Or do you really enjoy working for free (and quite possibly losing money each year)?

BruceShuell
08-03-2010, 02:51 PM
I wonder where the 6k estimate for a trip to OZ came from? Wil must use YTB.

calvinandhobbes
08-03-2010, 03:00 PM
There is some reason to Will's approach, as long as you ignore the IRS.

He's saying he will invest every penny from the business that would be profit back into the business to grow it. At any time, he can stop investing in his business and start collecting profit. The more he lets his business grow, the more it's worth on paper in his mind. He could tell a prospective buyer that the business generates X amount of revenue, and the new owner could forgo any of the growth efforts in the past and start collecting some % as profit.

The problem is he currently isn't running his business to create a profit. He thinks he can continually run the business as a loss or break even, and then pay the IRS when he realizes a capital gain when selling the business. Unfortunately the IRS doesn't agree with him. Thus, any loss isn't able to be counted against positive earnings from other sources, and some expenses may be disallowed (thus making him profitable and responsible for back taxes and the associated penalties).

He's playing with two fires. First, his MLM business may not be worth what he thinks it will be come time to sell, especially given the artifically restrained market (he can only sell to insiders). Second, the IRS. The first is a risk to his future value, the second is a risk to his past and current income, and possibly his future freedom.

Unsaved Trash
08-03-2010, 03:21 PM
He's playing with two fires. First, his MLM business may not be worth what he thinks it will be come time to sell, especially given the artifically restrained market (he can only sell to insiders). Second, the IRS. The first is a risk to his future value, the second is a risk to his past and current income, and possibly his future freedom.

Let's see here. I've asked him if he can give me any example of anyone that would be interested in buying his "business." He can't. No one is going to pay $30K for something that hasn't generated a profit in 11 years. OK, that's probably wrong because if you look at the suckers out there that get taken by the bullshit, I'm sure he could find one that just got into TriVita. It's possible but highly unlikely since these morons don't have that type of cash or they wouldn't be interested in MLM in the first place, and especially one that hasn't generated a profit in 11 years. He may not disclose that though. And if he had half a brain, he wouldn't.

iamwil
08-03-2010, 03:48 PM
I wonder where the 6k estimate for a trip to OZ came from? Wil must use YTB.6k was a fictitious number made up by your friend saved trash. Who knows after traveling to four or five cities a couple countries, food, lodging etc...the guess may be close. And I am currently keeping down expenses so that the debit card the company fills will be ready willing and able to be utilized.


There is some reason to Will's approach, as long as you ignore the IRS. We don't ignore the IRS....I make some profit occasionally and losses occasionally, my CPA handles these situations and they don't like risk, they play conservative. They like you can't believe I've done as well as I have over the years with MLM.

iamwil
08-03-2010, 03:52 PM
Let's see here. I've asked him if he can give me any example of anyone that would be interested in buying his "business." He can't. No one is going to pay $30K for something that hasn't generated a profit in 11 years. OK, that's probably wrong because if you look at the suckers out there that get taken by the bullshit, I'm sure he could find one that just got into TriVita. It's possible but highly unlikely since these morons don't have that type of cash or they wouldn't be interested in MLM in the first place, and especially one that hasn't generated a profit in 11 years. He may not disclose that though. And if he had half a brain, he wouldn't.You are quite funny. Can you give me some examples of some people that might buy your house? I've got three people in my upline...and they'd all purchase my business if it were available. I have a number in my downline that would be willing to purchase my business should I choose to sell....

And as the trend continues of sales and revenues rising it continues to be worth more. It is ok that you folks are naysayers...that is what you do, you do it admirably. But you really have no concept of the amount of cash folks have available to build, grow or buy a business, nor the regular businessmen that get involved.

But again...you all love to focus on me...one of the millions involved in MLM around the world. I wish to dicuss your thoughts on world peace. You don't think my solution is viable....that is all well and good, since you won't be joining MLM as it is.

But what pray tell is your solution?

A Life Aloft
08-03-2010, 06:11 PM
I wonder where the 6k estimate for a trip to OZ came from? Wil must use YTB.That was my laugh for the day on here!!! He plans on hitch hiking from the east coast to SFO and then being loaded as cargo in the hold. On arrival at SYD, he will hitch hike again and stay at a youth hostel with a roommate and eat snacks for meals. That way, he'll have enough left over to buy some plastic snow globes of the Opera House for his downline. Geez, you TA's are so cynical! lmao

Unsaved Trash
08-03-2010, 06:14 PM
You are quite funny. Can you give me some examples of some people that might buy your house? I've got three people in my upline...and they'd all purchase my business if it were available. I have a number in my downline that would be willing to purchase my business should I choose to sell....

A house has value, your business does not have any value. You have not made a profit in 11 years which would drive virtually any company out of business. You state that you have three people in your upline that would buy your business and several in your downline that would buy it. I previously asked you to show me anyone in TriVita that has sold their business. You chose to ignore that right along with all of the other pointed questions I've asked which would force you to admit the truth. You are a true MLMer in that respect.


And as the trend continues of sales and revenues rising it continues to be worth more. It is ok that you folks are naysayers...that is what you do, you do it admirably. But you really have no concept of the amount of cash folks have available to build, grow or buy a business, nor the regular businessmen that get involved.

Oh OK, so you have been in TriVita for 11 years without a profit and if "the trend continues of sales and revenues rising it continues to be worth more" of what? Zero equals zero. For this particular "naysayer," you've proven that in 11 years that you haven't turned a profit and most likely have lost money. But next year will be different, just as the past 10 years have been, right? And yes, I do have the concept and a smart person wouldn't put any money into any MLM unless they were the founder. Simply put, Wil, you're full of ****.


But again...you all love to focus on me...one of the millions involved in MLM around the world. I wish to dicuss your thoughts on world peace. You don't think my solution is viable....that is all well and good, since you won't be joining MLM as it is.

Gee Wil, I wonder why we focus on you? Could it be because you keep putting yourself out there for ridicule? Keep in mind that you posted your links, you posted your resume online, you named your current employer, you post on company time, you get upset when valid questions are asked and dodge them faster than a speeding bullet, you make the claims and can't back them up, and now you're stating you want to talk about world peace. No, you want to talk about MLMs or you wouldn't have posted this on the MLM forum. Why didn't you choose a title like, Can Fuller Brush Solve World Strife? No Wil, we just pulled you out of cyberspace to criticize you and you had nothing to do with it nor did you have a choice. I think you get the picture (but probably not).


But what pray tell is your solution?

A start would be for you to be ethical and answer questions about your business with honest answers. After all, you made the claims we're responding to so back them up or shut up. I'm still waiting for you to ever address the question if you find it ethical to post on the internet about unrelated work issues when you're being paid by an employer to do otherwise. Obviously you don't have a problem with shafting your employer. Now that's ethical in your mind. So is selling worthless cactus juice, aka snake oil.

Unsaved Trash
08-03-2010, 06:28 PM
CORRECTION

I just received a PM informing me that I have committed a gross error. I admit I have been wrong. I kept stating that Wil has posted the value of his business at 30K. Wrong, he stated it's worth over 50K. I stand corrected but I'm still laughing at the "value," and especially me underestimating it by 20K.



what do you think I'm using to pay the mortgage, health insurance, 25k into the 401k every year. I've said repeatedly...I have a job, I have kids, I have rentals, I work with scouts and church and soccer...and in between I've created a business that is worth over 50k if I sell it....to me that isn't too bad. But what do I know.

Whip
08-03-2010, 07:55 PM
I imagine my real business that actually makes money must be worth millions then.

calvinandhobbes
08-04-2010, 08:34 AM
We don't ignore the IRS....I make some profit occasionally and losses occasionally,pick a story. last i heard, you never made a profit.
my CPA handles these situations and they don't like risk, they play conservative. They like you can't believe I've done as well as I have over the years with MLM.no profit in 11 years is "well"? Let's see, doesn't understand the profit rule for business versus hobby...and thinks no profit is good. Yes, you do need an new CPA.

iamwil
08-04-2010, 08:59 AM
That was my laugh for the day on here!!! He plans on hitch hiking from the east coast to SFO and then being loaded as cargo in the hold. On arrival at SYD, he will hitch hike again and stay at a youth hostel with a roommate and eat snacks for meals. That way, he'll have enough left over to buy some plastic snow globes of the Opera House for his downline. Geez, you TA's are so cynical! lmaoIf time was no constraint, that would be a great trip. Except just a hint for ya....when you are hitchin to destinations nobody uses the airport codes...10-4?

There is absolutely nothing like hitch-hiking to really interact with folks. Of course there is nothing like first class cabins either....especially on Qantas. (no first class for me...on Qantas...domestic upgrades sure...)

iamwil
08-04-2010, 09:11 AM
A house has value, your business does not have any value. an opinion, and a wrong one, but it's ok...
You have not made a profit in 11 years which would drive virtually any company out of business. You state that you have three people in your upline that would buy your business and several in your downline that would buy it. I previously asked you to show me anyone in TriVita that has sold their business. You chose to ignore that right along with all of the other pointed questions I've asked which would force you to admit the truth. You are a true MLMer in that respect. Show you? What do you want a picture? Yes many businesses have been bought and sold and I know personally folks that have bought some. But I've got no need to prove anything to you, as with everything else, any time I've shown you anything you just move onto something else to whine about. You are true anti-mlmer in that respect. I think you are truly disgusted with me because I've been so honest and forthcoming with you and you can't stand it.

Oh OK, so you have been in TriVita for 11 years without a profit and if "the trend continues of sales and revenues rising it continues to be worth more" of what? Zero equals zero. For this particular "naysayer," you've proven that in 11 years that you haven't turned a profit and most likely have lost money. But next year will be different, just as the past 10 years have been, right? And yes, I do have the concept and a smart person wouldn't put any money into any MLM unless they were the founder. Simply put, Wil, you're full of ****. I'm stupid and full of crap in your opinion...how will I ever sleep at night?

Gee Wil, I wonder why we focus on you? Could it be because you keep putting yourself out there for ridicule? Keep in mind that you posted your links, you posted your resume online, you named your current employer, you post on company time, you get upset when valid questions are asked and dodge them faster than a speeding bullet, you make the claims and can't back them up, and now you're stating you want to talk about world peace. No, you want to talk about MLMs or you wouldn't have posted this on the MLM forum. Why didn't you choose a title like, Can Fuller Brush Solve World Strife? No Wil, we just pulled you out of cyberspace to criticize you and you had nothing to do with it nor did you have a choice. I think you get the picture (but probably not). Wake up, smell the roses...YOU are talking about other threads YOU are talking about other forums YOU are talking about other times. I'VE started a thread on WORLD PEACE, I keep wishing to discuss it, I have to waste all my time with YOUR inane questions that have nothing to do with it.


A start would be for you to be ethical and answer questions about your business with honest answers. After all, you made the claims we're responding to so back them up or shut up. I'm still waiting for you to ever address the question if you find it ethical to post on the internet about unrelated work issues when you're being paid by an employer to do otherwise. Obviously you don't have a problem with shafting your employer. Now that's ethical in your mind. So is selling worthless cactus juice, aka snake oil. All I've done is given you honest answers. You have issues with them, that is not my problem. I don't have to provide you with supporting documents for everything....I've asked you repeatedly...does it make sense that as an MLMer I would brag that my expenses have regularly exceeded my revenue??? Does it make sense to you if I was a braggart that I would say I have to work a day job and also run real estate rentals? Give me a break...if I wanted to lie to you I'd say I lived on a yacht, traveled the world and made millions....face it, it pisses you off that I am honest.


I imagine my real business that actually makes money must be worth millions then.depending on the nature of the business, and its potential...it may be...I know my potential buyers.

A Life Aloft
08-04-2010, 10:18 AM
If time was no constraint, that would be a great trip. Except just a hint for ya....when you are hitchin to destinations nobody uses the airport codes...10-4?

There is absolutely nothing like hitch-hiking to really interact with folks. Of course there is nothing like first class cabins either....especially on Qantas. (no first class for me...on Qantas...domestic upgrades sure...)You know, I have seen you make just hundreds of stupid, lame ass replies to other posters, but this has to be your most ignorant response yet. Here is a hint for you, anyone in the aviation industry or the travel industry or any business related to them, uses ICAO and IATA identifier codes and the same codes are used throughout the world. They are used for the names of any airline company as well and much more. They are the standard. So your response is so incredibly stupid and pointless, that I hardly know what to say. You just had to say something and this is all you could come up with? lol

How would you know what a first class cabin on Qantas or any other airline is like? Domestic upgrades? WTF? Why would you get a domestic upgrade? Do you even understand how that works in this day and age? Been on a flight lately? I can't wait to hear that explanation. On your budget, you'll be on a carrier making one to two stops where you will be sitting in economy with the unwashed masses like a sardine for the 18 hour flight. You can't even afford Business Class. It's more than your entire budget. lol

10-4? WTF? ROTFL! That might be used by law enforcement in the US but it has never used by any pilot ever, anywhere in the world. lmao

Before you bother responding to posts, maybe you should just stop. It's so embarrassing for you. Not that, that has stopped you up to this point. Your ignorance it seems, is boundless. Good grief. Just unplug your puter. Oh, and are you posting from "work" yet again??? ROTFL!

iamwil
08-04-2010, 10:35 AM
You know, I have seen you make just hundreds of stupid, lame ass replies to other posters, but this has to be your most ignorant response yet. Here is a hint for you, anyone in the aviation industry or the travel industry or any business related to them, uses ICAO and IATA identifier codes and the same codes are used throughout the world. They are used for the names of any airline company as well and much more. They are the standard. So your response is so incredibly stupid and pointless, that I hardly know what to say. You just had to say something and this is all you could come up with? lol

How would you know what a first class cabin on Qantas or any other airline is like? Domestic upgrades? WTF? Why would you get a domestic upgrade? Do you even understand how that works in this day and age? Been on a flight lately? I can't wait to hear that explanation. On your budget, you'll be on a carrier making one to two stops where you will be sitting in economy with the unwashed masses like a sardine for the 18 hour flight. You can't even afford Business Class. It's more than your entire budget. lol

10-4? WTF? ROTFL! That might be used by law enforcement in the US but it has never used by any pilot ever, anywhere in the world. lmao

Before you bother responding to posts, maybe you should just stop. It's embarrassing for you. Not that, that has stopped you up to this point. Good grief. Just unplug your puter. Oh you are so correct...yes when folks are traveling from Baltimore thru DC on the way to Leesburg by car they typically say I'll be leaving BWI by 10 should be at DCA for lunch and then we'll meet just west of IAD... No we don't talk like that...nobody talks like that unless they are flying in and out of airports...

Upgrades...last time I upgraded to first class it was $20 a leg...couldn't pass it up, did it right there at the electronic check in kiosk. Granted that was last October, granted I haven't flown since February.... No I'm not a pilot....and you didn't like the 10-4 sarcasm good buddy?

Yes, I often sit coach with the unwashed masses as you so eloquently call us. I am not of the upper crusty right pinky and nostrels in the air crowd. Paper napkins are ok with me. Don't get me wrong...the occasional first class cabin, cruise ship or night in the Biltmore are just fine...I can enjoy decadance and conspicuous consumption as much as the next guy....but it ain't my life.

I gotcher ICAO and IATA identifier codes hangin, Roger, over and out.

littleroundman
08-04-2010, 10:39 AM
Before you bother responding to posts, maybe you should just stop. It's so embarrassing for you. Not that, that has stopped you up to this point. Your ignorance it seems, is boundless. Good grief. Just unplug your puter. Oh, and are you posting from "work" yet again??? ROTFL!

Are you insinuating iamwil isn't behaving deliberately ???

Does anyone honestly believe iamwils' forum behaviour is anything more than an act ???

People get their jollies in all sorts of peculiar ways.

Some people scratch their names on shop windows,

some spray illegible messages on the walls of buildings with spraycans,

some break perfectly good things, scratch perfectly good cars for fun and steal hubcaps.

and iamwil,

well,

poor ol' wil does what wil does.

A Life Aloft
08-04-2010, 10:55 AM
Are you insinuating iamwil isn't behaving deliberately ???

Does anyone honestly believe iamwils' forum behaviour is anything more than an act ???

People get their jollies in all sorts of peculiar ways.

Some people scratch their names on shop windows,

some spray illegible messages on the walls of buildings with spraycans,

some break perfectly good things, scratch perfectly good cars for fun and steal hubcaps.

and iamwil,

well,

poor ol' wil does what wil does.

You are of course right.. he's nothing but a forum board whore troll, spewing garbage to mark his stink on the internet. lol

A Life Aloft
08-04-2010, 11:06 AM
Oh you are so correct...yes when folks are traveling from Baltimore thru DC on the way to Leesburg by car they typically say I'll be leaving BWI by 10 should be at DCA for lunch and then we'll meet just west of IAD... No we don't talk like that...nobody talks like that unless they are flying in and out of airports...

Upgrades...last time I upgraded to first class it was $20 a leg...couldn't pass it up, did it right there at the electronic check in kiosk. Granted that was last October, granted I haven't flown since February.... No I'm not a pilot....and you didn't like the 10-4 sarcasm good buddy?

Yes, I often sit coach with the unwashed masses as you so eloquently call us. I am not of the upper crusty right pinky and nostrels in the air crowd. Paper napkins are ok with me. Don't get me wrong...the occasional first class cabin, cruise ship or night in the Biltmore are just fine...I can enjoy decadance and conspicuous consumption as much as the next guy....but it ain't my life.

I gotcher ICAO and IATA identifier codes hangin, Roger, over and out.

Man, you are beyond a dumbass. I, as a pilot was posting and using the codes and responding to Bruce who is a TA, in the first place and not to you. Cripes, give it the hell up already. You don't even get that much do you? Quick, look up TA on Google. lmao

Seating in business class or first class on any flight, has nothing whatsoever to do with "upper crust" nor any of the other nonsense that you have stated, and it just goes to show how little you have ever traveled and the state of your finances. It's about service, comfort, amenities, perks and space. The same for hotels and cruise ships. Just because you cannot afford to travel in that manner, you try to degrade the experience and deflect from what it actually means. Sorry, that isn't working. If you had a half of a brain you would know that airline employees for example, are always upgraded to business and first class if there is space to do so. We won't even get into their families. That's way over your head. lol I suppose an FA or a GA or some tired deadheading FO to you is part of the "upper crusty right pinky and nostrels in the air crowd then" that you will often see in in First Class and Business Class. ROTFL! The same courtesy is often afforded active military. Get a grip on reality at some point Will......seriously.

There is nothing sarcastic about your posts Willy, they are just unintelligent, lame as ****, uneducated and ignorant deflections and lies. Nice to see your "boss" at "work" is still letting you post on the net all day long. lol

littleroundman
08-04-2010, 11:16 AM
You are of course right.. he's nothing but a forum board whore troll, spewing garbage to mark his stink on the internet. lol

I DO think, however, it's vitally important to keep iamwil posting in his own inimitable way.

When dealing with people who have retreated into their own little delusional bubble, it is relatively easy to keep "pushing their buttons", so to speak, and keep them believing they're "winning" some imaginary battle, when, in fact, they're merely reinforcing their own beliefs and impressing nobody.

Keep 'im talking, I say.

A Life Aloft
08-04-2010, 11:22 AM
I gotcher ICAO and IATA identifier codes hangin, Roger, over and out.Try again Willy. Commercial (cargo or PAX) Pilots never say "Roger over and out", either lmao. The "Over and Out" phrase is generally used on maritime radio communications, btw. ROTFL! Just quit while you are behind.

iamwil
08-04-2010, 11:25 AM
Man, you are beyond a dumbass. I, as a pilot was posting and using the codes and responding to Bruce who is a TA, in the first place and not to you. You were speaking about ME hitching to SFO....and then hopping a cargo ship to SYD....I repeat...we don't use airport codes to hitchhike...we write the name of the city on the cardboard sign.


You are of course right.. he's nothing but a forum board whore troll, spewing garbage to mark his stink on the internet. lolFunny if you weren't talking about me or the other forum you'd lose over half of your top ten threads...

I am what keeps this forum hopping...

you are welcome.

A Life Aloft
08-04-2010, 11:27 AM
I DO think, however, it's vitally important to keep iamwil posting in his own inimitable way.

When dealing with people who have retreated into their own little delusional bubble, it is relatively easy to keep "pushing their buttons", so to speak, and keep them believing they're "winning" some imaginary battle, when, in fact, they're merely reinforcing their own beliefs and impressing nobody.

Keep 'im talking, I say.He is beyond delusional. Your assessment is as usual, spot on. It's more entertaining than The Comedy Network on tv, I will say that. lol It's amazing just how deep the illusions are for these people. It doesn't seem to matter that they appear obviously clueless to everyone else around them. They just keep putting up the b.s. front that they believe is the truth and fact. But then when you have pissed away your life, and cannot face the reality of that nor change it, this is all they have I guess.

A Life Aloft
08-04-2010, 11:32 AM
You were speaking about ME hitching to SFO....and then hopping a cargo ship to SYD....I repeat...we don't use airport codes to hitchhike...we write the name of the city on the cardboard sign.

Let me go........ slow.....I was not........ speaking.......... to........ you....I was speaking......... to Bruce.........about.......... your....... trip............he is....... a .........TA....... we....(he and I).......... speak......a common.....language.

And no, I was not referring to you "hopping a cargo liner" either. I was referring to you being loaded in the cargo hold of a plane instead of being SLF. ROTFL! At least that would save the poor bastards sitting next you, from an 18 hour ride from hell.

I imagine you have a lot of experience with hitchhiking as your primary means of travel. That statement from you, is least is true. lol You finally got something correct on this entire thread.

littleroundman
08-04-2010, 11:34 AM
He is beyond delusional. Your assessment is as usual, spot on. It's more entertaining than The Comedy Network on tv, I will say that. lol It's amazing just how deep the illusions are for these people. It doesn't seem to matter that they appear obviously clueless to everyone else around them. They just keep putting up the b.s. front that they believe is the truth and fact. But then when you have pissed away your life, and cannot face the reality of that nor change it, this is all they have I guess.

There's a subject for a whole new thread direction right there.

"At what stage could one reasonably say "positive thinking" becomes "delusional" and then one stage further and becomes "denial" ???

A Life Aloft
08-04-2010, 11:38 AM
There's a subject for a whole new thread direction right there.

"At what stage could one reasonably say "positive thinking" becomes "delusional" and then one stage further and becomes "denial" ???Hells Bells! You have really hit on something there!!! Willy could be the poster boy. "If I imagine it, it will be real". lol

littleroundman
08-04-2010, 11:51 AM
Hells Bells! You have really hit on something there!!! Willy could be the poster boy. "If I imagine it, it will be real". lol

We could make it a variation of Descartes famous saying : Je pense donc je suis "I think, therefore I am".

The MLMers version would be along the lines of: je le pense, donc c'est "I think it, therefore it is"

iamwil
08-04-2010, 12:14 PM
He is beyond delusional. Your assessment is as usual, spot on. It's more entertaining than The Comedy Network on tv, I will say that. lol . Just practicin my stand up routine... love the hecklers.


Let me go........ slow.....I was not........ speaking.......... to........ you....I was speaking......... to Bruce.........about.......... your....... trip............he is....... a .........TA....... we....(he and I).......... speak......a common.....language.


I imagine you have a lot of experience with hitchhiking as your primary means of travel. That statement from you, is least is true. lol You finally got something correct on this entire thread. Oh....now I see your common language.

And yes, you finally have got one thing correct about all your misconceptions in my life...I have hitched quite a lot in my youth....last time coast to coast was '92 bout time for another trip. There is nothing like it.


We could make it a variation of Descartes famous saying : Je pense donc je suis "I think, therefore I am".

The MLMers version would be along the lines of: je le pense, donc c'est "I think it, therefore it is" Exactly...you all finally got it. MLMers think. It is what seperates us from the anti mlmers...

I'll be here all week.

Unsaved Trash
08-04-2010, 02:25 PM
an opinion, and a wrong one, but it's ok... Show you? What do you want a picture? Yes many businesses have been bought and sold and I know personally folks that have bought some. But I've got no need to prove anything to you, as with everything else, any time I've shown you anything you just move onto something else to whine about. You are true anti-mlmer in that respect. I think you are truly disgusted with me because I've been so honest and forthcoming with you and you can't stand it. I'm stupid and full of crap in your opinion...how will I ever sleep at night? Wake up, smell the roses...YOU are talking about other threads YOU are talking about other forums YOU are talking about other times. I'VE started a thread on WORLD PEACE, I keep wishing to discuss it, I have to waste all my time with YOUR inane questions that have nothing to do with it. All I've done is given you honest answers. You have issues with them, that is not my problem. I don't have to provide you with supporting documents for everything....I've asked you repeatedly...does it make sense that as an MLMer I would brag that my expenses have regularly exceeded my revenue??? Does it make sense to you if I was a braggart that I would say I have to work a day job and also run real estate rentals? Give me a break...if I wanted to lie to you I'd say I lived on a yacht, traveled the world and made millions....face it, it pisses you off that I am honest.

depending on the nature of the business, and its potential...it may be...I know my potential buyers.

As is standard with you, you failed to answer even one question. That's exactly what you've always done IF you didn't just abandon the threads. Now you state that you won't answer any of my questions because you don't have anything to prove, I'm anti-MLM, and my questions are "inane." This is your MO.

What a waste of time trying to ever have a discussion with you. You make the claims every time yet never back them up. At least you amuse me because I seldom run into fools in real life that are even close to your level of stupidity. You should contact Len Clements, spend $300 for his advice on how much your business is worth. He's the expert, you know (insert sarcasm here). Imbecile.

You may now move on to the next thread and contaminate it with more bullshit, ignore the questions, make more claims, and then move on to the next one. Some things never change.

iamwil
08-04-2010, 03:50 PM
As is standard with you, you failed to answer even one question. That's exactly what you've always done IF you didn't just abandon the threads. Now you state that you won't answer any of my questions because you don't have anything to prove, I'm anti-MLM, and my questions are "inane." This is your MO.

What a waste of time trying to ever have a discussion with you. You make the claims every time yet never back them up. At least you amuse me because I seldom run into fools in real life that are even close to your level of stupidity. You should contact Len Clements, spend $300 for his advice on how much your business is worth. He's the expert, you know (insert sarcasm here). Imbecile.

You may now move on to the next thread and contaminate it with more bullshit, ignore the questions, make more claims, and then move on to the next one. Some things never change.

Such a lost and troubled soul. The above is your response to my response of your post below.

Whine, I never answered one question....you only asked four questions in your entire rant. I took them as rhetorical, because they were either inane or already repeatedly asked and answered.

1st question.... in Trivita the businesses are valued by their revenue and direction of growth and longevity...the more the steady upward curve combined with annual gross the more it is worth...that is what I am building.

2nd question...After ten years of little or no profit why do I think next year will be different? Heck I don't know, I may not be able to justify spending the increased revenue on the business. But maybe I will be...we'll see.

3rd question....Why do you focus on me? The answer you already know, because you are enamoured with me and live vicariously through my posts. You wish you were me and could be so straightforward, instead you try to bolster yourself up by tearing down others.

4th question...Can Fuller Brush solve world strife? As I said, not on its own, but in combination with other companies and supportive people maybe we have a chance.

All either answered repeatedly or inane...(your post below for all to see)


A house has value, your business does not have any value. You have not made a profit in 11 years which would drive virtually any company out of business. You state that you have three people in your upline that would buy your business and several in your downline that would buy it. I previously asked you to show me anyone in TriVita that has sold their business. You chose to ignore that right along with all of the other pointed questions I've asked which would force you to admit the truth. You are a true MLMer in that respect.

Oh OK, so you have been in TriVita for 11 years without a profit and if "the trend continues of sales and revenues rising it continues to be worth more" of what? Zero equals zero. For this particular "naysayer," you've proven that in 11 years that you haven't turned a profit and most likely have lost money. But next year will be different, just as the past 10 years have been, right? And yes, I do have the concept and a smart person wouldn't put any money into any MLM unless they were the founder. Simply put, Wil, you're full of ****.

Gee Wil, I wonder why we focus on you? Could it be because you keep putting yourself out there for ridicule? Keep in mind that you posted your links, you posted your resume online, you named your current employer, you post on company time, you get upset when valid questions are asked and dodge them faster than a speeding bullet, you make the claims and can't back them up, and now you're stating you want to talk about world peace. No, you want to talk about MLMs or you wouldn't have posted this on the MLM forum. Why didn't you choose a title like, Can Fuller Brush Solve World Strife? No Wil, we just pulled you out of cyberspace to criticize you and you had nothing to do with it nor did you have a choice. I think you get the picture (but probably not).


A start would be for you to be ethical and answer questions about your business with honest answers. After all, you made the claims we're responding to so back them up or shut up. I'm still waiting for you to ever address the question if you find it ethical to post on the internet about unrelated work issues when you're being paid by an employer to do otherwise. Obviously you don't have a problem with shafting your employer. Now that's ethical in your mind. So is selling worthless cactus juice, aka snake oil.


As is standard with you, you failed to answer even one question. That's exactly what you've always done IF you didn't just abandon the threads. Now you state that you won't answer any of my questions because you don't have anything to prove, I'm anti-MLM, and my questions are "inane." This is your MO.

What a waste of time trying to ever have a discussion with you. You make the claims every time yet never back them up. At least you amuse me because I seldom run into fools in real life that are even close to your level of stupidity. You should contact Len Clements, spend $300 for his advice on how much your business is worth. He's the expert, you know (insert sarcasm here). Imbecile.

You may now move on to the next thread and contaminate it with more bullshit, ignore the questions, make more claims, and then move on to the next one. Some things never change.

Doc Bunkum
08-04-2010, 04:31 PM
Such a lost and troubled soul...

You sound a lot like that airhead Tulip "over there".


SBM (bubbles) is not going to let any negative opinion of her new forum be discussed unless the site picks up some steam and she is feeling confident.

Right now things do not look so good and anything said about their forum that is not positive is causing them heartache.

I think we should consider doing some soul searching and maybe offer some prayer to help them along during this time that is so very difficult for them.

I wanted to share this inspirational gospel tune by Elvis with SBM (bubbles) and those at realscam.com that are having a hard time right now

Hope this is uplifting and helps you to feel better.

Sheesh!

And when I feel an urge to post over there, I think of Tulip, and Chrispy, and Heiney... and I figure, what's the use?

King
08-04-2010, 05:05 PM
You sound a lot like that airhead Tulip "over there".



Sheesh!

And when I feel an urge to post over there, I think of Tulip, and Chrispy, and Heiney... and I figure, what's the use?

This man speaks the truth.

Unsaved Trash
08-04-2010, 07:31 PM
Such a lost and troubled soul. The above is your response to my response of your post below.

Whine, I never answered one question....you only asked four questions in your entire rant. I took them as rhetorical, because they were either inane or already repeatedly asked and answered.

Incorrect DoltBoy, I asked you a lot of questions. You skirted 90% of them. I asked you how you determined the value of your business. I asked you about ethics, I've asked you about posting on company time. I've asked you over and over to provide a link to anyone selling their TriVita business. The list goes on and on.


1st question.... in Trivita the businesses are valued by their revenue and direction of growth and longevity...the more the steady upward curve combined with annual gross the more it is worth...that is what I am building.

So your business is worth in excess of 50K according to you. In 11 years, you've made no profit, you have no physical inventory, and sometimes your revenue exceeds your expenses. So given your prior statements, those would negate "the more the steady upward curve combined with annual gross the more it is worth...that is what I am building." I guess I'm missing something here. Revenue is not generating a profit. Flat. But more than likely, you've lost money each year for 11 years. In those 11 years combined, have you ever broken even?


2nd question...After ten years of little or no profit why do I think next year will be different? Heck I don't know, I may not be able to justify spending the increased revenue on the business. But maybe I will be...we'll see.

So without being able to document what you claim your business is worth (in excess of 50K), you still don't know and you still have that "dream." Correct?


3rd question....Why do you focus on me? The answer you already know, because you are enamoured with me and live vicariously through my posts. You wish you were me and could be so straightforward, instead you try to bolster yourself up by tearing down others.

Thank you for enlightening me, Dr. Allyn. And your degree is from the "School of Hard Knocks." But you're absolutely right. Until you came into my life last November, I was an empty shell of a human being, living my life waiting for someone like you to enter it so I could walk down the Path of Righteousness and discover how truly wonderful, outstanding, upstanding, and moral person you are. I sincerely thank you for that. The pure jealousy I harbor of you being in TriVita for 11 years without making a profit and making endless claims of your success (building your business worth in excess of 50K) has truly inspired me to get out there and live my life not vicariously through your rampant success in the industry and to make a gazillion posts per day on various internet boards, but to actually join TriVita and then flood the boards with bullshit. Thank you, Dr. Allyn, thank you for that. I can hardly wait to get started but the only problem is that I'm retired and don't have the opportunity to post on company time.


4th question...Can Fuller Brush solve world strife? As I said, not on its own, but in combination with other companies and supportive people maybe we have a chance.

I suppose all of the MLMs will be bound together in this noble cause. That thread starter qualified for the all time stupidest one ever. Thank you for that one too.


All either answered repeatedly or inane...(your post below for all to see)

No, you still have quite a few to answer. Just scroll up and read though the posts. But for starters, please explain exactly how you put the "in excess of 50K" valuation on your TriVita business. Just the facts.

A Life Aloft
08-04-2010, 09:22 PM
Exactly...you all finally got it. MLMers think. It is what seperates us from the anti mlmers...

I'll be here all week.What actually separates you from anti-mlmers is logic, intelligence, critical thinking, rationale and being in touch with reality. lol

Oh please, of course you are here and at Scam and who knows where on the net all day long every damn day of the week. That's all you ever do. Nothing new. Other people here can't be because they have actual careers and if they are retired, or a homemaker and raising kids they have many more things of value, meaning and importance to occupy their time with. Sadly, you don't. I would bet that I earned more today in 7 hours today than you have made with your b.s. "business" all year long.

Unsaved Trash
08-04-2010, 10:54 PM
I would bet that I earned more today in 7 hours today than you have made with your b.s. "business" all year long.

I don't think you need to make that bet. Since he hasn't made a profit in 11 years, that would negate the bet. Unless of course you mean revenue which to Wil has nothing to do with profit. He could lose a grand a year but as long as he has revenue, all is well. That's my understanding anyway. Unfortunately, a real business wouldn't survive for long if their expenses exceeded or even broke even where revenue/profit is involved. But I just don't understand the economics of the world since I'm not in a MLM. With them, it's different than logical economics.

A Life Aloft
08-05-2010, 12:30 AM
I don't think you need to make that bet. Since he hasn't made a profit in 11 years, that would negate the bet. Unless of course you mean revenue which to Wil has nothing to do with profit. He could lose a grand a year but as long as he has revenue, all is well. That's my understanding anyway. Unfortunately, a real business wouldn't survive for long if their expenses exceeded or even broke even where revenue/profit is involved. But I just don't understand the economics of the world since I'm not in a MLM. With them, it's different than logical economics.Amazing that someone considers their business a "success" when they make no real profit. lmao

littleroundman
08-05-2010, 01:13 AM
Amazing that someone considers their business a "success" when they make no real profit. lmao

Now, perhaps, people can start to understand why it is that cults and MLMs try and convince their people to insulate themselves from the big, bad world "out there" outside the particular cult or MLM.

Inside the little bubble cultists and MLMers find themselves, it's only too easy to believe your "business' is worth something on the open market.

When you're surrounded by like minded robot.....err.......culti....err......upliner....e rr.....people of a similar mindset, delusions can suddenly become not only real, but reinforced.

Denial becomes a way of life and what would have been glaringly obvious in a persons' pre cult days is normalized and becomes fully accepted as being "real".

Seriously?
08-05-2010, 08:00 AM
OK, I have a question for Wil. If I read correctly, you say that you have several people in your upline and downline that will pay you the $50K you say your biz is worth. Is there anyone outside the MLM world that will pay you?

calvinandhobbes
08-05-2010, 08:32 AM
OK, I have a question for Wil. If I read correctly, you say that you have several people in your upline and downline that will pay you the $50K you say your biz is worth. Is there anyone outside the MLM world that will pay you?He is required by his company to only sell his business to those inside the company.

Will and Tom can argue value til they are blue in the face. The value of his company isn't revenue, profit, etc, etc..... it's how much someone will pay for it. Not how much someone says they will pay for it when they aren't really buying it, but how much they actually fork over.

On the one hand, Will hasn't made squat. Revenue is useless without profit. Currently, he claims his hobby (the IRS's word as well as mine) is worth 50k. I think he's full of it. Sure someone can come in, stop "investing in the business" and lower the cost base and start profiting...but how much? There is no history to judge the possible value, so it's a guess, meaning high risk. High risk means lower price.

On the other hand, Will has an artificially restricted market in that he can only sell to people in the company already. That brings the price down as well. But, he does have one thing going for him. This artificially small market is dumb as a whole. Given most people get into it not knowing what it takes and fail, I don't doubt he could get some idiot on the hook for his non-profit.

Seriously?
08-05-2010, 08:39 AM
He is required by his company to only sell his business to those inside the company.

Will and Tom can argue value til they are blue in the face. The value of his company isn't revenue, profit, etc, etc..... it's how much someone will pay for it. Not how much someone says they will pay for it when they aren't really buying it, but how much they actually fork over.

On the one hand, Will hasn't made squat. Revenue is useless without profit. Currently, he claims his hobby (the IRS's word as well as mine) is worth 50k. I think he's full of it. Sure someone can come in, stop "investing in the business" and lower the cost base and start profiting...but how much? There is no history to judge the possible value, so it's a guess, meaning high risk. High risk means lower price.

On the other hand, Will has an artificially restricted market in that he can only sell to people in the company already. That brings the price down as well. But, he does have one thing going for him. This artificially small market is dumb as a whole. Given most people get into it not knowing what it takes and fail, I don't doubt he could get some idiot on the hook for his non-profit.

Ahhh, the deck is stacked, then.

I wonder if he's checked into the regs for registering as a non-profit?

iamwil
08-05-2010, 09:32 AM
You sound a lot like that airhead Tulip "over there".



Sheesh!

And when I feel an urge to post over there, I think of Tulip, and Chrispy, and Heiney... and I figure, what's the use? So still the hot topic over here is me...and others at scam.com...

come on now...when are we gonna start a forum here that doesn't discuss the others?


I guess I'm missing something here. Revenue is not generating a profit. Flat. But more than likely, you've lost money each year for 11 years. In those 11 years combined, have you ever broken even?

But for starters, please explain exactly how you put the "in excess of 50K" valuation on your TriVita business. Just the facts. I have had some years I've made some profit...I've had other years my expenses exceeded profit...overall on average...zero profit or close to it.

The businesses typically sell for 2-4 times their annual revenue. I have twice been offerred in the upper range of that. There are no links, all sales are between to people or companies...and these are not made public to us. However I've spoke with people who have sold businesses and others who have bought businesses.


Sadly, you don't. I would bet that I earned more today in 7 hours today than you have made with your b.s. "business" all year long. I love it...that ranks right up there with the third grade 'nanny nanny poo poo'...great response. It also well aligns with your comment about us poor folks having to ride coach with the unwashed masses. How I'd love to be so arrogant and have a silver spoon in my butt. Some day I aspire to be just like you....NOT.

Of course I shouldn't have said that, because it is all so apparent you are so much better at dishing it out than taking it. All in good fun to me...but I know you will take it personal...oh well.


He is required by his company to only sell his business to those inside the company.

Will and Tom can argue value til they are blue in the face. The value of his company isn't revenue, profit, etc, etc..... it's how much someone will pay for it. Not how much someone says they will pay for it when they aren't really buying it, but how much they actually fork over.

On the other hand, Will has an artificially restricted market in that he can only sell to people in the company already. You are correct...only sales within the company...artificially restricted lowering the cost? Maybe...but the reason is as I understand it the company wants folks who know exactly what they are purchasing... And they do...which has created the 2-4x average that they pay...they know what they are getting and know what their return will be.

But somewhere along the line... I don't have to explain everything to you...you ain't buying the product, you ain't buying the opportunity, I don't need to open my books for you.



Ahhh, the deck is stacked, then.

I wonder if he's checked into the regs for registering as a non-profit? I'm with a couple of non-profits...surely you know nonprofit is an IRS designation and doesn't mean no profits...

Seriously....different thing.

calvinandhobbes
08-05-2010, 09:51 AM
I've had other years my expenses exceeded profit
Will. Stop. Clear your mind. Profit = Revenue - Expenses. You keep using the term "profit" for revenue. You've obviously used the term "income" when you meant revenue since you claimed you made 20k income in MLM.
The businesses typically sell for 2-4 times their annual revenue.one would hope that those businesses are "typically" profitable as well.
I have twice been offerred in the upper range of that.you've more than twice switched income with revenue. Maybe you just misunderstood them the way you misunderstand most of what people tell you.
There are no links, all sales are between to people or companies...and these are not made public to us. However I've spoke with people who have sold businesses and others who have bought businesses.everything in MLM is always "I know a guy..." Just like you know a guy that tripled his power generation using the 100 mpg carburetor (even though those pesky laws of physics say otherwise).
I'm with a couple of non-profits...surely you know nonprofit is an IRS designation and doesn't mean no profits...

Seriously....different thing.surely you understand the joke he was telling. actually, surely you didn't. And, no, I will not stop calling you Shirley.

iamwil
08-05-2010, 11:02 AM
Shirley you know what I meant...

Weren't you the one that wanted to put the profit line above the trip expense?

yes...revenue...what the company pays me...expenses....what comes out of revenue...profit....what is left after expenses....income...what I take out of profit for personal use.

I don't know a guy...a know a number of guys... You can read the VitaJournals on the website...I told you there was a guy I spoke with that owned car dealerships and was climbing the ladder....well he made the top of the chain...he's got folks above him, but he's made it to Presidential our highest tier...its a guy I know...you can read about him. Made his money in many different businesses and got into this one as well...he isn't alone. I do know some other guys, and gals as well.

tis the nature of networking.

the company has a goal....first Australia and New Zealand...and then in the next 10 years 100 countries! Will they make 100 countries, I don't know...but they will try. And I will try to have an organization started in each and every one.

Whip
08-05-2010, 11:47 AM
depending on the nature of the business, and its potential...it may be...I know my potential buyers.

Why would that be?
You claim that you can sell your 'business' without ever making a profit.
Mine does make a profit after 6 years of building.
You say yours is actually worth something.
How can mine not be worth far, far more?

calvinandhobbes
08-05-2010, 12:26 PM
Shirley you know what I meant...

Weren't you the one that wanted to put the profit line above the trip expense?Me? No. I was not in that discussion at all.
yes...revenue...what the company pays me...expenses....what comes out of revenue...profit....what is left after expenses....income...what I take out of profit for personal use.Profit = Income = Revenue - Expenses. Stick with that.

Now, have you ever made 20k INCOME from MLM in a year? You said yes before. Would you like to change your answer?

Have you or haven't you made a profit at the end of the year for any of your 11 years? You seem to have a series of answers for this one too.

iamwil
08-05-2010, 12:27 PM
Why would that be?
You claim that you can sell your 'business' without ever making a profit.
Mine does make a profit after 6 years of building.
You say yours is actually worth something.
How can mine not be worth far, far more?Did I say it wasn't?

Yours could be worth far more than mine.

In values of businesses different businesses are worth different amounts.

If I remember your statement correctly you said if yours is worth that much mine must be worth a million...

My response...it may be or may not be I don't know?

So you want to know how could it be that your business is or isn't worth a million...ask a broker.

A former boss had a construction company....in our last years we averaged over 25 million a year...he paid himself a salary of 3k per week, and on top of everything when all was said and done he averaged a little over 2% profit. He had a couple hundred thousand in equipment, backhoes, trailers, tools etc. He tried to sell it on the open market. And in the end, he offered 90% of it to me for One Dollar. He wanted 10% of the profit for ten years...and then it would be mine...all for one dollar.

It was too much for me...I didn't want the liability.

A mom and pop pizzaria or drycleaner sells for different than a construction company or a car rental company or a bar....folks look at how many hours they have to put in...how much maintenance is needed...

I don't know your industry or your business and wouldn't hazard a guess as to its value.

Hence my reason for saying it may or may not sell for a million...

calvinandhobbes
08-05-2010, 12:32 PM
Why would that be?
You claim that you can sell your 'business' without ever making a profit.
Mine does make a profit after 6 years of building.
You say yours is actually worth something.
How can mine not be worth far, far more?While I disagree with most of what Will posts on the internet, unprofitable companies are bought and sold all the time. How long did amazon.com operate without making money? they still had a large market cap because people knew the potential. Now obviously comparing some jungle juice (sorry, desert juice) distributorship based on wannabes is different a massive online retail outlet with proprietary products and mostly educated workforce, but businesses are valued for potential all the time.

iamwil
08-05-2010, 12:34 PM
Me? No. I was not in that discussion at all.Profit = Income = Revenue - Expenses. Stick with that.

Now, have you ever made 20k INCOME from MLM in a year? You said yes before. Would you like to change your answer?

Have you or haven't you made a profit at the end of the year for any of your 11 years? You seem to have a series of answers for this one too.You are correct, my bad you didn't say that, but this is the same discussion...it was unsaved trash...


Example: Revenue from TriVita = $10,000
Expenses = $10,000
Profit = 0
Trip to AU = $6,000
Loss = $6,000

Or am I missing something?

I have had over 20 k in revenue... I have made some profit some years and had some loss in other years.

No I never made 20k in profit....my 1099 has exceeded 20k but not my net.

iamwil
08-05-2010, 12:45 PM
(sorry, desert juice) distributorship based on wannabes is different a massive online retail outlet with proprietary products and mostly educated workforce, but businesses are valued for potential all the time. we have mostly consumers...in our massive online outlet with proprietary products...and mostly educated workforce...

We have hundreds of folks at the home office, answering phones, taking orders, and then herds more answering phones from the infomercials...we pay for the infomercials, we receive customers, we follow up with customers, we receive comissions from our customers orders...it isn't that complicated and it is different from most mlm as we do pay for advertising we do advertise nationally and locally daily, on television, on radio, in print, on the web...have been doing so for a decade.

calvinandhobbes
08-05-2010, 01:18 PM
we have mostly consumers...in our massive online outlet with proprietary products...and mostly educated workforce...if you think the MLM workforce is made up of mostly educated people, you are dumber than I give you credit for (and that's pretty dumb, Mr "Car=Carburetor", "Revenue=Profit", etc).

calvinandhobbes
08-05-2010, 01:23 PM
I have had over 20 k in revenue...which has nothing to do with the question I asked you (here or on scam.com).
I have made some profit some years and had some loss in other years.IIRC, that is not what you said at scam.com.
No I never made 20k in profit....whoa, he finally answers a question that was asked.
my 1099 has exceeded 20k but not my net. .....and then proceeds to add irrelevant information. Is your 1099 # supposed to change something? Does that magically turn revenue into pure profit? Of course not.

You have expenses for your business that, like for any business, make your profit less than your revenue.

Will...next time you are asked if you've made 20k income in one year from your MLM, it isn't a complicated week long discussion. It's one word. "No." Ok, maybe four...."No, not even close."

iamwil
08-05-2010, 01:29 PM
if you think the MLM workforce is made up of mostly educated people, you are dumber than I give you credit for (and that's pretty dumb, Mr "Car=Carburetor", "Revenue=Profit", etc). Now you know I don't believe revenue and profit are the same thing...or cars and carburetors are the same thing however much you enjoy it.

As I've said before and you don't seem to understand I have both revenue without profit and a car without a carburetor...so I see how you can be confused.

Our company's workforce consists of folks that answer the phones, run the office, R&D, they are great folks. They would be on average equal to their amazon.com counterparts, I don't believe our shipping department and theirs is much different. Nor our web techies and theirs...they just have more of 'em.

As for the affiliates...who aren't part of the company workforce...the independents out there...most of them are much more educated than myself. I know you all like to give me a hard time...but I haven't done bad on a public school education. I'm happy, and you all are enthralled with my every move in life....what isn't to like?

Seriously?
08-05-2010, 01:53 PM
but I haven't done bad on a public school education.

Nothing wrong with public education... as long as it continues past 6th grade.

iamwil
08-05-2010, 02:00 PM
Nothing wrong with public education... as long as it continues past 6th grade.Phooey, I knew I did something wrong...

But that is when they said I had to enter into indentured servitude with MLM...

calvinandhobbes
08-05-2010, 02:58 PM
Now you know I don't believe revenue and profit are the same thing...will, you REPEATEDLY have interchanged the two words, you have demonstrated that you can either not communicate simple concepts or don't understand simple concepts. this isn't a case of "i said income when I meant revenue that time", this is a mistake you have made over and over and over. It's also a common mistake among MLMers.
or cars and carburetors are the same thing however much you enjoy it.yes, i know you know a car isn't a carburetor, but you, again, REPEATEDLY...even AFTER BEING CORRECTED, misrepresented my words by substituting "car" for "carburetor." This is no exaggeration, it is exactly what you did.
As I've said before and you don't seem to understandthis ought to be interesting....what don't I understand.....
I have both revenue without profitwhen have I not understood this? The only time I was under the impression you made 20k in profit was when you said you made 20k in income. The misunderstanding is your misstatement, not mine.
and a car without a carburetor...when have I thought you had a car with a carburetor?
so I see how you can be confused.You have yet to point out one confusion on my part. You certainly have pointed out many a correction to your own misstatements on your part....MANY.

Our company's workforce consists of folks that answer the phones, run the office, R&D, they are great folks. They would be on average equal to their amazon.com counterpartsThere are people that work for amazon developing the kindle...developing VERY high end web retail portal stuff. They are people with phD's in software development, etc... you have no clue to what you speak of. Seriously...quit while you look like a complete idiot....it's only getting worse.

I don't believe our shipping department and theirs is much different. Nor our web techies and theirs...they just have more of 'em.You believe wrong. Not even close.
As for the affiliates...who aren't part of the company workforce...the independents out there...they are part of the work force. Employees....no. But they make up the network....the face of the company.
most of them are much more educated than myself.that doesn't make them educated.
I know you all like to give me a hard time...but I haven't done bad on a public school education. I'm happy, and you all are enthralled with my every move in life....what isn't to like?liking something as in being entertained by a trainwreck is different than liking, say Steve Jobs because of the iPod.

Seriously?
08-05-2010, 02:59 PM
But that is when they said I had to enter into indentured servitude with MLM...

Huh. Maybe that's how they manage to keep the kids on the books as employees...

iamwil
08-05-2010, 03:12 PM
Huh. Maybe that's how they manage to keep the kids on the books as employees...yup, use them to fold, staple, mutilate, stamp and mail...

It can be fun....once you get over the us v them mentality...we are all just humans playing human games...

A Life Aloft
08-08-2010, 12:03 PM
The only one playing any "games" on here and on Scam, is YOU. Just stop the lies. We know the truth and so do you. Stop lying already. Enough is enough.

Unsaved Trash
08-09-2010, 02:27 PM
we have mostly consumers...in our massive online outlet with proprietary products...and mostly educated workforce...

Who says they're "educated employees?" Where can I find that? By educated, do you mean they graduated second grade or are they all college educated and have a degree in nutrition or business?


We have hundreds of folks at the home office, answering phones, taking orders, and then herds more answering phones from the infomercials...we pay for the infomercials, we receive customers, we follow up with customers, we receive comissions from our customers orders...it isn't that complicated and it is different from most mlm as we do pay for advertising we do advertise nationally and locally daily, on television, on radio, in print, on the web...have been doing so for a decade.

Hundreds? How about between 100 and 150 employees which includes the telemarketers, the warehouse, and everyone else. You need to do your homework a bit better.


(posted on 8-05-10) And for driving...I'll be doing it all next week...family vacation....two years ago we went west, last year we went north...flipping coins at intersections deciding which way to go...stopping at the point of interest signs along the way...going wherever we fancied... This year we are going south, my twins are 17...gonna be seniors in high school...with their work and college...and then creating their own families...I don't know when we'll be able to spend a week together again. I'm hoping we can continue to find time over the years.....but there is a distinct possiblity this will be the last road trip.

This is next week and I noticed that you've racked up 5 posts over yonder today alone. It's Monday afternoon. Vacation canceled or are you on your laptop while cruising along the country roads?

iamwil
08-16-2010, 10:33 AM
This is next week and I noticed that you've racked up 5 posts over yonder today alone. It's Monday afternoon. Vacation canceled or are you on your laptop while cruising along the country roads? Laptop while my daughter drives down country roads...

the beach was wonderful...as were the mountains..

a good time was had by all...nice working holiday...

A Life Aloft
08-16-2010, 11:28 AM
Oh bullshit! You were posting and reading morning, afternoon and night the entire week that you were on your phony "vacation". ROTFL! Just stop the lies, seriously. Enough is enough. Driving through country roads my ass. Is that like your phony job and phony commute and phony office that you are at today while merrily posting away on Scam and on here?

iamwil
08-16-2010, 01:52 PM
Oh bullshit! You were posting and reading morning, afternoon and night the entire week that you were on your phony "vacation". ROTFL! Just stop the lies, seriously. Enough is enough. Driving through country roads my ass. Is that like your phony job and phony commute and phony office that you are at today while merrily posting away on Scam and on here? You are correct. While on vacation with my kids, while at the beach, while in the hotel, I log on...I answer email, I make phone calls, I post online...

The beach was nice, the waves were great, not great for surfing or body surfing but for fighting, riding the ridges and diving through...heckuva lot of fun. As was the mountains and the Blue Ridge Parkway...nice time...a couple of evening thunderstorms but all in all great weather. We played some mini golf as well, and went to a show at Legends...saw Buddy Holly (a 60 year old Buddy at that), Martina McBride, The Blues Brothers, the Beatles and Elvis...my son wasn't that interested, he was making periodic table flash cards during the show, my daughter and I enjoyed it thou. Oh and found a nice hole in the wall Thai place...and toured the largest collection of Amercan Sculptures... Beach, mountains, friends, family, good eats, some impersonators, and still work the business, and post some notes....what is not to like?

How about you, how is your time living vicariously thru my life, trying to determine what I do all day and how I do it. How is that going? Keeping track of where I am posting and when I am online...does it keep you busy enough? entertained enough?

A Life Aloft
08-16-2010, 06:40 PM
Well of course dear. Everyone takes their laptop with them on a vacation with their family and posts 54 times on Scam, morning, afternoon and evening.

iamwil
08-17-2010, 08:16 AM
Well of course dear. Everyone takes their laptop with them on a vacation with their family and posts 54 times on Scam, morning, afternoon and evening.Well there was just no need to post here...

I waited a week and there were only 19 new updates when I came back...

What do you all hunt and peck? 10 seconds to post this, a minute to post that...tis sooooo time consuming... and you can do it while other things are being printed, while waiting for a bus, while on a phone call, while sitting at the beach. I can only play in the surf so long...and read so many chapters... laying in the sun is not for me...

however entertaining you folks and listening to you squirm as you get your panties in a bunch and pull out your wedgies...tis fun, amusing past time.

How you hang on my every word, seek out my every post, contemplate my punctuation, pounce on anything that moves... being the hunted and haunted is quite interesting... I'm gonna head for the urinal now...don't stand to close, I think I've got a little gas.

A Life Aloft
08-17-2010, 09:40 AM
In truth Will no one asked why you didn't post here, but you just keep lying and deflecting and changing the subject. The real entertainment here is watching an idiot (that would be you) lie and squirm, make crap up and lamely try to justify his behavior. No one is buying the bullshit, Will. No one. No one on Scam and no one on here. The only one wearing panties is you. The rest of us are laughing our asses off at you, waiting for the next bullshit fairy tale from you. If they had an award for class clown on here, you'd be it. The only "vacation" you took is much like your "job", your "commute" and your "office". You walked from your bedroom outside to get the bills and Food Stamp vouchers in your mailbox and the sun shone on you for 60 seconds. lmao

iamwil
08-17-2010, 10:55 AM
In truth Will no one asked why you didn't post here, but you just keep lying and deflecting and changing the subject. The real entertainment here is watching an idiot (that would be you) lie and squirm, make crap up and lamely try to justify his behavior. No one is buying the bullshit, Will. No one. No one on Scam and no one on here. The only one wearing panties is you. The rest of us are laughing our asses off at you, waiting for the next bullshit fairy tale from you. If they had an award for class clown on here, you'd be it. The only "vacation" you took is much like your "job", your "commute" and your "office". You walked from your bedroom outside to get the bills and Food Stamp vouchers in your mailbox and the sun shone on you for 60 seconds. lmao Oh so now I don't take vacations and live off of foodstamps...

I guess a life aloft has a deeper meaning...a more flighty one, seems you are prone to flights of fancy eh?

Oh yeah you've found me out, I've never worked, have no kids and use the computer here at the home for the brain damaged....

I do love how the majority of the posts are yet again revolving around my life, my posts on scam.com, or scam.com itself.

Come on get a life, have an original thought, get into discussion and quit trying to make up things that aren't true when I just give you simple facts.

Unsaved Trash
08-17-2010, 02:21 PM
I do love how the majority of the posts are yet again revolving around my life, my posts on scam.com, or scam.com itself.



You are the one bringing up these issues. You can't seem to comprehend that. How would we know that you have twins, coach soccer or whatever, what your said is occupation is, etc., without you informing us of it. I don't think we're psychic. We're not allowed to comment on your posts? That's a new one on me since this is a discussion board.

iamwil
08-18-2010, 03:05 PM
You are the one bringing up these issues. You can't seem to comprehend that. How would we know that you have twins, coach soccer or whatever, what your said is occupation is, etc., without you informing us of it. I don't think we're psychic. We're not allowed to comment on your posts? That's a new one on me since this is a discussion board.You don't comment you interrogate, you call me a liar, you make up fantastical stories about my life. You seem to think you have a right to know everything about me...you don't...I have a right to choose what I tell you about me.

You hide behind this net name or that and take potshots... It has to do with the number of topics and discussions here...there are none, I am it, so it is your focus.

If you wish to assist this place in growth take the blinders off and look around, there are plenty of things to discuss other than my life, or hell, get one of your own.

Unsaved Trash
08-18-2010, 03:19 PM
You don't comment you interrogate, you call me a liar, you make up fantastical stories about my life. You seem to think you have a right to know everything about me...you don't...I have a right to choose what I tell you about me.

You point out one time that I've called you a liar. I want to see that. And what stories have I "made up?" Examples?


You hide behind this net name or that and take potshots... It has to do with the number of topics and discussions here...there are none, I am it, so it is your focus.

If you wish to assist this place in growth take the blinders off and look around, there are plenty of things to discuss other than my life, or hell, get one of your own.

Excuse me? You are the one that has brought your personal life to the forefront, not me. How else would I have this information? And now you're whining because you're being questioned? Too bad. If you post it, you should be able to back it up. In that area, you have failed miserably. I think you just like to post to see your name in print because they're pretty worthless. Well....except for your posts benefiting anyone that reads these types of forums and would want to join TriVita. Your failure in it is enough to keep anyone with a brain cell and a half from joining. I don't know anyone that would pay to be in an MLM and not make a profit for 11 years and continue to hold hope for that long. But that's my fault, right?

Whip
08-18-2010, 03:39 PM
You hide behind this net name or that and take potshots

Your always-lame Clements argument is as weak as always and never makes any sense.
You will meet none of us, more than likely, thus even if you allegedly use your real name, no one will know if it is or not and you will always be anonymous. You and your cronies are no better than anyone else just because you spout that nonsense.

littleroundman
08-19-2010, 12:21 AM
Didn't you guys know??

www.networkin4africa.com (http://www.networkin4africa.com)

It's already started!

WHOOPS !!!!


www.networkin4africa.com (http://www.networkin4africa.com/)

CirtexHosting - Site Suspended (http://www.networking4africa.com/cgi-sys/suspendedpage.cgi)
Account Suspended

Your account is currently suspended. Please contact us for more information via our Helpdesk (https://support.cirtex.com/index.php?_m=tickets&_a=submit).How on earth did THAT happen ????

scratchycat
04-10-2011, 06:16 PM
I just did a search on here for Kiosk and it brought this forum up. Just heard this today:


THE LARGEST MLM launch online ever!



Hi Friends,


My good friend Joel Therien, who has built several multi million dollar
companies online, is launching what I know will be, by far ..
The LARGEST MLM LAUNCH online ever!



Why do I know it will be the largest launch online ever?

1. He knows what he is doing ( a 12 year track record of success online)
2. He built a multi million dollar Internet Marketing and MLM data center
to support the infrastructure
3. He already hosts some of the biggest Internet and MLM marketers online!



I see many red flags here! Isn't this something to do with Global Domains?? I know I have seen Joel Therien's name before because he is big into MLM's.

The Chef
05-02-2011, 11:17 PM
You Gotta be kidding me, Right? Then we would just have a few rich people running the countries and the rest of the population would be starving to death.
I guess then it would be time to get into selling coffins, I bet you can make a pyramid out of those to.

Get informed people,

Dr. Jon M. Taylor of the Consumer Awareness Institute found in his analysis of over 350 MLMs that they all depend upon unlimited recruitment into an endless chain of participants – all of whom are incentivized to buy products in order to qualify for commissions and advancement in the scheme. And all of their compensation plans are top weighted, meaning a few TOPPs (top-of-the-pyramid promoters) profit handsomely at the expense of a revolving door of recruits, approximately 99% of whom lose money. To get your questions about MLM answered by a qualified independent analyst download his new eBook at no cost at, The truth about MLM, or multi-level marketing, based on solid research and world-wide feedback (http://www.mlm-thetruth.com)
Stephen Barrett, M.D., is one of the most prolific independent investigators of health quackery and related fraud on the web. MLM Watch (http://www.mlmwatch.org)
404 Not Found (http://www.vandruff.com/mlm) – A classic article on MLM/network marketing, “What’s Wrong with Multi-level Marketing?” is written by Dean VanDruff


The Chef

The Chef
05-11-2011, 08:57 PM
Dr. Jon M. Taylor of the Consumer Awareness Institute found in his analysis of over 350 MLMs that they all depend upon unlimited recruitment into an endless chain of participants – all of whom are incentivized to buy products in order to qualify for commissions and advancement in the scheme. And all of their compensation plans are top weighted, meaning a few TOPPs (top-of-the-pyramid promoters) profit handsomely at the expense of a revolving door of recruits, approximately 99% of whom lose money. To get your questions about MLM answered by a qualified independent analyst download his new eBook at no cost at, The truth about MLM, or multi-level marketing, based on solid research and world-wide feedback (http://www.mlm-thetruth.com)

Stephen Barrett, M.D., is one of the most prolific independent investigators of health quackery and related fraud on the web. MLM Watch (http://www.mlmwatch.org)

404 Not Found (http://www.vandruff.com/mlm) – A classic article on MLM/network marketing, “What’s Wrong with Multi-level Marketing?” is written by Dean VanDruff

www.pyramidschemealert.com , sponsored by Pyramid Scheme Alert, established to expose and prevent pyramid scheme fraud world wide. Robert Fitzpatrick, the founder, has appeared on several local and national TV programs exposing pyramid scheme abuse. This site offers news on court cases and regulatory actions, resources including many from (Dr. Jon M. Taylor), the most informed Consumer Advocate today, in addition to petitions for action by law enforcement agencies.

Tracy Coenen is a forensic accountant (and former Mary Kay participant) who investigates white collar crime. She has posted some interesting articles about MLM.. Go to – Sequence Inc. Forensic Accounting - Sequence Inc. Forensic Accounting & Fraud Investigation (http://www.sequenceinc.com) Then enter "multi-level marketing" in the search box at the top, and you can reference several articles and videos about MLM.
For a lively online discussion on the pros and cons of specific MLMs and of MLM in general, check out realscam.com. It was initiated when an MLM promoter became a moderator for the once excellent web site scam.com. Go to the MLM/ network marketing pyramid scheme category and follow one of the threads that interests you.

Lee Devlin's Weblog presents the article "which exposes in a very brief analysis the impossible math of MLM. Read how nicely his insights debug the obfuscation of numbers by MLM promoters.

littleroundman
03-16-2012, 04:50 AM
Entirely predictable.

Complete with the normal fraudsters' "it's not our fault" excuse:

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc153/thelittleroundman/n4a.jpg

http://networking4africa.com/ (http://networking4africa.com/)

Hopefully they didn't get away with too much.